A Thousand Cuts

Re: # 180

Urstruly,

Have you read Nawal el Saadaawi`s essays on FMG?

Re: # 176

I appreciate your passion for your cause but unfortunately we cannot support a cause, unless we know what exactly is being asked from us. In other words unless FGM is defined accurately it will be hard to garner support. Like I said, FGM is a blanket terminology and it covers everything. My definition of FGM is obviously different from yours or Western minded feminists, as indicated by several posts of mine. Just because you or West says that something is barbaric does not make it so. Atheists call even the male circumcision as barbaric, but they do not realize that 100s of millions of Muslims, Christians, and Jews and may be others too go through this procedure every year and in the 10,000 years of history of mankind there is not a single fatality recorded because of this ``barbaric procedure``. Fatalities aside 100% of males do not even recall the procedure while it was done in their early infancy. So there....

As far as Muslim part of the population is concerned, that engages in this practice, the cause will be an easy sell, since the limits set by Holy Prophet (pbuh) are humane and common sense. And if emphasis is put on the guidelines for cleanliness set by Holy Prophet (pbuh) then people may even be persuaded to abolish this practice because times have changed and there remains no use for this procedure anymore. All one need is honesty to approach Muslims.

However, a different approach is required for Chritians, pagans, animists, and people of other religions or cultural inflictions. I do not know about their value system and why they do it. But hauling everybody in one herd is not common sense and it is bound to fail.

Re: # 168



Sub Saharan Africa, part of a continent full of scholarship, complex cultural traditions, roles and systems and an amazing history of activism and reform is ``too far gone``?

Or is it that the denigration of one gender is too easy for all of us?

Re: # 174
Saminasha
Yes it`s been discussed in all those forums, however I think the large majority of people on chowk do not necessarily go to or are that interested in those forums. Some of the people who expressed outrage on this forum could still have been in primary school 15 years ago. Therefore it could be a shock to some of them.

While the discerning thinker can draw parallels with all the activities that you mentioned the chances are that those who feel strongly enough would be interested in cleaning their own backyards and eliminating problems that are more immediate to them.

FGM is a real problem. However everybody has their priorities, on what they can tackle at any period in time. And in societies where other ills are of a greater issue than FGM, chances are that it will not be high on their list of things to be taken care of.

Besides expressing shock is not entirely the same as ignoring the issue is it? At least it has woken up a lot of people.

#176, Jawahara {``Having said that, I`d like to make clear, that I don`t see men as the enemy here. That would be a knee-jerk reaction.``}

Jawahara,
In addition to being an effective writer who can present an important issue and garner support, you are also very rational and conscientious person. Thank you for letting us see how intelligent and effective women behave. I agree with your post #176 totally and appreciate your inclusion of male circumcision as another form of cruelty. In #171, I have pointed out other acts of barbaric cruelty against the human body. Of course, FGM is particularly horrid and deserves paramount attention and action. Thanks.

Cutting off a part of a body for reasons of cleanliness (an important part too....and yes, even the male foreskin is an important part of the body, as is the female hood that someone said they were not averse to being excised) is like cutting off all your hair (or your head?) because you might get dandruff.

What the heck? The Quran goes into detail about cleanliness (from bathing to abdast)....why are these two body parts then supposed to be cut off rather than cleaned?

Let`s stop making excuses, trying to pass the buck, trying to put a psuedo-science spin on this barbaric practice. It is what it is, and hadith or no hadith, it is a cruel and painful way to control women`s sexuality and their bodies.

Having said that, I`d like to make clear, that I don`t see men as the enemy here. That would be a knee-jerk reaction. The villains here, are the system, the secrecy and the ignorance that lets FGM thrive and grow.

For mosque-going Muslims to really make a difference, they need to educate the imams of their local mosques to speak out unequivocally against FGM. Even if there is just one family at the masjid contemplating it, having a trusted religious figure speaking out against it would be valuable.

In Waris Dirie`s lastest book she recounts going to an imam in a mosque in the UK I believe, who thought FGM was barbaric but was convinced no one in his mosque was doing it. It was proved that that was not the case and that there were practitioners in that mosque as well. It is a hidden problem and it needs to be brought to the forefront.

For non-mosque goers there are several social and humanitarian organizations that are against FGM and are involved in education, protests, amnesty and refugee status work, etc.

#173 by Kulharee on April 5, 2006 7:34am PT
{``Re: # 170
Truly Sahib, in your family, do you make the cut at home or take your girls to a clinic? And which clinics perform such a procedure? Has your mom also been thru this? ``}

Sir,
I find this post of yours to be extremely offensive. Mr. Urstruly has not personally attacked you or your family and you are so eagerly insulting people`s relatives. Perhaps you should learn from this article and get an operation performed on your larynx. Now that would be advancement instead of mutilation. Thanks.

Re: # 167

Swarrier,

Again...ten to fifteen years ago this issue was being discussed in the fields of Women Studies, Gender Studies, Political Science, Post Colonial Studies, Literature, Film. Btw, the discerning thinker would be able to draw parallels b/n Honor Killings, Forced Prostitution, Dowry Deaths, Girl Trafficking, the rape and murders of girls and women in ethnic/religious/ racial wars.

Btw, all of this takes place in the industrialized world as well as countries of original practice.

Re: # 170

Truly Sahib, in your family, do you make the cut at home or take your girls to a clinic? And which clinics perform such a procedure? Has your mom also been thru this?

exactly..why get so worked up about sub-saharan african problems with no relation to religion when we have karo-kari, dowry deaths ..its not like its palestine issue which we feel about due to ummaitis and general human compassion.

As Zeemax has carrectly pointed out, mutilation of genitals and other parts of the human body is not restricted to sub-Saharan Africa or even Somalia. Quite a few women in the US have that part of the vagina pierced (the one that protrudes like a shark`s fin - I don`t know the medical term) and put all kinds of rings there. We all know about the ``civilized`` habit of piercing ears, noses, and now lips, eyebrows, and even chins. Then there has been the practice among males, in the West and among Rajputs and other Indian males, to pierce their ears and put huge bangles in them.

In China, young women would somehow blacken their teeth after marriage so that they would not appear attractive to males. Young girls feet were ``trained`` in metal shoes so that they would not grow large - big feet were considered ugly for women in China. In Africa and other places women put plates in their lips to create a semicircle of ``beauty.`` I think it is the Watusi women who put rings around their necks every so often to develop long, sleek, ``beautiful`` necks. Lastly, we all know about tattoos and how they are creatively branded on every conceivable part of the human body. Enough has been said about both male and female circumcision. Shouldn`t the males be allowed to reach adulthood before the circumcision is performed so that they can have control over their own bodies? Female circumcision makes no sense whatsoever and should not be performed even if the girl insists on the operation.

I see all these mutilations as forms of primitive and modern barbarism. The only difference is the degree of pain and permanent damage done to the human body.

Some people in their interacts have pointed out that they assume that I am absolutely against FGM. This is not entirely accurate. As a matter of fact FGM is a loaded and blanket terminology that covers everything that is done to female genitles. I think we should make a distinction here. I see absolutely nothing wrong in making a cut at the vertex of the inverted ``V`` of the the hood or prepuce. But that is about it. Everything more than that is mutilation and inhuman and explicitly forbidden in Islam. One should also note that this practice though permissible, is not incumbent. I hope the point is clear to everyone.

#167 by swarrier

Exactly. You said it.

#166 by Saminasha

Because sub-saharan Africa is too far gone ... irretrievably if you ask me ...

And why not agitate against killing women altogether instead of removing that `pleasure` part? Perhaps life isn`t worth living without that anyway so its the same .... Is that it?

Re: # 163
Probably everybody who read Readers Digest x years ago knew about FGM. However as Zeemax pointed out people living in India (dowry deaths) , Pakistan (honour killings) have other things to occupy them. FGM is not quite on their horizon. And Africans aren`t queueing up to emigrate to India and Pakistan so it`s hardly likely to make news there. So they find it new and shocking.

Where would the average person come across FGM , even in this enlightened coutry when the high point with most peoples lives is , the O`Reilly show, Sex in the city, or some soap on Zee TV?

Re: # 165

and why not?