Girls Gone Wild

Re: # 1613
teshah,
I have one word for you huh???? You are either not from Pakistan or are compeltely oblivious to the political system in Pakistan. MQM ahs a big say in Karachi and not Punjab or Islamabad. What could have theey done to vacate those girls. They just showed the mullahs to not even think about doing the same thing in Karachi. MQM is striving to become a national party (help with the quake victim being an example) but it is not theere yet. What they could do was voice in the assemblies their displeasure with the government handling of this situation and they did that. What else do you want. At least MQM was better than Bezamir and Besharif (like the names-maybe they will stick). By the way I hope you are not a Punjabi tring to tell people how bad MQM is. Did anyone notice the hair job Nawaz has done. Can someone ask if this was also with the money he stole from the people of Pakistan. And one advice to Benazir - Shut the *&!@ up!
Zeena, I was happy to read your answer. Hope you do much more for Pakistan. Regarding the Hafza girls I dont agree with you because I dont think it has anything to do with woman empowerment. If it was I would be happy to support it. I just hope that these girls dont get hurt by their ignorance. They should stop listening to these mullahs and listen to their parents. They will not achieve anything and they should realize that the only reason they are still occupying the children`s library is not because their school is very powerful and these nullahs are backing them but because the government despite pressure from almost every person in Pakistan is reluctant to use force. I hope they learn from this and actually do things to empower women and not just take dandas in their hands at the behest of these mullahs.

Dear Zeena,

You are really a simpleton (take the meaning `innocent plus simple hearted`) like the JH girls.

I have been the one who always tried to stop others to even talk to you. But I have decided to give a little bit of try myself. Kindly try to take me seriously.

I am convinced that you are not in favour of Mullas or Islamization of Pak. You are sympathetic to MM. You are against violence against DVD shops. You are against prostitution. I and many others who you call liberals (and this term encompasses many religious people too) have the same view as yours on all these issues. Then where is the difference? I will tell you what. The difference lies in perception.

As things stand, we too are not as such against these burka clad girls themselves because these too are simple hearted, innocent young girls. In their innocence these girls have allowed themselves to be used by JH maulanas for their nasty aims which, I am afraid, have the potential of damaging Pak irreparably because these obscurantist Mullahs want Pak to be Islamized. They want Pak to be a 7th century nation which I hope you too don`t approve of.

You will appreciate that in war the front line soldiers take the whole beating. Even if the soldier is a kind hearted, God fearing, simple man he will be killed before he could kill the opponent. That is what is happening in this case. Because these girls have, in their naivety, become soldiers of Mullahs they are being condemned by peace loving people around the world. In the heart of the heart we all pity them. But if they resort to violence what a sane person can do other than to denounce them. The same is happening here. Even after being such a nice lady you get all the wrong words just because you are seen to be in the grip of Mullahs. So try to distance yourself from the ideology of fanaticism. Not only you should be correct, you should look correct too to get respect.

I don`t know who are you, or how old are you. I have tried to make you understand like I do with my simpleton mother or my cousin little Aisha who don`t dare touch my computer now.

If you find these words worthless even now, I earnestly, with folded hands request you to at least give a heed to the advice of the Chowk representative of the Mullahs, you better know who.

And last but not the least I take back all my words which you think are against you or derogatory to you. I can`t bear to have teased or mocked a lady who is only too simple to understand what is good for her, her society and her nation.

Samar

neembu sister

and you also wrote[[This issue-chowk`s absolute refusal to deal with evilness of its cyberharrasers-has been the one fatal flaw of this website. Under the misbegotten and plain delusional notions of ``free speech``, they have allowed almost every kind of cyber harrassment on this website-the kind of internet abuse that could qualify as hate speech, lose people their jobs, result in people`s being assaulted at their workplaces. No website is worth that risk]]]


And why this selective double standards from your part?
You are the part and parcel of your cyberharrasser abusive chowk gang for me for NO reason at all.

You and your abusive gang has had been personally attacking me, cyberharrassing me non stop. Why?

Both of us never even met , then what was your beef with me?

Why you supported all kinds of harrassement for me? And you are still supportinmg it here on un plugged and also on FP( HF article).

When your abusive gang members were cyberharrassing me, you encouraged them more and actually took equal part.

You have had been provoking fights with me by showing obsessive attitude for me. You have never been sincere in any efforts to interact with decency with me.

Now, all of a sudden , the establishment of these moral values......wawawawa

When someone abuses and harrasses you, that is called cyberharrassement and that is absolutely wrong.

But, when on same token you and your abusive brigade with multiple nicks cyberharrassed me(and you encourage them), that is quite alright and acceptable for you.

This is called, perfect hypocrisy......

As if I am not someone`s wife, daughter or sister......just think about it.

Now, call your female and male brigade to abuse me more with more multiple nicks.......you are quite an honest and fair person, sister neembu...just think about it....



[-X[-X:((:((

neembu sister
You wrote in your i-log{These kinds of double standards were defended by you. And this was not a ``UP/FP`` distinction ]]

And these are the kinds of double standards by you as well.

Just think about it......

from neembu`s i-logs................
[[[I am only critiquing their policies towards cyber harrassment which is short sighted, lazy and non committal. [[[Currently there are a few interactors who continue to refer to respected interactors as prostitutes, etc. {{Why would this be acceptable to any normal human being?]]]


I just wished to show the mirror to this highly decent intellectual interactyor, called neembu.

Ms.neembu
You are the one who came up on this Ms.Shandana`s FP article about HF sisters and STRONGLY SUPPORTED to legalize PROSTITUTION as a normal profession. And you are the one who strongly supported to legalize drug trafficking as well.

Well,

This is the height of hypocrisy that I just wished to show you.

Now, come up with more sickness.

Don`t forget to call your abusive brigade....LOL

PS:- When I was constantly saying the samething over and over again, you were constantly fighting with me and started all sorts of personal attacks for me.

Well, I am done with you . And, my case is closed here.

Thank you very much for this.....just think about it.

Besides, Manto

[[I never wished to see Pakistan as some sort of religious state..............My stand is totally different based on my own views and values that I am raised with. And I am quite sure, these people who have had been protesting agree with the same values as any average Pakistani is raised with and I am also sure, you`re also holding the same basic values.]]
Yes, I agree with each and every word that you said.

Except, that I have slightly different stand on this issue.
If, I will see some good efforts from any source(regardless), I will always appreciate that effort at that time.

But, if, suppose the same source will do something negative next time, I will never appreciate that source..............

Thanks again for your decent way of interactions. I will always love to support your views in a positive way and even if we disagree upon something, we will disagree with dignity as we always do.

I just read MQM agenda, yes MQM is a good addition against feudalism, which is the main culprit in the backwardness of Pakistan.

Mullahs are very few in active politics, and if they are, they are being used by these feudal politicians who are never sincere in their efforts..........]]]
Thanks
The main culprit in Pakistani Politics is feudalism. Just think about it.

My only question is, if, MQM is sincere in it`s efforts, then when will MQM have exactly the same kind of rally against the real culprits , feudal lords?

80% of Pakistani population is rural and they are hijacked by these corrupt and cruel feudal lords.

If, you really wish to see Pakistan as progressive secular state, then eradicate these feudals.....

And you know what, these feudals are the ones who are using Mullahs for their own corrupt politics.

I will not trust MQM untill they will NOT do anything against feudals.

manto

Yes, I am ready to support MQM`s agenda against all the points mentioned below, except I will still stand for Hafsa brave clads, who stood for the moral corruption.

I will not take their stand as a religious issue, but, as a moral one.

Whatever happened in Lal Mosque and latter ( burning cds etc).....is unacceptable.

If, MQM is really sincere in it`s efforts then they have to expand their issue throughout Pakistan.

And, not only that they should also try to eradicate corrupt Police , corrupt and weak law and order in Pakistan , which is very biased and which is very selective based on your status.



[[I never wished to see Pakistan as some sort of religious state..............My stand is totally different based on my own views and values that I am raised with. And I am quite sure, these people who have had been protesting agree with the same values as any average Pakistani is raised with and I am also sure, you`re also holding the same basic values.]]
Yes, I agree with each and every word that you said.

Except, that I have slightly different stand on this issue.
If, I will see some good efforts from any source(regardless), I will always appreciate that effort at that time.

But, if, suppose the same source will do something negative next time, I will never appreciate that source..............

Thanks again for your decent way of interactions. I will always love to support your views in a positive way and even if we disagree upon something, we will disagree with dignity as we always do.

I just read MQM agenda, yes MQM is a good addition against feudalism, which is the main culprit in the backwardness of Pakistan.

Mullahs are very few in active politics, and if they are, they are being used by these feudal politicians who are never sincere in their efforts..........]]]
Thanks

I reject Gandhiism in all its forms and manifestations.

The people of Pakistan have risen up against religio-fascist tyranny by these Fascist Islamists who were the original enemies of Pakistan and Racist Casteist Hindu Fascist Bigot Gandhi`s allies in 1947.... Also rally in Lahore on Thursday...



Massive rally against ‘Lal Masjid Sharia’


By Habib Khan Ghori

KARACHI, April 15: The Muttahida Qaumi Movement on Sunday staged a massive rally in the city against what it called the threat of ‘Kalashnikov Sharia’ of Islamabad’s Lal Masjid clerics and asserted that Islam did not allow enforcement of Sharia by force and Pakistan had not been created to be turned into a theological state.

In a telephonic address from London, party chief Altaf Hussain quoted profusely from the Holy Quran and Hadith to substantiate his attack on religious extremism. He said that extremists were defaming Islam and maligning the name of Pakistan and because of their acts of violence and terrorism, India, Afghanistan and other countries were describing Pakistan as a sanctuary of terrorists. He described the scholars supporting the Sharia of Lal Masjid and Jamia Hafsa as “Ulema-i-Sou” and said they were misleading the country and the people.

The venue of the rally was the vast expanse of M.A. Jinnah Road from the Square of the Quaid’s Mausoleum to the Tibet Centre pedestrian bridge, jampacked by people who had come from all parts of the city and the interior of Sindh.

Mr Hussain spoke for more than one and a half hours, during which two helicopters were seen hovering over the area.

Referring to Lal Masjid and Jamia Hafsa, the MQM chief alleged that the mosque and the Jamia, built on encroached land, had been occupied by armed terrorists and because of their actions the world was pointing fingers at Pakistan.

“For God’s sake don’t destroy Pakistan,” he said and termed the rally a referendum against the ‘Kalashnikov Sharia’. He said Ulema from different schools of thought had ruled that the enforcement of Sharia by force was against Islam.

He cited the Quaid’s speech of August 11, 1947 about equality of all citizens of Pakistan, whether Muslims, Christian, Parsi or of any other faith, and freedom for all of them to go to and offer prayers in their places of worship.

He said the rally demanded that Ulema should issue a Fatwa if construction of a mosque or a religious seminary on an encroached and illegally occupied land was justified?

Some Ulema belonging to different schools of thought, who were present at the rally, said it was illegal and that offering prayers or getting religious education in such mosques and seminaries was not allowed. They pointed out that Masjid-i-Nabavi, which was the first mosque built in Madina by Prophet Muhammad (SAW), was built only after the land had been purchased by the Prophet (SAW).

Allama Aun Mohammad Naqvi (Fiqah-i-Jafria), Dr Abdul Khaliq Pirzada (Barelvi school of thought) and Amir Abdullah Farooqui (Ahl-i-Hadith) came to the podium and said offering prayers in a mosque built on an encroached plot of land was against Sharia.

The MQM chief appealed to Ulema, intellectuals, women’s organisations and moderate, enlightened and liberal sections of the society to raise their voices against and expose the “Ulema-i-Sou” who were calling for demolition of girls’ schools and wanted to deprive women and children of their right to get education. He said the right had been given to women by our Prophet (SAW) who had declared the acquiring of education an obligation of every man and woman. The Muslims, he added, would not be able to catch up with developed nations if they did not get modern education.

He said the MQM was against the “Ulema-i-Sou” who were using the name of Islam to advance their vested interests. “Let us pledge today that we won’t be fooled by these people using the name of Islam for achieving their political objectives,” he said and urged the people to maintain sectarian harmony. “We want to make Pakistan a peaceful, democratic, welfare and liberal state.”

Mr Hussain said his party would support Ulema who would raise voice against extremists.

I wish to post nycoolest very nice comments here on this board from un plugged.

[[[#80 by nycoolest on April 15, 2007 5:35pm PT
{#23 by Zeena on April 15, 2007 3:10pm PT
#1602 nycoolest sahib

I never wished to see Pakistan as some sort of religious state..............My stand is totally different based on my own views and values that I am raised with. And I am quite sure, these people who have had been protesting agree with the same values as any average Pakistani is raised with and I am also sure, you`re also holding the same basic values.
}

Zeena, Thanks for your post. I was clear in my mind that our disagreement of Hafsa issue is not over the values; it`s rather the implementation of these values by the people who can`t be trusted. I have a lot of respect for your POVs you expressed in past. I believe you support in human rights, rule of law and freedom of speech in Pakistani society. Yes, I agreed these people in the rally have not come forward in the support of prostitution and banning Burqas... ( ) they are rather here to show support against the dandas, Kalashnikovs and threats being made against civil liberties in Pakistan. }}

nycoolest sahib
Thanks for your positive comments. That shows your sincere efforts to take few minutes of your precious time to read my post with open heart and mind.

Yes, I agree with each and every word that you said.

Except, that I have slightly different stand on this issue.
If, I will see some good efforts from any source(regardless), I will always appreciate that effort at that time.

But, if, suppose the same source will do something negative next time, I will never appreciate that source..............

Thanks again for your decent way of interactions. I will always love to support your views in a positive way and even if we disagree upon something, we will disagree with dignity as we always do.

I just read MQM agenda, yes MQM is a good addition against feudalism, which is the main culprit in the backwardness of Pakistan.

Mullahs are very few in active politics, and if they are, they are being used by these feudal politicians who are never sincere in their efforts..........]]]

#1602 nycoolest sahib

I never wished to see Pakistan as some sort of religious state..............My stand is totally different based on my own views and values that I am raised with. And I am quite sure, these people who have had been protesting agree with the same values as any average Pakistani is raised with and I am also sure, you`re also holding the same basic values.

For your eyes, I am re posting my previous post here. Post is lengthy. Please, read it carefully and try to not to ignore it and only then you will understand my whole stand for this issue.

Please, read it without any bias like majority of interactors have had been doing here on this board.

You and I have had agreed in past, when there was an issue about some abusive mirzaii chowkies on UN Plugged who have had been insulting our Holy Prophet(PBUH) in the most derogatory way possible. I hope you remember...........

So, here is my long post for your eyes only.

I hope you will take time to read it. Thanks
[[[#1562 by Zeena on April 13, 2007 8:00pm PT
#1547 by hasanmahmood sahib
With all due respect, Let me once more try to clear my POV on this issue and I will honestly answer all your questions one by one.

I am not just passing the time, trust me, If, I would have been passing this time, I would have been shopping or watching movies. But, instead I am here writting to you with all the honesty and fairness of my heart.

I strongly hope that you will read and will try to understand my POV with broad mind, enlightened moderation and without being fascist. I appreciate that you never ever tried to harass me, never ever abused me, always tried to interact with me with respect and with your dignity and trust me that is the only reason I am taking your interact seriously and is trying to respond to you with equal respect.

First of all, I am extremely disappointed by the way, my opponents have ganged up against me, including Males and ONE Female on this board and tried their best to harass me, abuse me , call me names and did everything under the sun to make me change my POV particularly on this very issue.

Let me ask you, Suppose right now I say, alright (HF girls are wrong, they are the worst humans on this earth) and all of you who abused me on this board just for one SIN that I supported a good act by HF girls only on this web site( are right and are very fine humans), I just gave my opinion. So, they gave me punishment for speaking up my independent MIND, so, they slashed me with their tongue blades just for standing up for my freedom of expression..................yes, they are very fine humans..........

So, what example did they set for me to look up to? What exemplary behavior they set for me to follow their POV`s? What act of decency did they establish here on this board that I should start worshipping them instead?
This is just an anon web site, where different interactors are supposed to come with their unflinching idealism and give their own POV`s. Without getting personal.

If, you re read all my posts and compare them to the ones who abused me, personally attacked me, collected all kinds of personal informations about me and tried their best to harass me.

I could have done the worst , but, all I did I kept on repeating my POV and did not surrender. And they made it their life to come to this board and harass me more.They made it their life and death type of a situation to abuse me and to personally attack me without even understanding my POV............

Only, you are the first and probably last interactor who took his precious time and asked me all these questions with the honesty of your heart. I smelled the fairness in this post of your`s and that is the main reason, I am answering your queries............You did not try to personally attack me, you did not collect all kinds of information about me to attack me out of some unknown personal REVENGE.........GOD(ALMIGHTY) KNOWS why? I am speechless on few ineractors here, they crossed all their limits of decency and they forgot that this is just a web site................We are perfect strangers for eachother.......Nothing personal..........But, I guess this is another lesson that I learned from this web site........................for my future plans and projects............

Well, even then I will be calm, composed and collected. Only my God(Almighty) is my witness. If I am true or NOT.

Now, let me answer your questions one by one............

#1:{{You ask me whether I want an Islamic state to not. Of course I do. But a true Islamic state, where nobody has a fear of living according to his/her own beliefs. I don`t want a Pakistan where people like Zeemax and their convoluted theories are in majority. I don`t want a Pakistan where these mullahs can take the law into their own hands without any fear of reprisals. I don`t want a Pakistan where you cannot say anything wrong about a dari-walla for the fear of prosecution. I don`t want a Pakistan where Mullahs tell me what and what Not to do. I want a Pakistan where people learn to live with each other. I do care about your POV not because I want to change it but because I do think of you as an intelligent person.]]]

Answer:- hasanmahmood sahib

Let me be honest with you here. I am absolutely NOT asking you to have an Islamic state.Show me a single post by me, where did I ask you to have an Islamic state? Never. of course I do not wish to see Pakistan as Islamic state. I wish to see Pakistan as a secular country, where each and every religious belief is equally respected , where people are free to practice their moral beliefs without any fear of extremism or fanaticism or Mullahism or dictatorship of any kind, where no one can play power or God, where all citizens (poor or rich) regardless of their status are treated with equal respect and dignity.Where , whether you are Mullah or NOT Mullah, no one should be above law.

And same goes for the ones who call themselves Liberals, but, show extreme intolerance (Like this board is an alive example of such behavior) , where those of my opponents showed extreme hate for me . Why? Just B/c I supported HF girls stand for the right action. I did not do any gaali gaaloch for them. ONE Female even gathered all my personal information and personally attacked me, and harassed me, while other abused me with the vilest abuse possible.

I am never an extremist, rather trust me these pseudoMullahs ( in my real life ) call me (kafir), which I always laugh..............But, I know what I am and what I am not.

I do not need anyone`s approval or disapproval. And frankly I am proud of what I am with all my ideology and with all my good deeds that I have had been doing and will still do in future.Nothing can stop me for loving poor oppressed Pakistanis and nothing can stop me for standing up for the right actions...........Period.

#2:- [[As for as Zeemax is....trust me, we do not know each other, we are completely strangers for each other. Sometimes , we agree and sometimes we disagree. But, one thing is for sure, Zeemax has never insulted me even when I have disagreed with him on other issues.

Zeemax is an independent, matured, married with kids and professional interactor with extra energies. Trust me I do not have any kind of influence upon him and same way Zeemax doesn`t have any kind of influence upon my mind.

If, we agree on this issue, It doesn`t mean anything. Still, we both are independent individuals , free thinkers and I respect him and all of you who did not abuse me for their patience with me.

I do not come on chowk to make any kind of PR or any kind of gangs or groupies or friends. I have sufficient friends and NO enemy in my real life. I am happily married professional woman with great many projects accomplished and so much more ahead to be accomplished.

I love Chowk and may be like everyone else I am now little addicted to this web site...........LOL.........

# 3:-[[[He probably does not know that Muslims are hated and looked down upon in the whole world because of what they have become. he probably loves everyone who believes in everything these mullahs tell them without ever reading Koran. he probably encourages people NOT to read Koran but to listen to these mullahs]]]

Answer:-Again I am absolutely NOT answerable on behalf of Zeemax for all his opinions and ideologies. I am a kind of person , you can call a real open minded and free thinker, I hate to impose my POV`s on others. If, you disagree with me, It does not mean you are my enemy. If I agree with you, again It does not mean I am your friend. This is not a high school class room,{{ where your friends are my friends and your enemies are my enemies based on our agreements and disagreements on some issues.}}.

If, Zeemax loves Mullahs, let him be. If , Zeemax hates Mullahs , let him be. That doesn`t affect my mental and Physical health and I won`t hold grudges against some people based on their own individual ideology either. May be on next board, you and I will be in complete agreement on some issue. Does it mean we will be friends or enemies? NO, not all. We are matured nation and are proud to be Pakistanis and Muslims, of course.

If, you ask me , [[[that I do not know that Muslims are hated and looked down upon in the whole world}}
My answer for this for me( again I am not talking on behalf of Zeemax). is.....
I do not see any hate for Muslims among average Americans now, they do not care at all. They only care, if, they are being affected by the presence of Muslims. To be honest , they do not even care, if, Muslim women wear Burqa or no burqa at all. These are just our fears.

The point is how we present ourselves , while living abroad? I never have had any problem regarding that very matter. And why should I be guilty for the crime or sin that I haven`t done? I am as innocent as any other American citizen is and I am as innocent as any other Pakistani citizen could be. I am absolutely NOT answerable to those who are biased and bigots and who are generalizing all the Muslims based on racial or religious profiling. B/c I am NOT Mullah, I am NOT jihadi and I am absolutely NOT a Taliban, either.

# 5:-[[he probably loves everyone who believes in everything these mullahs tell them without ever reading Koran. he probably encourages people NOT to read Koran but to listen to these mullahs]]]

Again, I am not answerable to what Zeemax believes? And trust me, again the way I am, I will never get offended , if, he loves Mullahs or their ways. B/c this is his life, not mine. He is a free man to think and to do what is right for his mind. Who am I to brainwash HIM to change his POV to suit my mind?

Yes, If, you ask me the same question , for myself. My answer is...........NO I do not love Mullahs and their ways. I know their kind of Islam is just mis interpretation of Quran to suit their minds. I always call them Pseudos. But, I do not impose my ideology upon them either. I am comfortable with Mullahism, as long as they do not impose their kind of Islam upon me. As long as I am not being affected.

I am not in secured by their presence. Plus, they have very little role to play in the political arena of Pakistan. Majority of Politicians are NOT Mullahs.

I read Quran almost daily and then interpret with my own mind and trust me I trust my interpretations more than anyone else. Mullahs are absolutely NOT the owner of Islam. Islam is not their commodity. It is a true belief just like any other belief.

I always respect all beliefs equally, I never hurl abuses to other religions. B/c, I strongly believe , if, you wish them to respect your belief, then you got to respect their`s and vice versa. But, here on this web site.
Even though I do not abuse other`s beliefs and nationalities, majority of interactors hurl tons of unnecessary abuses for Islam and for Pakistan. That is unacceptable. Even then I do not cross my limits and do not lower myself to their level.

I do not blindly trust Mullahs............I trust myself and my Quranic interpretations more than anyone else and also I trust in valid Hadiths( I totally reject Invalid hadiths).

But, one thing is for sure, I stand up for the right action ..............no matter where it is coming from.

Like here on this board, I strongly believe Hafsa Brave clads did the right action( I do not need to repeat my thoughts on this stand all over again) If, you wish you can read my posts.

I believe , if, corrupt Police failed to give the basic right of living with peace of mind in their homes, the people have every right to stand up against their violation of rights. I strongly believe, this matter is the matter of social morality............If, you do not wish to live right next door to a brothel and drug trafficking and all the pornography, you have every right to raise your voice, if, your state failed to provide you the basic right to live in a decent neighborhood of your own choice.

Let me give you an example..............In America, when we move to a new neighborhood , what is the first thing of concern that we ask from our seller or home owner?

We always ask, if, this is a decent neighborhood? If, this is the right neighborhood to raise our kids? If, this is the crime free, drug free, prostitution free, brothel free neighborhood? If, this is a SAFE neighborhood to live with your peace of mind?

And we investigate before moving in............B/c we believe we have every right to live with our own values, with our own cultural mannerism, with our own preferences........................with our own choices.

And I believe , every decent and moral society( No matter which religion, no matter which country) set certain rules of ethics, set certain rules of dignity and certain set moral standards to abide by.

I lived in Pakistan, London, Canada, Scotland, Ireland, Italy, France and Bermuda and Dubai...............I did not see any difference in this code of conduct, which is universally acceptable. And with which I am raised.

If, Madam Shamim ( with all her illegal activities) wanted to perform such sorts of activities, my only stand was/is and will be she better would have moved to the area where she is accepted with all her ganged illegal activities...................................Line has to be drawn somewhere and there is absolutely NO excuse for Madam Shamim to perform her illegal and harassing activities in that particular family neighborhood. Period.

And, trust me there is much corruption at each and every level in Pakistan, which needs to be addressed. And, I am sure this is the wake up call and just the beginning of a new era.........

Isn`t it shame that Pakistan is considered a # 1 corrupt country in this world? Yes, I do feel shame........And I am sincere in my part to make this country as much corruption free as possible. I wish to see Pakistan as much progressed as possible. Trust me, I do............

Even, if, some jeans clads would have done this action( like Hafsa sisters), I would have appreciated them the same way.

Even, if, some Pakistani men( No matter beard or no beard), jeans or shalwaar Kameez, I would have supported their stand.


# 6:-[[[You, however have disagreed with him in the past on many occasions, so what I don`t understand is why you think that Jamai Hafzaa girls are so brave to stand up against the law and order. lets say Musharaf was not in power. Would you say the same thing if there was democracy in the country? ]]]

Answer:- Again, I already answered this question above about my disagreement with Zeemax.

Again, I will never ever recommend to take law and order in their hands at first place. I am very peaceful citizen myself.

But, if, Law and order failed to protect your rights, if, law and order are themselves corrupted your rights, if, law and order have lost their true face and values, if, there is very selective and biased law and order..........means if, law and order is only for a particular people and spare the rest of the people, if, law and order are weak............

Then If, I feel the need to take law in my hands , I will stand up for my self defense. No doubt about it.
why law and order are made? for the protection of people rights....If, they start violating their rights instead, then as a respectable citizen, I have every right to stand up for my basic right.............I believe , if, I will not stand up, then I am equally violating the law which is made for my protection.

If, I am being harassed in my own home , my first response will be to call Police. My second response will be AGAIN to call Police(depending upon the emergency of my need). But, in spite of my variable calls, if, Police won`t show up or ignore my requests..............then I will NOT surrender in front of harasser to let him/her do whatever he/she wishes to do. I will then play the role of Police myself. I will then become SELF POLICE, just to defend myself. Period.

# 7:-[[lets say Musharaf was not in power. Would you say the same thing if there was democracy in the country? ]]]

Answer:- Trust me, there is no question of democracy here. Suppose, there is NO Musharaf here and there is Imran Khan or BB or Nawaz Sharif as heads of state................I would have supported Hafsa brave clads the same way.

No matter what Governance it is( democracy or dictatorship), I would have done exactly the same thing.

I am not scared of burqa or Mullahs, they CAN not affect my ways of Life...........if, we live in Pakistan or In USA or anywhere in the world. I know what My stand is for...........It is not for mullahs establishment, it has got nothing to do with burqa.............this is the right action that was taken when everything else failed.

# 8:-[[[Would you say the same thing about thee hooligans who want to close down the music stores or burn the cinema houses down. When do you think it should stop?]]]

Answer:- Just go back and read all my posts..............Tell me one post where did I support Mullahs for Lal Masjid`s Incident? Show me where did I support their demands for closing down the music stores or burn film theaters(cinema houses)?

Again, I believe that Lal Masjid`s incident and other stuff is just that some pseudo Mullahs took advantage of this whole situation and got all nerved up for their own selfish agendas.

Yes, I will demand closing down of music stores, if, their NOISES disrupt my daily routine. If, their NOISES disturb my sleep and the sleeps of my neighborhood............if, I am studying and their noises are disturbing my studies..................Then I will inform the higher authorities or will try to discuss it out with the owners of Music stores about my problems, if, my family is sick........If, this can be settled down in a very nice and peaceful way, I will not take any action myself.

I do not have any problem with selling CDs or DVDs..........

Again, let me clear one more thing.........I think even Loud speakers in Mosques should be banned, if, they do disturb your sleep and your studies and your daily routine.

Back in the past, there were NO loud speakers in the mosques..........even then people used to pray with more enthusiasm...............

We do not need loud speakers at all for any purposes. I do not even like loud music in Pakistani transport as well...............

It has got nothing to do with religion..................

At the end...........hasanmahmood sahib

To you , your belief and to me my own................

Regards ]]]]]

Re: # 1593

Folio

Thank you dear for your kind comments. You are right: I do get frustrated when one gets irrationally biased and tries to insult common sense and intelligence which Zeena baji is persistently prone to do.

Re: # 1603

Thank you ZahraJ for sharing the point of view. I couldn`t say it better then what you have said in your post.

Punjab is too divided among different political parties. It is hard for them to sit together rather then having a rally or a united voice against a serious issue like this. The politics of destruction and hate is not progressive. Karachi had it before what Punjab is facing now. The current development and positive outcomes in karachi proves goals can be achieved.

Like Karachi government, If checks and balance are in place and the elected officials come from the awam rather been a feudal who have no clue and concerns about the common people, Punjab has a lot of potential for progress.

Re: # 1592

samar

Thank you dear Samar for correcting me. But what does it matter to Zina or zeena (I forget the spellings of her name even). She is utterly gender-biased and has no concern whatsoever with the facts. In fact I sometimes deliberately misquote credits in order to invite a correcting comment. But this time it was due to default in my memory which mixed up credits.

Re: # 1602

What a joke is this grand show of MQM`s hypocrisy which could not get even the Children Library occupied by the wild girls vacated. Notwithstanding being a part of that Mafia in power they are now trying to usurp the role of opposition to gain votes in the coming elections.

What a shameless thing is this Musharraf-MQM brand `real` democracy!

Re: # 1602

What a joke is this grand show of MQM`s hypocrisy which could not get even the Children Library occupied by the wild girls vacated. Notwithstanding being a part of that Mafia in power they are now trying to usurp the role of opposition to gain votes in the coming elections.

What a shameless thing is this Musharraf-MQM brand `real` democracy!