Darakhat Bachao, Lahore Bachao

1- The widening of the road will lead to a saving of 7 minutes in total... the cost of the proposed project ? Rs 700 MILLION ... Is this fair? As per law, each project exceeding 50 Million Rupees needs prior public approval. - - - There MUST be public approval. I agree. However, if say 1.5 years ago it took me 15 minutes to drive from Thokar to the Mall, saving 7 minutes would be pretty good.

2- Secondly the EPA is a piece of progressive legislation which envisages direct public involvement ... it is the people`s right to opine in a matter so close to their heart. - - - - Again agree.

3- The project envisages 4 lane Highway... the underpasses are at best three lanes... and at places 2 lanes... Genuine planners will tell you that traffic is only as fast as its narrowest point. - - - -There should be four lanes for the underpasses as well. It`s common sense.

4- The trees are not just for shade... they have a very important role in sucking up the seepage water from canal and as a wall against noise pollution for adjoining residential areas. - - - - I don`t think they`ll cut the trees along the canal. It`ll be the trees on the left of the road. The canal is lined so the seepage into the greenbelt is probably not much - would need to check on this though.

5- Pollution will increase as average speeds rise from 60 KM to 80 KM meaning more exhaust, more pollution. - - - - I though pollution decreases with less traffic congestion.

6-The creation of this 4 lane Highway would mean an end to all cycle wallahs, rehraywallahs, and other poor people. The thoroughfare would be for the rich and only the rich. - - - - While they are increasing the lanes, there should be dedicated lanes for the smaller traffic. Perhaps a fifth lane!

How about flyovers and tunnels..

Why ``widen`` (and btw ... most Indians here would laugh at the meagre amount of traffic which is causing us to cut so many trees) when you can go over?

I don’t think that the number of lanes in the underpass should be a such big consideration. Because, underpass is only for the vehicles that have to continue onwards; surely there will be vehicles that will need to go on the perpendicular roads, so a 2 lane underpass for a 4 lane road is more than plenty. Secondly, every other underpasses on the Canal needs to be reconfigured. It should always be on the side of the fast lane and in Canal’s case, that is not always the case.

One thing is for sure, that whatever happens, it will be a good move. Lahorias will make the right decision.

Finally, there are cities where you have to walk 50 miles to see a tree. I work in downtown NYC on Broadway, and the nearest tree is like miles from here (not counting the Battery and the City Hall Park), similarly, Canal cities like Venus or Amsterdam don’t have 1/500th as many trees as Lahore does, and places like the Eastern Cost of Saudi Arabia has plastic trees… go figure.

Kulharee pai...

I`d rather convince you face to face over a cuppa that famous dunkin` donut coffee...

Why does Lahore not have a metro system? Thats what is needed now, by the sounds of things!

agreed...

Re: # 20

Manto yaar, it’s a deal… and make sure no decision has been made to widen any roads until we have met.

Inshalla, I will soon be in Lahore, the city that I left some 20 years ago, but the city that never left me. As they say, you can take a women out of Lahore, ……..

In the words of Patras Bokhari `Punjab will one day be the capital of Lahore`. The issue here is the mushrooming population of the city. Widening these roads is the equivalent of treating a gaping wound with blister plaster. The amount of money required to do this to all the major roads in Lahore would be much better spent on improving inter-city transportation between other cities in Punjab and Lahore. Lahore simply can`t sustain this level of growth. We also need to help other cities improve their infrastructure so that they become as attractive to people and businesses wanting to move as Lahore is.

#24 other day I was looking at the map of Lahore(City and District map) and comparing with the Google earth view...I knew Lahore has grown very big but this was beyond what I thought...whole district seems to be becoming the city...e.g. planned Nishtar Town goes only few miles away from the border...and what is this Wagha Town?
Is the long term plan to convert the whole district into the City?

Re: # 15

widening 7 underpassess...highly costly and im not talking a few million dollars

Kulharee:

Widening the underpasses is critical. Particularly for the Jail Road underpass - the first one. It`s only freakin two laned! During the evening rush hour, you are always stuck there for at least 5 minutes.

Though five minutes doesn`t sound like much, it`s clearly a bottleneck and will only get worse.

And yes, the town planners have made fools of themselves by having no consistent pattern on which side the underpass should be made (two of the underpasses are in the slow lane).

Manto: For flyovers, you`d still need to cut down a good number of trees - as they have done for the flyover through Thokar toward the Motorway by-pass as well as for the construction of the dual carriageway on the portion of the Canal between Thokar and Bahria town.

Public transport.

Re: # 18

i think the canal or atleast the part of the canal on which most traffic flows on measures about 6-8 kilometers....all of which is high traffic, imagine how much thatll cost...not to mention complaints about privacy and we may still have to cut a lot of trees, cause many of our beloved trees are currently hanging 20-25 feet over the existing canal road

tunnels...we already have 7 and they are much more costlier than widening roads.

Re: # 27

Rozaiba Ji, I am as sentimental about Lahore, even though I don’t live there no more, as anyone who lives there. Anything I say about Lahore is purely out of love, and may not necessity even be practical. One thing I am certain about is that Lahore will always be Lahore, because it is not the widened boulevards and measly streets that make Lahore what it is. It is the people. Like you and Manto and Feroz Sahib.

If you are looking for any sympathy for being stuck under the Jail Road underpass for a whole 5 (Five) (Panch) (Panj) (Panjam) (Sento) (Khamsa) (Schmakshi)... I live in NYC and it takes me 2 hours to park my friggin car, and that too on the weekends with no alternate side rules.

Here is a win win solution for Lahore`s problems:

Have the Tally Ban/Al Kayda rascals relocate from Wana Wana to Lahore.
Inform the Americans (and coalition forces, just to be polite) about the move.
Leak the news that UBL and Al-Zawahari are hiding out on Canal Road.
Allow the USAF to fly over Paki territory (as if it really matters).
Redeploy thousands of Marines from Tora Bora, Bora Bora, and Tora, Tora, Tora to Lahore.

Watch the fun begin:

Canal Road will be widened.
Some trees are bound to survive.
Hira Mandi will be revitalized.
Lahore`s economy will overtake Mumbai and Bangalore combined.
The dollar will drop to about Rs. 35/-
UAL, Delta Airlines, and US Air will begin daily service to Lahore.
Dubya will visit Lahore unannounced every other day and on Thanskgiving Day.
Condoleeza Rice will demand that Mushy install democracy in Lahore.
Veeresh will be posing to CNN`s Dr. Sanjay Gupta as the ``mayor`` of Lahore.
There will be not one, but a chain of Dunkin Donuts, TGIFs, and a host of other friendly places, not to mention GI English, bars along the Ravi, and televised NFL, NBA, and NHL games.

Rafay Sb,

Thanks for the generally well-argued article.

There are a few weak points:

a) the comment about the laid-back Lahoris not worrying about wasting an extra 7 minutes in traffic. What kind of an illogical loose ball was that?!

b) not addressing the root causes, as mentioned in several comments - the huge increase in cars on the road (caused by the lack of adequate public transport, much as it has improved since the late nineties and by the massive car leasing business of the last three years) and too great a difference in terms of economic opportunities between Lahore and its ``hinterland``

c) eucalyptus trees are actually no longer unanimously recommended for reforestation projects as their roots tend to dig very deep and suck out so much water that the water table is seriously affected. The fact that the roots go deep is good for areas where the top soil has been badly eroded by the combination of deforestation and rain, but there is a price to pay. At least that has been the experience in the Khyber Agency where the Forestry Department has stopped planting new eucalyptus after observing the effects of their reforestation projects for several years. Whether or not the advertisement you mention is linked to the canal-widening project is only your conjecture.

So, pros:
saves time
saves fuel consumption as cars idle in traffic jams or run at lower than their peak efficiency speed. But how much?
perhaps reduces emissions as cars transit faster along the canal with fewer gear shifts. But this is on a per car basis. If the total number of cars increases, this effect is nullified. If the total number of cars increases again to the point of congestion, then net emissions increase significantly.

Also, what do we do when the congestion point is reached again? Buy up houses along the canal, bulldoze them and build more lanes?

Cons:
poses serious potential threats to ground stability - though I`m not sure how valid this point is, as long as the lining of the canal is maintained. I imagine that only civil engineers could answer that question.
will raise the water table - to what point? under which scenarios? at what point do water-logging and salinity set in? How much of the land on either side of the widened road would be affected?
will remove the sound barrier that residential colonies along the canal benefit from, and which they might have to find substitutes for in the future - for example, the ugly steel and concrete walls installed in peri-urban areas in Europe to protect residents from the noise of motorways and by-passes
will reduce the oxygen-generating capacity of Lahore significantly. How significantly? What will be the effect on public health in terms of lung diseases (and other maladies I don`t know about)? There should definitely be a public health professional on that committe of experts.
promotes the use of automobiles at a time when fuel prices are increasing
as a corollary, is a disincentive to the use of public transport, especially as the money being spent on this project could be used to fund (or add to the funds for) an urban rail or tram network
promotes leasing as consumers pledge away their future earnings for convenience and competitive advantage in the present, which may or may not translate to increased earnings in the future


At a time when so-called post-industrial urban centres are shifting to bicycles for commuting purposes, we are stuck about twenty years in the past, facilitating expensive, individual transport with all that it implies in environmental and cultural terms.

For some reading on the possible effects of the car on society:
``But this is not, or not really, an article about speed, or cameras, or even cars. It is about the rise of the antisocial bastards who believe they should be allowed to do what they want, whenever they want, regardless of the consequences. I believe that while there are many reasons for the growth of individualism in the UK, the extreme libertarianism now beginning to take hold here begins on the road. When you drive, society becomes an obstacle. Pedestrians, bicycles, traffic calming, speed limits, the law: all become a nuisance to be wished away. The more you drive, the more bloody-minded and individualistic you become. The car is slowly turning us, like the Americans and the Australians, into a nation that recognises only the freedom to act, and not the freedom from the consequences of other people`s actions. We drive on the left in Britain, but we are being driven to the right.
`` -- George Monbiot in The Guardian

Thanks for article. The points raised are right no doubt.
Problem is not cutting trees, those Eucaliptus trees need to be removed as they most damaging to land, watertable and surrounding trees.
It is not water cutting but breeding of specially poor people is problem. Land can support 10 times the trees but the population is so high the all area along Indus may start sinking down, just so much overcrowding of people. B.Stan is more than 42% area is all land without water. Quetta will soon die in near future due to lack of sufficient water, fortunately we are told big Gport is going to get lots of desalinated water. Now god dam there is nothing beyond no water nothing and they want to make knew Karachi there. It is all stupidity crowned by Absurdity. Sindh is desert go beyond river indus few miles there is nothing. Any every year they are more and more cranking our more and more babies. Instead of cutting trees to help traffic reduce traffic by reducing production of people. Now all these idiots to not have to stop martial bliss. This family planning things are nearly as important discoveries as fire as you can control spread of people like weeds and still have entertainment. But masses are asses and theie asses need to be whipped. so they do not go on producing dark carbon copies of themselves. Now poor people demand always demard mercy and want handouts they aey are most cruel to their children by breeding like rats. You read story of poor people here he is dead and then he is poor and has 6 chidren and many times from one wife. This poor mentality has lead to people (poor) who can not support as many babies out of his poor wife till she is daed and exhausted by so many child births. This child birth of poor people is not day to celebrate but to mourn one more mouth to feed. I have no problem with dictorship is our birth right but we want like Sultan , Badshah who does not care but just want to do good. We will have no democracy as this land is full of idiots and is not fertile to produce democracy but can only sustain dictectorship like weed survives in bad lands and not mango tree. So we need benovelent dic. who will tell people to do right things or will whip. I like story of Ranjitsingh. One useless Fakir went to his court and told him that allah has come in his dream and wants he be given 100 rupees. Ranjit told him allah has told him to give him 50 lashes of whipping and he did that and allah`s wishes were carried out. I will support any despot only he makes people to control breeding and give place for breathing.
If you want to get to problem then you have to go to source of problem and you have to go against current. Musharaff will be great if he can control fertility or we can go on building roads and there will be always over crowding.
Good night.