The Spirit of Pakistan is Failing

Lofty words do not mean anything.

When all is said and done, the ``spirit`` of Pakistan was exclusivist - to make distinction among men based on the accident of their religion of birth. The end result of such ``spirit`` was predictable - based on simple common sense. Those who believe in making no such distinction should shed no tears on the ``spirit`s`` demise.

It never had a physical basis!

I believe that those who stoked the fires of communal tension and brought the mayhem of religion-specific slaughter to the subcontinent, flooding it with rivers of blood ought to be yanked out of wherever they hide - even their graves, and hung by their necks!

Saddam Hussein, now executed, could not hold a tiny candle to such people - those devil-incarnates!!!

I never thought that I would agree substantively with bjkumar on much. But I do agree entirely with him/her about #1. However, I wish he had not descended to #2.

As for the article it is true that Pakistan is better than it was under the previous general, Zia (interpret him as darkness!). However, I do not understand what scuttled Mushrraf`s early declared efforts to modernize Pakistan to a more acceptable state. May be he himself did not do enough to achieve all he outlined.

However, it is quite possible that before the end of the first decade of 21st century, Pakistan will split into three or four states.

first dibs on calling gandhi a racist casteist hindu nazi bastard...

manto...eat yer heart out....

Re: # 3

i never wish to enter in any kind of debate when both sides would have their conviction in the subject. but what pushes me to write is this mindset of seeing pakistan dissected into three or i-dont-know how many units forgetting about the basis of the nature of international relations. such an article or thinking could also have been taken as a comment of resistance against the situation that does not fit in the norms of a normal social or governance behavior but...three parts...four parts...five parts...six pa......

i would never get into a debate like this pointing daughters being exchanged in UP against a pair of dogs, missionaries being lynched alive with kids, mosques demolished and low-caste (whatever that means) people persecuted under a certain religion...or even eminent people writing about the ``end of india!`` spirit does matter and the ones who understand it, understand. the ones who dont, dont.

i would strongly suggest physicists doing physics and chemists doing chemistry etc.

Re: # 5, mubakr:

What you want to discuss and avoid is your choice. But your wail needed an evaluation and response.

Now, I can fully understand that my comments were like salt on your wounds. But I am sorry truth is truth.

The truth is that the entire delusion of Pakistan was a foolish and pernicious trick played by Jinnahs and Liyaqats as has been amply established by the honest and wise muslims like Azad and Zakaria.

I further assert that Pakistani spirit shall inevitably fail and it MUST. My only apprehension is the in its disintegration Pakistan State will hurt India.

Re: # 6

Go easy there big man... don`t be so harsh on J-man... after all, a vast number of muslims did want and voted for creation of pakistan...

Spirit of pakiland is certainly failing... but all is not lost yet... there is still time to pull back and recover - as long as pakis focus on the basics...

The pakistan spirit... in my opinion, that is epitomized in Jinnah`s words:`` Justice, fair-play, impartiality.`` This messae has been most brutally manipulated; so much so,in fact, that it now exists merely in the form of words- it is absent from the hearts. Why? Maybe because now,there are no more ``Pakistanis`` as Jinnah envisioned them- there are only people leeching off whatever Pakistan has to offer, never feeling an ounce of gratitude. Why, then should there be a ``Paksiatn spirit``?

Re: # 1

The spirit of Pakistan was not ``exclusivist``; it was a decision based upon FACTS as much as ideology. The creators of Pakistan did not want to create a state for Muslims because they were convinced of Muslim ``superiority`` or Hindu ``inferiority``, but because living together was NOT FEASIBLE for the two communities.
Had future generations of Pakistanis not terribly misconstrued it all, the reation of Pakistan SHOULD HAVE benefitted hindus AS MUCH AS Muslims of the sub-continent..

Butt Sahib,
I applaud you for expressing your true feelings without the sugarcoating of the unholy and much abused trinity of Jinnah, Islam, and Koran. The reason for for the common malaise among Pakistanis is that the foundation of our country rests upon the cracking bones of the murdered and butchered held together not too firmly by the stench of the innocents` blood.

Any nation that refuses to take back or even acknowledge its own unfortunate citizens, stranded in another country, deserves to be dismantled, humiliated, castrated, hanged, and flogged in a public parking lot.

If you don`t respect or love your own people, how are you going to save the world from all the evils that beset it. The Holy Koran requires us to save the world from evil - instead we have rapidly become that evil. May Allah forgive Jinnah and all the rascals that followed him in office - from the stupid Liaquat Ali Khan to the stupid and diabolical Mushy Mush Mush. Too bad we only had enough rope for Bhutto and none for his cohorts.

Only if Pakistani founders had made Spirit of ISLAM as the basis rather than superior inferior feudalistic distinction of being RULiNG moghul history when majority (democracy) of muslims where not Moghuls or Ghourie descendents

Pakistan is a failed state because Musharaf and the Army is ruling the country. They exist at the expense of Pakistan. While nothing has been done to change course, and the country slips from a failed state toward a train wreck, there are many elements which still exist that can be used and acted upon to alter disintegration.

It`s a futile exercise trying to put some conclusion to the exercise of partition in 1947. Justification for Pakistan and what it should be or should not be is irrelevant and uncessary to solving today`s problems. The problems stem from Army rule and an utter disregard for institutional development (whose most prominent manifestation is again in Musharaf`s parasitic rule). The framework, the institutions necesary for building a state exist.

Hi all,
Pakistan is failing because...
It is more severely afflicted by a malaise spread deeply all over the islamic world.
Its symptoms are as under:-
1 - An all encompassing arrogance ..a feeling of superiority..
(by associating itself with wrong type of conquerors..looters like gaznavi / Ghouri ..without pausing to wonder if their ``role models`` were really islamic heroes or just plain rascals out for a quick booty and women they could enjoy and dispose of as they willed under a religious sanction).
There are good ordinary people in this ummah even today ..who sincerely believe in mal -e - ghanimat ..even sharing and using women of ``plundered people`` as valid islamic duty!!

2 - Complete failure to isolate religion rom the state.

3 - An unexplainable love of power and tendency to extoll the source of that power.
(That is why not a whimper of protest at any excesses committed by islamic people on others! Till date no one has been prosecuted even in absentia for the genocide in BANGLADESH but look at the pious shouts of complicity regarding Gujarat / palestine / Iraq)!!

4 - A Sort of gut hate for all things ``percieved as western``
That includes studying science.
We have mullahs debating solemnly on TV about wearing watches during prayer is haram or not!!
And psychotic euro-converts touted on state television saying ``allah`s wrath was causing earth quakes!

5 - Watching a ``pakistan image improvement`` documentary very much touted on ary or some such channel..i expected some nice cultural thing / scientefic achievements..but what does one see?
A guy wailing in the background something vaguely sounding like ``anarkali``..!
A pompous religio-military music and visuals of ghauri and tanks!!
How much can a government ``miss a point``?

6 - Unquestioning robotic will to ``do anything for Islam.
result?
Mindless suicide bombings !

Last but not the least, a blind faith in the power of (no not allah) but saudi arabia to strike terror in the heart of the world IF...(IT IS USUALLY A PROGRESSION OF IFS..
IF NOT KASHMIR
IF THEY KILL SADDAM
IF IRAQ ID CONQUERED..

I still remember how one INDIAN MUSLIM rien in the gulf only 2 days ago pompously warned ..
``SAUDI ARABIA VAAT LAGA DALEGA SABKI AGAR SADDAM MARA TO``

Wah how mean can Islamic ``dada-giri`` get?
In UK they are already dictating foreing policy guided by above ``AISA KAR O VARNA`` ..stuff.

In the end as a result ``yeh to homa hi tha``!!.

Here is an interesting perspective why pakis are failing: Blaming others for their own problems...

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2006 12 31 story_31-12-2006_pg3_3

``Qadeer writes that the Pakistani way of perceiving and apprehending reality has been forged in the crucible of an agrarian economy and caste-clan relations. While being an evolving structure of many different parts, the Pakistani mindset is marked by a set of persistent assumptions. We tend to personalise the impersonal. Whether the event to be explained is a flood, poverty, a child’s truancy or marital unhappiness, it is attributed to someone else’s manipulation, malevolent intentions — and when it is something positive — to outside goodwill. The prime mover of every event is believed to be a person. Social or economic processes and even physical forces play a secondary role in the standard Pakistani narrative.``

#12 rozaiba {``Pakistan is a failed state because Musharaf and the Army is ruling the country. ...It`s a futile exercise trying to put some conclusion to the exercise of partition in 1947. Justification for Pakistan and what it should be or should not be is irrelevant and uncessary to solving today`s problems.``}

Rozaiba,
You sound like the mob that wants to lynch the chowkidar for the collapse of a building due to the contractor`s use of substandard cement.

Re: # 15

Wrong analogy Chauhan. The chowkidars play all the roles - they are the contractors, the sub-contractors and the manufacturers of the sub-standard cement.