An Agenda for the New Government

"If we don't fight them over there, we'll have to fight them over here"

(Bush/hamidm2/ferozk & even cliftronbridge-ism)

Really?

Taliban foot soldiers deeply ignorant of the world

Survey reveals Kandahar fighters know next to nothing about Canada or U.S., contradicting view Taliban are sophisticated terrorists

GRAEME SMITH

gsmith@globeandmail.com

March 27, 2008

KANDAHAR, AFGHANISTAN -- The typical Taliban foot soldier battling Canadian troops and their allies in Kandahar is not a global jihadist who dreams of some day waging war on Canadian soil. In fact, he would have trouble finding Canada on a map.

A survey of 42 insurgents in Kandahar province posed a series of questions about the fighters' view of the world, and the results contradicted the oft-repeated perception of the Taliban as sophisticated terrorists who pose a direct threat to Western countries.

Faced with a multiple-choice question about Canada's location, only one of 42 fighters correctly guessed that Canada is located to the north of the United States, meaning the insurgents performed worse than randomly.

None of them could identify Stephen Harper as the Prime Minister of Canada, and they often repeated the syllables of his name - "Stepheh Napper," "Sehn Hahn," "Steng Peng Beng," "Gra Pla Pla" - that reflected their puzzlement over a name they had never heard.

Nor did they seem to associate the word "Canada" with anything except, in some cases, the soldiers now serving in Afghanistan. Most could not distinguish between the French- and English-speaking rotations of troops.

One of The Globe and Mail's questions offered the Taliban a chance to volunteer any information about Canada: "Do you know about this country? What kind of people are there? Is it a big country or a small country? Poor country, rich country? Cold or warm? Do Muslims live there?" None offered any meaningful responses, and most of them simply declined to answer. One of the few who guessed, a 21-year-old farmer, seemed to think the word "Canada" indicated a faraway city.

"It might be an old and destroyed city," he said.

The results show the depth of ignorance among front-line insurgents in Kandahar. In a previous visit to the tribal areas of Pakistan, a reporter for The Globe and Mail personally met with more sophisticated Taliban who demonstrated a keen grasp of politics and appeared to know the latest news of the war. But those politically astute Taliban were hundreds of kilometres away from the battlefields, and it remains unclear how much control such organizers exert over the day-to-day operations of the insurgency.

The Taliban became synonymous with ignorance during their years in government, banning media such as television that might bring foreign ideas into the country. As insurgents, however, they've shown a newfound flair for technology, distributing video propaganda and sending press statements via text message to reporters' mobile phones.

"The Taliban also have a sophisticated media strategy and full grasp of modern technology," said a report by the European Council on Foreign Relations in January.

Canadian politicians and military officials often make public statements that suggest the Taliban monitor political trends in Ottawa and choose to attack at politically sensitive moments: General Rick Hillier, Canada's Chief of the Defence Staff, raised the possibility that a suicide bombing that killed more than 100 people in Kandahar province in February may have been connected with debates in the House of Commons about the future of the mission.

But a Western expert who reviewed The Globe's video footage said the kind of worldliness described by Gen. Hillier isn't the most likely explanation.

"Those [insurgents] making decisions are more sophisticated than those you are interviewing, so there is some chance of this being plausible," the expert said. "But I think they're working to their own calendar, not ours." Three fighters in the survey didn't recognize the name of U.S. President George W. Bush, and another mispronounced his name as "Bukh," suggesting he wasn't familiar with the word.

Those who had heard of the U.S. President often gave responses that revealed more of their parochialism. He was called a "Jew," and "King of America." Sometimes, amid the errors, the Taliban showed their simplistic view of world politics. "He is the son of George W, [and] he is the son of Clinton W, and he is American, and is a serious enemy of Islam," said one fighter in his description of Mr. Bush.

"Why is he an enemy of Islam?" he was asked.

"The Koran says: 'Jews and Christians will be unhappy until you obey them. When you obey them, they will be satisfied,' " the insurgent replied. "This means if you obey them they are happy, but if you don't accept their commands, they will fight you."

Some of the comments about Mr. Bush showed the Taliban's enthusiasm for crude violence: "If I were to capture him, I would cut a piece of his flesh even as he was still alive." They were equally vitriolic in their descriptions of Afghan President Hamid Karzai, calling him a "slave" of the Americans. "There is no difference between the red-faced and green-eyed infidel, and him," one said.

When the Taliban demonstrated any understanding beyond their immediate surroundings, it was often references to their own version of Islamic history. They invoked stories of ancient Egypt and compared the U.S. President to one of the pharaohs, also drawing a parallel between the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan and the medieval Christians who launched Crusades.

Another described the war in Afghanistan as part of a conflict that stretches back to the founding of Islam as a religion.

"Non-Muslims have been against Muslims for a long time," he said. "Just as they attacked the Prophet Mohammed and broke his teeth, so they are against us since that era."

Nau Gyara Bahana hai,
Afghanistan Thhikana hai,
Pakistan Nishana hai!

(Gen Retd Hameed Gul)

hmm.....pakistan start to disassociate itself from us gwot, and the weekly toll of suicide bombings goes down........

is it just a coincidence, or was there some meat to what many of us were suggesting......

......the current visit of the us delegation, wasn't really of the us delegation, but of a scared republican party.....the republicans are finished in their gwot wars.....one disaster after another.......

afghanistan is on its way to disaster.....and if pakistan backs out, it will be a complete disaster......pakistan is shoring up one flank, and is providing logistical lines, also.......

without this, americans have had it in afghanistan.......as nato allies start dropping off one after another.....

......the george bush/neo-con experiment has totally failed.....as many of us had predicted.....the only supporter left is hamidm mian.....

.....americans cannot launch war after war.....what will they do.....attack iran and pakistan.....there is no exit strategy to this war.......and no one wants to be a part of it......

americans should have not gone into afghanistan.....and should have spent that $80 billion/year rebuilding afghanistan and not bombing it.......

anyways, it is about time pakistan got out of gwot.......

re: tahmed32

Sirji, I did not misunderstand your post. It is just that I do not share your sense of euphoria about this government accomplishing anything other than revisiting old vendettas. I see nothing but another wasted opportunity, when Pakistan does not have any more time left to keep tinkering with a broken system, trying to fix, with worn out and tired out solutions that have failed in the past.

I agree, building up Pakistan's political capacity is good idea, but to do so with the intention of creating another round of confrontational politics, is a bad idea.

National reconcilation means forgetting the past and not embarking on another witch hunt! :)

Ciao

GT sahib: You must excuse Hamidm. He has not been in a good mood ever since King Musharraf I lost his lota Rashid.

R2D2's ... LoL Echoboom Saheb Zindabad!

#47 Posted by GT,

I have asked hamidm2 several times to take me to the eight mile strip ... but he never did ... :(

#44 Posted by tahmed32:

tahmed sahib,

Are you calling me a soul-mate of Hamid? Sir, Hamid is a true islamofascist. He has invited Urstruly sahib to the local bar several times (and God knows what they do there together) ... but he has never invited me even once!

#45 Posted by tahmed32,

Who's hiding in caves? I thought these guys were blowing up your towns.

#43 if "these guys" loved death, they wouldnt be hiding in caves.

#38 Excellent ideas, GT. Nothing less expected from a"Great Unwashed-Not" soulmate of Hamidm.

Flip side: Nothing more expected either.

#42 Posted by GT,

LoL ... yes i read them ... but those times are gone.

Not even # 2 will work. You see, these guys love death more than life, remember?

#41 Posted by zeemax:

OK, I will. What do you think of my suggestions in #38. I am serious about them (I do not mind slight variations).

GT,

Check out my thread on 'Connect'.

Arjun,

You are getting old and you may be on the verge of getting stuff wrong. Check out what NS is saying (New York Times):


" “If America wants to see itself clean of terrorists, we also want that our villages and towns should not be bombed,” he said at a news conference here. Mr. Sharif, a former prime minister, added he was unable to give Mr. Negroponte “a commitment” on fighting terrorism.

The statements by Mr. Sharif, and the cool body language in the televised portions of his encounter with Mr. Negroponte, were just part of the sea change in Pakistan’s domestic politics that is likely to impose new limits on how Washington fights militants within Pakistan’s borders.

.......

“If I can use an American expression, there is a new sheriff in town,”"

HAIL THE NEW SHERIFF .... plus all the zindabads etc.

#38 cont. ....

It seems that the Yanks do not have much of a problem with my suggestion #2.

"However, Negroponte said some hardliners can be "persuaded to participate in the democratic political process."" (Associated Press).

I am betting on this NS guy!