Images and Symbols -- Deconstructing the Iraq War

Re: #122 HP Theory

[“The CIA was fully aware of those warnings and knew something was brewing. Did the CIA have any clues as to where and when terrorist action would occur? The answer is still unknown. In the meantime, all the US could do was to bait and wait patiently.” ]

This is the most retarded theory ever.

Even the dumbest human being knew that Islamic terrorists were going to attack America again after the first paki attempt on WTC failed in 1993. Everyone knew that. There were enough warnings, and something was always brewing. So does that become proof that CIA was ``fully aware``.

Everyone knew that UK would be an islamic terror target. There are far too many paki-trained jihadi nutcases running around in UK. So MI knew and let it happen?

Everyone knows pakistani terrorism in India. So RAW knew about Varanasi bombing in advance and let it happen?

That is why prevention is better. If these islamic dumbasses are thrown out and are kept out of civilized countries, none of this stinking green shit will happen again. Already all the kafir countries are making good changes to their immigration laws.

Drink some more of indian zam zam water before you post you next fantastic theory. Accept responsibility. Accept the truth, it is far more easier than creating one on your own.

#122 HP

[That was my Bait theory in nutshell. Let’s hear what you have to say. Just remember it is just a theory and I really don’t have whole lot of documents to support that.]

Here is what I have to say - it is one of the dumbest theories I have ever heard (admitting the fact that I do not make particular efforts to find out about dumb conspiracy theories - and there might be a few others!)

Take for instance, this one ``gem`` from HP!
``...and in the end the commission report was hogwash.``

The report in question was put together by hundreds of individuals. The principals were half Democrat and half Republican. The commission reviewed 2.5 million pages of documents. It interviewed over 1200 individuals from ten countries, including nearly every senior administration official from the current and the previous administration. It held nineteen days of hearings and numerous public testimonies.

According to this guy HP, all those people got together to produce ``hogwash`` whereas he - the great HP - who admittedly has no proof but this great hunch - perhaps reinforced through numerous bouts of alcohoic nature - developed this great ``conspiracy``. And to top it all - he only seeks ``serious`` feedback!

He wants to build credibility, this HP - he REALLY wants to do so.

Well, for starters - perhaps he should start using his REAL name instead of a two letter made-up one. And instead of ``don`t have whole lot of documents to support that`` how about saying the following:

``I have nothing to support that! But I would LIKE to think that it happened!``

Re: # 122 HP

I never thought I will say this - but HP makes sense here.... of all the conspiracy theories I have hears so far - this one seems to be most credible.....

#124 Ballukhan

Interesting write-up. At first, I thought you came up with so much information by yourself but it appears to be a case of wholesale lifting from the web-site listed below.

http://www.angelfire.com/rant/pearly/htmls1/bush-laden.html

Then I started comparing with the original to see what you had left OUT and noticed you had left out the name of the writer of that piece - a renowned Bush-basher named James Hatfield.

Hatfield wrote ``Fortunate Son: George W. Bush and the Making of an American President`` in 1999. The book cited unnamed sources in claiming that Bush was arrested in 1972 but that his case was expunged. Bush, who was campaigning for president when the book was published, denied the allegations.

Soon after ``Fortunate Son`` was released by St. Martin`s Press, the company discovered that Hatfield had been convicted in 1988 of attempted murder of his former supervisor. It recalled 70,000 copies in October 1999 and left an additional 20,000 books in storage.

Police went to Hatfield`s house to arrest him on charges of credit card fraud, but Hatfield wasn`t home.

His body was found shortly after by a hotel housekeeper. Hatfield left notes for his family and friends that listed alcohol, financial problems and ``Fortunate Son`` as reasons for killing himself, police said. He is survived by a wife and daughter.

In ``Fortunate Son,`` Hatfield said three unnamed sources claimed a judge had expunged Bush`s case and given him community service as a favor to his father, who was ambassador to the United Nations at the time. The incident raised questions of how well publishers screen the credentials of authors and check facts in their books.

Hatfield was convicted in 1988 of paying a hit man $5,000 to murder his former boss with a car bomb. Both passengers in the vehicle, the intended victim and a colleague, escaped unharmed when the bomb malfunctioned. After news of that conviction surfaced, it was also discovered that Hatfield had pleaded guilty to embezzlement in 1992.

Well, Ballukhan, so much for the credibility of your source!

And so much for YOUR credibility in hiding your source and attempting to pass this crap you posted as legitimate information.

In June 1977, Dubya formed his own drilling company, Arbusto Energy (``arbusto`` means ``bush`` in Spanish), in Midland, Texas. Like his father before him, Dubya founded his oil business with the financial backing of investors, including James R. Bath, a Houston businessman whom Dubya apparently first met when they were in the same Texas Air National Guard unit. (Interestingly, both Dubya and Bath were both suspended from flying in August and September 1972, respectively, for ``failure to accomplish annual medical examination.``)

Tax documents and other financial records show that Bath, an aircraft broker with controversial ties to Saudi Arabia sheiks, had invested $50,000 in Arbusto, granting him a 5 percent interest in two limited partnerships controlled by Dubya.

Time magazine described Bath in 1991 as ``a deal broker whose alleged associations run from the CIA to a major shareholder and director of the Bank of Credit & Commerce.`` BCCI, as it was more commonly known, closed its doors in July 1991 amid charges of multibillion-dollar fraud and global news reports that the financial institution had been heavily involved in drug money laundering, arms brokering, covert intelligence work, bribery of government officials and—here`s the kicker—aid to terrorists.

Bath was never directly implicated in the BCCI scandal, but according to The Outlaw Bank, an award-winning 1993 book by Time correspondents, Jonathan Beaty and S.C. Gwynne, Bath originally ``made his fortune by investing money for [Sheikh Kalid bin] Mahfouz and another BCCI-connected Saudi, Sheikh bin Laden,`` reportedly the father of none other than Osama bin Laden, the man accused by the U.S. government of masterminding the August 1998 terrorist bombings of the American embassies in Kenya and Tanzania which killed more than 250 people.

According to court documents, Bath swore that in 1977 he represented four prominent and wealthy Saudi Arabians as a trustee and used his name on their investments in the United States. In return, he received a 5 percent interest in their deals. Time reporters Beaty and Gwynne suggest in their book that the $50,000 Bath invested in Dubya`s Arbusto Energy drilling company may have belonged to Bath`s Saudi clients since the Houston businessman ``had no substantial money of his own at the time.``

The FBI and the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network later investigated Bath after allegations were made by one of his American business partners that the Saudis were using Bath and their giant piggy bank to influence U.S. policy. (Dubya`s father had been appointed by President Ford to head the CIA from 1976–77.)

So, folks, the Middle Eastern oil money used to underwrite the first business venture of our future president of the United States, may have been derived at least in part from the family fortune of Saudi terrorist Osama bin Laden, who is now being accused of masterminding his assassination.

From the what-it`s-worth-department : I think Dubya`s handlers have fed disinformation through the CIA and other backdoor channels to German and Italian intelligence agencies about a possible hit on Dubya by the fugitive terrorist to gain public sympathy and concern for a U.S. president who has taken a nose-dive in the opinion polls.

The latest New York Times/CBS News poll showed Dubya`s approval rating fell to 53 percent from 57 percent a few weeks ago, its lowest since he took office. Only 50 percent of those polled approved of his handling of the economy, while 47 percent approved of his foreign policy performances. Some 44 percent felt Dubya was not respected by foreign leaders, a mere 39 percent agreed with his policies on the environment, and a whopping 61 percent of Americans believed the new prez was not addressing the issues they care most about.

Obviously, the pollsters didn`t call Dubya`s sugar daddies—the oil and gas companies. Because he damn sure is taking care of their interests.

An update on the environmental Hitler : Interior Secretary Gail Norton recently appointed the head of a group campaigning for oil development in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR) and an Alaska lawmaker who promoted North Slope oil development to key positions at the Department of Interior.

Norton said she was naming Cam Toohey as her special assistant for Alaska and state Sen. Drue Pearce as a senior adviser on Alaska issues. Since 1996, Toohey has been executive director of Arctic Power, an Anchorage-based lobbying group with the campaign for ANWR drilling as its sole purpose. He will be based in Anchorage, overseeing the Interior Department`s Alaska operations.

Pearce, an Anchorage Republican who served two terms as president of the state Senate, will be based in Washington.

Norton claimed oil from the refuge`s coastal plane ``needs to be considered in any debate`` about a national energy policy and added, ``It`s such a large resource that it cannot be ignored.``

Environmentalists and Alaska native tribes oppose drilling and say the narrow coastal plain, wedged between the Brooks Range and the Arctic Ocean, is critical to the ecosystem of the Arctic region. Energy exploration would also threaten the calving ground for a heard of 130,000 caribou.

``Today we`ve seen a hostile takeover of the Interior Department by the oil industry,`` said Sara Callaghan Chapell, of the Sierra Club. Instead of appointing stewards for Alaska resources, Norton has ``chosen cheerleaders for Big Oil,`` she said.

In other words, we`ve now got 2 foxes in charge of overseeing the hen house.

Vice President Cheney, International Man of Mystery: Congressional investigators are demanding that the White House turn over records on closed-door meetings of Cheney`s energy task force, which drafted Dubya`s energy plan this spring.

A letter from the General Accounting Office (Congress` watchdog agency) and two congressmen, Henry A. Waxman (D-Los Angeles) and John D. Dingell (D-Mich.), are alleging that Cheney met secretly with GOP campaign donors from the oil, electricity and nuclear power industries but excluded some groups critical of Dubya`s emphasis on energy production.

David Walker, comptroller of the non-partisan GAO, is demanding that the vice president tell the public who was on the task force and what was said. He recently sent Cheney a letter asserting that he was legally obligated to come clean, but the White House still refuses to divulge the names of the outside consultants it relied on, so the accounting office is threatening to issue a ``demand letter.`` It may even go to court to force compliance in the public`s interest.

So far, Cheney has rejected the request and a senior White House official accused the GAO of overstepping its authority and claimed its investigation would compromise Dubya`s ability to solicit honest advice from outside experts.

``The vice president should stop stonewalling and start cooperating with GAO`s investigation,`` stated Congressman Waxman.

What is Cheney trying to hide? Probably that the task force was nothing more than a sham to make the public believe the administration was actively trying to solve the so-called ``energy crisis,`` when, in fact, the meetings were only convened to hear the demands of the energy industry.

Vice President Cheney is unfit for office: When he disclosed last Friday that he had been experiencing irregular heart rhythms, Cheney should have tendered his resignation as vice president at the same time.

Since the election, Cheney suffered on November 22 what doctors called a ``very slight`` heart attack—his fourth since 1978. Doctors implanted a wire-scaffolding-like device called a stent to open an artery that was 90 percent blocked. On March 5 of this year, the 60-year-old vice president was taken to George Washington University Hospital after feeling chest pains.

With all due respect to Cheney, he is physically unfit for the office of vice president, which is literally a heartbeat away from the presidency.

In the interest of his country and his own health, he should make a graceful exit.

Now.

Whassup with Daschle and the other Democrats?

New Majority Leader, Tom Daschle, announced that he doesn`t see a need to investigate senior presidential adviser and chief dirty trickster, Karl Rove, for meeting with officials of Intel when Rove owned at least $100,000 in the computer-chip-maker`s stocks.

Even Stevie Wonder could see that this a prosecutable case of influence peddling by Intel and outright conflicts of interest by Dubya`s right-hand man in the White House.

Rove, who held between $100,000 and $250,000 of Intel stock, met in March with the company`s CEO and 2 lobbyists as they sought federal approval of a corporate merger and a Dutch company.

Surprise, surprise, surprise! The administration gave its okay to the deal less than two months later, coincidentally around the time that Rove sold all of his stocks, a diverse portfolio of holdings in defense, high-tech, banking and energy companies valued at between $1 million and $2.5 million.

Democrats have complained that Republicans were too quick to launch investigations of the Clinton White House, and Daschle indicated a change of course since they took control of the Senate. ``We`re not going to get into vendettas. We`re not going to go after individuals,`` he stated.

This isn`t about revenge or paybacks, Senator. To borrow a quote Superman, we`re talking about ``truth, justice and the American way.`` Rove clearly broke the law and there needs to be a congressional investigation. If this happened on Clinton`s watch, Rove himself would be the loudest dog barking for a special counsel to probe any wrongdoing.

And Rove`s not the only administration official that should be the target of a Capitol Hill investigation.

Treasury Secretary Paul O`Neil recently completed the sale of $100 million in stock and options in Alcoa Inc., nearly three months after he promised to sell the stock to avoid conflicts of interest.

O`Neill, who was chairman of the aluminum giant until joining Dubya`s administration, has made substantial profits on the holdings since he announced on ABC`s This Week on March 25 that he had decided to sell the stock so he could ``take the issue off the table and get on with my business.``

Oh, he got on with his ``business`` all right. Alcoa`s stock has risen 30 percent since O`Neill took his pledge, in part because of the administration`s energy policies.

Somehow everything in Dubya`s White House always comes full circle to his connection to the oil and gas companies.

I`ve said it many times, but I`ll say it again: He`s nothing but a high-priced gigolo, yet as flagrant and shameless as a common streetwalker.

I told you so, part I : I argued weeks ago that Dubya`s tax cut plan would be Reagan redux and would eat up the budget surplus and leave us with huge deficits. Now comes word from the Congressional Budget Office that Dubya`s newly enacted tax cut has gobbled up three-quarters of the projected federal budget surplus through 2004.

As the surplus shrinks, budget experts from both parties claim Congress and Dubya will have to tap funds reserved for Medicare to pay for the spending increases they want for the fiscal year that begins in October.

The CBO attributes virtually all of the disappearing surplus to the 10-year, $1.35 trillion tax cut that Dubya signed this month. It will lower the surplus by $310 billion through 2004.

You can say adios to the steadily growing surpluses the budget office has reported for the past several years during the Clinton years.

I told you so, part II : I warned that Dubya`s stubborn determination to abandon the 1972 ABM treaty and construct his Son of Star Wars missile defense shield would spark a new arms race. Last week, Russia test-fired a huge 26-year-old Stiletto ballistic missile in Kazakhstan, hinting the weapon would gain new life as a ``hydra-headed`` countermeasure if the U.S. pressed on with Dubya`s defense plans.

Putin, who Dubya recently described as ``genuine`` and a ``very sincere guy,`` claimed no missile defense system would be able to counter multiple warhead rockets for decades. (The Stiletto ballistic missile could be re-equipped to carry up to six warheads.)

I used to be only concerned with Dubya`s obvious attempts to rape the earth through his environmental policies. Now I`m as scared as a long-tailed cat in a room full of rocking chairs that this village idiot wants to incinerate the planet through war.

But when I`m wrong, I`ll admit it : In my April 10 column, I applauded Dubya`s Republican successor in Texas, Rick Perry, for some of his progressive actions since becoming governor and noted ``maybe there is such a creature known as a `compassionate conservative.```

Not only have I been eating crow, I`ve paid for an all-you-can-eat buffet.

On the day that was the deadline for him to pee or get off the pot, veto the bill or let it become law, the Texas guv struck down legislation that would have prohibited the execution of the mentally retarded.

The federal government bars such executions, as do 15 states. Last month, Dubya`s brother, Jeb, the governor of Florida signed such legislation after the bill passed the state House of Representatives, 110 to 1.

While Dubya and his clone, Perry, claim Texas has never executed anyone who was mentally retarded, official records indicate that six inmates with IQ`s of 70 or below have been put to death since 1990. People with IQ`s that low are generally considered retarded.

But, of course, Dubya also alleges that not a single innocent person has ever been executed in Texas, either.

Yeah, right. That`s why it seems like almost every day we read or hear on the news about someone who has served years in the Texas prison system and then is released, based upon new DNA evidence.

Nationwide, more than 90 innocent men, a half-dozen on death row, have returned to freedom after analysis of genetic evidence. With 2 million Americans behind bars, mistakes by one in 1,000 juries could leave 2,000 innocent people in prison.

With Dubya`s IQ and his history of breaking the law, he better hope he never commits a capital crime in Texas.

We`ll do this all again next week, folks, so please come back.

The George W. Butcher of the English Language Award of the Week : ``I want to thank you for coming to the White House to give me an opportunity to urge you to work with these five senators and three congressmen, to work hard to get this trade promotion authority moving. The power that be, well most of the power that be, sits right here.`` — Washington, D.C., June 18, 2001

``It is possible that the bait was set with some higher ups involved and when the trail went sour or the terrorist beat the bait and the trap, the admin was so embarrassed that they decided to play safe and not allow the 9/11 commission to investigate the whole saga. ``

The biat theory is certainly plausible but that only touches a part of the cover up of the administration`s lapses.

There were supposedly even bigger cover ups involving Bush`s OIL interests. There were cover ups involving Bush family`s links with the Bin LAden family. There appears to be even bigger cover ups involving Bush Sr. who is now retired and associated with a number of big money OIL as well as ARMS dealers..............Remember, the only interests of US has been OIL and ARMS which OBL as well as Saddam were trying to hit hard................rest of the things about ``Crusades`` or Islam Bashing is just plain old mullah`s propaganda to communally incite muslims worldwide...............

People were discussing conspiracy theory with gusto but nobody paid attention to my conspiracy theory. I think it is unique and it provides a different perspective to the whole 9/11 saga.

It is true that US admin was reluctant in investigating 9/11 and when it was forced in to it, it played politics with the whole investigation and in the end the commission report was hogwash.

Now why this admin would not like a completely independent and impartial investigation of 9/11? There are some powerful and competent investigative agencies in the US and they could have easily put their best minds to find out how the terrorist were able to manage and hoodwink so many agencies in flying four planes within a short span of time. There are some legitimate questions out there about the whole 9/11 saga and there are really no answers.

The theory that I have -may sound outrageous to some- and I have inserted it in the article.

“The CIA was fully aware of those warnings and knew something was brewing. Did the CIA have any clues as to where and when terrorist action would occur? The answer is still unknown. In the meantime, all the US could do was to bait and wait patiently.”

My thinking is that the US had the idea that the Jihadis were up to something but couldn’t pin that down so they decided to play dumb and set the bait. People that are familiar with the law enforcement agencies in the US would know that setting up the bait is the standard operating procedure for almost all US agencies. From the FBI to the CIA to local law enforcement, they set the bait and then wait for the criminals to fall for it.

Most of spies caught by the FBI are baited and then trapped in the act. Here in my opinion the FBI set the bait as we all have some idea that some terrorist were known to the FBI and CIA. The only reason they were not caught before hand was because the agencies either wanted to catch them all or wanted to grab them during the act. But somehow things got out of control and the terrorist beat them out in the game.

The reason the FBI was able to name the terrorist quickly after the 9/11 was that the FBI had some idea about them already.

It is possible that the bait was set with some higher ups involved and when the trail went sour or the terrorist beat the bait and the trap, the admin was so embarrassed that they decided to play safe and not allow the 9/11 commission to investigate the whole saga.

That was my Bait theory in nutshell. Let’s hear what you have to say. Just remember it is just a theory and I really don’t have whole lot of documents to support that.

It is just an exercise and I hope people that are NOT willing to make a serious contribution would stay away from this. Now if you think it is a ridiculous theory, then by all means, make fun of the theory but also provide the reasons why you think it is ridiculous. (or face my fury!)

Jang’s input is requested!

Re: # 119; Yar, don;t go so soon. I didn`t even ask you about your views on the next prophet yet.

#119 by masadi

[I am on my way out of here but I will address all concerns.]

I think you just revived the spirits of Tauheed saheb tremendously! (He seemed genuinely concerned.)

#118, I don`t have a wife and those were American laws
tahmed and Kulharee, I think I have effectively answered you, so if you have any further objections, I suggest you shove them and respectfully return to the topic on hand.
#117 HP, sorry about all that, go ahead. I am on my way out of here but I will address all concerns.

#103 by masadi on March 21, 2006 8:43am PT


A man can legally beat his wife, but not more than once a month.


I can see how America is violating your right to beat your wife everyday..

Well I hope this is the last post in this duel.

I have something I wanna post but I will wait when sanity and Jang return to this board.

Kulharee: <<< I quote from yesterday’s LA Times:

…. MALANG, Indonesia - Yusman Roy, a former boxer and a convert to Islam, is serving two years in prison because he believes that Muslims should pray in a language they can understand.

Roy, who led bilingual prayer sessions at his small East Java boarding school, is seen as a heretic by conservative Muslims here. They believe true prayer can be conducted only in Arabic….. >>>


MAsadi: Here read this short report

Incarcerated America

Human Rights Watch Backgrounder
April 2003

http://www.hrw.org/backgrounder/usa/incarceration/

According to the latest statistics from the U.S. Department of Justice, more than two million men and women are now behind bars in the United States.1 The country that holds itself out as the ``land of freedom`` incarcerates a higher percentage of its people than any other country. The human costs — wasted lives, wrecked families, troubled children — are incalculable, as are the adverse social, economic and political consequences of weakened communities, diminished opportunities for economic mobility, and extensive disenfranchisement.....

Perhaps the single greatest force behind the growth of the prison population has been the national ``war on drugs.`` The number of incarcerated drug offenders has increased twelvefold since 1980. In 2000, 22 percent of those in federal and state prisons were convicted on drug charges.4

Even more troubling than the absolute number of persons in jail or prison is the extent to which those men and women are African-American. Although blacks account for only 12 percent of the U.S. population, 44 percent of all prisoners in the United States are black (Figure 1).

Census data for 2000,which included a count of the number and race of all individuals incarcerated in the United States, reveals the dramatic racial disproportion of the incarcerated population in each state: the proportion of blacks in prison populations exceeds the proportion among state residents in every single state. In twenty states, the percent of blacks incarcerated is at least five times greater than their share of resident population (Figure 2).

goddammit masadi, i told you not to give me a 3-page essay!!! see you are turning into a mauvli already, verbose and with a tin ear.

HP sorry about this detraction, these khotas just don`t get it

Here tahmed and Kulharee, read your answers in this post, and for every copy paste of news from our part of the world, I can produce equally gory news from this part of the world, I don`t even have to look too far.

Ali Sina : The Islam threat is real, the Islam threat is real! The world is in danger!

MAsadi : what threat? Sounds like unwarranted alarmism to me

Ali Sina: Terrorism is not an ideology, it is a tool; but the terrorists kill for an ideology. They call that ideology Islam.

MAsadi: Not all terrorism is garbed with Islamic rhetoric, in fact a very small percentage of what can be described as terrorism is done by those labeled Muslim, or done in the name of Islam.

Darius: Sina, you cannot call an ideology evil because of the tools used by people purporting to follow that ideology. People are the ones who are ``evil`` not ideas on their own. Ideas are benign.

Ali Sina: We are a group of ex-Muslims who have seen the face of the evil and have risen to warn the world.

MAsadi : And what evil is it that you have seen? And what kind of random sampling have you done to decipher the effects of this ``evil`` on people.

Ali Sina: Islam, and the Muslim mind is the evil effect of Islamic ideology. I used to be a Muslim and I know.

MAsadi : And how is that? Where is your random sample and scientific study about the Muslim mind? How many Muslims did you come in contact with when you were a Muslim out of the over one billion in the world? Can you form a non- stereotypical generalization based on such a non random, non-representative sample and introspection alone?

Ali Sina: Terrorism: In the front page of this site I have placed a dynamic link to thereligionofpeace.com As you can see every day there are more terrorist attacks somewhere in the world. Every day tens or hundreds of people are bombed, beheaded, killed and their bodies are torn into pieces by the followers of this ``religion of peace``.

MAsadi : Those are not random samplings of either terrorism or what goes on in the ``Muslim mind``. What about the ``threat`` posed by those that embark on wars on fake pretenses and lay whole countries to waste in the name of “freedom and democracy”?

Ali Sina: those are really for freedom and democracy, it is no terrorism. The American leadership does it so it must be good.

MAsadi : Using your rhetoric, instead of tens or hundreds, tens or hundreds of thousand innocents are killed for ``freedom and democracy``. Therefore whatever ideas are represented by “freedom and democracy” are evil.

Ali Sina: that`s a cop out

MAsadi : How come? I`m using your logic of assigning labels of ``evil`` and ``threat``. For example look at this scenario: the FBI estimates that around 19,000 Americans are murdered every year, not by Middle Eastern terrorists but by fellow Americans, so let`s talk about the ``American as your neighbor threat`` etc.

Ali Sina: you want us to ignore the killings done by Muslims.

MAsadi : not at all, simply showing the world that you are deliberately confusing the causes of terrorism and thereby helping to perpetuate it. You are masking the true causes and hiding the mass killings by everyone that cannot fit under your hate for Islam. You are therefore helping to keep the cycle of violence going and thereby benefit from a portion of it by supporting your hate agenda.

Ali Sina: I don’t think this argument really needs any response. Basically what he is saying is: “close your eyes to Islamic terrorism and forget about it so we can continue killing you, bombing you and massacring your children.”

MAsadi : And masking its causes, like you are, while treating the symptoms of a small percent of global criminals will prevent those? Are you dumb?

Ali Sina: I don`t want to argue with thugs and name callers.

MAsadi : Because you have been stumped, now you can go hide in your hole where no light enters and teeming colonies of e-coil abound

Ali Sina: The Islam threat is real! I don’t debate thugs.

MAsadi : And those that possess the greatest weapons of destruction the world has ever seen and have used them on innocents, they are the voice of peace?

Ali Sina: (hiding in his hole).

MAsadi : The ``lynch-mob`` mentality of alarmism, of Islamic ideology as a global threat, that was (and is) commonly portrayed in such writings, as Sina`s book’s title suggests, is not at all justified: the number of terrorist acts committed by those who claim to be Muslims and in the ``name of Islam`` as a percentage of the total number of Muslims, even as a percentage of the total number of crimes committed in the world, are statistically insignificant as cause. The numbers of people harmed by such acts (of criminals) are also far less than the number that have been killed in the name of ``democracy and freedom`` and free markets: a look at the military adventures of the U.S. elite in the post World War 2 era should suffice as empirical evidence. Rhetoric of freedom has been abused to kill and maim, so has rhetoric borrowed from Islam, both represent abuse of sets of ideas that have no bearing in the purpose for which they were being used.

Bluerock: [MAsadi] Please don`t forget the Black Widows, blowing themselves up and one being pregnant. Bloodthirsty and Evil is Islam

MAsadi : Really and the mass murderers that are advertised on the US media at the rate of several a year, all non-Muslims like the Jeffrey Dahmers and (other) murderers whose crime is deeply intertwined with religious rhetoric, in frequency much greater than any suicide bombings done by ``Muslims``, what religion or ideology do they condemn? Would you place a blanket condemnation on all Americans or all Christians because they happened to belong to their group? All you all can do, and that sob Senile can do is take a few cases, spin your own interpretation on the causes of the events (without any scientific research) and then over generalize to the entire world population of Muslims and Islam- there is no logical or scientific connection to your conclusions.

Yeezeevee: read what this mullah said in Egypt of this one in Saudi Arabia or what this person did in the name of Allah

MAsadi : how many news stories of crimes that non-Muslims do every single day, for their multiple reasons, garbed in all kinds of religious rhetoric, do you want me to copy paste for you?

Yeezeevee: Here have a look at the timeline of Muhammad’s crimes!

MAsadi : Where are your witnesses about those alleged crimes? And what relation does the messenger’s morality have to do with the message that he was commissioned to convey, a message that proclaims separation between author and messenger?

Yeezeevee: Ghazali, Bukhari, Ibn ishaq....ibn Kathir…..Mullah Nasruddin

MAsadi : None of them were witnesses, their reports in the earliest are removed over 200 years and you have not answered my second question.

Yeezeevee: Mr. Muhammad was .....

MAsadi : Can it. I have not asked for your psychiatric evaluation of the prophet or your judgment based upon no witnesses. The Quran states, if the prophet did anything wrong God will judge him, and we shouldn`t concern ourselves with what earlier generations that have passed away might have done or not done, their judgment is the domain of God alone.

Yeezeevee: here have a look at this news article about a follower of Mr. Muhammad. Here is another copy paste of the timeline of what Mr. Muhammad did

MAsadi : It is sad to note how disabled you have become in your ability to reason and decipher the truth. I pity your wasted lives. And you want to risk eternity based on such flimsy reasoning and absolutely zero credible proof?

masadi: OK. i`ll be back masadi. and you know what`ll happen if you write another one of your ``khaali katora`` posts about ``world socio-economic systems`` and ``US elite``!!!