Lessons From Another Lahore Tragedy

Romair:

Why will you not keep it simple, and throw the rascals out?

Re: # 328
hasho...
"Btw, Pakistan will be saved the day the Pak army is completely destroyed and some other army is raised from the ashes...."
oh no...as per general perception, armed forces are more popular than political establishment in Pakistan...so, Pakistani armed forces are not going to vapourize overnight like camphor....if Paki taxpayers are not paying money, NATO/USA or China and Saudi Arabia will provide resources to Pakistani armed forces (for strategic interest).....

Re: # 303
arjun....
this is real problem...when internal security is handed over to armed forces ( a lot more in India than in Pakistan), you see such problem...fortunately for India, the arned forces are fighting in regions, which has very thin presence in armed forces...(Naxalite tribal belt, Kashmir etc...)

Romair,

The only problem is that the Taliban has now acquired some kind of a momentum in Af-Pak region. Even if US quits A'stan, they wont stop and if they are not stopped in time, they will make things worse for Pakistan (wont overwhelm Pakistan though)

HP saeen,

Looking at the larger US interests, it might go for the final solution one day

I presume you mean the destruction of the Pak Army. But why shud US destroy Pak Army which has been a good dog catcher in the region. At worst, Pak Army is of no good use to USA which means that USA has no incentive to fund it any more. But why destroy Pak Army, when really Pak Army has no interest in or intent to to harm US interests.

Regards

tahmad #: "that if a burglar entered your house you would hold down the missus and tell him to have a go at her but not to hurt you?"

the expat pakistan crowd in the usa, has reached extremely low levels of idiocy......i could expect that from you, hamidm mian and urstruly.....but even otherwise reasonalbe commentators of this expat crowd have joined you......

normally, such a question would be far too idiotic for me to answer......however, since this is the gist of your intellectual development, i feel i must answer it.....

if someone was having a go at my missus, i would fight him.....however, if harish_hyd was having a go at your missus, and you were having a go at his missus, i would not get involved......

i would only get involved on my own terms....i.e. if it was in my interest in going after your missus and if i enjoyed it, or if it was in my interest in going after harish_hyd's missus.....

.......usa is going after the taliban (let's equate them to your missus and usa to harish_hyd's........let them go at each other......why should pakistan get involved........unless it does so on its own terms......

fuzair #: "That's also what I've heard; the locals were very happy to have the TTP and associated Islamist thugs exterminated."

...i think everyone wants the ttp finished.......however just wanting something, doesn't make it happen......things happen, when practical solutions are practiced.....

.....nato, with all its firepower and budget, and with none the muslim associations, has been unable to win in afghanistan, against the taliban.....now hillary clinton is offering negotiations and mullah umar is rejecting them!

how in the world do you expect the pakistani army, with a much smaller resource pool, to be victorious......

it is impossible to win these political wars through force.....

......pakistan will have to first separate out the two wars....the us war in afghanistan and pakistan's war against the ttp.....

since you are sitting in the usa, I am quite sure you are quite ill-informed about what is going on in pakistan.....in addition, i have noticed those who live in a certain environment, eventually start adapting the ways and thinkings of that region......much like pakistanis living in saudi arabia start becoming wahabis and salafis, pakistanis living in the usa, slowly start thinking that all us policies are kosher and should be loved......

......as long as the ttp can link their cause to opposing american occupation in afghanistan, and as long as their is collateral damage, they will always have a resource pool available in pakistan.....

pakistan can only defeat them if it de-links itself from the one entity that is hated, in pakistan, even more than ttp....and that is the usa......

standing up to a country, which is, totally, violating another country's sovereignity with no regard for the later's own considerations is what a govt. is supposed to do......there is a unanimous resolution against drone attacks.......shouldn't that be followed.....

there is mass support of getting the usa out of pakistan's decision making process and making the decsions based on pakistan priorities.....this is normal behavior for any country........

if one is going to allow any country to carry out drone attacks in pakistan, regardless of the deaths involved........then why oppose india's right of doing that......why did pakistan not allow ussr to do that......

pakistan needs to get rid of the influecne of two entities......usa and ttp.....

Re: # 316
fuz...
Kargil was Pakistan's stupid mis-adventure, which Paki army carried out on behalf of China...After 1998 Nuke Test, India clarified then PM of Pakistan that, Indian nuke program is mainly China centric and Pakistan need not worry about it...Vajpayee was able to convince NS in this matter...and then the Chinkus threw couple of bones to Paki generals and they acted like obidient dogs of Chinku PLA....After Kargil, RAW handed over intercepted conversation between PLA and their pet dogs on Paki army...but somehowm, NS was thrown out and the entire information landed on the lap of Mussarraf....
BJP govt. was stupid enough to trust Pakistani govt. ( keeping in mind about the history of military take overs)....
From Kargil episode, Pakistan achieved almost nothing (apart from heavy casualty in Indian side)....

Re: # 297
vengat...
I am not fiddling with greatness of Indian mind...but some of the methods identified by ancient indians are quite unique and better to say not driven by animal instincts....yoga is one of them....

Killing others for something you believe (Islam is seer stupidity) is not matter of having spine...it is stupidity.....

Hasho: The Pakistan Army may not want to fight this war, but the Taliban - geniuses that they are - dont know when to leave well enough alone now that Swat has been shamefully surrendered to them. Like I said to fuzair below, Pakistan's saving grace is that the taliban are even bigger duds than our duds.

#314 Posted by fuzair
"I've also heard that one of the reasons why the PA is relying so much on firepower in, e.g., Bajaur, is that it is afraid that if it commits infantry units to FIBUA, they will obviously suffer heavier casualties and might then refuse orders to deploy against fellow Muslims."
-----

This line was advanced by the Pak army and some in the US around 2006. Many were duped. I too for a while thought this might be the case. Since 2008, the bits and pieces that have come out clearly show that the Pak army generals don't wanna fight this war to save their necks and place the blame on the poor jawans who mostly would not refuse the orders given to them by the command. Yes, there may be some desertions but that happens in every war. This would not be the first time that the Pakistan army would attack the fellow muslim. Army has a habit of doing that and many parts of Pakistan have witnessed that.

The issue really is that the both armies(US and Pakistan) don't want to fight the war. NATO has made it clear that it will not fight the war. So now the US is pressuring Pakistan army to fight so that it can save American lives and the Pakistan army generals take the line that the since the US Army would not fight, why should they.

So what both resort to? Drones and aerial attacks by the Pak army. There is no way they can defeat the Taliban that are mostly perched in the mountains, by the aerial bombardment. The aerial attacks are just part of larger face saving strategy.

Until the situation gets really desperate, both Pakistan and the US would continue this dance and the tea talk.

Btw, Pakistan will be saved the day the Pak army is completely destroyed and some other army is raised from the ashes. In the last two to three months(since nov mumbai attacks), it appeared that the US would weaken the army beyond repair but again Pentagon pumped some fresh air.

Looking at the larger US interests, it might go for the final solution one day and I will be out there supporting the US.

Dear Masadi ji:

Do you care to share how you plan to disband Pakistani Army and what will you replace it with? From the news and posters, it could half Talibani already.

Re: # 324

Then may I humbly suggest that you start writing without the froth coming out of your mouth and onto the screen ...

Pssssssst.... Break your sentences so they are at least coherent.

not the gist of my argument.

wiseguyin writes "Another assertion which claims that the first assertion is propoganda! "

Learn how to read you moron. Tahmed referred to the Al-Qaeda "shadow Army" as a new evolution in order to fuel the US GWOT. That was from the propaganda dens of the CIA, now the gist of my argument.

TNITC masadi

The only thing they have achieved was installing the Taliban in Afghanistan and "Saudi-Islamizing" Pakistan through their "Shadow army" what this misrable moron tahmed is reproducing below from the propaganda dens of the CIA itself

Fasadi ji - do you realize you are contradicting yourself in one line? (This is a first for the rest of us ... but you seem to be doing it with well trained practice).

In one line you say: The only thing they have achieved. An assertion of a fact.
In the same line you say: misrable moron tahmed is reproducing below from the propaganda dens... Another assertion which claims that the first assertion is propoganda!

Re: # 320; masadi

[[The sooner this miserable military is disbanded the better it will be for the nation, and a great loss for the Americans whose occupation force it is]]

this is the third post (in as many weeks) of yours that I agree with!