Huntington's Clash of Civilizations Thesis

Mr. Asadi, there are shades of George Orwell`s masterpiece 1984 in your characterization of ``Clash of Civilizations``.... i.e. endless war with an enemy who isn`t much different from you.

Both Islamic and Western civilizations adhere to the same capitalist model of political economy. So there is no clash of economic ideologies either.

Of the 50 Islamic states in the world, only a handful are monarchies and/or tyrannical dictatorships (which ironically are supported by the U.S.). Most of the Islamic states are either fully democratic or quasi-democratic. If there was a clash of political systems, the Americans could easily address this by withdrawing support for the Saudis... instead of mounting a war.

The clash of civilizations is really a bid to control the energy resources of the world, because the two civilizations don`t have too many disagreements to speak of.

#233 by dost-mittar on February 6, 2007 2:09pm PT


Only someone with a chip on his shoulder would see that thread as an endorsement of jihadis in Kashmir.


Anyone using an article about rioting muslims to imply that gujrat was somehow legitimate is an apologist for chaddi fascism...

it`s like this...If I post a thread titled ``They wonder why men become rapists`` and the body of the thread has an article about how a man was repeatedly dumped/turned down by women, I am effectively rationalizing the act of raping..which under no circumstances should be justifiable..

that`s why you are an apologist for jihadi terrorism...

arjun2#231:


Only someone with a chip on his shoulder would see that thread as an endorsement of jihadis in Kashmir.

Re: # 229
Dear Mr Chouhan or Chauhan or whatever,

It is not a crime in English to spell wrongly a Proper Noun. And it certainly is not Adharma, if you would care to know.
And definitely it doesn`t look like a name that needs to be diligently spelt correctly anyway.

#228 by dost-mittar on February 6, 2007 10:00am PT


by the US war-mongering machine to formulate his `clash` theory. And since the so-called war on terror was triggered by the 9/11 event, does the author believe also in the conspiracy theories regarding the forces behind that fateful event?



DM: I asked you a question on your UP thread...If someone was to post a thread titled ``And they wonder why gujrat happens`` and in the body, they post some incident of a muslim mob rioting against hindus who refused to shut their shops to protest the saddam hangings, would that person be an apologist for the chaddi fascists?

re #227
Why do Pakistanis hate heeng so much? It comes from a plant that is native to Iran and grows primarily in Afghanistan and Iran.... you guys should be stuffing it right up your Central Asian wazoo...

#203 loksevak {``Chouhan,
Aurangzeb`s peer is Shivaji. After killing Afzal Khan at Pratapgad, Shivaji buried Afzal and built a kabar for him, which still exist. The name of Aurngabad in Maharashtra is not yet changed. ...This exhibit will show to Indians that the state power needs to be in the hands of people with higher consciousness for Dharma to prevail. When Indians did not care who rules in Delhi, the result is the worst among us got the chance to destroy dharma (Natural Law and Justice) and spread Adharma (Violence, which violates natural justice). The seed of this ``worst`` is the undue attachment to the distant ideology ... it may not be even an idea but mere material book of ``words`` in alien language you do not understand or relate. ``}

Dear Mr. Loksevak,
For someone who is so proud of Dharma you sure haven`t learned to spell Chauhan. Yes, the Hindu name is Chauhan and NOT Chouhan - so much for your Adharma against my very Indian roots. :)
I am all for independence, for self-government, and for righteousness. Unlike you, I do not use selective events from history to justify current actions that may border on fascism.

BTW, I am glad you discovered Sivaji`s talents at playing undertaker or was it taxidermy that you had in mind?

I do not agree with Huntington but I am more sympathetic to Tariq Ali`s formuatlion of a clash of fundamentalisms.

But what I do find somewhat incongruous is the condemnation of Huntington by those who are quite willing to obey/follow/worship (choose the word to suit your sensibilities!) the man who originally coined this concept almost fourteen centuries ago.

As far as the article itself is concerned, the autor could bring more credibility to his hypothesis if he were to provide evidence that Huntington was supported by the US war-mongering machine to formulate his `clash` theory. And since the so-called war on terror was triggered by the 9/11 event, does the author believe also in the conspiracy theories regarding the forces behind that fateful event?

masadi mian,

``made India into a peon generating whore of the US``

..... you really need to get out of the cave that you are living in ........ look around and start reading the business and technology journals instead of poring over heavenly text of dubious origin ..........

.......... as much as i chide the horrible hindoos for risking their miserable lives by squatting on the railroad tracks, it is a fact that india is `rising` ....... every business meeting or seminar i attend - whether it is about automotive parts or it - india figures prominently ....... heck, the main theme at half the major conferences concerns china and india ............many of the us `power elite` that you talk about are scared silly of the indians (and chinese) are are bending over backwards to accomodate the head-wagging heeng-eaters ........ less than a year ago i was involved in sourcing more than 300m in precision forgings and complex injection molded parts from india and grounding the corporate jets of at least half a dozen us `power elites` .............. and no, it was not all based on wage arbitrage - bharat forge had the best technology in some cases ....... in the it services sector some of the best salesmen for ibm, hp, eds and accenture now work for infosys, wipro, satyam, l&t, tcs and patel systems ..............what does that tell you ?

........... and you can see it in the attitude of the younger indian generation - they walk tall and proud unlike miserable folks like you who slink around in the shadows wearing suicide belts and beating their women out of frustration...........

p.s. this does not mean that i have changed my opinion about idlee and heeng in general ......

masadi mian, why are you jealous of the brothers who made it in the west. You appear to be like the one arm bandit, hanging from the roof of a house and having an itch in your balls.......

just curious!

Re: # 220

What is wrong in tweaking the system ? It is called adjusting to new realties. You accuse the elites of adjusting to new realties. What about the masses ? They adjust to new realities. They have new often higher levels of expectations.

bbabu mian, atleast provide some decent examples to support your case, there are immoral people among people of color no doubt but comparing the higher immorality of the US elite in the harms it causes worldwide, while claiming to civilized, is like comparing apples to oranges. The examples of the few tiny countries you give that have managed to develop better economies, ignoring South Korea and Taiwan, whose development is more a result of political manuvering by the US vis a vis its enemies, are too small to be considered examples , these kinds of exceptions when the vast majority of humanity the over half the population of the globe that languishes in extreme poverty and is colored, is of no consequence. Or do you mean to tell me that the corporations whose heads or previous heads dominate the president`s cabinet and who consider the world as their labor camp will tolerate higher or equal wages in the third world due to a rising standard of living and will tolerate industrialization so that third world products compare and compete with their own. Do they have a suicide wish when they are accumulating profits and capital and unforseen rates? Get real.

While the rest of the world has graduated to aviation as a mode of transportation, Masadi’s Khoti is stuck in the colonial mud.

ranjit writes <<< India has followed an independent foreign policy and even economic policy. It has never given the US carte blanche on any decision.... >>>

Is that why you were cursing those elite that chose independence and praising those that have now made India into a peon generating whore of the US? Atleast be consistent in your analysis...

Re: # 216

`` My dear friend, we are talking about social institutions, institutions that by definition are viable, while people occupying the various statuses in them might change. You can be sure that anyone who has succeeded within a skewed instution has been adapted and controlled enough so that doing what the structure of the institution requires has become second nature to them, otherwise they would end up at a position of no consequence. There is an order to how the world is governed and that order just does not happen because all the colored folk decided to be corrupt or harm their own folk while all the white folk are decent and hard working people. This is the mythology of superior/inferior generated by these elite and forced upon the rest of the world where poverty is concentrated predominantly among the colored races. ``

There is enormous poverty in Eastern Europe and Russia. It has lead to massive sexual exploitation of East European/Russian women.

South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore, Chile have graduated from third world status to quasi first world status without any oil bonzana.

You conveniently ignore that wealth needs a legal and political framework to survive. It is hard to create wealth when it is okay to take it away from individuals who earn/create them.

The list of examples where poor colored people have found it convenient to disregard the rule of law is long ....

1. Indonesian Muslims found it convenient to kill their Chinese minority because they were more successful.

2. Malays in Malayasia openly discriminate against the Chinese minority because they are afraid of Chinese community success.

3. Robert Mugabe would rather expel White farmers than feed his people

4. Idi Amin did Uganda no favor by expelling 20,000 Asian businessmen

ranjit writes <<< Inadvertently you are taking a bunch of human beings and giving them omnipotent status of being able to control everything in this world, thus showing your deep down inferiority complex with respect to white people >>>

Don`t try to swing the mullah vote in your favor by trying to cling to theology, when I am suggesting no such thing. The elite do control the lives and livlihood of billions that work in their corporations and cities and depend on their crumbs but this does not make them omnipotent. At times of crisis, they have been forced to compromise but this compromise was not due to the elites that are their lackeys it came from conscious people who managed to organize. Once their demands were incorporated, be it in a dilued form, as in the Civil Rights Act etc, this elite did everything to neutralize any and every gain but they cannot always contain the fallout. The capitalists were forced to incorporate socialism into the workings of their economy in the form of the New Deal, why do you think that happened? because they read Marx and liked him? No, because they understood that if they didn`t institutionalize these mild reforms their entire system might collapse. That hardly tells me that they are omnipotent. Managing deprivation has now become their hallmark, and using explicit force as their lackeys do in the third world is much more tenuous and leaves open the possibility of change than does the bureaucratized control in the developed world. Let the third world conquer the basic needs of its people and then witness the challenges to these elite....