The need for De-Bhuttofication of the Pakistan People's Party

Bhutto is the need of the hour.

Pka troops have surrendered to the tribals, signing ceremony is over, the new niazi of teh west will be welcomed home by the pak troops.

What is needed now is a declaration of 1000 year war with the tribals, that is what teh father bhutto did after he got teh troops back.

Benzir, where are you, your father land needs a repeat of what your father did.

Thanks mano for post 159.

This confirms what I understood about pakistanis, they can be schooled, by they never get educated. The schooling give them the pretences of education, but never learning the basic foundations of science because of what they have learned in mothers lap.

A scientific comparison of the state of muslims in India would ahev been comparing the indian muslims in USA to indian hindus. But you have used the majority, exclusive religion of pakistan, islam and compared it with the minority religion of india, to draw your conclusion.

If you had compared the status of hindus in pakistan to the status of muslims in india that would have had some basis.

The more tragic fact is that all the other paki interactors also think that your comparison is valid, as reflected in the absence of a rediculing comments about you.

Thanks manto for substantiating my view.

Manto 159,

Here are a few more indo pak muslim comparisons

No indian muslim is in guantanamo bay where, the most concentrated pak location after karachi.

No indian muslim has come back with ball and chanin in aircraft from the US, while most pakistanis, possibly some on chowk have come like that.

No indian muslim has bombed london bus while many pakis have done that.

No foreigners have come to indian muslim madrassas to learn bomb making while most foreign visitors to pak madrassas are for that.

From an Economist book review (May 2007) of Benazir’s autobiography:

…Benazir Bhutto, however, twice prime minister of Pakistan, and now in exile, is a formidable politician. She seems determined to give the general a run for his money. Indeed, perhaps it was his book, to which she refers in her own, that prompted her to update and relaunch her own autobiography, first published in 1988. Less a considered reflection on a life half-lived, it is the manifesto of an inchoate political campaign.

This is, after all, a crunch year in Pakistani politics, with General Musharraf manoeuvring to stay in power, and in uniform, despite the constitutional obstacles and the promises to stand down he has made. Recalling Benigno Aquino (an opponent of the Philippine dictator, Ferdinand Marcos, who was shot dead on his return to Manila in 1983) she concludes her book with a promise to go home: “I take the risk for all the children of Pakistan.”

As with General Musharraf's, the most interesting parts of her book are a few juicy and unprovable revelations—in her case about the general himself. The man now making peace with India, she reports, came to her when she was prime minister in 1996 and offered to invade the Indian-administered part of disputed Kashmir.

Coming up to date, she argues that General Musharraf is a fraud. Though he presents himself to the West as Pakistan's main bulwark against Islamist extremism, “his regime cohabits with extremists” guilty of terrorist atrocities across the globe. She also points out that General Musharraf's reluctance to deal with democratic parties, notably her own Pakistan People's Party, has helped create the political space in which extremism flourishes. Yet Pakistani politics are rife with rumours of an imminent deal between Miss Bhutto and General Musharraf, allowing her return. Perhaps a rapprochement will be marked by a public burning of their autobiographies, both of which drip with their mutual antipathy.

Literature would be less of a loser in such a bonfire than political analysis. But Miss Bhutto could not hope to write as bad a book as General Musharraf's: her story is too remarkable and too moving. She was born into one of the country's wealthiest dynasties and educated at Harvard and Oxford. Her father, Zulfikar Ali Bhutto, a deposed prime minister, was executed. Her two brothers were killed. She, her mother and her husband have all spent time in jail. The first words of the new edition—“I didn't choose this life; it chose me”—are almost true. She became the leader of a Muslim country and “the only head of government in recorded history to actually give birth while in office”.

It is hard not to admire her for the hardship and loss she has endured, and the determination she shows to carry on the fight. But it is hard to like her refusal to admit any serious misjudgment. Undemocratic transfers of power are deplorable; but the incompetence and corruption of her regimes contributed to their own downfall, a sad truth she ignores. Perhaps it is too much for a reader to expect candour from a politician in what is, like General Musharraf's, a political work-in-progress. Or maybe it is too much for a politician to expect us to read it.

#156 Harimau

[It is FAR FAR worse when your choice is between an Italian maid, Lalloo Prasad Yadav and Jyothi Basu. ]

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news sir, but neither Karunanidhi nor Jayalalitha have made it to the Zee-TV 'Sa Re Ga Ma Pa: Challenge 2007'! In fact, only one of the individuals you named did!

Re: Masanamuthu:"We would be in Nigeria/Lebanon like situation if not for partition.. Hail Jinnah.."

You got that dead right...Worse we could have been "them" as this report shows. MAJ thanks for your yeomen service to India and your fore-sight in removing the riff-raffs, rascals, and looters out of India..and to Pakistan where they are doing excellently well in what they know best...

'Pakistan is world's most dangerous country'
20 Aug 2007, 0813 hrs IST,PTI


WASHINGTON: Terming Pakistan as "the most dangerous country in the world", the US' Senate Committee on Foreign Relations has slammed Bush administration for having a "Musharraf policy" instead of a policy for Pakistan.

"The fact of the matter is, Pakistan is the most dangerous, potentially the most dangerous country in the world. A significant minority of jihadists with nuclear weapons. We have no Pakistan policy; we have a Musharraf policy," chairman of the US Senate Committee on Foreign Relations Senator Joseph R Biden said at a debate featuring the Democratic candidates sponsored by ABC News at the Drake University in Iowa.

I too have my own experience.

My experience was that for every 1 Indian Muslim on an American university campus, there were atleast 25 Pakistanis.... also... I never came across a single Indian Muslim in the Silicon Valley and travelled extensively there.

Economic logic suggests that Pakistan would not have been as developed had it not been separate. Arguing by giving the example of Azim Premji etc is pretty pathetic.


Ranjit,

Then the Congress should have done what Azad was advocating... the acceptance of the cabinet mission plan .. that Jinnah had accepted.

However... I share the view that the situation would have been ultimately be disastrous for both Pakistan and India.

Ref VRV #103

[Ch HP, how can u compare Muslims in Pakistan with Muslims in India?]

What do you expect from a Pakistani? Comparison of Pakistani Hindus to Indian Muslims? Ha, ha, ha. We all know where that comparison would lead to.

Ref HP #93

[Why the Muslims in India have not recovered from a loss, minuscule in numbers, in the last 60 years?]

Why don't you ask that question of the four-wives-fcuking, Haj-subsidy-demanding, rioting-over-Satanic-Verses-or-Mohammad-cartoons Muslims of India?

Ref bjkumar #85

[I know, I know – it is not much fun having to choose between the BB, the NS, the Mushy, or the mullah! But things could be a lot worse – you could even end up with the commies!]

It is FAR FAR worse when your choice is between an Italian maid, Lalloo Prasad Yadav and Jyothi Basu.

Ref Yasser Latif Hamdani #58

[As for the succession plan issue... pray tell sir did Jinnah's demise lead to a war of succession in Pakistan Mughal style? Amazing.]

Yasser, dear boy, what do you call a series of Army generals taking power punctuated by a few "democratically elected" (meaning with rigged votes)?

It looks very much like the Slave Dynasty and also like the post-Aurangzeb succession.

Ref bulleya #54

[.....while i tend to agree with your analysis of muslims in pakistan, i am afraid your analysis of muslims in india, is quite a bit off target....

i have seen enough of india now, to realize that muslims aren't doing too well, there......that would be an understatement....i sit in so many IT meetings, where i am the seniormost muslim......barring the odd azim premji, i see line after line of indian hindus (and christians, for that matter) executives achieving success; but ironically, i see no indian muslims......in fact, i saw hardly any in silicon valley or in my universities....]

So, Christians who form a smaller part of India's population, are achieving success while Muslims with larger population base are not.

And you think it is the fault of Indians but not of Muslims.

The problem with Muslims is very simple: it is Mohammad and his Book to End All Books. No wonder Muslims are not willing to study any other book.

I read the Farzana article...

"Indeed. The Chinese, the Japanese, the Russians are doing rather well for themselves, and they don’t go around kowtowing to some colonial mentality that talks about English in such a fashion. He mentions that most Muslims are educated in Urdu."

She is factually incorrect. Neither the Chinese, nor the Japanese and least of the the Russkis are doing well in the export of services. Japan does well in Value Added manufacturing. China does well at manufacturing, period. Russia is "doing well" because commodity prices are high. It is like ersthile India selling Jute. Globalization and the English language are reality. Maybe Farzana can start writing her rebuttals in Urdu instead of English.

".. i could never figure out what makes india a nation ..."

Indian Railways.

Re:HP
"Replacing this kind of mediocre talent should never have been a problem for the Muslims.....If Indians wants to keep their 150 Mil population down..."

The fact of the matter is India provides ample opportunity for anyone willing to work hard. If Indian Muslims fail to avail the opportunity you cant blame the system.

Regards,

Faruk

Re: # 125

Hamidm Sahib:

You were not drunk enough to ask the right question

"India ka matlab kya?"

Let me answer it for This India, they are going to teach few tricks to shell-shocked and non-shell shocked Indians of your and my generation.