A Pakistani-American in India

Re: # 213i totally agree wid u these abnormal indians r gone mad i think specially this joshi.....nyways ur answers r gud
keep it up!!

Re: # 323Well i think mr joshi ur a typical case of psycatrist...huh ur acting like frustrated man who does'nt know the reality but keep on exagerating the false things...
its better 4 u to study first & then give ur idiotic comments on any thing....u duuno any thing true abt ur own country so how can u bullshit abt others so just behave like a decent indian dont show ur reall face.
thanks

Thanks for the answer, laddu.

Re: # 692

It is not a common Hindu view because the mullahs still clamour to represent the muslims and hence present the worst face of muslims before the hindu idolators.

However, those hindu who intereact with modern educated indian muslims on a dialy basis understand that the problem in Islam is the presence of un challenged hate verses.

Modern tafsirs would in variably arise because modern muslims are finding it increasingly difficult to leave the interpretation of Islam in the hands of traditional mullahs and Islamic scholars.

From what I have gathered, hindus are not revolted by reading Quran per se, with the hate verses contextualized with respect to Mohammad's times and readily agree to muslims who only accept non-belligerent form of Quran
In my view the Quranists are indeed the best muslims.
I think the prime example being tahmed on chowk.
I think Masadi would also be joining the ranks if he gets out of hate mode and adapts a mystical sufi interpretation of Quran.

laddu bhai, I do have a question, if you don't mind.

Is this the common Hindu view that (1) new kind of 'modern' tafsirs (that presumably did not exist before) would arise, that (2) Muslims will (sooner or later)reject verses from Quran, that (3) Quranists form the 'light' of Islamic scholarship, and that (4) Quranists are fundamentally different from traditional scholars (more peaceful, from your point of view)?

Would greatly appreciate if you would share your view. Thanks.

Great, then, laddu. Hopefully, in a few generations Islam will have "modern" tafsirs, 'hateful verses" from Quran will be rejected by Muslims, and there shall be peace :)

Re: # 689

They would change only if new modern tafsirs come up that reject the hate verses form Quran and Hadiths.
The trend has already started and we find more muslims willing to reject Hadiths as haresays and try to contextualize the hate verses of Quran.

The Quranists are the only light of Islamic scholarship. Traditional mullahism , literalists and wahabbists are going to die out.

The future of Islam is in those who reject Hadiths and come up with novel allegoric interpretations of Quran.

That would SAVE Islam.

Other wise, the traditional Dawah factory is going to keep on suporting and justifying modern day Islamic terrorist culture in muslim societies.

dawa, how often do you need to be reminded? I am a very bad person. I won't give Muslims what they deserve.

laddu, are we waiting for Muslims to change?

http://www.thestar.com/News/World/article/246411



Not the best thing to share on Independent day of neighbouring country, but couldn't resist. It might be just staring this way that people are hiding their ID as some poor desis do in west. But by looking at the dire situation of Muslims in general in India, this doesn't come as a shocker. Muslims are equally responsible for their current state. They didn't do enough to vamp up their youths in education, after 5 generations, they are still paying for it.



Fearful Muslims adopt Hindu IDs


In India, many members of religious minority hide the signs of their faith to escape discrimination

August 15, 2007
Shaikh Azizur Rahman
SPECIAL TO THE STAR




CALCUTTA–On a busy street in Calcutta's business district, he runs a food stall called "Rajib's Paratha" and is known as Rajib Mallick.




Using the popular Hindu name, no one suspects he is Rajab Ali Mollah, a Muslim who has adopted a fictitious identity to blend in with the neighbourhood's mostly Hindu office workers.




Sohrab Hossain, a Muslim student who came to the city to complete his Masters degree in English and lives in a Hindu-dominated housing complex, is known as Sourav Das among the students he tutors. To keep up his Hindu appearance he has a small idol of Saraswati, the Hindu goddess of learning, on his desk.




Every morning as she prepares to go to work as a fishmonger, Hasina Khatoon takes off her silver armband embossed with "Allah" in Arabic, puts vermillion powder on her forehead and red-white conch bangles on her wrist – symbols of a married Hindu woman – to maintain a Hindu appearance in a fish market where almost all of her customers are Hindus.




Rajab Mollah, Sohrab Hossain and Hasina Khatoon say they have adopted new identities in a Hindu-majority society where as Muslims they would face discrimination.



Analysts say many Muslims from all socio-economic backgrounds are quietly hiding their religious affiliation.




"Muslims in almost all spheres of life face a communal discrimination by powerful Hindus and they are denied many of their basic rights and freedom in an unjustified way," said Anjan Basu, a social analyst and executive editor of Pratidin, a Bengali daily in Calcutta.



Six decades after Partition, "many (Hindus) believe that Pakistan was created for Muslims and now they do not have right to live in India, which is meant for Hindus."




The Partition of India 60 years ago was a highly controversial arrangement, and remains a cause of much tension on the subcontinent today.




Basu, who is a Hindu, also said discrimination has been "institutionalized," with many Muslims being denied employment in government and private-sector offices where 90 to 95 per cent jobs are held by Hindus.




Gautam Ray, a senior journalist with Calcutta's largest Bengali daily Anandabazar Patrika, said that since the bulk of the dalits (low-caste Hindus or so-called Untouchables) converted to Islam when the religion spread in India, many upper-caste Hindus look down on Muslims as they had for generations looked down on dalits.




"The root of this communal discrimination is deeply entrenched in the society and most of these communal Hindus are not expected to change their feeling for Muslims any time soon," said Ray, who is also an upper-caste Hindu. "Muslims are often denied housing in Hindu-dominated modern residential complexes," he added.




"This communal discrimination against Muslims will not end unless Hindus themselves change their attitude. But we do not see hope of any such positive social change anytime soon."




Muslims who adopted fake Hindu identities believe they did nothing wrong by hiding their original identities.





"Ten years ago, when my house and land in the village was eaten up by a river and I came to Calcutta in search of a job, almost all street shops and restaurants in the city refused to employ me because I was a Muslim," Mollah said.




"Some said their Hindu customers could refuse to eat at their restaurants if a Muslim worked there," he said.




"But I met a Muslim man who worked under a Hindu identity to supply water to restaurants. I followed his advice, picked up a Hindu identity and soon an upper-class Hindu employed me to run a food stall."




Nearly all of Mollah's customers are Hindus and he fears his business would suffer disastrously if his customers found out he is a Muslim.




"I don't think I have done anything wrong because I know how they hate Muslims simply because of their religion," he added.




A federal commission recently found that Muslims "live in socio-economic conditions worse than many so-called backward tribal people," according to commission chief Rajendra Sachar, a former judge.



In the state of West Bengal, where the Muslim community makes up 27 per cent of the population, employment of Muslims in the government sector was below 3 per cent, the Sachar Commission reported.

Some Muslim leaders see education as the key to a better future.





"If the younger generation can educate themselves, it will be difficult for even the most communal Hindus to discriminate against a new Muslim force," said Nazrul Islam, a senior public servant and noted Calcutta writer.



"Maybe discrimination will not be wiped out completely, but an educated and powerful community of Muslims will be able to fight off the injustice, at least to a good extent."



this Article is taken from pakistan greatest forum ...

http://www.paklinks.com/gs/showthread.php?t=261635

Re: # 684 no..smell the coffee..today ground realities say..200 millions muslims live miserably in india..so its thier basic right to have a a seperate muslim land inside india...why you not give them thier basic right ..why ???

Re: # 681 My sympathies with you...as usually defeated people have such attitudes....pooh

Re: # 683

This will go on AS LONG AS 'educated' muslims keep on flocking to his 'lectures' and wowing at his 'performance' and calling it a 'proof' of 'superiority' of the Quranic 'truths'.

Unless and until the roots of scepticism get entrenched within the realm of Islamic thinking, I cannot see any retreat from this trend of ISlamists trying to conjure up a 'grand narrative' that supercedes or even pre-empts ALL human thinking.

Zakir has mande his millions through IRF and commands a sizable chunk of 'educated' muslims. I believe even Kafeel brothers were influenced by his sermons.

shah, agreed. Turtles are the rightful owners of the land. We can live under the oceans. Dawa bhai can have his boats ready. You and I will jump in when he is not looking.

:)

"to vacate all land that belonged to our forefathers"

in gesdture of light heartedness if you go back further ...indian subcontinent was detached pat of AFRICA which floated off Indian ocean to join Asian continent ...The evidence of it being 'emerged from submerged staus' is to be ound in the Himalayas in the form buried remains of Marine ..how else would they have gone 1760 ft above sea level..lol

laddu, well, then he is merely carrying on a very long tradition. The question is will this continue? Or will there be a response?

kaal,

Actually this guy Zakir Naik has never got into a straight debate with any hindu scholar in India. He just shows off before the illiterate muslims who flock him to see just like muslims flock to see quranic ayaats 'written' on natural patterns on trees or stones.

He undertakes the so called 'debate' in a completely controlled enviroment , in a room full of testrone high faithfuls who immediately pull out the mike from some one who asks 'disturbing' questions.
He gives such stupid answers to very basic questions about say - the Teleological proof of God's existence - and makes such stupid gestures of self assurance that only fiathfuls can get fooled by his 'logic'.
In my opinion he is a part of growing Islamist movement that would culminate in preparing huge propaganda for the subsequent genocide of the idolators and kafirs.
Zakir Naik has gone on record saying that "all muslims should be terrorists" and that in an Islamic state hindus and idolators cannot be allowed to propagate their religion . In my opinion his thinking is similar to moududi regarding the status of 'dhimmis' as second class citizens.