The Dirty Tricks Brigade Tries to Spoil a Party

#217 Posted by HP:

" GT, Hamid is a master of subtleties." Agreed. At times, it is fun to play with god ;)

I understand that Zakaria is writing for the Western audience ... but IMO one paragraph, tucked in somewhere in the middle, was not enough.

#219, you I can because you know the reality of the US viz a viz Pakistan, Hamid I can only credit with absurdity, and Zakaria with hypocrisy. By the way, you need to return to the homeland, leave the human swamp hole for people like tahmed, they deserve each other...

asadi,

Would you not credit me with some subtlety?

HP writes "Hamid is a master of subtleties"

Rather he is a master of absurdities. McCain panders to the war crowd, together with Lieberman, that he manages to mix that with liberal banalities says nothing for the man. Zakaria just repeats the mainstream BS in new and improved words

GT,
Hamid is a master of subtleties. Pairing John McCain with Zakaria is a master stroke as both show significant amount of pandering to the audiences when it comes to political issues, still, they manage to put the truth out on the table.

The truth is Fareed Zakaria was trained in a very good school at home when it comes to political analysis. His father Rafiq was one of the better political analyst in India. Fareed obviously wants to step away from his father’s name and political thinking- which for many reasons would not be acceptable to his audience in the US.
Still, he drops enough hints in his articles for mature people to figure out what he is saying.

I have not the article yet but as quoted by you, when he says, "But it is also possible that Pakistan's political class might surprise us with its maturity."
Has plenty of beef for astute readers.

He is basically saying that the pak politicians need to show maturity in facing the current situation. I will read the complete article and would be able to comment on it later.

fuzair "On a completely different note, when were you at St. Mary's Lalazar and St. Patricks in Karachi? I'm assumng you were there about 12-15 years ;-) before me but just curious. "

I was in both those schools too until 1986, in Henderson's model O'level class stories about which abound

Hamidm Saab,

On a completely different note, when were you at St. Mary's Lalazar and St. Patricks in Karachi? I'm assumng you were there about 12-15 years ;-) before me but just curious.

There's a story of the frog and the boiling water:

When you put a frog in a pot of boiling water, it will jump out immediately.

However, if you put a frog in luke warm water and keep heating that water slowly, it will sit there and actually feel warm, till the water comes to a boil and it will die.

This applies to the Kanjars. These are the frogs in the water being applied the flame.

It is a certainly very naive suggestion. However there is a historical first situation in Pakistan: both political forces and military are tied up in their own problems. They will not be able to interfere much.

May be all those who have suffered, both in India and pakistan by militancy, can quickly generate a new dyanmics. Won't it be easier to call for opening schools and small industrial units in the turbulent areas of west pakistan and afganistan? Pakistani army is fighting a war which they will probably never win but if they are asked to run schools and ... run business (which they know how to), I'm sure many of us, pakistanies and Indians both (besides americans, europeans...) will come forward to finance, supervise and help. Maybe indian army can also be roped in work to do the same overtly on afghan side.

Just walking down the streets of Waziristan as women did in N. Ireland offering schools and work and not handing out money as British did.

A pipe dream!! yes when you see kids killing themselves. It is not for Houris but because of desperation daily lives and for small pittance. Wonder if they will go to school or take up stitching footballs if are paid the same money!!

Our own kids in Karachi, Lahore, Delhi will be able to live normal lives as tehy do in west. Half a chance and I'll pay for a school and spend a couple of months working there every year.

Hamid:

Do you know why Zakaria thinks "political class might surprise us". I do not. But it may have to do with your confident assertion that ... "as for abdul, he doesn't think - he is no better than sheep ".

Re: # 209

GT,

zakaria is one of two americans who understands foreign policy - john mccain is the other ...... i think we can get to critical mass if we get these two together!

..... as for abdul, he doesn't think - he is no better than sheep ..... 'civil society' includes the lawyers and lums students, but it does not include abdul or the sheep ....

Zakaria states:

"But it is also possible that Pakistan's political class might surprise us with its maturity."

No. The Pakistani political class as we know it will probably not surprise us. What is happening is that people are getting politicised - from (apolitical) MBA students in LUMS to a nine year old on the street challenging the police to students in Lahore opposing the bearded ones to (and very importantly) bearded ones opposing pseudo bearded ones. As a result the "political class" is changing. This "Changed" political class may well surprise us with its maturity a few years down the road.

This is not to say that one should give up on the PML/PPP etc. They are extremely important for democracy. I do not give a fig about this corruption nonsense. As Madani sahib has often pointed out, running a party and participating in elections requires money and we do not have proper institutions to generate this money. So corruption is OK. And in that sense BB was OK and so is NS. Wheeling and dealing is what is required in politics. No question about that. However, I have a feeling that this wheeling and dealing will be very cautious about the US and the army in the near future. At least, I hope so.

Hamid:

I read Zakaria's article. I do not understand why you found it to be great. Yes the dictator, BB and the jihadis are important but not as important as what is making Abdul think in between sips of tea or whatever he drinks. Unfortunately, Zakaria devoted only one paragraph to this phenomenon. I reproduce it below"

" At a political and constitutional level, the crisis in Pakistan is actually good news. Civil society has mobilized. The print media have been utterly fearless in its criticism of the president. Musharraf's actions have given the parties an agenda to get passionate about, and so far they have not succumbed to the infighting that often destroyed them in the past. It would be a mistake to romanticize Pakistan's democrats. Many are feudal, corrupt and pliant. But increasingly there are some young and talented ones emerging as well. The polls may be rigged, though there are fewer opportunities than before for massive illegalities. The king's party may be able to buy allegiances after the elections. But it is also possible that Pakistan's political class might surprise us with its maturity."

.... a request to president john mccain: please appoint fareed zakaria as secretary of state

http://www.fareedzakaria.com/articles/articles.html

majumdar, tahmed32,

Correct ... but this S.O.B still has one card up his sleeve, which is to have his own NRO declared illegal through his Supreme Court (ironically which exactly the previous SC would have done). and reopen all cases against Zardari to blackmail him.

He's working on that right now.

Re: # 203

Unfortunately for Pakistan, we have lost a great strategist and person of stature who had the charisma and gumption to carry Pakistan, meaning Benazir Bhutto. Rest of the crowd appears to be pygmies in this giant cesspool of opportunism and realpolitik. As for the PML-NS, they are already in negotiation with Musharraf & Co, so there is very little hope for any impeachment.