Bullhe Shah and His Veil of “Meem”

"is it true that the verses which came after the attainment of power by the prophet are harsher and more violent as compared to the time when muslims were persecuted?"

As an idolator I need not think about "keeping the fsith anchor safe" or avoid "criticism of devine" that troll Islamist Kaale Khan aka Eklavya, this is called Quranic warfare - when momeen are supposed to feel good about their power their "Jazba-e-Jehad" is supposed to increase. Quran just reflects that because "Allh is merciful" but momeens are supposed to act like terrorists and only giving them booties and jizya would please Allh to be merciful towards idolators.

Re: # 95

"Some 'Muslims' may (unjustifiably) feel a bit shortchanged because their God and their contract with their God does not allow revisions."

what BS. The so called "contract" is FORCED upon muslims men in their childhood.
Hope you remember the painful visit by your kasai for the khatna or 'signing' that god's contract??

Re: # 94

eklavya,

"Now, it may seem that, as raw argued, a Muslim may want to go back and 're-write' that contract, but other Muslims, who have their own individual 'contracts' with the same God are likely to feel contract-bound to not let that happen"

......... sounds like the damn mafia to me!.... once you sign a contract with the godfather you cannot leave without him putting out a contract for you ....... maybe that is why they call him god-father ........ what utter nonsense! ..... i can't believe people say all this with a straight face ........ what sickos !

"you know, a long time ago being crazy meant something. nowadays everybody's crazy" ........... you know who said that ? ... charles manson - i think he was talking about you religious nuitcases ......

I have not read the interacts, so some of what I say might have been said before.

Gill saheb, you have brought out an interesting aspect of sufism. What is the difference between love and worship? Does love become worship only when one prostates or does a sajda? Is one worshipping one's parents or elders when one touches their feet to seek their blessings?

I love sufi music and I am transported to another world when I listen to someone like Sabri Brothers or Abida Parveen. During last month, I have attended three sufi mehfils and will go to a few more, insha-allah, before I return to Canada.

To me, there are two key aspects to sufi devotion - niyet and ishq, i.e. intent and passionate love: If one's intention is noble, it does not matter what one is actually saying or doing and if one is passionately in love with something, even a human being, it can translate into the love for the divine.

To give an example of the first, let me borrow an example from Hindu mythology; it is said that a notorious dacoit came under the influence of a sage who asked him to recite the mantra of 'ram' to seek salvation. The dacoit memorised the mantra incorrectly and instead remembered 'mara'; so he started saying mara, mara, mara, which after the first 'm' sounded exactly like m- rama, rama, rama.

For an example of the second, it is said that a Mulla asked Majnu that instead of saying laila, laila all the time, he should be saying allah, allah, to which Majnu replied that if the Mulla listened carefully, there is no difference between Laila and La-Ila.

In addition to the love of the prophet, the sufis also expressed a deep reverence for their teacher or murshid. In this, they were borrowing from the local culture which gives to the guru the status of the highest god. Even today, a student of classical music or dance, whether hindu or muslim, will start with guru-vandana, which is:
guru brahma
guru vishnu
guru maheshwara
[the guru is like the three manifestations of god]

But there should not be any doubt about the sufis' commitment to their faith; indeed one could say that they were islamists in their own right. As has been pointed out several times on this websites, sufis were responsible for the bulk of conversions to islam on the subcontinent. Many of them (not bulley shah), especially during the pre-mughal period, considered prosleytising as a key mission. They brilliantly tailored their 'product' to suit the tastes of their hindu clientele. At that time, the hindu bhakti movement was sweeping all over India and they delivered their message in such a way that it became indistinguishable from that of hindu bhaktas. Even today, when a hindu listens to "jhannan jhannan teri naubat baaje, naal vaje kharhtall", he can imagine himself sitting in a temple, or when she listens to "chhaap tilak sab chheeni ray, tosay naina milaaye-kay", she thinks of expressing love for her idol Krishna. The transition was made quite seamless for the convertee.

laddu#98:

ladduji, let me let you in on a secret; eklavya is Hindu brahmin (can you even think of a muslim adopting the nick of eklavya?)

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laddu:

How do I know? Only through chowk, eklavya has a history at chowk and was once subject of all our prayers. [sorry, eklavya, for saying this].

Re: # 103

DM ji,

This guy is an Islamists who is following the latest Dawah technique that one should not offend the kafirs and always "show" them the choclate coated "un-truths" of Islam.
This guy has refused to negate the kalima which only an Islamist would do. He knows more about Islam than hinduism- and knows more about Pakistan than any ordinary Indian hindu.
I am surprised that despite his dhimmi talk with eulogies of Quran and Sunnat you could be fooled by him into thinking that he is probably a hindu.

dost_mittar,

Since you were interested in knowing, Javed Hashmi has confirmed PML(N) decision in an interview with Asma Shirazi yesterday that (1) they will provide numerical support to PPP to form government in the center but will not participate in the cabinet because of differences upon immediate restoration of judges and; (2) even though they have sufficient numbers in Punjab, they will share power with PPP in the province to express goodwill.

http://pkpolitics.com/2008/02/23/parliament-gallery-23-february-08/

Re: # 80 Cheema wrote: ["... If I see injustices in the name of Islam, with clear Quranic verses in its support, I am not going to stand by and just accept it! But I still wouldn't mind sharing "sawayyan" on Eid day cooked by my mother! But I am not just going to see millions of animals being slaughtered on Eid-ul-Adha as comemmoration of Abraham's alleged attempted sacrifice of his son and not comment on the sheer brutality of it all! ..."]

Very well said. I wish there were more of "your kind" who had the courage to stand up and say so openly.

...SR

Re: # 65
Lady Laddu, you've ben watching the wrong 911 film! Watch Loose Change, Fahrenheit, read a few other things; rest assured, you WILL GROW up.

"you damned Paki Islamists - you are like kutte ki dum- nothing can change your character."

From which bitch's behind have Hindu extremists emerged?

Which king Cobra bit to leave you with so much venom inside? Your handlers will ruin you...

Shanti!

Re: # 74
"Not even if the charlatan claiming divinity is a paedophile , rapist and a Bandit?"

A good description of yourself, finally...

Shanti

Re: # 80
Read Muhammad Asad's translation; you will feel liberated. You're carrying a lot of excess baggage my friend!
Peace.

Re: # 83
I can't wait for a distorted Tafseer from you! Please consult with your near US-authorised eye-surgeon.
Peace.

Re: # 87
An Aussie from NWFP. Vow!

The initial Quranic lessons strengthen faith in ONE God (concept of tauheed). The later half gets you into specifics and details like conduct during active struggle, what to uphold, what to resist, family law ammendments etc.

If you're struggling with the bascis at age... (whatever the age!); please stop chasing after Australian currency and get down to reading The Book.

Peace.

Re: # 99

Manson! That explains away YOU my friend!

Start counting the 99 attributes of Manson now: I mean NOW!

Peace (in your little cubicle)