Musharraf’s New Ordinance Hoopla

Yaar Borivili, one more thing. Pakistan insists that every candidate standing in the local elections in Azad Kashmir sign an undertaking promising to work for J&K's accession to Pakistan. Amanullah Khan, the JKLF chief was not allowed to contest elections because he was pro-independence. Even today if you see, all the pro-independence outfits have been marginalized to the point of extinction while those advocating merger with Pakistan are pampered and provided every kind of support. Do you still think Pakistan cares for Kashmiri aspirations?

Harish bhai,

(And Indian forces have been better behaved than their counterparts in these countries.)

Very well said. We have yet to see 300 odd Indian soldiers surrender in one day flat to the Jihadis.

Regards

Borivilli mian,

Just becuase u dont agree with my answers does not necessarily make them stupid. Kashmiris have a right to elect their own govt, do the people of Pakistan have the same right?

Yes, I do agree that Indian govt made huge mistakes in Kashmir in the past, the constant denial of Kashmiris right to elect their own representative by having free and fair elections being one of them. And that is one of the major contributory factors in the mess there.

Regards

#210 by borivili_express

....sometimes it seems they do and sometimes it seems they dont.

Yaar Borivili, the brutal truth is except for mouthing platitudes, Pakistan has done *nothing* for the Kashmiris. Heck, it even gave away a part of Kashmir to China. A few Pakis might sympathize with them and even cross the LoC to fight Indian forces, but beyond that, there hasn't really been anything. The Paki PM and President might enthusiastically take part in Kashmir Day celebrations and make emotional speeches about providing support to Kashmiris' aspirations, but when it comes to hard facts, The ISI has merely used them as a pawn to settle Pakistan's scores with India.

OTOH, India might be guilty of excesses, but by and large Kashmiris still have all the freedoms that the average Indian has. It is just that in an insurgency-racked state, excesses happen. Soldiers use heavy-handed tactics all the time. The tribal territories in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Americans in Iraq are all examples. And Indian forces have been better behaved than their counterparts in these countries. They haven't used helicopter gunships as Pakistan has done, nor have they managed to kill as many Kashmiris in 20 years as the Americans have killed Iraqis in just 6 years.

Thats a good question harishhyd (compared to majumdar's stupid answer) sometimes it seems they do and sometimes it seems they dont. But irrespective the indians dont care a fig for the kashmiris else they would have met them midway and solved this issue long ago, its been on 20 years now,I think its their vanity and hubris that stops them.

#207 by borivili_express

and dont tell me that Kashmir is the same as tribal ara or baluchistan because Indians have 700,000 troops in Kashmir, where as the entire Pak Army is 550,000

Yaar Borivili, tell us one thing. Does Pakistan care for Kashmiri aspirations? A simple yes or no would suffice. Thanks in advance.

Borivilli mian

(Kashmir is the same as tribal ara or baluchistan because Indians have 700,000 troops in Kashmir, where as the entire Pak Army is 550,000)

Pak Army has 90,000 troops in W'stan and as we all know 1 momin = 10 kafiir. So in equivalent terms Pak has 900,000 soldiers in W'stan and W'stan population (less than 1 mn) is much lower than J&K (close to 10 mn). And Injun Army's opposition is supported by a hostile neighbour (Pakistan) while Pak Army has the support of the worlds greatest coalition- US/UK/Afghanistan et al.

(Kashmiris dont even have the level of sovereignty that waziristanis enjoy.)

Kashmiri people have the right to elect their own govt, MLAs/MPs (like all other Indian states) but have no right to secede (again no other state enjoys that right either). Do Pakistanis (Waziristanis or otherwise) have the right to elect their own govt.

Regards

and dont tell me that Kashmir is the same as tribal ara or baluchistan because Indians have 700,000 troops in Kashmir, where as the entire Pak Army is 550,000

I dont know wether waziristan is justified or not, but Kashmir is because the Indian govt and public denies the aspirations for fredom of the people there

Kashmiris dont even have the level of sovereignty that waziristanis enjoy.

Borivilli mian,

So the jihadis are justified in Kashmir but not in Waziristan or in Lal Masjid.

Regards

Hamidm without getting into the rightness or wrongness of what the Jihadis are doing (and I think in Kashmir they are justified), i think it is not always appropriate to cheer on morons like arjun chutiya, how do you know Urstruly doesnt send 5 dollars to jihadis for every 1 dollar he pays the US govt (of which prob 90cents goes to basic services), where as in Pakistan he wouldnt be able to give even 1.

Have you heard of comparitive advantage?

hamidm2 mian #: " i believe in adam smith and the division of labor ....."

.....so you passionately support the american wars, however you will never go and participate in them, yourselves....nor will you encourage your children to do so......they are ok, as long as other people's kids get killed.....

......you are passionate about change in pakistan, in the direction you want, but will never go and initiate the change in that direction yourself......

......why are you so passionate about such things, yet unwilling to participate in them, yourselves?.....why is it that in your division of labor theory, you always end up with the easy task?......

as i said, passion without conviction is hypocrisy.....much like urstruly is fighting his kashmir jihads, without ever participating in them, you are fighting your american jihads, in the same way......much like urstruly wants a religious revolution in pakistan, without willing to go to pakistan, you want an anti-religious one, without willing to go there......

......nothing wrong with not going to pakistan.....everyone has a right to migrate.......but then, why talk the talk so passionately, when you are unwilling to even begin walking the walk.......

if, however, you do believe in the adam smith theory, then do you think urstruly can also use that argument......

ok i got it. the michigan defeat at the start of the season. last time i saw a michigan game (3 decades ago) they also got beat. no big deal.

ok i got it. the michigan defeat at the start of the season. last time i saw a michigan game (3 decades ago) they also got beat. no big deal.

hamidm #198 big house? i thought the big house was sing-sing prison.

romair is the god of Connections, masadi is the god of Knowledge. It is blasphemy to call them fools.

hamidm #197 they also had portraits of Ayub Khan, Yahya Khan, Saddam Hussein, lions, tigers and seductive females on rickshaws and busses. So that doesnt prove anything.