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The Way Out

Hussan Zia November 5, 2008

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#1 Posted by MatloobZaman on November 6, 2008 6:06:19 pm

"Ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country."
J.F. Kennedy January 20, 1961. In his inaugural address
He also asked the nations of the world to join together to fight what he called the "common enemies of man: tyranny, poverty, disease, and war itself." In closing, he expanded on his desire for greater internationalism: "Finally, whether you are citizens of America or citizens of the world, ask of us the same high standards of strength and sacrifice which we ask of you."

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#2 Posted by nkg on November 7, 2008 1:54:26 am
Was Pakistan supposed to be a decent place with thriving democracy!!!!
Pakistan keya matloob kya hai, "La Illla Illlha"...
The purpose of Pakiland is ( some shouting in arabic)...
and you guys are doing pretty well....
i think pakiland is a quite successiful islamocracy....
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#3 Posted by pavocavalry on November 7, 2008 7:51:46 pm
a rather arbitrary analysis....first responsibility is Mr Jinnahs who deliberately retained section 6 or section 9 from the 1935 act after partition , while Nehru made it a point not to have this.In a discussion with ex CJ Sajjad Ali Shah in 2002 , I pointed this fact out.He asked the authority and I gave him destruction of democracy by an american lawyer published bu oxford press.

then comes the non regulation province status of punjab ...non regulation meant that executive was all powerful....the deputy commissioner was a law unto himself....now other provinces of east india company were regulation provinces......this legacy was decisive in punjab and that included nwfp of that time,non democratic ideals were virtually internalised and when the west pakistanis i.e more specifically the punjabis and pathans dominated things after 1951 this non regulation tendency became the guiding theme.then the generals.the isi.the feudals.how can you blame the people.

rigging was started by liaquat ali khan from the mymensingh elections and the habit of branding all political opponents as dogs of india was also started by liquat ali khan.

constitution making was deliberately delayed by west pakistani politicians and liaquat ali khan because they feared that bengali majority would be their political death sentence.


thus 9 years lost.the army feared equal recruitment which would remove the punjabi barani years majority in the army .thus the constitution was agreed to only after the punjabi feudals in league with army forced the bengalis to agree to parity.
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#4 Posted by pavocavalry on November 7, 2008 7:57:08 pm
the sections that jinnah retained allowed the governor general to dissolve the constitutent assembly.jinnah died and ghulam mohammad used this section to dissolve the constituent assembly in 1954.The funny part is that none of Jinnahs successor realised the paramount necessity of removing this deadly imbalance and anomaly.
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#5 Posted by pavocavalry on November 7, 2008 7:57:12 pm
the sections that jinnah retained allowed the governor general to dissolve the constitutent assembly.jinnah died and ghulam mohammad used this section to dissolve the constituent assembly in 1954.The funny part is that none of Jinnahs successor realised the paramount necessity of removing this deadly imbalance and anomaly.
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#6 Posted by pavocavalry on November 7, 2008 8:23:48 pm
CORRECTED AND CONSOLIDATED :--

A rather arbitrary analysis....first responsibility is Mr Jinnahs who deliberately retained section 6 or section 9 from the 1935 act after partition , while Nehru made it a point not to have this.In a discussion with ex CJ Sajjad Ali Shah in 2002 , I pointed this fact out.He asked the authority and I gave him destruction of democracy by an american lawyer published by oxford press.the sections that jinnah retained allowed the governor general to dissolve the constitutent assembly.jinnah died and ghulam mohammad used this section to dissolve the constituent assembly in 1954.The funny part is that none of Jinnahs successor realised the paramount necessity of removing this deadly imbalance and anomaly.

Then comes the non regulation province status of punjab ...non regulation meant that executive was all powerful....the deputy commissioner was a law unto himself....now other provinces of east india company were regulation provinces......this legacy was decisive in punjab and that included nwfp of that time,non democratic ideals were virtually internalised and when the west pakistanis i.e more specifically the punjabis and pathans dominated things after 1951 this non regulation tendency became the guiding theme.then the generals.the isi.the feudals.how can you blame the people.

Rigging was started by liaquat ali khan from the mymensingh elections and the habit of branding all political opponents as dogs of india was also started by liquat ali khan.

Constitution making was deliberately delayed by west pakistani politicians and liaquat ali khan because they feared that bengali majority would be their political death sentence.


Thus 9 years lost.the army feared equal recruitment which would remove the punjabi and pashtun barani areas majority in the army .credit must be given to jinnah for creating the first two bengali infantry battalions.General Ayub Khan made sure that only a third was raised and no more.This was because he himself was from the rain irrigated barani areas and he did not want his kinsmen to loose the majority in the army .Thus the constitution was agreed to only after the punjabi feudals in league with army forced the bengalis to agree to parity.

Pakistan never recovered from 9 years lost in constitution making,from reducing the bengali majority to parity at gun point,three declared and one undeclared martial law of musharraf.its highly unfair to blame the common man.after all in 1946 elections only 5 % of indias population was enfranchised.nehru created the constitution in 1949 and made the system coup proof.pakistani politicians punjabi pashtun and hindustani in lead deliberately delayed constitution making because this would have meant losing their political power to the bengali majority.thus india became a country with a political system and pakistan remains an army with a state with some windbag feudals,industrialists and dubious bankers as the armys junior partners.the situation would continue.pakistan will remain a vassal of USA because this suits the military and political elite.
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#7 Posted by majumdar on November 8, 2008 2:30:42 am
Amin sahib,

Re: #6

Well written. Only two observations.

1. It is unfair to blame MAJ (pbuh). He died within a year of Parttition and there was enuff time for someone else to write a constt and remove the offending sections.

2. The Punjabi and Hindoostani Muslims were quite right in finding loss of political power to Bengalis a highly repugnant and dangerous matter.

Regards
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#8 Posted by KaalChakra on November 8, 2008 3:38:33 am
The role of Bengal in Pakistan is an unsettled one. According to many Punjabi and Sindhi Pakistani historians now, Pakistan was supposed to represent ancient Punjabi and Sindhi civilizations that had lived quite distinct from the Indian civilization (or whatever lay to the east of Punjab and Sindh).

So the acceptance of Bengalis as Hindu dogs or Indian agents, according to this seemingly popular Pakistani view, was integral to the formation of Pakistan.
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#9 Posted by mohar11 on November 8, 2008 6:12:02 am
I don't know what's this randi rona is all about... who said pakiland was supposed to be "democracy"?... like NKG pointed out - pakistan ka matlab kya - la illah allah hilla... pakistan was supposed to be for allah and islam and that's exactly what it has become... more or less...

Jinnah was just another colonial lawyer in a suit, who cares what he said or didn't say?... not people of pakiland...
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#10 Posted by mohar11 on November 8, 2008 6:18:26 am
Re: # 7

MAJ didn't live long, but even if he did, I am not sure how much positive impact he might have had... I mean - this dude went to dhaka and declared urdu to be enforced on bongs... ha ha... can you believe that?...
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#11 Posted by viqarm on November 8, 2008 1:01:58 pm
Re: # 7 Majumdar Sahib,
Why would the loss of political power to Bengalis have been a repugnant and dangerous thing?
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#12 Posted by TrichMir on November 9, 2008 3:22:02 am
#10 this dude went to dhaka and declared urdu to be enforced on bongs... ha ha... can you believe that?...


Jinnah must have though that like Punjabis Bengalis also hate their own mother tongue and would easily give it up in favour of Urdu.

Even in Balochestan, the Baloch language which is a very developed and sweet language (Baloch anyway is an Iranian language like Persian) has been replaced by Urdu which will remain a second rate Indic language no matter how many Persian and Arabic words are incorporated into this languages.
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#13 Posted by Kamath on November 9, 2008 3:58:25 am
Re: # 1 MatloobZaman:
"....Ask not what your country can do for you; ask what you can do for your country...." J.F. Kennedy January 20, 1961. In his inaugural address.

Do you know by chance, the name of the speech-writer who wrote this for Kennedy?

Kamath
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#14 Posted by fuzair on November 9, 2008 5:04:57 am
Very interesting comments, Major Saab. Would you have a reference for the differences between regulated vs. unregulated provinces?
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#15 Posted by pavocavalry on November 9, 2008 5:46:18 am
ok i will give reference if i have time,but this regulation and non regulation province is hard fact..in non regulation province when a britisher came on a horse a native had to get down and go into abject submission from a distince of 100 yards...(narrated by my grandfathers brother,his father being SHO of Thana Chauntra in Rawalpindi in 1880s and 1890s)
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#16 Posted by rashid_s on November 9, 2008 5:38:11 pm
“Much of the responsibility for the failure in Pakistan rests with the people themselves who have not played their part in protecting their rights�
What is it that prevents Pakistanis from coming out on the streets to remove what appears to be a wart of corruption and other putrid issues bigger than Ben Hur!
There are many countries even in Asia, such as Thailand/Philippines for example where the people face similar problems but they do not take it lying down, and often use the “People power� to turn the tables on the governments.
In Pakistan there WAS some glimmer of hope when the “Wuklaa� came out in the streets on single issue affecting them, yet that too was just a bubble in the pan!
Apart from the list of the shortcomings given in the article, which many a nations face, it appears the masses here are not yet choked into death throes, or may be they have gone beyond it and are dead already, that is, it is a case where any amount of ‘nami’ only creates a ‘daldal’ such that no Musa can take them out of it.
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listing 1-16   1 2 3

Interact Index

    #33 barristerakc
    #32 Salim_Chauhan
    #31 nkg
    #30 nkg
    #29 bulleya
    #28 majumdar
    #27 nkg
    #26 majumdar
    #25 Shah2
    #24 Shah2
    #23 nkg
    #22 MatloobZaman
    #21 MatloobZaman
    #20 nkg
    #19 majumdar
    #18 HP
    #17 HP
    #16 rashid_s
    #15 pavocavalry
    #14 fuzair
    #13 Kamath
    #12 TrichMir
    #11 viqarm
    #10 mohar11
    #9 mohar11
    #8 KaalChakra
    #7 majumdar
    #6 pavocavalry
    #5 pavocavalry
    #4 pavocavalry
    #3 pavocavalry
    #2 nkg
    #1 MatloobZaman

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