60 Years of American DogHood

zeemax #15 Thanks for summarizing the article. Unless the author choses to discuss her article, I am not going to waste time reading it. The heading tells me where this article is headed anyway.

While you and I may not be in full agreement on Pakistan's relations with the US, I fully agree that Pakistan is not anyone's dog. Musharraf may like to think of himself as one, but not the country he flatters himself into thinking he is worthy of being called a "leader" of.

"Peaceful demonstrators"

LOL

IB: You are merely trying to defend the MQM for the same reason that MQM killed peaceful demonstrators against Musharraf on May 12 - namely, your ethnic affiliations, which are clearly stronger than any moral scruples (How can you claim MQM changed its views after May 12 with a straight face?), in total disregard to the fact that you are supporting a dictatorship and opposing the democratic movement and calls for the rule of law in Pakistan!!

Do you really think such mindless ethnic affiliations are even in the interests of the very community you feel so strongly attached to? Do you think the rest of Pakistan are a bunch of fools who dont see all of the above?

actually pakiland is worse than a dog...you'd go to jail in the US if you treated your dog like the US has treated the land of the pure...

they don’t believe that Muslims carried out the attacks on the two towers


Oh you poor pakis you...

Notice how the paki liberals/moderates(cough cough) can go through 20 thousand words without a single mention of the root cause of all this...Pakiland's policy of using islamic fundamentalism as a strategic tool...

If you're bombing your people, it's your own damn fault...nobody forced you to radicalize your own population to produce jihadis to fight your wars...you made a conscious decision. now deal with the consequences...

Saima Shah, I would like to request the wheeravouts of such writing in Karachi?
Cheers

What MQM did on 12th May was wrong ! - and its only MQM politicians who have to face there voters everyday - and because of the pressure from the MQM voters ; MQM changed her stance regarding CJ Issue and the killings on 12th of May. MQM is a genuine political party unlike others - with lot of problems. I personally think MQM without Altaf Hussain would be better - but how could a party kick out the vary person who made the party and sacrified!
What do you guys think of other political parties like ANP and PPP who came out with guns on 12th as well.
As a law-enforcement officer myself I could point out that Sorah Goth, North Nazimabad Phatan Areas are loaded with Guns - and is a refuge for terrorists and bandits. Whenever Govt. tried to come donw hard on them - ANP comes and rioting starts - same with Sindi Goaths in Karachi - all illegal.

The central thesis of the author appears to be: "... problem is that not much of Pakistan will remain if we shoot all the American Dogs."

This is an uninformed perception. First, with Pakistan exports to USA of $3.8 billion in 2006/7 of the total $ 18 billion, FDI of $ 913 million out of $ 7 billion, and direct aid of approx $ 1 billion, Pakistan is nowhere near economically dependant on USA.

Next, Pakistan survived for ten years during 90s with the Pressler amendment which effectively blacklisted Pakistan for all economic and military assistance, but despite all it came out with massive infrastructural improvement as well as a nuclear deterrent in the same period.

As it stands now, Pakistan has no military threat from USA (even though the successor to Bush may be even more stupid) other than a few bombing sorties over FATA. It can neither spare land forces committed in Afghanistan/Iraq/S. Korea, nor can it fight on the ground in FATA where Pakistan's Frontier Constabulary recruited from the same region cannot. On the other hand, any such attempt will get rid of any remaining vestiges of pro-west opinions in the country and spread the civil war to cities.

What else? Can USA attack Pakistan's nuke facilities? Probably it can. But that will be an existential threat and whatever capability remains will be used against it's forces and allies within reach.

It disappoints me that the author has such a low opinion of Pakistan and its inhabitants. Pakistan was not a pushover even 10 years ago when it tested the nuke in the face of tremendous carrot/stick pressures from the US, much less now. It was only Musharraf who agreed with the author in 2001 and rented out the Pakistan Army to the US to be used as mercenaries against Pakistanis on false pretexts fed to the nation.

No one was going to send Pakistan to the stone age.

H-Ikram: Well said. Bush didnt tell Musharraf to have MQM come to the street with guns on May 12 to kill innocent Pakistanis. Mush and MQM did this on their own. Bush isnt telling Mush to have unfree and unfair elections that Mush shamelessly continues to insist in effect in having. In fact Bush told him the opposite.

Ms. Saima Shah's article, which points away from the real culprit and foolishly tries to paint America as the enemy is precisely what genuine Pakistan-haters (see Jayp post below who is wetting his lungi with delight) from India would like to see.

At my response number 12 , I doubted by leader but since light into came - I would like to review and paste the following note:

Those recipients who received the cash amounts were (surprisingly not mentioned in Mr Cowasjee’s column) the MQM’s nemesis Jamaat-i-Islami’s Amir (Rs5 million), and Maulana Salahuddin of Takbir’s fame (Rs0.3 million), Mr Altaf Hussain Qureshi (a red-haired veteran journalist) and Mr Mustafa Sadiq (Rs0.5 million).

Perhaps it was the second time that Mr Altaf Hussain Qureshi’s name was, by design, engineered in the infamous list of 32 politicians etc. (on the pay roll of the ISI) as Mr Altaf Hussain (MQM). Why, it is deliberate?

How was the name of Mr Altaf Hussain Qureshi tampered with to read Mr Altaf Hussain? And how was the sum of Rs0.5 million enhanced to Rs20 million? The answers slouch with Mr Cowasjee’s conscience.

Mushraff was once a loved leader by All Pakistan between 1999-2002 but mind you there was a group who has always been active since Mushraff took over - this group belongs to PML(N) for reasons which is quite understandable (Mushraff finished Nawaz Sharif's rule) .
When I stressed on ethinicity factor this time - I making a observation from the ground realities I see in Punjab where atleast 2/3 of educated ( the uneducated Punjabis - still thinks to this day that all Urdu Speakers aka Mohajirs are actually Hindus and they should be thankful
that 'we' gave them land to put there tents on ) are opposed to Mushraff not because they believe
in democracy but because they are against Mushraff's ethinic origin and his so-called links with MQM.
When you link Altaf Hussain with politics on body bags , language and ethnicity - you should remember
why Altaf Hussain ( with all this evil , cartoonish acts ) became Altaf Hussain?
He became a leader because he exploited (what anyother politician would have done) the grievences of
Urdu Speaking and Memon Speaking Community - and addressed the vary issues directly related to them ; Although a Imran Khan fan because of his politics and principled stand - his standing with the likes of MMA and his statements against MQM has put him off from a lot of people I know. We from here find his statements and of Nawaz Sharif's ethinically motivated.

which were as follows:

a) Quota System
b) Urdu/Memon Speakers were ignored at both Fed./ Sind level
c) Re-investment on Karachi from Karachi's Fund was very little
d) There was a need for a Urdu/Memon Speaking Community Political Party in Pakistan

All said and done - Altaf Hussain and MQM are not angels ( they are politicians ) a bit more violent then others but thats because of religious parties which are if not equally then more violent. People vote for MQM now atleast because theres no other option in Karachi/Hyderabad -because if we does not vote for MQM ( which actually is present at grass root level) Jamat-e-Isalmi and Maulana Noorani Son's Owais Party (MMA) and now a new factor Sunni Tehrek will win seats - no one in Khi/Hyd want religious hypocrites running Sind/Khi/Hyd.

I stand firm that Punjabis are ethinically motivated - and because of them - there is a reaction in other coummunities in Pakistan - Mohajirs/Phatans/Sindis/Balochis.

President Mushraff with all the pitfalls would never compromise on national security - thats for sure.
Yes, CJ , 12th May Issues have hurt the popularity but atleast hes a honest man. As far as democracy is concerned - what kind of democracy do we want ? most of the politicians including the person I vote ( Altaf Hussain ) was paid Rs.30 million in 1991 by ISI , Nawaz Shairf , javed Hashmi and all of anti-PPP camp.
I am not saying this is a excuse for not installing democracy back but with the same politicians?
is it worth it? our Judicial Activism Doctrine is doing a much better job then Politicians.

For Saima, mushy is the reformer ans she does not want benazir to come back. But my dear pakistanis, she has a destiny, she is the daughter of pakistan, she ha to complete what her father started, and that is her destiny.

Her father delivered the bomb, she has to complete the second part of her fathers prophetic promise to pakistanis, to feed them grass.
Her father dismembered pakistan, now she has to liquidate it.

Let benazir come back, that is her destiny, that is the destiny of pakistan.

Th great Bhutto is what is needed now, to co,plete what her father said before he was killed. " pakistan will have the bomb and will eat grass". The bomb is the biggest liability, the americans are going to bomb pakistan to clear out teh bomb,

then leave it for indians to clean up the mess. It was done to a majority of pakistanis in 1971, it can be done again.

Thank you Saima,

"America, however, cannot take the risk of letting Pakistan become the next Iran if Ms Bhutto is ousted by the Fundamentalist Militants (a possibility), therefore Pakistan does not even have the luxury of Fundamentalism. The only feasible alternative for America is to use India to fight America’s war, and invade Pakistan in case Musharraf or Benazir are unable to curb the rising tide of militant fundamentalism in the event of a hostile takeover."

That is precisely what I had been telling, pakistan has to be eliminated, there will be expanded afghanistan, India and Sindh as a new country.

If more people like you start talking about it as the only option, it will happen. This should have happened a few years ago if it were not for that stupid collin powell, Osama woul;d not have been in pakistan, if pakistan also were bombed out

IB I am impressed by your observation … had Musharraf been judged by ethnicity he would have not gone, he would have been a dead man long time back.
I am a Punjabi myself and I can ensure you that it is Punjabis that see least of all things in ethnic prism. Unfortunately, it is people like Altaf who do business on dead bodies, language and ethnicity.
Tell me who was ZAB? I think not a Punjabi.
Who was Jinnan, not a Punjabi, I think? Who is BB? Who is Liaqat Ali Khan? Except Nawaz Sharif when was a Punjabi at the helm of affairs? Did Punjab come out for a Punjabi CJ?
Most important of all, did Punjab not distribute mithai on the arriva of Mush?
The simple fact is that Mush is taking the country for ride now, Punjabis non-Punjabis alike. He is interested only and only his perpetuation. He would sell his (yours and my) daughter, his (yours and my) mother for that no matter they are Mohajir or Punjabi. Remember yours and my sons and brothers, he has already been selling in open market.

Could Saima Shah kindly give me details of the wall chawking so I could get it erased!