Cholesterol Say Paak

I don't think Paracha is a Jiyala. He is an independent thinker of great ability.

Yes Mr NFP....
The results of the election are in front of us...
Even in rural areas the people have not considered judicial crisis as "media manufactured".....
Kindly elaborate on this......
And yes this question is also directed to your "fans"....
May be to quote you....
They are also confused with little to no knowledge of geo politics....
Answer jani......

Mr.Paracha is a jiyala just like his father, which of course takes away nothing from the fact that they are both highly intelligent, accomplished men. But a jiyala by defintion is one who can see no wrong when it comes to the PPP and the Bhutto family. I suspect if Benazir had chosen to support the restoration of the deposed judges, Mr.Paracha would have written a different article. She of course could not do so since the brother judges had made some rather unfriendly noises about the NRO.

I entirely agree with one of the charges Paracha makes against the this civil movement i.e. naivety. It is naive to think that a few thousand lawyers, journalists and students will be able to shake of the military-led establishment that has been ruling us for over fifty years now. It is also true that most in this civil movement are from a well-fed, high income minority with little purchase amongst the 'unwashed' masses. So it is futile yes..but valiantly so. It takes courage to offer one's head to the mean end of a police 'danda'.I am surprised that Mr.Paracha cannot appreciate this since I suspect his head was similarly offered during the Zia years..or not? I'd say the least that drawing room commentators like myself can do is doff our hats in respect to what is a brave but hopeless effort.

NFP deserves kudos for this brilliant piece..but he fails to make the point about benazir bhutto..it is equally ironic that she claimed to be against the two percent elite and was herself a feudal princess who cashed her surname..

Re: # 124
I hope Mr NFP does read it and answer it. I have also asked some questions in my post no 6 of this interact thread...
Mr NFP seems determined to ignore us....
But well done....
You do make a strong point.....

Oh Dear, what a shame!
You have no idea Mr.F. Paracha how shoddily you have used your powerful skill of writing. I am not a good writer esp. of English but I know the power of words. If your eyes are 'Nappak' and so creamed up with the left over cholesterol from your satiated stomach that you are unable to see the pain in which the whole nation is right now then the problem lies with you. It’s easy for you to say that this so called movement is by the courtesy of some naïve, hypocrites, confused bourgeois is because you Sir, are certainly not remotely related to these crazy few million fanatics.
You are blessed with such a highest form of intellect that you have lost your insight. You are not part of those few conscientious bourgeois protesting alone in front of Aga’s super market but one of those ‘enlightened moderates’ who prefer to play with semantics while sitting in their luxurious apartments. You make mockery of those ‘paanwaala’ kind of lawyers jumping and crying their hearts out for justice and does not even for one moment acclaim his conviction that not with a penny in his pocket he preferred to be injured by ‘Laathi charge’ or to be put behind bars just for expressing what he think is right.
I was your fan Nadeem F. Paracha when you used to write music reviews in beginning and some times on social issues. I still remember that shocking article about ‘Defense kee Aunties’ you wrote in ‘Mag’ but I feel so bad that our “Highly parhee likhee Writer’s community� is being so reclusive about all this ‘Movement against emergency/Martial Law’. It’s no time to sit back like ‘Nero’ when two of your provinces are smoldered with civil war.
True you can’t see any ‘movement’ like ‘Long Marches’ ‘Jalsa’ ‘Juloss’ because you are a Karachiite and being a Karachiite myself I am fully aware of the fact that ‘wahan chirya bhee per naheen maar saktee’ against that big ethnic party of Karachi, but then also prevailing stillness, uncertainty, discontentment could not remained escape even from your ‘Cholestrol se napaak’ eyes
Though my stomach is full but I am fighting along with the fellow citizens of Balochistan, NWFP, Punjab and Sind to give us equal rights of freedom of expression and equal opportunities to choose our leadership for future of Pakistan. We are struggling for Pakistan integration so no more excuses for America to invade us like ‘Iraq’, in order to save us from ‘Taliban’. We are fighting to get rid of American puppets in government. We are working to form an environment of justice for all, strengthening of institutions based on merit, revival of actual democracy and return of army to their camps.
Whether it is a “deewane ka khwaab� like creation of Pakistan or a sheer idealism, it is happening. We might loose and suffer for ever but at least we will not be ashamed of our selves as we did play our part in making the change which we desperately want and wished for Pakistan.
‘Jis Shaan se koi maqtalmein gaya, who SHAAN hee baqee rehtee hai,
Yeh Jaan to aanee janee hai ,is jaan kee koi baat naheen�.

Nikhat Riaz

It is a play of words. Is it man’ s playful nature? No, likeliest it seems to come out of boredom.as when one gets bored with tv ads,or one wants to start a conversation.speaking without thinking, then comes easy.the words civil, civil society, why not citizens. then i got reminded of the word ‘’regularisation’’,as in illegally constructed structures. most play with words and derive meanings to suit themselves, because english is not our Mother tongue. specially business english, is not our tongue at all. so whose business is regularisation?then it is surprising why a question arises when the group of youths come to see you? the answer is in your article. a cause, any cause, generally speaking is used to put youth on the scene, with self importance, furthering social contacts, getting some work done for cause, for family, friends, acquaintances and community. if community benefits individuals will too. such self important work daily, then go home, no work, and get stomach full, gives sense of fulfillment to ordinary lives.we center around family and food. we love/live to eat and we make our family work to make food the all important central issue; this gives us immediate gratification; this is our society, nowhere in the world you will find such.nice rambling article of yours in these times of tension.

Government Refuses to arrest Imran Khan:

The best laugh I have had in a while.

I have not been able to understand what does the writer mean by 'civil soviety'. Does the article aim to pinpoint hypocrisy in certain people?
Sana Gulraiz

I have not been able to understand what does the writer mean by 'civil soviety'. Does the article aim to pinpoint hypocrisy in certain people?
Sana Gulraiz

Though as an afterthought, I would like to add that I gave up on Marxist ideals after a while of vociferously advocating it for myself-why? Political parties are microcosms of the "mob"-they made me claustrophobic.

Thankyou. Thankyou so much.
I am so glad someone finally says it like it is.
The first thing that interested me when this whole emergency hoo-haa happened, was not dramatic, secreaming crowds of "protestors", but the fact that almost immediately the media, both Pakistani, US and the British(I might absolve the French media of this)drew this terrible picture of how everything was falling apart in the country, how roads were blocked, army personnel was patrolling the roads, barricades were being setup everytwhere and that the hush on the roads was ominous, black and basically worse than post-war Iraq. So I called my sister in Islamabad, and asked her if all of this was true. She said no, just the media blowing it up. I called my father, asked him if it was true in any small sense of the word. He said no, all that was going on was that electronic media had been blocked and some of the protestors were beginning to get arrested(this was towards the start of the emergency). I was fascinated by how everyone on the Western side of the world, was being given this gruesome picture of Pakistan, mostly by Pakistanis who study in the USA and visit Pakistan often, or had studied there and were now in Pakistan. My facebook minifeed(pardon my not-so-humble indulgences in the world of consumer technology) spoke every other second of how the situation was "unbeearable, oppressive, denying all freedom," etc etc. Stock phrases for stock placards. There has been only one article till now, and you might like to read it: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/7090632.stm
Th is a BBC correspondent who was in Pakistan and he sketched a picture of how stupidly wrong it was for anyone in the West to consider Pakistan as "dangerous" as Iraq and how life was absolutely normal.
In fact, if one actually stops and considers for a moment, the print media hasn't been blocked. And if one stops further and thinks about some of the utterly atrocious manhandling of facts that many private channels were indulging in because it gave them higher entertainment value and hence more viewers and hence, like you argue, more advertisements, and hence more m oney, I think it wouldn't have been bad to start some kind of regulatory body anyway to atleast make the channels take some responsibility for the trash that they were spewing out. Because quite honestly, it's all good to harp about "free speech", but when "free speech" on a public channel is a plethora of provocative catch phrases projecting a certain kind of mindset onto people, we might as well pack our bags, renounce any kind of governmental control and join the USA's print media in their unbelievable debachery of facts and substance.

And though I think that the middle class with their confused morality, finally coming onto roads might not be a bad thing, I also think that it is equally transparent, that for most, it's "a la mode". All the cool, pro-democracy people are doing it. Either jump the bandwagon or be off with you. The problem with any kind of mass movement is that the mob doesn't allow any middle ground to take root. I oppose this emergency. I oppose Musharraf's joke of a constitution. I also oppose Benazir Bhutto. I don't need the permission of a mob to do that. I can also do that without holding up a red placard that screams that I am protesting to the world, or at least if I did that, I would want to do that for something more than just being a part of this royal, screaming mass of neo-democratists.(And I think I just made up this word).

Finally, I'm sure everyone found out that our "Saviour of democracy", the Chief Juustice, got awarded HArvard LAw School's "Medal of Freedom". Naturally, the first world did not do its due homework on the third world before dishing out golden glories in the support of their forever-blaring bandwagons for democracy. Harvard Law School, as it announces to the press that its giving the CJ this prestigious "Medal of Freedom", should also announce the names of who it has given this medal to in the past, and the criteria according to which it awards this medal. It might turn out, that Asma Jahingir(of the Asma Jillani Case against Yahya Khan) might turn out a better candidate than our current flag-waver of the "people's cause".


-Saleha Waqar(Saleha.Waqar@Dartmouth.edu)
http://politicsofpakistanandotherstories.blog spot.com/

#113 Kulharee,
I find your behavior to be quite disgusting. At a time when your people are facing annhilation in Pakistan, you should not be going around being yourself and providing ammunition to people who want to lock you up and throw away the key. As Rey Juan Carlos said to Oooogo Chavez ...

Banana republics are controlled, used and abused through dictatorships, that is why with every dictatorship comes a short term boom of dirty money and speculation and consumption- that is no growth, nor any sign of economic development....

cliftonbridge writes "and you are right about inflation but isnt inflation the sign of a growing economy?"

Inflation is no sign of a growing economy when the growth is based on consumption and consumption alone which is accounted for by population increase and the spending of the top 1%, when over 84% of the population is languishing at under $2 a day, and yes in the 1990s, even though we were still under the military gun, regardless of the sham of a free democratic government- none of them were "free", they operated under the military gun, absolute poverty was lower

Zeemax are you the economic pundit here telling impressionable minds that the macro economy was better in the 1990's ? was absolute poverty lower? and you are right about inflation but isnt inflation the sign of a growing economy?

Re Bubbas limp attempt at ethnic slurs - looks like you saved us the effort by dipping your own face in custard pie ...Shame on you! this is no time to go telling pathan jokes (And its not relevent to tell irish or chinese jokes either).

#112 Chuhay, You made Masadi’s day by comparing him to me. Now Masadi will send you a double wrapped Paan with extra Supari and additional Chuna. Enjoy it in good health, and happy memorial day.

Kulharee #106 {"Masadi, your posts are generally stupid and dumb."}

Kulharee aka Qutubuddin Bukbuk

Somehow compared to you Masadi Sahib comes across as an intelligent, well-informed, and genuine person. You, on the other hand, give credence to all the anti-Mirzai rhetoric merely by expressing yourself rather than exercising self-imposed censorship. You should really shut up out of consideration for your race, your religion, your province, and your habit of visiting the Greek Isles too frequently.

Wow... this is how Paul must have felt on the road to Damascus.

Thanks NFP, I am deinitely enlightened (if not moderated)and in your debt. Finally understand why/how PPP has been such a dazzling success when in office. Gosh ... now I have a healthy respect for their policies.

Dang, NFP, you ain't lost your punch! And I don't know if I am even qualified to argue back with you. But isn't it a good thing that them dang Burgers--I guess I am officially one, now--are getting off their patooties and standing up for something besides a cappuccino?

The problem really was that the only ones that stood for anything in this country were The Great Unwashed who stood with Bhutto, or stood with the MQM or other ethnic parties, or stood with the "Islam is the Solution" crowd.

I am not bad-mouthing anyone; I respect that they stand for what they believe in. I even respect the young people who think that "Imran is the Solution". At least they stand.

And now if a good-looking aunty wants to stand, I say we encourage her! She looks better on CNN and her cousin in Kalamazoo blogs about here. I say we try to engage the burgers and the aunties in deciding how their country is run. We've sat on the couch and watched Zee TV for too long. Let's all stand!!

massaddi Mian:

When was the last time you smiled or laughed in friends company?

Re: # 107

masadi,

...... you are like a broken record harping on and on about the us elite ........ you need to find another gig if you ever want to find a decent job and get married instead of slapping the monkey when you are forty five .....

.... the first thing you should do is stop blaming the us elite for your failure to 'make it' in the land of oportunity ....... not everyone is like my sprinkler guy; there are lots of pakis with 'advanced' degrees in sociology driving cabs in ny city and 'teaching' at community colleges .......... nothing wrong with that - everyone doesn't have what it takes ..... but you don't have to be bitter .... things will get better

Kulharee writes "Re: #94 - Masadi, your posts are generally stupid and dumb. "

People like yourself with the comprehension ability of an eleventh grader, would not know anything regarding my posts- they are much beyond their "pay scale" so to speak. Regarding bigotry, the person (you) who spares no (manufactured) opportunity to insult Islam, Muslims and all Pakistanis because he suffers from multiple inferiority complexes due to the third rate status granted him in the US, not to mention how dumbo treats him, like a servant, should not have the audacity to call anyone else a bigot, not to mention that I deride not a race or nationality but an elite which oppresses humanity using the criteria of color, and propaganda that people having more than an eleventh grade reading ability would easily see through. You don't because you have happy being a slave to the US elite that pay you a few $$ and to dumbo....

Re: #94 - Masadi, your posts are generally stupid and dumb. Stop giving yourself so much importance. All your half-baked theories have been proven wrong, go find some job, there still is hope that you can get some peon job at the post office. My post you flagged was addressed to Salim Bihari Chuha who spares no occasion to badmouth Punjabis (but you wouldn’t find that racist, because you yourself are a bigot and a racist on top of being thick).

or u can become his Illegal advisor ....
his crime partner ....huh

hey NFP ...
y dont u send ths article to PTV ... i guess u'll get a handsome job there ....
n dude get a life ...
or u can send ur CV to Musharaff for his PA .

Re: #

LOL

but the FACT of the matter is AH celebrated the occasion of his getting the British passport with Fanfare, with media and photos and brimming with happiness, on being accepted as a LOYAL British Subject by Her Majesty the Queen and her Govt..!!

..Maybe the receding Past 'Once ' super power , has left a Peg, firmly placed , to be used on a later appropriate moment, by the Way the 1997 Hong-Kong matter was solved rather amiably , so maybe the OTHER plans are being shelved for now.

.... and I again, admire the vision of Nehru , for taking appropriate action on time...


... Unfortunately the Punjabi Dhagga has not learned any lesson, and has again acted like an ASS [ donkey ] , by lending his shoulder ........ Period.

I see quite clearly that some people most vociferously applauding the central theme of this article are very those who advertise on this forum offering a passive gay relationship.

No names of-course. But can there be a correlation?

#56 Posted by cliftonbridge

Before 99 we had 35% of pakis below the poverty line ...

... but then we also changed the definition of poverty from x dollars per day to x caloric intake per day in 2000 so no comparison can be made ... :)

Re: # 76

Aqua-paiyaan,

Karachi does not need any seal of confirmation regarding their patriotism or nationalism. Kindly keep your bile of prejudices up your's u know where.

Courts of pakistan,

Every institution in pakistan is corrupt including teh supreme court. The previous justices were biased against mushy and now he has put a few that supports him. What is wrong with that.

Re: # 96
That is a strong point- I wish that more people could understand it rather coming up with NS, BB and Mushi stuff.
Or Mr NFP's twisted "middle class morality " stance......
Certain things in life whether perceived to be considered important or relevant by a vast majority are important nevertheless...
I will again give example of Hudood Ordinance..
It was a draculian law which could actually impact any woman but at the same time a vast majority of lower class women were not even aware of it and therefore it was not considered relevant....
Does that mean it was in reality not relevant....
It was....
And should have been opposed
And was opposed by some of the same people whom Mr NFP are tauntingingly calling as "civil society".....

Re: # 87

bhubba Paiyaan,

"But the two brain dead mohajirs. Why are mohajir brains so expensive in Pakistan? Because most of them have none."

Deliberate provocation or just plain stupid? Iam betting on tha latter. By the way, moron, this joke is for pathans and it was the mojos who wrote that joke for dummies like u.

No Democracy with a destroyed judiciary,..golden words of Ms Nasim Zahra...

The News international...

Saturday, November 10, 2007
Nasim Zehra

Islamabad: The Musharraf government's reported attempt to forcibly flown off the legitimate Chief Justice of Pakistan Iftikhar Chaudary , along with his family to Quetta did not succeed because of resistance by the Chief Justice and his family. Most of the deposed judges are under house arrest. The government hopes, and very erroneously, to gag these honorable men in the hope that the public too will forget these men and what they have stood for. The battle to roll back the serving army Chief's orders to trash the Constitution of Pakistan will indeed be centered around the national demand to restore these honorable judges. No matter how many thousands the government imprisons, the demand to r5estore the judges will spread.



There can be no genuine democracy with a destroyed judiciary. Therefore the twining of two demands is essential: the revival of the Constitution, the restoration nation-wide of the pre-PCO independent judiciary and the holding of fair and free elections under a credible care-taker set up. This crucial twining cannot be overlooked by any of the forces that have joined the debate on Pakistan's current crisis; whether the lawyers, the politicians, the media and Pakistan's friends abroad. Yet those who seem to understate or miss this point include some of Pakistan's political parties, the present government, general Parvez Musharraf and no less the United States government.



If we do not sufficiently focus on this issues, the fear is that in a couple of weeks after the weak PCO -accepting judiciary will rule general Musharraf's presidential election Constitutionally valid he will be willing to give up his army chief position and announce the holding of elections. This would satisfy Washington as it has not concerned itself with the question of the judiciary's restoration. It may have been convinced by genearl Musharraf that the judiciary has 'hindered' Pakistan's participation in the war on terrorism. Washington and London may then conclude that it is time to rejoice the return of democracy sans an independent judiciary.



Meanwhile the overwhelming majority within the PML-Q barring Mushahid Hussain, S.M Zafar and Wattoo do not care how independent or pliant is the judiciary. Finally as far as the Opposition is concerned it remains unclear how far the Opposition parties will then, after the election announcement mobilize the public to demand restoration of the judiciary. Other than sporadic statements on the need to restore the judiciary there has been no passionate and united demand by mainstream political parties, except Imran Khan demanding the restoration of the pre-PCO judiciary.



But in fact after having mutilated the independent judiciary, from which at least 55-60 judges refused to take oath and are thrown out, we will have been presented with only more of a khaki-engineered and Washington-underwritten democracy. A docile and pliable judiciary will be 'legal guarantor' of just a mutilated democracy.



Unless the destruction of the judiciary is reversed, for the next 20 years no judge will ever speak up for Constitutional rule in Pakistan. The ones who paid a price of standing up and performing their Constitutional duty must be owned and honored by the people of Pakistan. Pakistan's present and future will then hang in a limbo while the country will be ruled according to the wisdom of individuals functioning outside the discipline of the Constitution.



Meanwhile general Musharraf will have effectively destroyed the only real attempt at institutional balancing...attempt to hold State power accountable. Once Musharraf doffs his uniform the Bush government will happily accept him as a democrat..



We must continue to focus even more sharply on how the independent judiciary was ransacked and demand the restoration of the judiciary. We need to get all the political parties to clearly state their stance on general Musharraf's dismantling of the judiciary.



Our heroes, if at all we are to have any, have to be the deposed judges, the ones under house arrest, the ones who refused to take oath under the PCO, the ones who were trying desperately even if at times somewhat flamboyantly, but never unconstitutionally, to enforce rule of law in the country.
We need to popularize the phrase no democracy with a destroyed judiciary… pre-November 3 judiciary must be restored.

Re: # 88

bubba payaan,

What do we have here? Cant say anything intelligent therefore resort to grunting and moaning?

Why Kulharee can get away with posts like his #92 and even my most benign posts are censored and I am banned is because he is possibly on the miserable Chowk staff's board. The users here need to counter the efforts of this staff of misery's effort to convert this site into a propaganda network like PTV.

Dear Mr. Paracha,
I so totally agree with you.
Where are all these lawyers and the Judiciary when things that really matter to the democratic spirit of Pakistan matter. Our women......and the Repealing of the Hudood ordinance. Where is the Shor and Ha ha Kaar?
What democracy?
Benazir Bhutto was a farce during her first and second rule!
What did her democracy accomplish for Pakistan?
I dont know of any other woman far removed from the reality of the common people she so represents....I remember when she first came to Pakistan to contest Elections after the demise of Zia ul Haq, she couldnt even speak the language of the people properly........Her accent of Urdu and grammar were both atrocious......

She promised us great 5 year education programs and stabilized inflation.........
Yeah Right.....The poor still dont get the education they deserve...Which member of a provincial or national assembly sends their children to public schools....
And Inflation...yeah...It sky rocketed during her tenure of greatness and the golden age of democracy she ushered in after Zia Ul Haq....
The Champion of the people......Mr. Nawaz Sharif wasnt even worse.
Nawaz Sharif almost got us declared a terrorist state during Clinton Era. His family filled its coffers, polluted Punjab with Ittifaq foundaries waste, paid no taxes and robbed the uncivil folk blind.....


Yes, this is the democracy the judiciary wants......

Democracy in a place where Might makes Right.....

and I am not talking about the strong arm of the army....

I am referring to the industrialists and Jagirdaars who rest their behinds in the halls of our provincial and federal governments.

I just dont know that who will raise their voice for Pakistan's Silent Majority.....
Its WOMEN........
Its mothers, daughters, sisters, wives, mistresses, whores, saints.

Perhaps that day, I will think all these lawyers are fighting for something worth fighting.......

otherwise we will again have a "DEMOCRACY" where a despot idiot will almost declare himself a Caliph.and Pakistan a terrorist state

or a woman with nothing in common with the Pakistani people will rule riding the waves of her controversial father....

Sorry, the #91 meant to site #83 and not #86 of that Bihari haramzada moron Salim Chuha... sorry Salim bhaijan for an unintentional oversight. I beg your pardon. Gracias.

#86- Sharjee, when you will come out of that god forsaken subjugated oppressed land, little nobody’s like Paracha Sahib will appear really insignificant. Just as they appear from the corner office of Wall and Williams. This guy is trying too hard for his own good. Please move on. 60s Che Guevara’s is a dead ideology. Pakistan can do without it.

Re: # 83
Hmmmm
That was a brilliant take..
I think Mr NFP has a lot to answer...
Shargee,add some issues I have mentioned in my post no 6 to one you have just raised.....

bubba,

I am a mojo too, please don't say bad things about us. It hurts our feelings :(

Re: # 77 Posted by cliftonbridge on November 9, 2007 9:43:40 am

[They are actually supporting the army instead of being slaughtered by it.] Mohajirs are supporting the army, because like beggars they want hand outs. It is unfortunate that BB would even consider bringing them along in her next government. Strange political bedfellows indeed.

Re: # 79 Posted by hamidm2 on November 9, 2007 9:48:38 am

[..... first it was zardari and now she is stuck with these three clowns: mushy, fazloo and altaph bhai ......... maybe she can persuade mario khan .........]

fazloo might be the best politician amongst the four. But the two brain dead mohajirs. Why are mohajir brains so expensive in Pakistan? Because most of them have none.

#66 Neem Boo {"also, if karachi is lukewarm, what might be the reasons? "}

For someone claiming to be a professor, you have got to be the most stupid person on Chowk. If you have to ask this question, you must be a seasonal Paki.

Re: # 80

tahmed,

.... i don't think i said anything about today's rally .... i did say that the long march to nirala sweet house will take place (maybe)......

........ but seriously, do you have any doubts that mushy and bb are in bed ? here is what bbc says:

'Mock conflict'


But is the falling-out quite what it seems?

More cynical observers think Friday's dramas in Islamabad and elsewhere are an exercise in mutual face-saving, a clandestine understanding that is meant to benefit both.

Gen Musharraf imposed emergency rule after months of unrest

According to these observers, the masses in Pakistan are not yet ready to come out in full support of political leaders against a government bent on preventing street protests.

This, they say, was known to Ms Bhutto when she called Friday's public meeting in Rawalpindi, near Islamabad.

Her subsequent detention has helped preserve the "mythical name" of the Bhuttos in Pakistan.

And, the cynics say, has also negated the impression that she, a self-declared champion of democracy, is in cahoots with Gen Musharraf, a military dictator who came to power by deposing an elected government.

As for Gen Musharraf, a mock conflict with Ms Bhutto's Pakistan People's Party (PPP) affords him time to get the revamped Supreme Court to endorse the legality of his re-election as president.

Bubba #40 {"MQM having brains? If you are the proof of a mohajir brain, then only Allah can save Pakistan"}

Bubba,
If my good friend, ZK, had not alerted me, I would have lost the opportunity to rectify your rectum-constricted brains about Mr. Ahmed Madani's ethnic credentials. Unlike most Paindoo Khotays who bray uncontrollably, like Hypo Chacha Al Butteesi, at the mere appearance of an Urdu speaking Mohajir, Mr. Ahmed Madani is a shining example of Punjabi literacy, courage, and enlightened outlook. Too bad his kind is an endangered type in our Punjab.

To Mr. Paracha, thank you for mentioning me in your article.
To others, I am the “young socialist lad� NFP sahib is talking about. I was told about this piece by my fellow room mates and I write here to clarify something, when I should be studying. :P
First of all, NFP, I never said I was a Socialist, but a socialist sympathizer. And I got what you meant when you said how can a progressive person like me be listening to a reactionary like Imran Khan. Why? Because so many of us look at people like you with a history of struggle against dictatorships, mullahs and multinationals, but what happens if you too back out from a struggle just because of what you call “the tyranny of middle class morality.� Who else should we turn to if not men like Imran? Fazlu, Qazi, BB (even though it is well known you have a soft spot for her)? I might not agree with Imran on a lot of things, but he is the only one addressing the educated youth, while you don’t even bother to turn up whenever asked to speak at seminars in lahore, as someone rightly mentioned here. Now, those who have been calling Mr. Paracha a Marxist, think again. His history as a Marxist student leader against Zia and a lefty journalist is well known by those who follow him, but they should have heard him last year when he was a speaker at a youth conference in Karachi. His speech was a clear give away at what he has now become.
First of all, more than Marx, he quoted Nietzsche. Then he read a few paragraphs from what he says are his favourite books. One was “A guide to Military Coups� and the other, “The Mass Psychology of Fascism.� He also clearly said that he was only an “academic Marxist� with sympathies for people like Hugo Chivaz and Castro, and that he is nothing but “an old fashioned Socialist.� But what shocked me was when he went on to say, “I don’t care if a Socialist order is achieved through a democracy or a dictatorship.� So he doesn’t mind a dictatorship then.
All said, I still have deep respect and admiration for Paracha Saheb, and will not oppose him just because he did not take our invitation to support our struggle, because no matter what he thinks about our thinking, he is still read by a number of people and does manage to highlight the social issues haunting our country.
Just needed to clear a few things. Now back to my books. Thank you.

Nadeem, This needed to be said, even in your "convoluted" satirical fashion. Thank you. This brings up certain questions I would like to ask your full stomached self since I am one of those somewhat disappointed in your take on El Generalissimo, but those will have to wait for now. I do agree with much of what you have said here though. Hope you're well.

lol hamidm...that about sums it up ...national fcuk frenzy!! Looking at the sorry faces in that loveless bed its small wonder imran is desperately trying to evade a fate worse than death by putting himself under lock and key..... Imran unlike BB has probably got better taste in men.

hamidm: I think you have caught Nostrodamiusitis from Romair. This is a terrible disease, where the victim starts coughing predictions.

Yesterday you had predicted that Musharraf would let Benazir have her rally today, that a handful of aunties would show up, and everyone would go home. Mush sent thousands of men over instead, arrested 5000 of her supporters, banned BBC and CNN broadcasts..and still couldnt keep Benazir from making a charge through the ranks of his incompetents and actually break through the first "lines of defense".

Today I see you making more predictions...alas. :-(

talking about karachi, can you imagine altaph bahi in that bed too ....... poor benazir - she does have bad luck when it somes to men ..... first it was zardari and now she is stuck with these three clowns: mushy, fazloo and altaph bhai ......... maybe she can persuade mario khan .........

"ctually karachi is more pakistan "

well thats your POV

Else the exactly opposite response during the CJ - Drama , says something else.

"Well, the present status of Karachi, is , its unofficially not a Part of Pakistan any more.... PERIOD"


...actually karachi is more pakistan now than it has been in the past. They are actually supporting the army instead of being slaughtered by it. Id say thats a step up.

Some one asked about the lukewarm response of Karachi,


Well,the present status of Karachi, is , its unofficially not a Part of Pakistan any more.... PERIOD.

its now ruled by the Zombies of a Loyal British Subject, a proud holder of British Passport, living in SAFE-HOUSE or rather Held by the Govt of Her Majesty the Queen , who was recently officially advised by the Govt of Her majesty the Queen, to restraint himself on the return of BB darling ,with the tacit approval of Mr Bush and Co.

Period.

the bed we made

... what a crock of bs and dramabazi!........ can somebody post that picture of benazir and mushy getting married with condi and bush standing behind them ?

.... all we need is fazloo in bed and we will have a perfect menage a trois ....... yuck! what a disgusting thought !

BB launches election campaign !

... okay, how much do you want to bet that musharraf WILL doff his uniform before Nov 15, a provisional government WILL be announced and elections WILL be moved up to Jan 15 ?? ........ i also think that BB will be allowed to have her Long March from lahore to islamabad ...... heck, the spooks will also supply the busses and maybe even a couple of thousand marchers .....

........ at this rate chaudhary shujaat hussain and pervez elahi will be asking to get arrested ... get in line behind imran khan!

here is why .... from NYT:

"But late in the afternoon, the authorities said Ms. Bhutto’s detention could be lifted tonight, and in what appeared to be a carefully stage-managed move agreed on with the government, Ms. Bhutto emerged from her house and made a speech that was broadcast on official Pakistani television.

Ms. Bhutto said she was “listening to the voice of my conscience� and appealed to the government to end the emergency rule. She said that she had not spoken to General Musharraf and would not negotiate with him until emergency rule was ended and the Constitution revived. "

love2love karachi is a very diverse place. The people at the press club being beaten were karachiites... the cops were karaciites ....the ones beating the cops (actually i know from eye witnesses that the cops got beaten up first) were also karachiites.

There isnt a mass cry for democarcy because karachi suffered hugely under BB and benefited under Mush.

Masadi you are correct in suggesting that overall poverty is still shocking in pakistan. The point being made is that using the same standard (which accounts for inflation/purchasing power etc) there is less absolute poverty now than before.

Re: # 65 Posted by hamidm2 on November 9, 2007 8:40:26 am

[.... talk is cheap, mutton is not .......] How about daal? Good diet these days. Pakistanis will have no cholesterol problem, if they start eating chicken and daal. What do you thnik?

Seems like NFP , want to dismiss the whole issue as NOT WORTHY following.
Disappointing very disappointing, irrespective of who is at the fore front, whether the Devils is Black Coat , so to speak, or the Civil , One Playcard Society.
Does he has any idea , what are the issues that are involved here..?
I think not.
I have been saying this for long.
Dictators are poison to any society.

The First Dictator, alienated one whole section of this god forsaken unfortunate nation,resulting in separation, inspite
of the fact, that 5 out of 8 earlier PMs , before 55-56 were Bengalis, and Pakistan's second economic plan , was a model taught in countries like Korea.
..this First Dictator had a bit of shame in him , with the first cries of " Ayub Kutta Hai Hai " , he relinquished .

The Second Dictator , tore the very fabric of this so called unfortunate experiment of a nation, into every conceivable division.
Social,legal,provincial,regional,religious, and worst of all ethnic , the fruits of which , .......the society, both civil and un-civil is still bearing.

This Third Dictator has firmly put this 'experiment' on the Path of disintegration , .that is the bottom Line.

...and if some one is Defending , or dismissing such an obvious ... then the bottom line is the only answer.

neembu, the episode was filmed by some channels but since they are off, very few actually saw it, even though I think Business Plus did show a clip of it this evening during a short docu they ran on BB.

Mr. Paracha, I have no idea why Chowk has given a midless freak like you a dedicated space. You should stick to making midless Telenor adds.

You say : "To hell with democracy. After all, as most uncivil beings will tell you, it's easy to defend democracy on a full stomach."

To hell with you for making such a comment. Food price inflation can only be countered in a enviroment where there are indpendent instituions. Food price inflation has been the hihghest in DICTATOR Musharraf's reign. In September he announced a ficticious bumper crop only to allow his junta to make money by exporting the grain. This while 70 mio live below USD 2 a day . We have the one of the most adultarated food according to WHO because there is not instition left to consumer rights (thanks to Mushrraf again).

Leave your imagination to your Telenor adds and directing girls and boys running around the trees while it is raining. You are not much good for anything else.

Re: # 63
I am not surprised if he popular in LUMs...
Firebrand radical appeal...
Excellent command of language...
Controversial and unconventional ....
Cool...
Has the ability to give an intellectual rationale to apparently strange opinions!!!!
But then you have yourself written left wing as "left wing"...
And in LUMs left wing is "left wing" in reality....

#60 Posted by masadi:

Masadi, Pakistan is shining today like India has been shining over the last few years. The quote below from today's The Sydney Morning Herald clearly indicates that poverty is fast dissapearing in Pakistan:

" General Musharraf's comrades in the military control Pakistan's epaulette empire, a $US40 billion ($43 billion) sprawl of businesses. Controlling about 10 to 15 per cent of the economy, the military is the biggest single stakeholder in Pakistan's booming economy. Property, tourism, construction, transport and telecoms, there is barely a business sector not tinted with some sort of brass hue. The generals even own a popular breakfast cereal brand, alongside bakeries, petrol stations, farms, banks and companies listed on Karachi's soaring stock exchange."

Re: # 63

this is interesting. would appreciate a link if this incident was covered. also, if karachi is lukewarm, what might be the reasons?

masadi mian,

.... talk is cheap, mutton is not ....... tell me, did you try to get to liaqat bagh yesterday or did you stay home and watch the cricket match on dish ?....... nobody i know - and some of them are ppp 'jiyalas' - went out yesterday ...... as my nephew said, 'uncle, jalsay jaloos tau hotay rahtey hain; cricket match kabhi kabhi hota hai"

........ musharraf's timing of the emergency was impeccable - indian cricket tour, wedding season, bakr eid, thanksgiving, christmas , new year's eve, valentines day .......... he know his people very well ...

Re: # 56
He is not making this point that " masses have not been mobilized because they dont understand how they will benefit from democracy this time round since they never have in the past"

Look he has cited PPP's strong showing on 18th October as evidence of non relevance of certain issues which are a reflection of middle class mentality.
I am questioning the selective use of mass protest to support stance...
I feel it bewildering that on 18th "un washed masses" slapped urban middle class and media manufactured issues by turning up in large numbers..
While those were not even there when ZAB was hanged...
ZAB was popular in the masses....So using his own logic will I be correct if I say that masses endorsed ZAB's death...
He was unpopular with conservative elements, Industrialists and urban middle class at that point of time...not with masses...

People are in this country not organized for collective action….They can only come out through the organizational apparatus of a well entrenched political party such as PPP and that too only when the State allows them the luxury…So appearnce of masses on 18th October and lack of masses in this emergency state has to be viewed from this angle also…
If today emergency is lifted and government allows political activity, the same masses will appear if BB gives a call to protest on apprently irrelevant anal middle class issues such as uniform etc…

Paracha has a pretty solid following among the "left-wing" students of LUMS, even though he has continued to refuse offers to speak there. He makes good points here, but I do not agree with him on some. So what if, as he says, the liberals and conservatives and extremists are coming upon a single platform. Let them get rid of a dictatorship and let the people decide whom they want during an elections.
But Paracha is right in saying that a contradictory middle class morality has stung the media and the civil society. I think this is his main problem. He lives in Karachi and it is true that so far Karachites' response to the emergency has been lukewarm. Few days ago when some journalists were being thrashed outside the press club, I saw many onlookers actually taunting them and appluading the cops. It was hearbreaking.

Even with a so called democratic dispensation, the military will still be in charge (as much as you can be in this country) they don't need a dictator for that. If the military rules openly with a figurehead in charge they will be responsible for their fuckups rather than projecting them onto their frontmen/women and completely discrediting democracy in the eyes of many paki's .

#56 Posted by cliftonbridge:

".... lets sow the seeds now...". I think the seeds are being sown. More and more unwashed are talking about the constitution. They just call it by a different name. A version of this constitution may very well be passed and "voting" for this constitution may very not be very civil.

clifton writes "Before 99 we had 35% of pakis below the poverty line , now that percentage is 23%. Those are not unimportant numbers"

Whose "poverty line", Musharraf's? According to world bank data over 84% of Pakistanis live below $2 a day, with possibly half of them under $1 a day. Poverty in absolute numbers as well as percent of population has not been reduced during the Musharraf era, in fact given runaway inflation the fate of the common man and woman is much worse than it was in 99

clifton writes "Before 99 we had 35% of pakis below the poverty line , now that percentage is 23%. Those are not unimportant numbers"

Whose "poverty line", Musharraf's? According to world bank data over 84% of Pakistanis live below $2 a day, with possibly half of them under $1 a day. Poverty in absolute numbers as well as percent of population has not been reduced during the Musharraf era, in fact given runaway inflation the fate of the common man and woman is much worse than it was in 99

#54 Posted by masadi:

"Small movements can sometimes gather momentum to make a greater difference than sitting on your ass, and driving around town will not lead you to the "uncivil" society because roads have been constructed with the needs of the civil society in mind."

Very well said!

Re: # 56

does the average person in the us care? what explains dubya then?

having said that, the average person probably does care but doesnt want to expend the energy needed to make change. we see it all the time around us at work, etc.

skeptic i think NFP is right in saying the masses have not been mobilized because they dont understand how they will benefit from democracy this time round since they never have in the past.

Before 99 we had 35% of pakis below the poverty line , now that percentage is 23%. Those are not unimportant numbers. If we had 50% living below the poverty line that would be a revolution.

Similarly hudood is not important to anyone in pakistan except a marginal elite. Bhutto was also kind of unpopular before he was hanged.

The glorious vague ideals of democracy are hard to follow for most people. Democracy takes time.... lets sow the seeds now...even rotten seeds will eventually give life to a gulmohar someday. That just doesnt have much street power.

Its not a question of moral right its a question of whether the average person (not the average rich person)really cares.

Re: # 53
I want him to answer the queries....
Read post number 6.....

GT writes "The guy must be a total looser ... braging about his debate with some teenage kids here in chowk ... kind of pathetic. "

Loser maybe but frustrated yes, because as part of the "civil society" he has been unable to cause any change or to make any dent in the power structure. So with frustration come different reactions, some make a deal with the devil and have a jolly good time, others fight against themselves and their own demons, a kind of schizophrenia- like the author is doing, yet others keep on with the struggle trying to raise consciousness in both the "civil" and "uncivl, as he calls it" society. The author has taken the path of a loser, his own failures he has attributed to the failure of all those who seek to make some change. By the way full stomachs give better insights into viewing the larger picture and not keeping busy with your own personal circuits, maybe that is why more of the "civil" society who have not sold out to the devil, and have a social conscience try to "react" to these things. Small movements can sometimes gather momentum to make a greater difference than sitting on your ass, and driving around town will not lead you to the "uncivil" society because roads have been constructed with the needs of the civil society in mind. Paracha, get a life and quit discouraging people who have the spirit of resistance regardless of their tiny numbers....

Hey guys,

I dont think its fair to attack writers when they arent around to respond. Please desist, thanks.

Re: # 51
Well I wont go to the extent of calling him a total loser....
He is an egoist nevertheless..
He writes entire article if some one even opposes him in a personal meeting…
There was an article on chowk by Mr NFP which originated because a TV journalist had turned down his request to abstain showing a so called anti Darwin video on her TV channel. She apparently had taunted him on being “retro socialist and out of sync with modern ideas…�
But he does need to clarify his position properly and stop usage of allegations such as “confused self contradictory half baked philosophy� to refute his contrary opinions…
He just uses it to wriggle himself out of tight spots…. When logic fails-he comes up with a sweeping allegation…..

#50 Posted by Skeptical:

Agreed. I do not know this Paracha guy but he seems to be some kind of a radical idol in Pakistan. I re-read the article after reading your post and I do agree with what you say. The guy must be a total looser ... braging about his debate with some teenage kids here in chowk ... kind of pathetic.

Re: # 41
Yeah I think unfortunately NFP sort are interpreted as "rebel" by many....
I just think he needs to clarify his position and contradictions to actually be vindicated.....
I keep on hearing about self righteous middle class and its confused leaders and the plight of down trodden by VTI driving and Grammer School educated people like NFP...
I have raised some issues in my post no 6....
These issues are not only about his contradictions in his personal life but also the selective use of “masses� to make his point….
So masses turn out on 18th October is cited as evidence of “non issue� status of NRO and lawyers movement …
And whereas lack of mass protest on ZAB’s death or things like Hudood ordinance is being conveniently ignored…
My point is that masses showing up should not be a criteria for making a viewpoint….
And if you decide to make basis of a viewpoint than be consistent across the board…

"The bearded goat look is so OUT!"


Bj hopefully the bihari bakra look is still in .....or at least in benazirs ageless mind.

While Mr. Paracha practices his debating skills with teenage business school students, I thought the following 2 pieces of news (from Dawn) would interest middle class confused chowkies:

SWAT, Nov 8: Armed militants captured more government installations in Swat on Thursday and announced a punishment of 15 lashes for anyone not offering prayers in Matta tehsil.
Sources said the militants took over a police post on the Shangla hills, some 35km north of Mingora.
In Charbagh, Maulana Fazlullah’s supporters took over the Pakistan-Austria Training Institute for Hotel Management. The centre was established with the financial assistance of Austria in 2003 at a cost Rs150 million. It is the only training facility in the country for hotel management and tourism in the private sector.
In Khwazakhel area, militants set on fire the police station.
A tense calm prevailed with military helicopters hovering over the area. Security forces were consolidating their positions in and around Mingora amid reports that an operation was likely.
A handout issued in Peshawar said the overall situation in Swat was under control and no untoward incident had been reported over ‘the past 48 hours’. Paramilitary forces were on high alert and educational institutions remained open.


KARACHI, Nov 8: In four trading days of the current week on the Karachi Stock Exchange, foreign investors withdrew around $185 million from equity and $50 million from government bonds.
From Monday to Thursday, market capitalisation of insurance and banking sectors declined by 6.5 per cent and 5.2 per cent, respectively.
Figures of possible outflow during the four trading days of mayhem at the market, prompted by political events, varied from analyst to analyst, but most of them thought that it could hardly have been below $160 million.
Since the aggregate foreign portfolio investment stands at $850 million (excluding those in GDRs), the outflow was a substantial 20 per cent of the overseas equity investment, traders said.
Overall, the KSE-100 index shed 491 points during the week. Volatility on Thursday, like the day earlier, was exceptionally high with the index oscillating 311 points between the low and high for the day.
In the absence of credible real-time news about the market from an independent source due to the blackout of private television channels, most healthy and wealthy investors behaved like blind men in a dark room. They had solely to rely on their stockbroker picking up the phone in order to know what the value of scrip at the time was. Until the prayers of the investors were answered and the broker was free to attend to the call, the share may have dived by several rupees leaving trail of losses in its wake.

And Zeemax,

The bearded goat look is so OUT!

Anyone from the Pindi and Islamabad area?

We need to know what is going on there and

also in Lahore at the moment.

Ras

Zeemax,

Beauty is ageless!

I read this piece, and yes it is well written, prickly and all those good things. Granted, everyone's got some payoff, some deal. But no one has been able to explain why lawyers and journalists are risking their physical safety, livlihoods and reputations in the street, day after day. Can we get some info please?

Re: # 41

but zeemax is not a leftist...?

"Sindhi , punjabis are no match for MQM brain" ...hate to talk in stereotypes but the pushtoons are the only ones kicking ass in Pakistan at this point, while everyone else struggles to clutch at straws. Talking in stereotypes its safe to say brains have little to do with it :)
Unfortunately for us all the only intelligent strategist in pakistan today seeems to be the wicked witch Osama. Everyone else has made critical mistakes, maybe irreperable. I dont see much for anyone to gloat about.

Skeptical:

I liked reading through the article just for the style. It seemed that a lot of ideas were borrowed from our own Hamid. But that is life ... you grow on the shoulder of giants.

You make an excellent point. I do not know the author, but know the type you are talking about quite well ... upper-middle class background, excellent English, casanova for leftist women, left-wing rhetoric, financed in life by relatives and/or crumbs thrown by the rich and/or NGO type organizations, and above all condescending as hell and able to criticize everything outside their own selves. But we need their kind ... just as we need the Indian actors Jeetendra and Govinda.

Re: # 33 Posted by ahmedmadani on November 9, 2007 5:13:45 am

[It proves Sindhi , punjabis are no match for MQM brain, iit is not race comment it is facts.]

MQM having brains? If you are the proof of a mohajir brain, then only Allah can save Pakistan.

Re: # 17 Posted by hamidm2 on November 8, 2007 6:09:58 pm

[..... you know me well .....] I know you well. You are just a resident comic at chowk.

Re: # 36

zee its called Botulinum toxin

Re: # 33

LOL

yep Nehru was a true visionary.

#35 Posted by hamidm2,

Yeah she had a face lift plus eyelid surgery last year to remove the crow's feet and wrinkles around the eyes.

Re: # 31

zeemax,

....... you must admit that she looks pretty good for a 54 year old woman ..... if she lost 10-15 pounds i would vote for her

..... everybody in pindi and islamabad is pissed off at the government for making life miserable ....... nobody can get to work or go to school and the butchers have raised the price of mutton .......

......... finally ,abdul paki is getting pissed off! ...... if the price of milk and tomatoes goes up mushy is a goner .......

Re: # 22 General has more knowledge of military strategy than Big Khan. He has defeated him by refusing to fight and this must be most pathetic movement in life. It proves Sindhi , punjabis are no match for MQM brain, iit is not race comment it is facts.

Why not me!

ISLAMABAD Nov 10, 2007: Pakistan Tehreek-i-Insaaf Chairman, Imran Khan, complained to the Human Rights Commission that inspite of his best efforts the government was refusing to arrest him. "Today they even arrested Benazir Bhutto at the request of the US administration," he said. "Why arn't they arresting me? Am I not worthy of being a leader?" the Big Khan said. A spokesperson for the Home Ministry laughed when asked why the government was discriminating against Imram Khan.

#29 Posted by bjkumar,

You are merely jealous of the BeeB because of her youth

Her youth? Bhai BeeB is 54 yrs old, and not even alum baths help her.

Is she young in your comparison? Ohh ... no dig on age but in that case you must be about 68.

NFP

Jee Rukh, keep writing, this was pertinent and timely reminder of the hypocrisy in our society. Thanks

Bridge,

Come out and admit the truth!

You are merely jealous of the BeeB because of her youth, her beauty, her charm and her other virtues commonly associated with the fair sex.

Yes, that aunty's pic was funny. Good read this, because I wonder where civil society vanishes when there are keepers of the faith burning CD shops and planting bombs.

Yaar skeptical, just give this UKP a bhara hua charas ka cigarette and he will start arguing from the other side.

Two bit journalists are a dime a dozen.

Clifton Mian,

Looks like Benazir has been placed under house arrest.

That Qabar is getting stronger by the day.

The people from the other side of the bridge still say:


Jab Tak Pakistan Rahay Ga

Bhutto Tera Naam Rahay Ga


Aur wohi in a paigham rahay ga......

But seriously, why does she still retain such a large

vote bank? It makes one wonder...


hamim,

I would vote for a stop at Nirala Sweets too.

Too much politics these days on CHOWK.

We all need to lighten up and indulge in some Merlot.

This is either a storm in a teacup or a

teacup in a storm!!!!

As long as they don't start arresting the dancing

girls and the hijras too....

"Jab Tak Pakistan Rahay Ga

Bhutto Tera Naam Rahay Ga

tu qabar se jald wapas aa - nahin tu

har Bhutto badnaam rahe ga"


....sorry Ras couldnt resist !

NFP Touche....

Uncivil/Unwashed masses Zindabad!


Jab Tak Pakistan Rahay Ga

Bhutto Tera Naam Rahay Ga


Jiyala

LAHORE, Nov 13, 2007: The million man march called for by Ms. Bhutto started at 9:00 am at Regal Chowk. Fifteen minutes later, it ended at Nirala Sweet House on Beadon Road where mithai was distributed to the more than 24 leaders and workers who had marched the half mile surrounded by five hundred policemen, hijras from ghoray shah, and tabalchis from heera mandi. An impromtu mujra was performed by the hijras and the tabalchis. The dancing girls failed to show up for the event because of threats by the MMA.

Sherry Rehman complained that she received jalebis whereas the male members of the central committee were given ladoos and burfi. Ms. Bhutto promised to take action.A one kilo box of mixed mithai was sent to Ch. Aitizaz Hussain who is still in Adiala Jail.

Re: # 21

ahmedmadani sahib,

.... the big khan left abpara police station and is now headed to rawalpindi to offer his arrest at the raja bazar police station ........ he is desperately trying to get arrested, but the government is ignoring him - this is sheer discrimination ! ....... the constitution must be restored so that he can have the right to be arrested like any other citizen ......... this is shameful !

Re: # 12 Gerneral have not arresting BIG Khan just punctured his political arrier. This is anticlimax.

Re: # 19
yaar I just made one post asking Mr NFP and that is it...
I will shut up....
I do no want to offend you if you love his "rebel" drug/bhangi lifstyle....
Naraz mat ho......
Bhai....

#14 Septic yaar, please shut up already. No one here really cares about the iconoclastic stature of Paracha or any other Pakistani journalists/bhangis. We here at Chowk like Paracha for his drugs lifestyle. His views are his views and should not be taken as journalistic intake. Now wait for him to come back and address a few of your concerns.

Hamid Saab. I hope so too, but I am skeptical.

Re: # 14
Why are you even assuming that I doubt you intelligence...
Let me assure you that you are much more justified in your opinion than apparently “intellectually appealing� opinion of NFP…..
Brother (if you allow a low intellect middle class individual like me to actually call you that), I respect every one’s opinion. Unfortunately one has to eventually come up with a position, and my position though incorporating your viewpoint will be somewhat different….
Let Mr baghiraja (his sign in name) answer certain probing “low intellect questions….�
Brother, even icons like NFP need to be probed and questioned…He has taken explicit positions, has ripped apart many people, so lets ask him a few “frank� questions…..
In my opinion though u agree with his stance, u should also question him….
After all NFP keeps on talking of ordinary people…
So he should be having a big heart to answer low intellect half baked bastard questions from anal middle class like us…

Re: # 13

kulharee,

..... you know me well ..... i honestly hope the civil and uncivil paki society does come out tomorrow to put an end to military rule once and for all ........ but i doubt it .... the problem is with the political leadership - the people just don't trust them ....

...... but i sincerely hope nobody is killed, unless it is a bus load of jihadis who are in a hurry to have sex in heaven ......

Skeptical,

Being the moorakh that I am, I look at everything thru rose colored glasses.

But since you are a skeptic, allow me to play one for a few minutes.

"..let me assure you a part of me perhaps admires him a lot and admires him much more than any one and certainly more than you……"

Wha? How would you know that? Maybe you are right and I don't know NFP from a hole in the ground, maybe you are wrong and I am NFP himself, and extremely narcissistic! [no, I am not NFP, but you knew that]

"You take his opinion to be an endorsement of your pro Musharraf stance or your anti Imran stance."

I cannot take any an article by NFP to be an endorsement of my views because: 1) He prolly does not know of me or my views and 2) He has not addressed my opinions, just his own. So no, I don't take it as an endorsement :)

"You are narrowing your opinion to character assassination of anti Musharraf element…"

Nope. No character assassination going on. I am merely calling a spade a spade. You can browse my iLogs at your leisure.

"I would like to offer my humble opinion that at times interests of self righteous anal bastard middle class and down trodden, though not explicitly realized, can actually converge…."

I agree. Sometimes they can. At this moment, democracy and the stability of the country are at odds.

"So while you praise and “respect� him for writing this wonderful piece (mainly because apparently he is pro Mushi and anti democracy or anti “sham democracy� or he endorses your view, his take is actually different ……"

wait wait. I praise his piece for its anti-sham democracy point of view. I don't think he is endorsing my pov, how could he? I am not anti-democracy. I just think the a-holes that are our candidates do not cut it. I am anti-BB, he is pro BB :) see...there are other differences.

This was a fun exercise!

with much respect,
thinking storm

"he SHO and constables laughed at him and refused to comply with his request. He was offered a cup of tea and some biscuits, but he refused and tried to lock himself up in an empty cell. The police staff on duty resumed their card game and the SHO tried to persuade Imran Khan to come out of the cell by offering him chapli kabab from Peshawar More. It is a tense stand-off."

Hamidm,

this has to be one of the funniest things I have read today !
with much respect,
thinking storm

skeptical,

thanks for your response.

I understand that Nadeem has a different view of Musharraf than I do. What he and I appear to share is the healthy dose of skepticism we have of the so called lovers of "democracy".

IF your ideas are half baked, mine haven't even been kneaded yet, so do excuse me for my simplistic views :)
with much respect,
thinking storm

Hamid Saab, you might have to eat your words when you see hordes as well as herds of civil and uncivil servants and other Pakistanis after Allah Puja tomorrow, the holy day of Jumma. Masadi will be leading uncivil and uncouth Jaloos of unemployed sociologists. Down with Mushy. I predict scores will be killed tomorrow in Pindi, either by a isiuicide bomb or by Police. Please don't go out. Thanks.

Government Refuses to Arrest Imran Khan

ISLAMABAD, Nov 9, 2007: Tehrik-i-Insaf leader Imran Khan was refused arrest by the Federal Government when he presented himself at the Abpara Police Station this morning. Eyewitnesses report that Imran Khan showed up alone at 9:00 am and demanded to be arrested for violating the PCO. The SHO and constables laughed at him and refused to comply with his request. He was offered a cup of tea and some biscuits, but he refused and tried to lock himself up in an empty cell. The police staff on duty resumed their card game and the SHO tried to persuade Imran Khan to come out of the cell by offering him chapli kabab from Peshawar More. It is a tense stand-off.

cricket trumps 'emergency'

..... excellent! ......... that is what i have been saying all along about this 'emergency' drama - nobody gives a hoot except for the unemployable lawyers and aunties with blonde hair who couldn't get an appointment with their hairdresser .......... it is all lufangebazi designed by mush to get rid of the pesky cj ..... bb, bush, fazloo and the uncivil allah rakha from lalamusa all know this ...... i think i saw bush wink when he asked mush to hold the elections on time and bb couldn't help smirking when she asked him to take off his uniform ........

...... what a load of crap ! the cricket match was much more exciting and unlike the emergency i don't think it was fixed ......

Re: # 7 and 9
No thinkingstorm

Look I respect opposite and contrary opinions. My sign in name is Skeptical or sceptical.....
I doubt everything and this guy needs to be questioned for his own contradictions....
Mind you I have a love late relationship with this iconic writer and let me assure you a part of me perhaps admires him a lot and admires him much more than any one and certainly more than you……
People like NFP should exist, they are the benchmark for the left wing but in my humble and " confused" opinion Mr NFP does need to answer some questions....
You take his opinion to be an endorsement of your pro Musharraf stance or your anti Imran stance. You are narrowing your opinion to character assassination of anti Musharraf element… The typical approach is that anti Musharraf element is corrupt and self serving……
He is not pro Musharraf.....at least not the way you are ...He is trying to interpret and justify it through class "theory" and through liberalism is necessary at any cost approach….
The implicit idea according to my low intellectual and “contradictory half baked confused � fcuking philosophy is that….( these are his favourite words...):

Things like independent Judiciary are purely a creation or reflection of middle class anal self righteous mentality…..
Though of far less intellectual calibre than him and having “no knowledge of geo politics�, I would like to offer my humble opinion that at times interests of self righteous anal bastard middle class and down trodden, though not explicitly realized, can actually converge….
And one should be careful when one’s own life is itself reflective of those anal middle class choices….
I have merely pointed out some contradictions …..
Let him answer them…..
And let me assure you once again that your opinion and his opinion though apparently same are not the same….
So while you praise and “respect� him for writing this wonderful piece (mainly because apparently he is pro Mushi and anti democracy or anti “sham democracy� or he endorses your view, his take is actually different ……

Nadeem,

You have eloquently described all that I have been incoherently rambling about on unplugged.

At first, I was shocked at myself as well. Why o why would I have protested against the Zia monster, and then turned around and not gone apeshit at Musharraf?

Perhaps it has to do with the hypocrisy of the "supporters" of "democracy". These very people are encouraging the completely arrogant and ignorant reactionary forces to spread and grow stronger using the gun as a weapon in nwfp, and TV in the cities.

Bravo for writing this wonderful piece!

with much respect,
thinking storm

"What movement, where?"

I too underwent the same puzzlement when I heard Imran Khan telling the video (YouTube) camera. He says that he want to 'lead' the anti-Emergency movement from underground. LOL.

He ran for his life and want to make a facade of defiance. That way Asma Jehangir is the real and the ONLY MAN in Pakistan.

Skeptical,

I could be misreading you, but do I detect anger?


with much respect,
thinking storm

I was waiting for your article and I had an instinctive hunch what you were about to say....
I want you to answer some bloody fcuking questions...... I have deliberately used fcuking because the real word though describes a hypocrite like you accurately would nevertheless be filtered out...
Mr Paracha if you are fcuking man enough to answer some questions, lets have your take about them....

1. Why do you write in a language which is elitist and understood by a only few......
2. Why despite your fcuking claims about being a "conventional" old fashioned Marxist Leninist and your fcuking tall claims to speak on the behalf of the down trodden, you have married an elitist yuppy commercial foreign banker..... why couldn’t you find some one from ordinary class for your steamy affairs and for your life partner.... After all in one of your articles you have actually made fun of Imran for marrying Jemima....Mr Paracha .... what about your own choice......
3. I am sorry I am getting personal here, but having slight "knowledge" of your immediate family, I would like to bring out your bloody hypocritical true face here.....because there are people here who like you because they think you are an "honest and straight forward" person. Your controversial style is interpreted as being fearless and straight forward…......
4. I do not blame you for certain things though, after all you got famous for writing "rebel" anti culture stuff... remember those anti culture days.....the News when you blamed Junoon for "selling the revolution....."
5. Answer Mr Paracha if Junoon sold the revolution to Coca Cola while never claiming to be "anti corporate" revolutionaries, you have actually "sold" your services to Nandos and Telenor.....If you claim to be straight forward and a true "socialist...", why have you written jingles for "elitist colonial" multinationals like Nandos and Telenor.... So the chicken crosses the road.... sounds familiar Mr NFP....... and the underpass is full of water.
6. Please do not claim that Engels was also an industrialist...
7. So you have decided to go against the grain.... why ... tell me and convince me, is it to merely reinforce your image as a "rebel" journalist or because you actually believe the crap you say....

8. You think that NRO and lawyers movement is a reflection of anal middle class mentality.... Your supporting evidence is lack of common man's protest......
Ok once again, lets have you take on it..... How many people actually came out when the most charismatic "roti Kapra makan " leader was hanged.....
At that time, due to Marshal Law of Zia people could not come out..... Would you give the same spin on that……Would you insult ZAB by saying that apparent lack of protest on his death was not because of Marshal Law but because he was a creation of anal middle class mentality….
9. By the way it took an air crash to remove Zia, he could not be removed through a popular movement…. Would you support him by saying that since no body came out Zia was a great leader…..
10. I have personally campaigned with a female NGO against Hudood Ordinance… I know for certain that majority of the lower class women were not even aware of the “Hudood� ordinance unless actually raped…. Would you cite that lack of awareness as endorsement in your articles the way you are ridiculing lawyers movement by saying that it is actually a reflection of anal middle class mentality ( interestingly u are yourself married into upper self righteous middle class family…..)
11. If public support is the true criteria for truthfulness of an idea, why you claim to be “Marxist Lenisist.� And yet support PPP when it despite retaining liberal outlook has moved away from nationalization……..In fact privatization started during PPP’s first tenure…and yet PPP’s street power and mass appeal is still intact….
12.. Answer Mr Paracha……. these entire questions one by one ……. Straight and to the point answers…..
13. I know that you will see this post…..You are an egoist person……. You have claimed in your articles that you have read a million books ( anti culture) and you are quick to answer anything which even mentions Salman Ahmed…..
14. Answer Mr Paracha
15. And answer logically and with proper supporting evidence
16. Do not say that I am self contradictory and a tableeghi or am Islamic fascist….
17.. In reality I may be far more left wing than a corporate jingle writing confused yet popular writer like you……
18. Great NFP……oh straight forward NFP…….
19. Answer !!!!

Nadeem,

Thank you, thank you.

While the bandar tamasha of the opportunists continues, it is refreshing to hear some reason!

You are the second sane voice in this bazaar (the other sane voice being mine, of course).

with much respect,
thinking storm

Uncivil society has changed since Zias' time. Only in sindh do the great unwashed look to BB for salvation.

Far greater numbers are looking to Osama.....and the sad truth is he comes good for his supporters alot more than she does.

It also a term that refers to people that come together for a cause (usually against State).

Paracha Sahib, I think you are confusing “Civilians�, vis-à-vis the Military, the Lawyers, the Uniformed. And so on. That’s what the “civil society� implies, at least in the rest of the world, and it does include un-civil (as you put it) as well (so long as they are not “uniformed�. I could be wrong.

Hope all is well with you. It appears from the outside that things are pretty eff’d up.

mr paracha, were u on cbc a few days ago?
the person who was on cbc had this weird notion that shutting down the tv stations was a welcome idea coz they were not doing anything good anyway - very autocratic thinking if u ask me