Fatima Bhutto Fighting for Justice

#202 Posted by MantoLives on May 23, 2008 5:21:00 am


but now people have begun to see the light.


people meaning at least half the people in your household...

Since BJ is attributing Kasturba's death to mosquitos... and others have attributed her death to Gandhi's refusal to accept modern medicine...

Now that puts Nana Patekar's "Saala eik machar" in a whole new light.

Re: # 200

We have a complete record of Gandhi's activities at Aga Khan's palace. You may read it.

Also Gandhi was a racist casteist blue blooded Hindu fascist bigot. This is a historical fact.

Enough marketing has ensured that this fact has been kept hidden... but now people have begun to see the light.

Both truth and time is on the side of those who are ready to expose Gandhi's ugly face to humanity.

Re: # 197

Gandhi's stint in Aga Khan's gorgeous Palace with acres of land around it for Gandhi to stretch his legs cannot be compared to ZAB or Mandela's little cells.

Guys, before you end up killing each other over people long dead, this is what I have to say:

just because the Agha Khan palace is a 5-star tourist destination now doesn't mean that is how Gandhi ji was treated at the time

he was hardly used to a life of luxary otherwise.....I don't even know what this discussion is about?

Long live Gandhi ji!! one of the most beautiful (albeit idealistic - hence naive) souls to walk this planet

I'll not bother you again so please resume your positions gentlemen

Cheerio

ummm, errr, harish, one would think you missed yasser terribly the way tum usske peechay par gaye ho.

or vice versa. :)

har baat maiN gandhi ko laanay ki kya zaroorat hai. . . (although this was majumdar's doing)

Harish bhai,

I have asked you for the names of these other "prisons" so that we may decide if they were better or worse than Aga Khan's palace.

Your personal attacks against me are the height of desperation as well as BJ's claim (which you've endorsed) that Aga Khan's Palace where Gandhi was incarcerated was dark and dreary.

It is not fair to compare mr. Gandhi with mr. Z.
Mr.Z.A. Bhutto and mr. Gandhi are in same league. But time will tell about Z as he is making history and still very youing. Only Buutto senioor has affected in good way and giving her daughter for his nation and sytill her son is ready to do his duty in due time. Gandhi has affected pakistan wrong way specially with respect to being fountain head for armed and religious milittancy which is threatening the hollowing of state power.

Mr. Z is exactly in same position as mrs Gandhi and just like she is carrying the message of family and advancing interests of her son and PM MMSing is keeping PM chair hot, same mr. Z is keeping seat ready for bilawal. My feeling is that mr. Rahul and bilawal Bhutto will be making peace as chief executives of indo / pak area.

Now agout legacy of Mughal empitre. British carried legacy of mughal empire, Indian govt is legacy of Mughal empire while pakistan is legacy of Sikhashai. Look at dominence of Jats like mr. R anjit Singh and general llawlessness.

I think poor fatima is hijacked by By Manto and and changed to Mr. Gandhi. That what what happens when some body with knowledge of laws takes case . Now fatima is finished and gandhi lives through terrorist inspiration for jehadis in trial wild west. About Manto one can say " Duniya zukati hay ye herdam nahi zukanewala" . That is what is called power of personality.

Hope problem of K is not forgotten and military down gradation going is hopefully arrested by mr. Z. Problem with north west insergency is being used by indians as opportunity to help and BLA to carry out terrorist activitoies specially blowing of pipelines/ gas, 5railways and electric power. Sad part is no body is paying attention and asking to stop interfearing in other countries private affairs.

It is good mr. Arjun is put down or we will too much hate postings.
Good evening.

#192 by MantoLives

Yasser yaar, why are you running pillar to post now? All this while you were focused on the 2 years Gandhi spent in AKP. Now that your case has been proved wrong, now you jump on to the 4 years spent in other prisons when you were just not willing to talk about it? This is the height of desperation.

Harish bhai,

Do you really believe that Aga Khan's Pune Palace was dark and dreary... as BJKumar says?

It was a first rate facility. There is no "sprucing up". It was a house of luxury and Gandhi was kept there.

As Naidu said so well "It took millions to keep Gandhi in poverty".

"the Agha Khan Palace during (Gandhiji’s incarceration there) was quite a bit different from the current spruced-up version for promoting tourism."

Ha ha. Okay.


"In addition to being dark and dreary, it was also full of malaria-bearing mosquitoes which (I think) took Kasturba’s life."

I have heard that Kasturba died because Gandhi would not allow the administration of penicilin and other modern medicines.

#191 by bjkumar

Thanks Beej bhai! Yasser's (and by extension Majumdar bhai's) whole case was built on the theory that the Aga Khan palace was a 5-star facility. I hope he manages to review his opinions at least now.

PS: Like I said I only know of Aga Khan's Pune Palace.

Why don't you name the other facilities where he was incarcerated to show us that he was treated badly in prison?

Look... Bhagat Singh was kept in Lahore ... in appalling conditions. Any similar evidence for Gandhi?

Re: # 159

(and various others)

Harish, the Agha Khan Palace during (Gandhiji’s incarceration there) was quite a bit different from the current spruced-up version for promoting tourism. In addition to being dark and dreary, it was also full of malaria-bearing mosquitoes which (I think) took Kasturba’s life.

For those who care a bit about the truth (which, based on past experience, automatically excludes Manto miaN) here are a few items excerpted from Wikipedia regarding Gandhiji’s various arrests.

----------

….In 1906, the Transvaal government promulgated a new Act compelling registration of the colony's Indian population. At a mass protest meeting held in Johannesburg on September 11 that year, Gandhi adopted his still evolving methodology of satyagraha (devotion to the truth), or non-violent protest, for the first time, calling on his fellow Indians to defy the new law and suffer the punishments for doing so, rather than resist through violent means. This plan was adopted, leading to a seven-year struggle in which thousands of Indians were jailed (including Gandhi), flogged, or even shot, for striking, refusing to register, burning their registration cards, or engaging in other forms of non-violent resistance. … Gandhi's ideas took shape and the concept of Satyagraha matured during this struggle.

Gandhi's first major achievements came in 1918 with the Champaran agitation and Kheda Satyagraha, …. Suppressed by the militias of the landlords (mostly British), they {the villagers} were given measly compensation, leaving them mired in extreme poverty. ….Now in the throes of a devastating famine, the British levied an oppressive tax which they insisted on increasing. … In Kheda in Gujarat, the problem was the same. Gandhi established an ashram there, organizing scores of his veteran supporters and fresh volunteers from the region. …

But his main impact came when he was arrested {in Champaran} by police on the charge of creating unrest and was ordered to leave the province. Hundreds of thousands of people protested and rallied outside the jail, police stations and courts demanding his release, which the court reluctantly granted. ….It was during this agitation, that Gandhi was addressed by the people as Bapu (Father) and Mahatma (Great Soul). ….

…In Punjab, the Jallianwala Bagh massacre of civilians by British troops (also known as the Amritsar Massacre) caused deep trauma to the nation, leading to increased public anger and acts of violence. … it was after the massacre and subsequent violence that Gandhi's mind focused upon obtaining complete self-government and control of all Indian government institutions, maturing soon into Swaraj or complete individual, spiritual, political independence.

…."Non-cooperation" enjoyed wide-spread appeal and success, increasing excitement and participation from all strata of Indian society. Yet, just as the movement reached its apex, it ended abruptly as a result of a violent clash in the town of Chauri Chaura, Uttar Pradesh, in February 1922. …Gandhi was arrested on March 10, 1922, tried for sedition, and sentenced to six years imprisonment. Beginning on March 18, 1922, he only served about two years of the sentence, being released in February 1924 after an operation for appendicitis.

…Gandhi stayed out of the limelight for most of the 1920s, preferring to resolve the wedge between the Swaraj Party and the Indian National Congress, and expanding initiatives against untouchability, alcoholism, ignorance and poverty. He returned to the fore in 1928. The year before, the British government had appointed a new constitutional reform commission under Sir John Simon, with not a single Indian in its ranks. The result was a boycott of the commission by Indian political parties. Gandhi pushed through a resolution at the Calcutta Congress in December 1928 calling on the British government to grant India dominion status or face a new campaign of non-violence with complete independence for the country as its goal. Gandhi had not only moderated the views of younger men like Subhas Chandra Bose and Jawaharlal Nehru, who sought a demand for immediate independence, but also modified his own call to a one year wait, instead of two.[11] The British did not respond. On 31 December 1929, the flag of India was unfurled in Lahore. 26 January 1930 was celebrated by the Indian National Congress, meeting in Lahore, as India's Independence Day. This day was commemorated by almost every other Indian organization. Making good on his word, Gandhi launched a new satyagraha against the tax on salt in March 1930,…. This campaign was one of his most successful at upsetting British rule; Britain responded by imprisoning over 60,000 people.

…Lord Irwin's successor, Lord Willingdon, embarked on a new campaign of repression against the nationalists. Gandhi was again arrested, and the government attempted to destroy his influence by completely isolating him from his followers. This tactic was not successful.

…World War II broke out in 1939 when Nazi Germany invaded Poland. Initially, Gandhi had favored offering "non-violent moral support" to the British effort, but other Congressional leaders were offended by the unilateral inclusion of India into the war, without consultation of the people's representatives. All Congressmen elected to resign from office en masse.[15] After lengthy deliberations, Gandhi declared that India could not be party to a war ostensibly being fought for democratic freedom, while that freedom was denied to India itself.

…Gandhi was criticized by some Congress party members and other Indian political groups, both pro-British and anti-British. Some felt that opposing Britain in its life or death struggle was immoral, and others felt that Gandhi wasn't doing enough. Quit India became the most forceful movement in the history of the struggle, with mass arrests and violence on an unprecedented scale…
….Gandhi and the entire Congress Working Committee were arrested in Bombay by the British on August 9, 1942. Gandhi was held for two years in the Aga Khan Palace in Pune. It was here that Gandhi suffered two terrible blows in his personal life. His 50-year old secretary Mahadev Desai died of a heart attack 6 days later and his wife Kasturba died after 18 months imprisonment in February 22, 1944; six weeks later Gandhi suffered a severe malaria attack. He was released before the end of the war on 6 May 1944 because of his failing health and necessary surgery; the Raj did not want him to die in prison and enrage the nation. …

Re: # 188

I had every reason to bring in Zardari. The discussion started with Zardari in #95. Zardari's 4040 days became of supreme importance after 2338 days of Gandhi were being thrown up as evidence of his Mahatmaness.

As for Aga Khan palace ... I have asked you on number occasions to point out what other palace/A class facility/Jail he was incarcerated in but you've not told me. How am I to blame then.

Now I don't know if Jinnah was pissing in his pants but from your claim it is apparent that he did not anticipate the first rate Pune Aga Khan Palace facility that Gandhi was given.

As for your personal attack... lets not personalize it simply because you don't have an argument my friend.

#187 by MantoLives

That Zardari was kept in an air conditioned jail or that Gandhi was imprisoned in Aga Khan's Palace in Pune with acres of Garden to his disposal?

What a dishonest man you are Yasser mian to continue speaking of Gandhi's incarceration at the AKP when just 20-odd posts earlier, I provided explicit proof of his arrest and incarceration elsewhere! That you continue to focus on his 2 years there when he spent 4 more years at various other prisons is proof enough. You are beyond reform.