Encounters With Depression

Re: # 26

masadi,

...... what about the bushmen of the kalahari desert and the eskimoes who suffer from depression ?.......... are they depressed because of colonialism ? ........what about postpartum depression and what about all those women in pakistan who routinely commit suicide - are they the victims of the american elite ?

.......... masadi, you really need to get some psychiatric help ....... dr sohail, please help him .....

You missed Moses, BJ. Moses was a stammerer.

Ppl who are conformists cant think out of the box. U need eccentricity to think differently. This is what Royal Council of Surgeons(?) said abt creative ppl.

There have been many great men with mental disorder, most of whom overcame their challenges by themselves, some could not. One wonders what these folks would have been like WITH medical intervention – even better than they turned out to be or would they have been just another average Joe?!

Winston Churchill

Churchill lived a long life and one probably richer in experience than most in the course of human history. His biography runs to some eight volumes. It is well known that he suffered throughout his life from what is now known as bipolar mood disorder - what used to be called manic-depressive disorder.

Abraham Lincoln

The questions concerning the fact that Lincoln was overcome by anxiety and depression are numerous. Michael Burlingame remarks, in his book The Inner World of Abraham Lincoln, that the death of Lincolns mother was responsible for his life-long tendency to melancholy. It has also been stated that his depression stemmed from a series of childhood losses. These deficits may have included the death of his newborn younger brother (Lincoln was only three years old at the time); the death of his mother, aunt, and uncle when he was only nine years old; and the passing away of his sister in childbirth when he was eighteen years of age. According to psychologists, bereavement in childhood can be one of the most significant factors in the development of depressive illness in later life.

Isaac Newton

Issac Newton , the man who was the pioneer of the law of gravitation and the law of motion suffered from a nervous breakdown compelling him to retire from research, but that didn`t deter the genius, and he went on to be the Master of the Royal Mint, President of the Royal Society and attaining Knighthood.

Ludwig Van Beethoven

Beethoven, one of the greatest composers of all times suffered from manic depression. He once wrote ``As for me, ``I am in despair so often and would like to end my life.``

Vincent Van Gogh

Van Gogh was an indisputable genius, utterly, indisputably ignored. He created hundreds of bold, brilliant paintings; only one was sold during his lifetime. He suffered from Paranoid Schizophrenia and ultimately committed suicide in 1890.

(The above information is from the website http://www.twilightbridge.com/icons1/iconshomepage.htm)

masadi,

............ i think that finally you might be on to something ! .......... i have always maintained that psychiatry and psychology are not real science and belong in the same category as sociology and palmistry ......... maybe you and i should petition the medical associations and universities to stop teaching this nonsense ........... having said that, i think you would benefit from prozac and a lobotomy.......

dr sohail,

che brings up an interesting point, that of self medication via drugs and alcohol. this is by far a more popular alternative for people diagnosed with a disorder in pakistan than medication. and it works too, at least for a while :)

my problem with medication, which you at one point suggest is an essential part of treating those with bipolar disorder, is that it generally doesn`t. work, that is, unless you get put on lithium, which essentially makes you a zombie. a flatline is not an attractive or pleasant state of being, and medication prescribed is often so that people around you find you easier to handle, it doesn`t really help the sufferer in the long term.

i have come to believe medicating people at the drop of a hat is a bad thing. if the person is seriously incapacitated or non functional then ok, but i think people with certain tendencies also have inbuilt coping mechanisms to deal with those tendencies, a lot of them tend to be creative and exercising their creative muscles often does more to alleviate symptoms than a cocktail of crap drugs manufactured by giant pharmaceuticals. how can you decide there is a chemical imbalance in someones brain when we dont really understand the human brain? and what is the chemical imbalance is part of a longer process that gets nipped in the bud by an influx of anti depressants, anti psychotics, anti nausea pills, appetite stimulants when the medications gets too much etc etc? and isn`t it true that the current method of choice for treating bipolar people is talk therapy?


you are right to suggest that there is a lack of understanding and awareness in society about disorders like bipolar, i think in pakistan that lack of understanding and awareness extends to the psychiatrits too.

in good faith,
shandana

Re: # 21
Shandana, I don`t think antidepressants work as well as the drug companies would like to tell us. And I agree being sort of flat-line is a bad thing, but it is better than being outright miserable. Being able to be creative is all very good, but I see a lot of peple mechanically going about their lives, they have no energy to do anything except that which they need to exist. They don`t get hospitalised because they are no danger to anyone, but what sort of a life do they lead?
The problem with talk-therapy with bipolar activity is that when people are manic, they will pay no attention to what they are being told, so it is not much use until their mood stablises a little.

Re: # 38
dear nb...i fully support your ideas. talk therapy works when the person is stable enough to

sit down and discuss emotional problems in a meaningful way. i have used medications in

the first stage of therapy to control symptoms and psychotherapy in the second stage to

resolve conflicts and improve the quality of life. thanks for your comments....by the way do

you practice medicine and if yes where?...sincerely sohail

Re: # 39
I do actually-in Queensland, Australia. Thanks for sharing your views.

Re: # 21
dear shandana (in good faith)....in my opinion there is a difference between use and abuse

of medications. im my practice 80% of patients are treated with individual, marital, family

and group therapy to understand their Depression and take effective steps to improve their

lifestyle. But for those 20& who are acutely depressed or acutely manic.....when there is

chemical imbalance...one needs to control symptoms before they can sit in the office for an

hour to discuss their problems seriously. These days I am treating three people who are in

acute psychosis

....one woman is manic state started going to bars and getting drunk and promiscuous. her

children were embarrassed and her husband was going to divorce her. Now that she is

treated with Lithium and other antipsychotic medications ...she is stable. The loving wife

and mother they knew is back.

....the other woman got manic, and started spending money. Now she is in 25000 debt and

her husband who is very sympathetic is thinking of bankruptcy. She used her Visa,

Mastercard and American Express to maximum. She is refusing to take medications or go

to hospital and the whole family is in a crisis.

...one man in Depressed state sold his 150, 000 dollar house for 50, 000. Now I have

contacted his lawyer to discuss that when he sold the house he was psychotic and his

signature was not valid.

I am just quoting some examples to show you that when people suffer from mental illness

they do self destructive things and need to be treated and protected. Once their psychosis

is in control, they make healthy and wise choices.

I agree with you that medications need to be used as the last step not as the first step.

By the way Lithium is like salt, it does not produce sedation and does not make people

zombies.

These medications....antipsychotics...chlorpromazine was the first one discovered in 1952

and Lithium Carbonate in 1971 are some of the great discoveries of medical science.

These medications helped us treat people and help them live in community with their

families.

One Pshchiatric hospital that I worked in had 1000 patients in 1900.....and many of them

committed suicide....In 2000 the same hospital had 400 patients because others were

successfully treated with

psychotherapy

medications

education

family support

and rehabilitation.

Psychotherapy and education is the first step. But wise use of medications expecially in

Manic Depressive Illness is an integral part of treatment.

I have many patients who needed Anti-depressents for a few months and once they

stabilized we gradually decreased the dose and finally stopped.

For me academic discussions are different than listening to painful stories of people who

suffer and people who look after them. Mental health professionals not only help patients

but also their families who also suffer.....sincerely sohail

#17 Delhiwala

Yaar, don`t feel jealous! :) :)

Dear Dr. Sohail,

I have read your exchange with masadi and it is my sincere suggestion to you to not to waste time with him. He has no clue as to what you have written. In his paranoia, masadi wants to blame everything on USA, even the depression of an individual. Masadi is one of those people who want to frame everything in sociopolitical context even if it is biochemical in nature. Fortunately for him, C. Wright Mills existed otherwise masadi wouldn’t have known what to think.

I have seen so many examples of people growing up and living under same sociopolitical setup and parameters and yet some show the symptoms of depression and others don’t. More interestingly, the ones who show the symptoms usually have a family history of depression. That is indicative enough that depression of a certain kind has biochemical sources rather than sociopolitical.

I think you can find better ways to spend your time than responding to the paranoids. And, by the way, do write something in future on the topic of paranoia as well.

Rafi

I see a box, I see it clear, it is my day, my night, my dear.
And when the darkness fades away, it takes with it my night, my day.

come share my meal, some share my space, ask not for talk or watch my face
lest you see who you would be too, if in this box your shoe tripped you.

- wink -

Asadi,

>>Of course not the suicide rate stays........much greater among the most alienated i.e. young black men, and lowest among young white males but when young white males become old white males they lose their social status being worthless to the capitalist structure and so have the highest rate of suicide....<<

How do you explain the highest suicide rates in Japan? Even a chef who cooks fugu fish commits suicide if the dish kills the consumer. Do u think that the non-existent `social structure` is responsible 4 suicides in Japan as well?

Asadi, do u suffer from depression since Chowk staff refused to publish ur articles?

Drsohail:
Does copulation really help in depression? I am serious.

People in Punjab believe that copulation helps in freeing up the emotions.

Re: # 15
Drsohail:
why are you not answering my very important question?

does or not does not ``Copulation help fighting depression``?

If you notice I did not use any bad words here. I could have easily said that Choodam-choodai or something like that but as a sincere person I chose appropriate words.

BJKumar: Tum apnee harkato se baaj aa jao....warna....

Re: # 42
dear dehli walla.... Freud would have loved your obsession with sex and might

have made you his Asian representative. smiles.

on a serious note ....unfortunately people with depression have lack of libido and sexual

desire and sometimes do not even have erection. on the other hand people who are manic

can be so excited and uninhibited that they become promiscous and can sleep with anyone

who is willing to sleep with them. sincerely sohail

ps...are you happy now that i answered your question?