Ahmer Muzammil May 18, 2008
#10 Posted by Delirium on June 7, 2008 10:45:06 am
We have been experimenting and struggling to find the right fit of governance for our society for the past 60 years. The military dictatorships and western form of democracy have proved pathetic and failed repeatedly.
Looks like its about time we get our acts together and evolve the right "system". We can't put all of it right the first time but then we have to start at some point and learn quickly.
Looks like its about time we get our acts together and evolve the right "system". We can't put all of it right the first time but then we have to start at some point and learn quickly.
#9 Posted by quin on June 7, 2008 6:38:40 am
Re: # 7 TehsinA
So succinctly touching pulse of the time ... salute
So correctly transmitting a seething undercurrent
So elegantly capturing the simmering wrath
Will it happen or will it not -
But you have your finger right on the spot!
So succinctly touching pulse of the time ... salute
So correctly transmitting a seething undercurrent
So elegantly capturing the simmering wrath
Will it happen or will it not -
But you have your finger right on the spot!
#8 Posted by quin on June 7, 2008 6:38:37 am
Re: # 7 TehsinA
So succinctly touching pulse of the time ... salute
So correctly transmitting a seething undercurrent
So elegantly capturing the simmering wrath
Will it happen or will it not -
But you have your finger right on the spot!
So succinctly touching pulse of the time ... salute
So correctly transmitting a seething undercurrent
So elegantly capturing the simmering wrath
Will it happen or will it not -
But you have your finger right on the spot!
#7 Posted by TehsinA on June 6, 2008 10:10:12 am
“During French revolution the mobs killed anyone with soft hands.”
When you advocate de-stabilizing the system you are in fact endorsing something akin to the French Revolution. As you mention, the burning of the bandits is a clear indication that the masses are loosing their hesitation to administer street justice. This also is going to help remove most qualms they have about killing anybody.
But I would like to draw another parallel from the French Revolution which is perhaps more apropos. It was the women of the lower classes who attacked Versailles and seized the King and Queen. They were also identified with extreme violence in the revolution. Beware of the wrath of the women of Pakistan. When her hearth is cold and there is nothing to feed the children, let me tell you she will tear through this house of cards. Her anger and frustration is at a boiling point right now, as indicated by the incident in Multan where one tried to sell her 4 children and the numerous mother children suicides. The army, the maulvi, the feudal or the tribal will all be swept away because the men will have no choice but to follow the women.
When you advocate de-stabilizing the system you are in fact endorsing something akin to the French Revolution. As you mention, the burning of the bandits is a clear indication that the masses are loosing their hesitation to administer street justice. This also is going to help remove most qualms they have about killing anybody.
But I would like to draw another parallel from the French Revolution which is perhaps more apropos. It was the women of the lower classes who attacked Versailles and seized the King and Queen. They were also identified with extreme violence in the revolution. Beware of the wrath of the women of Pakistan. When her hearth is cold and there is nothing to feed the children, let me tell you she will tear through this house of cards. Her anger and frustration is at a boiling point right now, as indicated by the incident in Multan where one tried to sell her 4 children and the numerous mother children suicides. The army, the maulvi, the feudal or the tribal will all be swept away because the men will have no choice but to follow the women.
#6 Posted by tahir on June 5, 2008 9:53:46 am
Re: # 5
Dear Naked Spiritual Guide,
Fairly decent analysis spoilt by an over-exposed bottom line!
Try rephrasing it: Indulging in P-envy while puffing bitter tobacco!
Regards.
Dear Naked Spiritual Guide,
Fairly decent analysis spoilt by an over-exposed bottom line!
Try rephrasing it: Indulging in P-envy while puffing bitter tobacco!
Regards.
#5 Posted by NangaPir on June 4, 2008 2:25:58 pm
A system is composed of subsystems and then on its components. There may be parallel structures in a system as a fail safe state but does not mean the rotten components become a permanent part. The system in Pakistan - alas old communists used to do the Moscow/China mantra as semi-feudal/semi-capitalist - can not be quantitively described. It is just subjective. There were also many other descriptions in olden days. And all these progressive or most of them have their own religio-politic agendas but used the left-wing shelters for their executions. Anyway let me be blunt. There is no system in Pakistan. It runs on corruption and if you take it out the country will fall in no time. Take any component of its system, let's say jurisprudence. Look how lawyers are trying hard for their survival. We have jirga system that much ancient but much in need because the colonial system is crippling. Let me put in this way. If you get in trouble under colonial British system, First the police will round you up, disgrace you and family, take bribe and beat the hell out of you. Then the lawyer will try to rob you strating with his peon, munshi, etc. Then you are in a lock up. Finally, judge will deliver a verdict based on whatever evidence he is presented. In a joint family system there are hundreds if not thousands who will become eyewitness to support you even you have murdered someone. People will feel pleasure and honor in defeating a system that was imposed on them and is no good. It is not their dishonesty. In fact it is their honesty that they do not accept the imposed system deep down in their conscience. Let's take the same scenario in a jirga. If it is not a murder case, normal cases are settled in a day and both parties hug each other and happily return home. The jirga does not try to deliver some balanced verdict based on evidence. Rather it tries to maintain the delicate fabric intact in its social system. It does not mean it is perfect. It shows how the imposed system is rotten. I am well aware of huge movements against Jirga. The government machinary has tried its best to malign the system but it never worked. Even USA, Karzai and Mush need the help of jirga. And look how Madrasshas, with elms and donations, out perform your billion dollars education system in every respect? And millitants are ready to die whereas your army officers join army to bulid bungalows, have cars and become the president of Pakistan. So my friend first try to analyze or even try to understand the biology of a living, evolving and adapting system. Let me give readers very rudimentary example about work ethics. Let's an American, a Chinese and a Pakistani are ploughing a field in their own countries and someone is watching them from heaven. When an ox is not ploughing fast the American will replace him with horse. Then he will look for camel, and eventually he will progress to fossil fuel driven tractor. A Chinese will have two cows. One is fast and the other is slow. He will throw a handful of hot peppers in slower cow's arse and double in the fast one. Once the slower will die due to drag he will grab who ever is available there and keep ploughing the farm. Now comes the Pakistani. He has one ox fast and other slow. The Pakistani will press the plough in the soil and go in the fornt of fast ox, and beat the crap out of him. Are you in too much hurry? Can't you eat cool? And then he will groom the slower one. If one dies in this process he will blame the living one. The Pakistani will erect a tomb of the dead ox and start a Ziaret or convent there. And the fast ox will become a sign of bad luck for ever. The bottom line is: Kerna Karana Lora - Tobacco Peena Korah.
#4 Posted by tahir on June 4, 2008 8:43:08 am
Dear Ahmer (Red),
Are you asking people we don't know to de-stabilise the system so lovingly put in place by the Untidy Satans?
God, you must be with 'us' then!
Regards.
Are you asking people we don't know to de-stabilise the system so lovingly put in place by the Untidy Satans?
God, you must be with 'us' then!
Regards.
#3 Posted by izuber on June 3, 2008 11:17:02 pm
Ahmer
You are so right, what system and what destabilization?
Gotta have a system before destabilizing it, and when the system whatever it may be is destabilized as it is, what else can one do to destabilize it any further?
In as much as politicians are concerned where are they, unless we look at these robbers of the nation as politician.
You are so right, what system and what destabilization?
Gotta have a system before destabilizing it, and when the system whatever it may be is destabilized as it is, what else can one do to destabilize it any further?
In as much as politicians are concerned where are they, unless we look at these robbers of the nation as politician.
#2 Posted by quin on June 3, 2008 6:54:12 pm
"... brutality that would shame animals" Let's remember no animal kills for sport; it is only man who may kill just for the fun of it. This fact speaks volume in itself.
The passion and pain, the dread and desperation that the author has expressed is being felt by many ... but seems we can only wail and cry ... ship is already sinking. Thomas Paine said, “It is the duty of the patriot to protect their country from its government.” - Alas, if only we could!
The passion and pain, the dread and desperation that the author has expressed is being felt by many ... but seems we can only wail and cry ... ship is already sinking. Thomas Paine said, “It is the duty of the patriot to protect their country from its government.” - Alas, if only we could!
#1 Posted by Leadenwinter on June 3, 2008 5:03:20 pm
This is all very well and good but why again is democracy nessessary ??
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