Musharraf’s New Ordinance Hoopla

I was thinking about writing a few words about ideology and how the ideologies play out in the political arena especially with regards to the Pakistani Politics. After reading one hell of a ridiculous post from Bullya about ideologies, I think it is time we look at this subject for the record.

bulleya’s post misses the proverbial bull’s eye by not just miles but by thousands of miles. Basically bulleya does not even understand what ideology is and what ideological political parties are.

There are some major ideologies that have played a part in politics and some still continue to play a significant role. There really is no truly ideological political party in Pakistan excluding the Islamic parties and we will come to their ideologies a little bit later.

Wiki definition: An ideology is an organized collection of ideas.

Now can someone tell how many political parties really have ideologies in Pakistan? I think Bulleya before writing screeds should first look up the definition of any political terminology he plans to enlighten us about.

The Marxism, Socialism, fascism and to a certain extent capitalism come close to being called ideologies. Then we have religious ideologies that attempt to find some room in the murky political waters. There are many other ideologies that exist but really don’t have a whole lot going for them so we can basically ignore them here.

The Ideologues don’t seek the political power for a limited purpose. Their goal always is to gain the control of the state to impose their ideologies over the people who live in that state. By this definition, most of the ideologies are inherently anti democracy and seek to establish dictatorial regimes. The reason most of the ideological parties fail in elections is that their whole set up is not designed to work with a democratic process where they have to beg for vote by exploiting the small things voters usually need to be relieved of the temporary discomforts of life.

The ideological parties don’t believe in providing temporary relief, they are looking for permanent solutions; Solutions such as the establishment of workers state, setting up a religious state, or for fascists, establishing the superiority of a race or a particular nation. Capitalism as an ideology just lurks around everywhere but stays away from the debate as the capitalists already control the world. The fact is that capitalism is the greediest of all ideologies and most opportunistic too. It too seeks the control of the state but it never defines a political set up for that and thus seeks to use any and every political system for state control.

The hallmark of the ideologies is that they don’t assign any value to human. In pursuit of the ideology, a human body is just a body or some thing that can be ignored or if needed, glorified for the cause. Therefore, the pursuits of ideologies have brought about the most significant misery to this earth. In the last century all three major ideologies cost most human lives. Fascism, Communism/Marxism and capitalism all have dived and enjoyed swimming in the pools of blood.

The Marxism and fascism got lost in their own blood but the surviving capitalism has taken up the cudgel of ensuring that the bloodletting does not stop. During and since the Second World War, the capitalism has been responsible for majority of the deaths in pretty much every part of the world.

The new breeds of religious ideologues, whether they are in Pakistan, Israel or in the US, have no sympathy with the humans. Humans are just a number that needs to be sacrificed at the altar to achieve the desired goal of establishing a religious state.

In Pakistan, the religious ideologues are following in the footsteps of the earlier ideological models. They are throwing human bodies up everywhere to achieve their political goals. To them a suicide bomber is not a human; he is a body being sacrificed for the good of the ideology. They lie, cheat and kill people to make sure that they are able to establish a state for their religious ideology.

Re: # 161 HP Sahab, which idealogy do you follow?

HP: The wiki definition of an ideology ("An ideology is an organized collection of ideas.") is incomplete. The proper definition would be: "An ideology is an organized collection of ideas that have been twisted to become a collection of meaningless nonsense spouted as being the Absolute and Therefore Unquestionable Truth by its adherents, the idiotlogues."

IB and hamid u are both bonkers, Imran couldnt do any thing because he was against the center, this meant he wasnt given the funds when it comes to doing something he built the first and best cancer hospital in a third world country like pakistan out of nowhere

And he is politically stupid because he is inflexible but he is one of the most intelligent captains and bowlers ever, he used to think his opponents out by building expectations one way and then going the other. similarly in cricket captaincy is a mind game that why is why the british call cricket the king of games, and he was a champion at studying the oppostion and the format of the game and then coming up with an appropriate strategy.

In the world cup semi and in final people were surprised at the slow batting and thought pak had lost the game, but Imran was playing slow to preserve the wickets he knew that if wickets are in hand the run rate can be jacked up in the last 10 overs, as 20 20 is now prooving.

similarly he used wasim as a strike bowler and told him to bowl fast and move the ball not worry about wides and no balls because he knew wickets taken would automatically slow the opp.

he used mushtaq and aqib as strike bowlers not containers, Imran backed inzimam throughtout the 92 world cup despite his initial failures, and kept salim malik chor on the bench because he didnt go by past reputation but by current ability.

And when it comes to working hard u might not know Imran was not even the fatsest at atchison leave alone the world but he set that as a goal and achieved it, on the dead pitches against strong oposition he did not settle into a gentle pace in the swelterung heat, he bolwed aggresively whenever he was in the atack, he had a never say die pathan atitude

you can also see his hard work in raising the funds for the cancer hospitl and then building it and maintaining it

he is not some run of the mill politician

Borivilli mian,

You have described IK's cricketing career well. But just becuase he was a good cricket captain does not necessary mean that he wud be a great politician or PM.

Regards

Borivilli mian,

You have described IK's cricketing career well. But just becuase he was a good cricket captain does not necessary mean that he wud be a great politician or PM.

Regards

Majumdar

I was pointing out through his cricket career that he is intelligent, hardworking, honest and through the cancer hospital and his refusal to compromise with the corrupt his commitment to the welfare of the poor

do u get it?

Borivilli mian,

I do get it. But if u (like YLH) expect him to show the same characteristics as PM of Pak u may be in for a rude surprise.

Regards

Hamidm u are a soulless man, u celebrate the crooks and knaves while for an honest man u have contempt.

even i know Imran wont become anything, but u rejoice in his defeat, u are a heartless man

Re: # 167 borivilli,
Who is the greater fool, the fool or the fool who follows him?
What's all of his cricketing skills to do with politics of Pakistan?

Someone wise said, ' don't argue with a fool because he will first drag you down to his level and beat you with experiance'

you are simply not worth it mate!

IB u will never understand logic if it farted on ur face

then don't fart - whats the relationship between sports and politics? how come fielding tactics, batting order, reverse swing fit into politics?

I hate ( knowing the power of hate ) Imran Khan because of two reasons:

a) his alliance with religious fanatics
b) his role against MQM where he was used by Jamat

IB I agree with you, his alliance with the religous parties was wrong, about the MQM i am not sure its such a good force what with altaf bhai running it like a dictator, his character too is quite poor.

I pointed out cricket for evidence of his hardwork and intellect and his work for the cancer hospital as well as his refusal to compromise with the crooks as evidence of his honesty and commitment to the poor

Like I said, this is just a dog's leash being changed.

Britain and US in 'safe return' deal for Bhutto
By Andrew Buncombe and Omar Waraich in Islamabad
Published: 08 October 2007

The depth of British and US involvement in the deal that helps General Pervez Musharraf retain office for another five years emerged yesterday when it was revealed the two countries have worked to secure a "safe return" to Pakistan for the woman he is poised to share power with.

British and American diplomats have met with leaders of a controversial political party long at odds with former prime minister Benazir Bhutto and encouraged it to show restraint when she returns to Karachi in 10 days' time. The leadership of the MQM party – which this year was blamed for violence in the city which left 41 dead – has vowed to keep off the streets on her return.

Details of the effort to smooth Ms Bhutto's return came as General Musharraf called for national unity following the overwhelming vote that should secure him another five years as president. "A majority, a vast majority, have voted for me and therefore that result is the result," he said after winning in a vote by the national and regional assemblies.

A central part of pre-election political horse-trading was a deal with Ms Bhutto's Pakistan People's Party (PPP) that paves the way for her to return and seek a historic third term as prime minister. A bullet-proof limousine is to be flown in for her arrival on 18 October. She told the Sunday Times: " I know there are security risks, people who want to kill me and scuttle the restoration of democracy."

#133 Posted by hamidm2,

I guess you can say this to Maj Gen (Retd & injured) Rashid Qureshi whose chopper was shot down today over AK when someone missed musharraf's chopper ahead in the air convoy.

anil # ....it was quite difficul to figure out exactly what you were trying to say in your reply.....it was somewhat all over the place.....

.....i think too many expats tend to think that whatever is thought up in usa think tanks must be ingenious.....whatever dealings i have had with americans, on subjects related to middle east, pakistan etc. has indicated to me that their think tanks for this area are generally filled with bumbling idiots......i cannot think of any country that has a poorer understanding of what goes on in this area.....just look at the mess the usa has gotten itself into in iraq and afghanistan, despite having massive resources available to it.....

......hence you may want to set aside any info that comes out of strategy sessions and think tanks in usa, regarding pakistan.....hamidm mian would be a good candidate for such think tanks......

........musharaff's trump card has been that he has divided pakistani society along conservatively religious and enlightenendly moderate groups.....he has, then, presented himself to the world and specifically to the usa as the leader of the last bastion of enlightened moderates in pakistan......

......this has served him well, and has forced bb to join in with the same lines.......however, this is going to do an extreme amount of damage to pakistan......it is as bad as dividing the country along ethnic lines.....it is one thing if a country, naturally, democratically and organically, divided along such lines.....it is another if a leader divides it to secure his/her place.......

.......pakistan is neither taliban nor enlightenedly moderate.....yet now it is going to have a govt. pushing the later, while simultaneously carrying out a very unpopular us foreign policy.......this is going to leave the door wide open for the religious right to exploit the vacuum.......do keep in mind that the mma could never win more than five seats, until the usa started bombing afghanistan and musharraf joined in wholeheartedly.....

......the problem for musharraf is that the liberal wing of pakistan - himself included - consists of crooks, fascits and dictators......on top of that, they ideologically oppose each other......how long will they last and what kind of governance will they provide.....it is one thing to have one dictator ruling the country.....now bb, altaf etc. will all be ruling together.......

........this will, in the long run, open up the space for the religious right.....and pakistanis, despite not being orthodoxoly inclined, will tilt towards this group more and more........they are already getting more and more anti-usa, as musharraf is getting more and more pro-usa.....

......someday musharraf will be gone, and then this flood of anti-american and pro-right feelings will come rushing onto the political spectrum....

anyone dividing pakistan along secular/religious or enlightendly moderate and maulvi lines is setting the basis of a polarized society.......

as i said, urstruly's star is about to rise.....smart money is on him......not on us think tanks......