Whence Then is Evil?

re. klpd:
``Man by definition is finite. God by definition is infinite. The infinite is beyond the comprehension of the finite.``


er.. so how did man comprehend his existence or his infinitude, since its impossible to comprehend that which we cannot... er.. comprehend, right?

It`s a little like saying ``The colour of my shirt is ERSEDE. But don`t even try figuring out that colour because its not within the spectrum of light that the human eye/brain can perceive.``


...as I wait for someone now to tell me that shirts can and do contain colours that the human eye cannot perceive, and thus miss the point altogether.

correction to #80: ``But the recognition that, with our present capabilities and emotions it is in fact absurd to look for a First Cause... ``

Dr Saheb,

A good article. But I have doubt about the concept of good and evil. The creator has made everything as he chose to make. There is nothing evil as such. Even if we go with the concept of God as someone doing only good then too we can`t deny Him because he has created everything and has to see the wellbeing of each and every species including the non-living things. So, something that appears to be evil for the humans might be in fact good for some other species. If we judge Him with the sole perspective of humans it will be too selfish for us to do. God should not be expected to take our perspective into account. Therefor on this ground only we can not declare Him to be evil or good.

I have also published a similar article `God, Religion and spirituality` in `self publish`. Will you please read and comment on that. In my opinion, humans have been given limited senses and a limited capacity to use them so it is not possible to say for sure whether God exists or not. For example, it is not possible to explore anything beyond the speed of light. We can`t smell or hear as many animals can. Then, we can`t know what the non-living things are `doing`. As such, it is and it will be a futile exercise to search God. Those religions which believe in God may be spiritually and philosophically true but there are religions, like Buddhism, Jainism and many Hindoo scriptures too, which deny God and can`t be declared wrong. All religions have flourished with the backing of and served the purpose of the power/establishment.

PM: #80

The answer to your query regarding free will was there in my essay; I therefore didn`t think appropriate to repeat it.

Man has free will without any doubt. But it is difficult to square it with the concept of an Almighty and All Good God.

The cause and effect issue that you mentioned is also interesting. It seems to break down in the world of subatmic particles; there all that you can suggest is only the probability of an even taking place.

Einstein had a continuing discussion until the end of his life with Bohr on this subject for 30 years. Neither of them accepted the other`s point of view. Einstein argued for cause and effect (determinism). Evidence so far has vindicated Bohr`s point of view in the subatomic world. Cause and effect prevails in the macro-world, the world of our day-to-day experience.

Thanks for your valueable discussion.

Mohammad Gill

the root of all evil

Brainwashing has taken a new meaning. Not only youngsters, but now
educated people are willing to be brainwashed and `educated` in nonsense
and superstition called religion.


We should recognise religious brainwashing in madrasas, which must be
investigated by Indian intelligence agencies and destroyed with an
iron hand NOW!


If ever there was a blaring call to ban religion - muslim, jew, sikh,
christian or hindu, THIS IS IT! It is high time we banned religion.


Religious brainwashing of youngsters should be made a punishable
offence with immediate effect.

Yes, parthaab

Let`s ban religion, now!

Brothers and sisters, Parthaab bans religion!! Let it be known to all.

Re: # 87

Kaalchakra

(((((Yes, parthaab

Let`s ban religion, now!

(((Brothers and sisters, Parthaab bans religion!! Let it be known to all.)))))


ROFL.,.


see you guys soon..

zeemax, philosopher and echo (?) ...

...... since you guys receive your welfare checks from her majesty`s government, you might want to be careful - your budding careers as aspiring cyber jihadis might be in jeopardy ........... the uk, and the rest of the civilized world, has had enough ..... as for the chicks with sticks and the younger male `students`, i really feel sorry for them and blame their parents for their predicament - the state should not allow them to return to their homes .........

LONDON, July 5: Three ‘cyber-jihadis’ who used the Internet to urge Muslims to wage holy war on non-believers were jailed for between six-and-a-half and 10 years on Thursday in the first case of its kind in Britain.

Tariq Al-Daour, Younes Tsouli and Waseem Mughal had close links with Al Qaeda in Iraq and thought there was a ‘global conspiracy’ to wipe out Islam, the Woolwich Crown Court in southeast London was told.

Moroccan-born Tsouli, 23, was jailed for 10 years; UAE-born Al-Daour, 21, received a six and half years sentence; and 24-year-old Mughal, who was born in Britain, was given seven and half years.

Sentencing them, Judge Charles Openshaw said the men had engaged in ‘cyber jihad’, encouraging others to kill ‘kuffars’ or non-believers.

sorry, #89 was meant for the burqa board .....

Gill sahib

Many of these interacts are simply beyond me since they are framed exclusively for semitic and, as in Parthaab`s case, Leninist/Maoist minds.

Here is something that many Indians would agree with.

Where does evil come from? It comes from the same place and source that man comes from.

Go-od, by which I mean the ``Indian God,`` cannot be understood. So talking of human will with respect to such a God is a wasteful excercise (it is not totally useless. For instance, it is excellent for honing one`s language skills).

We can only speak of the ``Revealed God`` - God as understood, ``captured,`` by our knowledge at any time. May be that is what you mean by ``something less than God.`` We Indians call it a descended form of God. To be ``true`` this God HAS to make sense in a human framework.

To repeat, while ``Go-od`` HAS to be beyond human ``sense`` and human senses, ``Revealed God`` MUST make sense in a human framework.

As a corollary, speaking of ``religion`` is nonsense, unless we first specify what we are talking about - specifically what kind of ideas.

Make that distinction, specify what good and evil mean to you, and, Indians argue, you may begin to see where evil comes from.

---

Granted, like anything else, this may not be true, and may be as much Sanskrit to many as detailed discussions of God and free will are Latin to me....:)

Gill writes <<< There are 99 attributes of Allah many of which conflict with one another. >>>

Look, fool, not only have you not been able to address anything I wrote, you`re making claims that are totally false. First, there are more than 99 attributes that describe the `personality` of God in the Quran, the Mullahs decided to stop at 99, that is their problem, and NONE of those attributes contradict the other, that is your limited/sophomoric intelligence that tells you that they do...

#91 by kaalchakra

To repeat, while ``Go-od`` HAS to be beyond human ``sense`` and human senses, ``Revealed God`` MUST make sense in a human framework.

LoL Kaal ... as I have said often before, You`re the limit ... !

But it`s good to have the language skills honed .... no? So `Go-od` must be `Good` to have made that possible .... :~)

Re: # 89
[...Three ‘cyber-jihadis’ who used the Internet to urge Muslims to wage holy war on non-believers were jailed for between six-and-a-half and 10 years on Thursday in the first case of its kind in Britain...]

Alright - finally the brits are waking up... way to go...

But zeemax has nothing to worry... his backup plan is ready: red purse, blue burkha and the paki-made getaway ``car``...

But philo and masadi are scr@wed... they have nowhere to hide...

... add-on #93...

But of-course your addressee wouldn`t know anything about `Mashi`at` ... now would he?

I recall having a little conversation about that with you on some board a long time ago ...

Yeah, Zee, I absolutely recall! That was when we were discussing sufis or Al Ghazali having discovered absolute knowledge or something. Right?

I think you had mentioned allah ki raza (reza?) - ``Will of God`` concept?


Sorry, didn`t pay it that much attention then, since you know what I think of Sufis and their ``Islam.``

Anything specific you had in mind?