Beena Sarwar January 15, 2008
#77 Posted by HP on January 16, 2008 8:01:59 pm
" too many people witnessed the murderous, reckless, and devastating behavior of PPP workers, supporters, and goons in systematically destroying property and burning innocent people."
How many MQM workers were arrested after the 12th May? Even the ones whose pictures were clear despite the darkness, still roam the Karachi streets.
How many MQM workers were arrested after the 12th May? Even the ones whose pictures were clear despite the darkness, still roam the Karachi streets.
#76 Posted by HP on January 16, 2008 7:58:45 pm
Viqarm #63 {"MQM's place is more with the progressive parties in Sindh; not with the feudals that is the PPP."}
So mahijir are progressive now...Since when communalism became Progressive... Modi must now be really happy...He got company in Karachi. heheheh...
So mahijir are progressive now...Since when communalism became Progressive... Modi must now be really happy...He got company in Karachi. heheheh...
#75 Posted by HP on January 16, 2008 7:41:03 pm
There are many instances in history when groups of people decided to leave their homeland and ended up never owning a land. The Jews of Egypt left their land en masse to stave off the oppression they faced. Their 2500 years of travels have shown that the land they hated was the only land they could have lived in. The face of the world would have been different now if the Jews had stayed in Egypt and had fought their oppressors right there.
The gypsies of Romania were primarily Indians who left their country and are still gypsy in a land, where they have lived in for thousands of years. The Gypsies when they are kicked out from other European countries, like from Italy recently, still go back to Romania but their connection to Romania are so weak that even Romanians don’t want them.
The Afghans left mountains to conquer India and ended up living in India and their progenies still have difficulty calling themselves Indian. But they can never go back to Afghanistan because they are not Afghans any more.
The Mohajir in Pakistan left their land for the flimsiest of reasons. And they refuse to become the part of the land which welcomed them. Like the Jews, they can’t find any association with the land they live in now. They feel they are better than the natives so they deserve to be the masters of the native. To them the native culture and customs are not worth respecting.
They left India as Muslims, ended up in Bengal as Bihari and now want to leave Bangladesh as Bihari. Well Bangladesh is a majority Muslim country why not stay there. Did you not come to Bengal as Muslim?
They came to Sindh as Muslims but turned themselves in to Mohajir because they never liked the Sindhi Muslims as their equal. In 1980s they got some heat from the federal government for their illegal and communal activities and what they do in response, they go against Pakistan. After being co-opted back into the power what they do, they stand with an army that is bent upon keeping the reins firmly against the wishes of the majority of the people of Pakistan. And the mohajir…are now an accessory in destroying the fabric of the same country they landed in as Muslims.
Pakistan is a country of Pathan, Sindhi, Baloch and Punjabis and other people who live there and associate themselves with the land. The Pathans live in Baluchistan, the Hazarwal live in NWFP, and the Saraiki live in Punjab, they do ask for their political and linguistic rights but they never go against the country or even the Province they live in.
But we have a group of people that is bent upon destroying not only the province they live in, but the country that gave them shelter when they needed it the most.
Once you betray your land and your culture, betrayal becomes a habit …And that is what we see in play in Sindh and Pakistan.
Flame the Casbah!
The gypsies of Romania were primarily Indians who left their country and are still gypsy in a land, where they have lived in for thousands of years. The Gypsies when they are kicked out from other European countries, like from Italy recently, still go back to Romania but their connection to Romania are so weak that even Romanians don’t want them.
The Afghans left mountains to conquer India and ended up living in India and their progenies still have difficulty calling themselves Indian. But they can never go back to Afghanistan because they are not Afghans any more.
The Mohajir in Pakistan left their land for the flimsiest of reasons. And they refuse to become the part of the land which welcomed them. Like the Jews, they can’t find any association with the land they live in now. They feel they are better than the natives so they deserve to be the masters of the native. To them the native culture and customs are not worth respecting.
They left India as Muslims, ended up in Bengal as Bihari and now want to leave Bangladesh as Bihari. Well Bangladesh is a majority Muslim country why not stay there. Did you not come to Bengal as Muslim?
They came to Sindh as Muslims but turned themselves in to Mohajir because they never liked the Sindhi Muslims as their equal. In 1980s they got some heat from the federal government for their illegal and communal activities and what they do in response, they go against Pakistan. After being co-opted back into the power what they do, they stand with an army that is bent upon keeping the reins firmly against the wishes of the majority of the people of Pakistan. And the mohajir…are now an accessory in destroying the fabric of the same country they landed in as Muslims.
Pakistan is a country of Pathan, Sindhi, Baloch and Punjabis and other people who live there and associate themselves with the land. The Pathans live in Baluchistan, the Hazarwal live in NWFP, and the Saraiki live in Punjab, they do ask for their political and linguistic rights but they never go against the country or even the Province they live in.
But we have a group of people that is bent upon destroying not only the province they live in, but the country that gave them shelter when they needed it the most.
Once you betray your land and your culture, betrayal becomes a habit …And that is what we see in play in Sindh and Pakistan.
Flame the Casbah!
#74 Posted by SR on January 16, 2008 7:35:56 pm
Re: # 65 Muhammad Hamid wrote: ["... it is the same ww-ii stuff the british left behind and i was running around in thirty yars ago ....... the billions of dollars are used to buy staff cars and new curtains for the mess, not radio communications ...."]
What you assert may very well be true, but the military's "agencies" are not as thoroughly incompetent as I would have thought. I say this because of a recent anecdote.
A couple of weeks back I attended the jinaza in F-6. The deceased was the father of an acquaintance. He'd died unexpectedly while the son (my acquaintance) was out of the country. At the jinaza the son was absent. I asked a mutual friend who told me that the son was flying back the next day, but the story was an interesting one.
The son had gone abroad without telling his family where he was going. Since he travels a lot within the country, mostly in the far reaches of NWFP and Baluchistan, his family is used to his being away a lot. However, this time he wasn't on official business, but had (secreatly) sneaked off to the Far East with his mistress, while his wife was on Hajj with her brothers. So when the father died suddenly, his brother contacted this gentleman's office and asked them about his whereabouts. The office was under instructions not to reveal any details, however, they did tell the brother that their boss was "out of the country."
Armed with only this piece of information the brother called a friend of this gentleman who is a high up in one of the "agencies" ... By the end of the day the agency friend had not only discovered what country the gentleman and his girlfriend had gone to and on which flights etc., but had also contacted his operative in that country and found out what local flights he (and his mistress) had taken to reach their holiday destination and what hotel they were in with phone numbers and all. The gentleman was thus called and informed of his father's passing away.
This story, later authenticated by others close to the family, left me wondering how our agencies have surplus resources that can be squandered on such trivial private matters. So rest assured that not ALL of the billions of dollars are spent on curtains and cars.
...SR
What you assert may very well be true, but the military's "agencies" are not as thoroughly incompetent as I would have thought. I say this because of a recent anecdote.
A couple of weeks back I attended the jinaza in F-6. The deceased was the father of an acquaintance. He'd died unexpectedly while the son (my acquaintance) was out of the country. At the jinaza the son was absent. I asked a mutual friend who told me that the son was flying back the next day, but the story was an interesting one.
The son had gone abroad without telling his family where he was going. Since he travels a lot within the country, mostly in the far reaches of NWFP and Baluchistan, his family is used to his being away a lot. However, this time he wasn't on official business, but had (secreatly) sneaked off to the Far East with his mistress, while his wife was on Hajj with her brothers. So when the father died suddenly, his brother contacted this gentleman's office and asked them about his whereabouts. The office was under instructions not to reveal any details, however, they did tell the brother that their boss was "out of the country."
Armed with only this piece of information the brother called a friend of this gentleman who is a high up in one of the "agencies" ... By the end of the day the agency friend had not only discovered what country the gentleman and his girlfriend had gone to and on which flights etc., but had also contacted his operative in that country and found out what local flights he (and his mistress) had taken to reach their holiday destination and what hotel they were in with phone numbers and all. The gentleman was thus called and informed of his father's passing away.
This story, later authenticated by others close to the family, left me wondering how our agencies have surplus resources that can be squandered on such trivial private matters. So rest assured that not ALL of the billions of dollars are spent on curtains and cars.
...SR
#73 Posted by Salim_Chauhan on January 16, 2008 7:29:24 pm
Janoo #56, {"Mohajirs continued to harm the interests of Bengalees, Punjabis, Pathans, Balochis and other sons of soil by ruling over them like the imperialist British. MQm is a fascist party threatening to kill anyone who opposes them."}
Janoo,
Now I am not afraid if FOX-TV is ever banned! You, outdo them in every category ranging from asinine to zero-intelligence. :)
Janoo,
Now I am not afraid if FOX-TV is ever banned! You, outdo them in every category ranging from asinine to zero-intelligence. :)
#72 Posted by Salim_Chauhan on January 16, 2008 7:21:18 pm
Viqarm #63 {"MQM's place is more with the progressive parties in Sindh; not with the feudals that is the PPP."}
Viqar Sahib,
Excellent response. Why is it that desperate warriors against terrorism simply assume that they can perform a shotgun wedding between MQM and PPP simply because both tend to be secular? One represents the urban centers and the latter is clearly the mouthpiece of the landed blue-bloods.
Viqar Sahib,
Excellent response. Why is it that desperate warriors against terrorism simply assume that they can perform a shotgun wedding between MQM and PPP simply because both tend to be secular? One represents the urban centers and the latter is clearly the mouthpiece of the landed blue-bloods.
#71 Posted by dost_mittar on January 16, 2008 7:17:32 pm
nasah#61:
Muqarrar, muqarrar! (or is it mukarrar, mukarrar?)
Muqarrar, muqarrar! (or is it mukarrar, mukarrar?)
#70 Posted by Salim_Chauhan on January 16, 2008 7:13:50 pm
{" Already stunned at the loss of their leader, the PPP is now reeling from the registration of tens of thousands of FIRs against its workers. Its electoral candidates face charges that include attempted murder"}
Beena,
You raise some excellent points about the "dirty tricks" brigade. But, dear writer, too many people witnessed the murderous, reckless, and devastating behavior of PPP workers, supporters, and goons in systematically destroying property and burning innocent people. If this party behaves in such a lunatic fashion when it is being oppressed, I can just imagine its behavior when it becomes the oppressor - once again. No thank you, PPP na khapey. :(
Beena,
You raise some excellent points about the "dirty tricks" brigade. But, dear writer, too many people witnessed the murderous, reckless, and devastating behavior of PPP workers, supporters, and goons in systematically destroying property and burning innocent people. If this party behaves in such a lunatic fashion when it is being oppressed, I can just imagine its behavior when it becomes the oppressor - once again. No thank you, PPP na khapey. :(
#69 Posted by Ras on January 16, 2008 7:09:32 pm
Beena,
unfortunately the dirty tricks have just started.
But BB's murder is still very difficult to accept.
Ras
#68 Posted by tahmed32 on January 16, 2008 6:48:58 pm
hamidm: even my mother-in-law's maali has a cell phone which he uses to talk to saudi arabia. every tom, dick and harry in Pakistan has a cell phone.
#67 Posted by tahmed32 on January 16, 2008 6:46:10 pm
hamidm #65 I have a life outside chowk. I do!! I do!! I type fast, that's all.
#66 Posted by tahmed32 on January 16, 2008 6:45:03 pm
fuzair #48 What is incredible is that this is not the first time - it is a repeat of Swat where militants were actually able to overrun police posts.
Something is very wrong somewhere - maybe it is the obvious fact that the military is overstretched in the wrong directions (keeping tabs on threats to Musharraf's job rather than on threats to the national integrity, per the subject of this article). or maybe there is something else going on.
Something is very wrong somewhere - maybe it is the obvious fact that the military is overstretched in the wrong directions (keeping tabs on threats to Musharraf's job rather than on threats to the national integrity, per the subject of this article). or maybe there is something else going on.
#65 Posted by hamidm2 on January 16, 2008 6:38:49 pm
Re: # 64
tahmed,
.......it seems you have too much time on your hands ... why do paki men squat and pee like women ? ....... that, i think, is the bigger question .........
... 'in this day and age of radio communications and gunships' ..... you must be kiddng! ..... have you seen the pithoo and helmets the fc guys are wearing (in addition to their hand-stitched peshawari chappals) ?...... it is the same ww-ii stuff the british left behind and i was running around in thirty yars ago ....... the billions of dollars are used to buy staff cars and new curtains for the mess, not radio communications ......... the only person who has radio communications is maulana fazlullah, aka maulana radio ..........
tahmed,
.......it seems you have too much time on your hands ... why do paki men squat and pee like women ? ....... that, i think, is the bigger question .........
... 'in this day and age of radio communications and gunships' ..... you must be kiddng! ..... have you seen the pithoo and helmets the fc guys are wearing (in addition to their hand-stitched peshawari chappals) ?...... it is the same ww-ii stuff the british left behind and i was running around in thirty yars ago ....... the billions of dollars are used to buy staff cars and new curtains for the mess, not radio communications ......... the only person who has radio communications is maulana fazlullah, aka maulana radio ..........
#64 Posted by tahmed32 on January 16, 2008 6:25:26 pm
GT #44 No doubt the soldiers put up a fight. The question I had was why, in this day and age of radio communications and gunships, did they even have to put up a fight (let alone lose their lives in the process). See also Fuzair #48 on this.
On the other question of inner party democracy - it would be instructive to see how it was introduced in the US. As far as I recall reading, it was due to the passage of laws following massive corruption scandals in New York (the Tammany Hall politics I referred to earlier).
On the other question of inner party democracy - it would be instructive to see how it was introduced in the US. As far as I recall reading, it was due to the passage of laws following massive corruption scandals in New York (the Tammany Hall politics I referred to earlier).
#63 Posted by viqarm on January 16, 2008 5:29:48 pm
Re: # 62 Nash
MQM's place is more with the progressive parties in Sindh; not with the feudals that is the PPP.
MQM's place is more with the progressive parties in Sindh; not with the feudals that is the PPP.
#62 Posted by nasah on January 16, 2008 4:45:26 pm
MQM place is with PPP -- not against PPP. Period.
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