Obama’s Promise

Re: # 69
I don't see it on the cards, nor is it the pressing issue of the moment. Right now, Pakistan has to fight and defeat the Taliban insurgency, and get its house in order.

Longer term, a common market for all of South Asia does make sense.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

I still think Bangladesh and Pakistan should reunite. Riaz any comments?

"India's Kahmir policy has been far more damaging to India than Pakistan."

Riaz,

This is a typical Paki Army bootlicker speak.

The Good diplomat keeps on speaking about victory while the bad army keeps on sending the armed jehadis.

It is an old game that war mongers of Pakistan have mastered.

Remember, Mushy said during the kargil that he achieved his aims.

Yes, Pakis gloated how they were causing draining of indian exchequer by making india spend on bofor ammos .

They all gloat how indian army has been kept engaged in kashmir.

This was all a propaganda to let army occupy Pakistan forever and turn Pakistan into a banan republic as it is which is perpetual ast was wit itself and others.

This Paki army game is over, yet it's vestiges planted asbroad are still on their job for their masters.

=== Interact Filtered ===
view this users filtered interacts

Re: #
Being personally abusive with me may score your some points with some of your fellow vulgar Indian posters, but it won't wash with me.

Mahmohan's expression of "deep love" for Bush was not one-man's opinion, as Menon explained after the meeting in the White House. It was based on the poll results that showed Bush was much more popular in India than in Europe or America.


Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

#64

You should check out some of his other pompous proclamations. He is a typical uber Paki Pipsqueak. But it is fun watching him unravel.

Well, I am done with this speciman. Going back to my silent lurk mode. So many interesting Pakis to observe...Madani is so much more interesting to read...he is an original.

I wonder what happened to Hamidm. He is in a slump these days.

Riaz do you really represent PakAlumni worldwide? I have trouble believing that...

Hehe...this is hilarious. Now not only is Obama's love of Islam gauged by one (beautifully orchestrated) speech in Cairo to the "Muslim world" but India's love of Bush is apparently gauged by one speech given by Manmohan to -what?, the "American investor world"?
If you read that much into politicians' speeches you are too stupid to be true. Sorry mate- but it needs to be said!

Re: # 58
I do hope sincerely that my words encourage and energize the new generation of Indians (not the septos and octos in charge of the government) to dedicate themselves to improve the human resources of India, the most important of all resources India possesses.

No nation has ever achieved greatness by leaving the majority of its people behind.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Riaz you are officially my DDOM - daily dose of motivation...:)

Riaz saab your expectations are too high - give us poor indians - abt 20 yrs - we promise - you will not have any more complaints.

We need more Pakistani's like Riaz who convert their hatered for India into critical words rather than killing bullets. Thanks Riaz.

Re: #57

I like Pakistani's like Riaz who help Indians by constantly reminding them that Indian achievement so far are impressive but there are still miles to cover and at the same time I hate Paksitani's like Kasab and their masters who are so jealous of India's baby steps towards progress that they resort to insensible violence.

Re: # 55
When you fail to respond to my arguments backed by incontrovertible data, you distract attention from the sad reality of Shining India by making me the issue.

You can not bring yourself to acknowledge the fact that India remains a poor, backward, third-world country based on all objective measures of people's progress.

Unless you acknowledge that there are extremely serious problems of human deprivation in all of South Asia (including your beloved country, you will not be do the right things to achieve the grandest of your dreams.

It's up to you if you want to live in fool's paradise or make the effort to make India into a real paradise.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 3
EXCEPT that the Christian verse Obama quoted was used by the Lord Jesus Christ to explain to the disciples who followed Him the attributes and trials they and all true believers would go through. Altho there were thousands who found where they were and came, this sermon was not meant for generic purposes. But if people heard, they could only surmise from it what was necessary to follow Jesus and know God completely through Him.

There are several other attributes of "blessed" people Jesus outlined in this sermon...being poor in spirit (humble), merciful, hungering for righteousness, pure in heart and blessed for being persecuted FOR following His path of righteousness. And at the end of the sermon Jesus is clear "Not everyone who says to Me 'Lord, Lord', will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. Many will see Me and say on that day, 'Lord, did I not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and perform many miracles?' Then I will declare unto them 'Depart from me, you who practice lawlessness. Therefore, everyone who hears these words and acts on them is a wise man'...............later Jesus clarifies all this by saying "all things have been handed over to Me by My Father, and no one knows the Son except the Father; Nor does anyone know the Father except the Son and he whom the Son wills to reveal Him...............
I hope all this clarifies why the the quote from the Holy Bible Obama used was NOT a generic peace message, but really can be seen as pretty divisive!

Have you wondered by RiazHaq is such a bigot? Inspite of his education he oozes hatred and issues lies about india and indians...here is the answer - this is the kind of education he has received...


http://www.hindu.com/2009/06/09/stories/2009060955850800.htm
A waiting changes to a syllabus of hate



Nirupama Subramanian



All the focus is on madrasa reforms but Pakistan’s schools are also seen as encouraging extremism, while the government has shown little urgency about implementing a revised curriculum.






On a recent weekday afternoon, a small group of youngsters gathered at a meeting hall in Islamabad to discuss how to combat extremism, militancy and terrorism in Pakistan. Listed were top-notch speakers, including two members of Parliament and the well-known physicist, Pervez Hoodbhoy.

Dr. Hoodbhoy, who teaches at the Quaid-e-Azam University in the Pakistan capital, spoke passionately and at length, on a theme that he has worked to highlight for years: the education imparted to Pakistani children is flawed and encourages extremism, intolerance and ignorance. He showed the group, mostly undergraduate students, slides from an illustrated primer for the Urdu alphabet he picked from a shop in Rawalpindi: alif for Allah; bay for bandook (gun); tay for takrao (collision, shown by a plane crashing into the Twin Towers); jeem for jihad; kay for khanjar (dagger); and hay for hijab.

This was not a prescribed textbook, but another set of slides he showed had excerpts from a 1995 government-approved curriculum for Social Studies, which stated that at the end of Class V, the child should be able to acknowledge and identify forces that may be working against Pakistan; demonstrate by actions a belief in the fear of Allah; make speeches on jehad and shahadat (martyrdom); understand Hindu-Muslim differences and the resultant need for Pakistan; India’s evil designs against Pakistan; be safe from rumour-mongers who spread false news; visit police stations; collect pictures of policemen, soldiers, and National Guards; and demonstrate respect for the leaders of Pakistan.

“Instead of teaching our children about the nice things in this world like the colours of flowers, about the wonders of the universe, we are teaching them to hate,� he said. The school curriculum was one reason, he said, why Pakistanis were in denial that the militants and extremists now terrorising the entire country were home-grown products, and why many tended to externalise the problem with conspiracy theories about an “external� hand.

At the end of the discussion, which included a question-and-answer session, the group was asked how many thought Pakistan’s present problems were the consequence of an “Indian hand.� A quarter of the group put up its hands. Next, the students were asked how many thought the problems were the result of an American conspiracy to destabilise Pakistan and deprive it of its nuclear weapons: more than three-fourths of the group sent their hands up without a moment’s hesitation.

The irony was that this was the “youth group� of a non-governmental organisation, the Liberal Forum of Pakistan. The students had reserved their maximum applause for a speaker who projected the widespread line that Pakistan’s problems began only after 2001, and are the fallout of the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan.

“Was there a single incident of terrorism before that? A single suicide bombing? No.� he said. The speaker was an official of the Ministry of Youth Affairs.

In the search for solutions to the crisis sweeping Pakistan and threatening to tear it apart, the international community has tended to focus on madrasas as “terrorist factories.� But for Dr. Hoodbhoy and others who have been fighting a long battle for urgent changes in Pakistan’s national school curriculum and the prescribed school textbooks, children getting a government-approved education in the public school system are at equal risk.

“Madrasas are not the only institutions breeding hate, intolerance, a distorted world view. The educational material in government-run schools do much more than madrasas. The textbooks tell lies, create hatred, inculcate militancy…� This was the damning conclusion of a landmark research project by the Islamabad-based Sustainable Development Policy Institute.

For three years, 30 scholars commissioned by SDPI pored over textbooks in four subjects taught for Classes 1 to 12: Social Studies/Pakistan Studies, Urdu, English and Civics. The startling findings of their labour came out in a 2004 publication, “The Subtle Subversion: The State of Curricula and Textbooks in Pakistan.�

The much-written about research unleashed a huge debate on what was being taught in Pakistan’s schools, and became the basis for a major revision of the national curriculum undertaken by the Musharraf regime in 2006. The new curriculum has made several big changes. There is a conscious move to teach tolerance and respect for diversity, and the open vilification of India is absent. It also does not insist on imposing Islamic religious teaching on non-Muslim students. Religion is to be taught in focussed courses, rather than being infused in Social Studies, Civics, Urdu and English.

Unfortunately, so far, no move has been made to introduce new textbooks that reflect the changes.

“The revised curriculum is a huge departure from the earlier one. But whether the changes it prescribes will be implemented at all is not clear to us. The more it is delayed, the less and less we are sure it is going to come,� said A.H. Nayyar, research fellow at SDPI and one of the initiators of the project.

The changes in the curriculum are up on the Internet site of the Ministry of Education. For Grades 4 and 5 Social Studies, the curriculum has dropped the learning outcomes prescribed by the 1995 and 2002 curricula, focussing instead on providing an “unbiased� education that aims to build informed citizens equipped with analytical skills and “values such as equality, social justice, fairness, diversity, and respect for self and diverse opinions of others.�

The SDPI recommendation that history be taught as a separate subject instead of being lumped into Pakistan Studies was accepted by the framers of the revised curriculum. So, for the first time, a curriculum has been framed for history as a separate subject from Grades 6 to 8.

In contrast to the earlier approach in the Pakistan Studies curriculum, in which the history of Pakistan begins with the day the first Muslim set foot in India, the revised curriculum includes a study of the Indus valley civilisation, of Hinduism, Buddhism and Jainism, and of the ancient Maurya and Gupta dynasties.

The curriculum appears keen to emphasise a composite South Asian history from which Pakistan took birth including the “joint Hindu-Muslim� efforts in the struggle for independence. The Pakistan Studies curriculum for Grades 9 and 10 wants children to learn about the multicultural heritage of Pakistan and “get used to the idea of unity in diversity,� a big no-no earlier.

The revised curriculum also has a component on “peace studies� and conflict resolution.

One reason new textbooks based on the revised curriculum have not come out yet, Dr. Nayyar speculated, may be that the 1998 national educational policy introduced by the shortlived Nawaz Sharif government, remains in force till 2010. The Pakistan People’s Party-led government could be waiting to introduce its own education policy, and usher in the changes to the curriculum and the textbooks along with this, he said.

Even the draft new education policy is ready, based on a two-year-old White Paper. It too reflects a major shift from the 1998 policy, which laid down that education should enable the citizens to lead their lives as true practising Muslims according to the teachings of Islam as prescribed in the Quran and Sunnah. It also made the teaching of Nazra Quran a compulsory subject from Grades 1 to 8, and the learning of selected verses from the Quran thereafter, in clear violation of the Constitution that Islam will not be imposed on non-Muslims.

By contrast, the draft new policy makes it clear that only Muslim children will be provided instruction in Islamiyat, while minorities will be provided an education in their own religion. The new policy will provide the framework for the implementing the new curriculum and introducing new textbooks.

The bad news is that in April, the federal Cabinet put off approving the draft indefinitely. Only after the Cabinet approves the policy can it be placed before Parliament. A report in Dawn newspaper said the Cabinet wanted the Education Ministry to make the policy “more comprehensive, covering every aspect of education sector which needs improvement along with an implementable work plan.� But no urgency is visible in the Ministry to get cracking on this task. Another concern is that the Education Minister is not known for his progressive views, especially on gender issues.

“My fear,� said Dr. Nayyar, a soft-spoken physicist who retired from teaching at the Quaid-e-Azam University some years ago, “is that the government may not have the political strength to bring in a progressive education policy. They may succumb to pressures of various kinds and end up bringing in a hopelessly muddled policy.�

Yet the need for reforms in education has never been as urgent and necessary as now. As Dr. Hoodbhoy has pointed out in several recent articles, while a physical takeover of Pakistan by the Taliban may be a far cry, extremist ideology has taken root in young minds across the country, thanks to a flawed education system.

Compared to the 1.5 million who study in madrasas, an estimated 20 million children are enrolled in government schools. Dr. Nayyar laments that in the five years since the publication of the SDPI report, children who were 11 years old at the time have completed their matriculation. They read the old textbooks, and learnt a way of thinking about themselves and the world that will prove hard to change.

“Another generation has been lost because the process has taken too long,� he said. And until the new textbooks are introduced, millions of children will continue to learn in their Urdu lessons in schools about the differences between Hindus and Muslims in a hatred-generating way, about “India’s evil designs against Pakistan� in their Social Studies, and that Bangladesh was a result of a conspiracy by India with assistance from “Hindus living in East Pakistan.�

Unlike Mr. Daniyal, MJ Akbar clearly understands that for Obama "Muslim world" is the same as middle-east + fake arabs of jihadistan...oops, I meant pakistan.

In other words, Akbar is concerned for the millions of indian, bangladeshi, malysian, indonesian muslims. For the middle-eastern arabs they are kala slaves like the hindus, only the arab concerns are important, other muslims are meant to be their servants.

Here is his take on Obama's speech, robustly centred on a commonsensical attitude and taking into account muslims of south and south-east asia.

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Thank you for the Nildus speech, Obama
M.J. Akbar | Arab News

Dear Brother Hussain, I am certain about two things. I am a Muslim, and I live in this world. Now the uncertainties begin. On June 4 you gave what was heavily advertised as a major speech to the “Muslim world�. Does that mean that while every Christian believes in the divinity of Jesus, he can be legitimately and widely varied in his political interests, but Muslims must have both Allah and politics in common?

As an Indian Muslim I belong to the second largest Muslim community in the world. I also live, proudly, as an equal, in India, a nation that contains the largest Hindu community in the world. Do you think I have the same political views as my fellow Muslims in Pakistan or Bangladesh or Nepal? You did mention that there are around six million Muslims in America. Were you speaking to them, or on their behalf, in Cairo? But for the accidents of life, you could have been an American Muslim, a Kenyan Muslim or an Indonesian Muslim. Would the same speech serve for all three?

Muslims live not only in different cultures and geopolitical spaces, but also under different constitutions. Indonesia, which is the largest Muslim nation, does not believe in a state religion. Pakistan, the second largest, became the world’s first Islamic republic. There are kings and autocrats and elected heads of government in the “Muslim world�, and one category that can only be described as “immovable object� unopposed by any irresistible force. Many Muslims live on the margins. Not many seem aware of this fact, and it is possible that none of your speech writers pointed it out, but 10 percent of the Russian population is Muslim. Islam came to that vast Eurasian region around the same time as the Christian church. Do Russian Muslims belong to the same “Muslim world� as Indonesians and Moroccans? The Chinese keep their Muslim-majority province, Xinjiang, a sort of closely guarded state secret, frightened that Islam might jump up and bite off communism’s ear. Which world do these Muslims belong to? And what about the chaps in Britain, who probably went over on the assumption that Britain was still Great. Or the French Muslims, whose ears are still ringing with the famous Sarkozy diktat: “Off with their head scarves!� Where would you place them? In Above-Saharan Africa?

At one point you were kind enough to suggest that “America is not — and never will be — at war with Islam�. But no sane person ever accused America of being at war with Islam. America would have to be a theocracy, with Inquisition as its preferred domestic policy, and conversion as the principal instrument of foreign affairs, to declare war on Islam. I hope you will not accuse me of being pedantic, in the sense of calling a toothache a gumache. The conflation of Islam and Muslims is precisely the kind of misconception that encourages pre-nation-state fantasies like the revival of a caliphate. One might add that while every Muslim was deeply committed to his faith, political disputes among Muslims began with the election of the very first caliph, Abu Bakr. Muslims see themselves as a brotherhood, not a nationhood. If Islam is sufficient glue for nationalism, why would Arabs be living in 22 countries? That should have been obvious while you were snacking on Arab cookies and Islamic lemonade in Cairo.

“Islam and the West� is another phrase wandering through a dialectic shaped within the Queen of Alice’s Wonderland. Islam is a faith; the West is geography. How do you construct a relationship between faith and geography?

You can have a debate on Islam and Christianity, or indeed between the West and West Asia, or the West and South Asia, or Southeast Asia. There is a past and a future to discuss. “Islam and the West� is straight out of 19th century Orientalism, laden with a subtext that is best left to warmongers. Peace requires a different idiom.

We understood your problem as you weaved through political and rhetorical swamps, because your predecessor managed to achieve what the mightiest of Muslim rulers failed to do — unite Muslims, albeit against him, rather than for something. But every Muslim does not need a homily on democracy. Muslims of Indonesia, Malaysia, Bangladesh and India, who add up to nearly half the Muslim population, are not democracy-deficit.

The appropriate venue for a speech on Islam would have been Makkah, Madinah or Jerusalem.

Cairo was the perfect podium for the speech that we did hear, since your true theme was not the “Muslim world� but the region between the Nile and the Indus, which I have, elsewhere, called the “Arc of Turbulence�. Those searching for a convenient caption for the Cairo oration might want to call it the “Nildus speech�.

For the citizens of this region between Egypt and Pakistan, and particularly for Muslims, this was a brilliant gleam in the gloom to which they have become accustomed. Its great merit was justice and fairness, virtues that are repeatedly exalted in the Holy Qur’an. You did not deny Palestine its rights because you wanted to preserve what Israel has acquired. Of course, you will be criticized for being even-handed, but you have survived worse.

It was extremely important that a president of the United States quoted the Qur’an’s unequivocal condemnation of terrorism, through a verse that is particularly beautiful. This will go a long way to correct the propaganda unleashed by those who controlled the White House and influenced media before you.

There was one element of your speech that did address almost the whole of the Muslim world: Your stark, unambiguous condemnation of gender bias, one of the besetting sins of the “Muslim world�. If Muslims do not eliminate gender bias, they will not be permitted into the 20th century: Who is going to send them an invitation to join the 21st? Barack Obama has offered the key, but it is up to Muslims to open the door.

Riaz - you forgot to point that indians should abolish caste first; also build 500 million toilets (I know that is a personal obsession for you).

After that pakistan might consider normalizing relations, perhaps..

Re: #51

I think you start with getting back Bangladesh first. Then resolve Balochistan. Then come to Kashmir.

Re: # 44
I am no closet India, but I do care for both nations. If both can see what is best in their own enlightened self-interest, then I think the situation can improve dramatically. But they have to rise to the occasion, not be distracted by the narrow, short-term interests that serve neither nation in the long term.

To begin with, Pakistan should try and get India and the world to resolve issues of Kashmir, Afghanistan, etc. to spend much less on defense and more on its people in need.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Eta ke college e pele chanta marte partum...

CPM kaalchar! :P

Re: # 48

Dash_Dot, nkg,

Translation please?

Thanks,

Re: # 47 mosshay ki bolchein aapni:D chowkay kichu relief chai, baba

Re: # 44
majumder...
ha ha ha...ei malta (Riaz)ki bhabe balo to!!!Eta ke college e pele chanta marte partum....ki sab boke jachhe....mane India defence tule debe ar Pakistan eshe vir vikrame Kashmir dakhal korbe.....4 te juddhe kichhu hoi ni, jihad kore o kichhu holo na....ekhon ei sab boke jachhe....

Raiz,
Thanks for your concern for poor people of India...Can you please ask GoP to divert some of the aid (10bnUS$) to India? That will be great favour for us and we will be grateful to you....If you want, all Indians on chowk can sign on a mass petetion...
If possible, you can draft the petetion....

weak=weekend

Re: # 44 Over the weak I met this guy (at a desi charity do), and inbetween courses they had a Dutch Auction for some tickets. This guy, a Daktaar from Srinagar, suggested that basically the Kashmiris were conducting the Dutch Auction and maybe it was time for all to call the bluff - remove 370, and pakitsan ask for a withdrawal of the resolutions - without anteing the status quo.

The dutch auction part made sense...the rest was...

Riaz Haq sahib,

India's Kahmir policy has been far more damaging to India than Pakistan.

If that is true, if I were a Paki I wud hope that India wud continue with the same policy. But I have a feeling that you are a closet Indian really so you are unhappy with this state of affairs.

Regards

Re: # 42

India's Kahmir policy has been far more damaging to India than Pakistan. It maintains a huge army and a large defense budget while spending very little on domestic programs like education, healthcare, poverty-alleviation, hunger-reduction etc. Two-thirds of India's 2009 budget is allocated to police, military, security and debt service etc. That leaves only one-third for everything else. It's a real shame that a democracy treats its people so shabbily, where hunger, malnutrition, illiteracy and poverty are more widespread that most of the nations of the world.

Such stupidity on India's part has also hurts Pakistan with its outsize defense spending.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

#39 by RiazHaq

I expect Obama to turn his attention to Kashmir, although he might do it more discretely.

Riaz mian, keep expecting. For 60 years, you guys have been expecting someone to force India to hand over Kashmir to you on a platter, so what's a few more decades?

kashmir is like a cancer and slowly but surely it's eating both nations, look at the spending both are doing in hundreds of millions, it can be used in development projects on both sides. let go of it already !!! stupid politics.

Re: # 39
Keep hoping. For sixty years Pakistan has been shouting from the rooftops for foreign mediation or intervention in Kashmir. If it did not happen in the last three conflicts, it is not about to happen now.
The only face saving option for Pakistan is to accept the Line of Control as the international boundary between India and Pakistan.

Re: # 32
I think Obama is signaling a fundamental shift in US foreign policy which is not welcome in either India or Israel, who have both been the biggest beneficiaries of Bush's war on terror. Both India and Israel have demonized legitimate freedom movements by labeling them as terrorism. Obama is no longer even using the words "terrorism" or "war on terror", a change that makes India and Israel very nervous.

I expect Obama to turn his attention to Kashmir, although he might do it more discretely.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

you guys talk about opression of women in the arab world as you have not seen it happening it in india or pakistan? camon guys, we know what goes around!!! the whole region has this virus !!!

Nice one from Jemima; wonder how pakistanis would have survived without her......
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Jemima Khan's broken country

In Pakistan, refugee children live with the trauma of having witnessed beheadings, yet she still finds much to beguile her

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/asia/article6446446.ece

:


:
The next day I set off for the refugee camps close to the Swat valley, where the army is fighting the Taliban. Before I leave, Imran’s chowkidar (watchman) tells me that the newspapers in Pakistan are all funded by Yehudis (Jews). His Kalashnikov-toting commando — it’s the first time Imran has felt the need to have security — nods, adding that there are no Taliban. They are a fabrication by Jews and Hindus to destabilise Pakistan. He adjusts his belt of bullets.

Pakistan pulsates with conspiracy theories. One, which has made it into the local newspapers, is that the Taliban when caught and stripped were revealed to have been “intact, not Muslims�, a euphemism for uncircumcised. (Pakistanis are big on euphemisms.) Their beards were stuck on with glue. “Foreign elements� (India) are suspected.
:
:

Another one........
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From “This is not a Western Conspiracy�


"When you feel that whenever you leave your house there are hidden eyes that spy on you, follow your movements, watch you with suspicion and misgiving, and make you return quickly back from where you came - this is part of the culture of fear. And without the least bit of doubt, it is not a Western conspiracy that was hatched against you; this is a product of your own country.�

"When your young children come home from school and tell you that they learned that day that the 'others' are despicable people who do not deserve any respect, acceptance, or appreciation, and that God commanded them to hate ['the others'] and to fight them, at all times and everywhere - this is an institutionalized plan for disseminating hatred. Don't worry, this is not a Western conspiracy gainst you; this is a product of your own country…�

"When all the years of your life are stolen from you… and your vitality, your mind, and your soul are wrested away, all in the name of religion, customs, traditions… and an outmoded heritage - and you know that this has usurped your right to life - don't weep and don't cry, and don't imagine that this is a Western conspiracy against you; these are actions and behaviors that are a product of your own country.

"When everything you hear, see, feel, and perceive tells you that women were created to be a receptacle for you, and that [a woman] is an incubator for your pure offspring, and that you can replace this receptacle whenever you want, and do with her whatever you see fit, and when your friends add a harem of miserable women to their lairs, and think of them as their very private possessions, like hens in a coop or ewes in a pen… don't be surprised. Know that this is not a Western conspiracy that has been hatched against you; this is a product of your own country.�


Wajeha Al-Huwaider is an amazingly fierce and brave woman. The fact that she is a Saudi woman just makes her more so.

She ain't bad looking either; i wouldn't mind...
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Wajeha Al Huwaider
Profession: Writer and journalist

http://www.englishpen.org/writersinprison/writersunderthreat/saudiarabia/wajehaa lhuwaider/

Wajeha Al-Huwaider has been subjected to harassment since May 2003, when she was first banned from publishing. A prominent Saudi Arabian author and journalist, Al-Huwaider wrote for the Arabic language daily Al-Watan and the English language daily Arab News. Al-Huwaider writes on political, social and cultural issues in the Arab world, including women's rights, the treatment of the Shiite minority, and relations with the West. She also writers poetry and short stories. In 2004, she received the PEN/NOVIB Free Expression award.



On 20 September 2006, Al-Huwaider was arrested in her home by the Saudi secret police and questioned about a protest on women's rights she was organising, despite the fact that the protest had already been cancelled due to fear of reprisals. Before she was released, Al-Huwaider was forced to sign a statement agreeing to cease all human rights activism. She was also banned from travelling outside Saudi Arabia. The travel ban was lifted on 28 September and she was able to return to Bahrain where she currently resides.

More from the same Arab babe
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http://memri.o rg/bin/articles.cgi?Page=archives&Area=ia&ID=IA31206

Arab Women Are Worse Off Than the Prisoners in Guantanamo

In an article published May 25, 2006 on the reformist website www.rezgar.com, [7] which Al-Huwaider signed "The Second Rosa Parks," she drew a comparison between the lives of the prisoners in the "terrible inhuman prison" of Guantanamo and the lives of the Arab women: "...Anyone who examines and analyzes the lives of the prisoners in Guantanamo, and compares them to the lives of the Arab women - particularly in the Gulf states, and especially in Yemen, Oman and Saudi Arabia - will discover that there are very many similarities... First, in some Arab countries a woman is a prisoner in her [own] home, and can only move with the permission of her guardian, or, more accurately, her jailor. Her situation is similar to that of a prisoner in Guantanamo.

"Second, in some Arab countries, the woman's guardian is her owner, and the one who has the legal right to use her. He controls all her affairs, great and small. His role is very similar to that of a jailor in Guantanamo.

"Third, a prisoner in Guantanamo, like many Arab women, is not the master of his own body. He has no power to control his own fate, and his personal freedom has been taken away, along with his right to protest his situation.

"Fourth, the prisoners [in Guantanamo] are not protected by law, and their lives are the property of their jailors, just as the lives of the Arab women are in the hands of their guardians. When the guardian feels that his wife has crossed a red line, she is doomed to a die terrible death.

"Fifth, many Arab women have tried to escape or to kill themselves as a way out [of their plight], but they failed just as the Guantanamo prisoners [who tried to escape] failed.

"Sixth, some Arab women are forced to wear impractical and suffocating garments in colors that do not suit the scorching climate of our [region]. [In this respect] the prisoners in Guantanamo are better off [than the Arab women], since they wear practical, light-colored clothing suitable for the climate [in which they live].

"Seventh, a prisoner in Guantanamo [can] see the sun, feel its rays and enjoy the caress of fresh air on his face, even when he is physically in chains, whereas the women in some Arab states are shackled [both] physically and spiritually. They carry these chains around all their lives, beginning in childhood... The minute the girl enters her teens, she no longer sees the light of day, and she cannot breathe fresh air except through a veil, since she is covered from head to toe in black garments.

"Eighth, all human rights [organizations], up to and including the U.N., have condemned what is happening to the prisoners in Guantanamo, and have demanded that the Pentagon release them. But nobody has lifted a finger for the Arab women who have been kept prisoner for hundreds of years. No organization, local or international, official or unofficial, has bothered to expose what is happening to them in the dungeons incorrectly referred to as 'their homes.'

"Ninth, the plight of the Guantanamo prisoners is temporary. They might be released at any time, and then they will return to their ordinary lives as Arab men, and may even receive a medal of courage. The Arab women, on the other hand, will remain prisoners until the day they die, and their tragedy may also continue in the coming centuries, until the women... [Finally] manage to seize their rights, attain [equal] status and restore the dignity that has been taken away from them.

"Finally, the female Arab Guantanamo prisoners [i.e. the women] have never been warriors or suicide [bombers]. They never joined any terrorist organization and have never harmed anyone, but they nevertheless live as prisoners all their lives, and their situation is, in some of the respects mentioned above, far worse than the situation of the prisoners on that island. There is nobody in the U.N., or in any other [organization], who takes an interest in their [plight]; nobody protects them or presents their grievances to the world's judicial bodies. This is even though there are millions of them, as opposed to the 500 prisoners in Guantanamo, who knew, [when they set out on their operations], that they might be killed or arrested.

"I wish I knew why the situation of the women in certain Arab states is not condemned by the countries of the world, and does not enrage their citizens. Why do the human rights activists ignore their suffering as though they do not even exist? Why isn't the cry of these millions of women heard, and why isn't it answered by anyone, anywhere [in the world]? Why? Why? Why? Is it because they are women, while our patriarchal world is ruled by men without an ounce of compassion in their hearts? Maybe that is [indeed the case]."

Not that I care much for Arabs and what they write but for anyone who does.......
-------------------------------------------------------
In a satirical poem titled "When," posted on Arabic reformist websites including http://www.aafaq.org , reformist Saudi author and journalist Wajeha Al-Huwaider lamented what she regards as the conditions in the Arab world. In the introduction to this poem, she wrote: "'When' is an ode to the troubles of the Arab citizen.

The following are excerpts from the poem:


"When you cannot find a single garden in your city, but there is a mosque on every corner - you know that you are in an Arab country…

"When you see people living in the past with all the trappings of modernity - do not be surprised, you are in an Arab country.

"When religion has control over science - you can be sure that you are in an Arab country.

"When clerics are referred to as 'scholars' - don't be astonished, you are in an Arab country.

"When you see the ruler transformed into a demigod who never dies or relinquishes his power, and whom nobody is permitted to criticize - do not be too upset, you are in an Arab country.

"When you find that the large majority of people oppose freedom and find joy in slavery - do not be too distressed, you are in an Arab country.

"When you hear the clerics saying that democracy is heresy, but [see them] seizing every opportunity provided by democracy to grab high positions [in the government] - do not be surprised, you are in an Arab country…

"When monarchies turn into theocracies, and republics into hybrids of monarchy and republic - do not be taken aback, you are in an Arab country.

"When you find that the members of parliament are nominated [by the ruler], or else that half of them are nominated and the other half have bought their seats through bribery… - you are in an Arab country…

"When you discover that a woman is worth half of what a man is worth, or less - do not be surprised, you are in an Arab country…

"When you see that the authorities chop off a man's hand for stealing a loaf of bread or a penny, but praise and glorify those who steal billions - do not be too surprised, you are in an Arab country…

"When you are forced to worship the Creator in school and your teachers grade you for it - you can be sure that you are in an Arab country…

"When young women students are publicly flogged merely for exposing their eyes - you are in an Arab country…

"When a boy learns about menstruation and childbirth but not about his own [body] and [the changes] it undergoes in puberty - roll out your prayer mat and beseech Allah to help you deal with your crisis, for you are in an Arab country…

"When land is more important than human beings - you are in an Arab country…

"When covering the woman's head is more important than financial and administrative corruption, embezzlement, and betrayal of the homeland - do not be astonished, you are in an Arab country…

"When minorities are persecuted and oppressed, and if they demand their rights, are accused of being a fifth column or a Trojan horse - be upset, you are in an Arab country…

"When women are [seen as] house ornaments which can be replaced at any time - bemoan your fate, you are in an Arab country.

"When birth control and family planning are perceived as a Western plot - place your trust in Allah, you are in an Arab country…

"When at any time, there can be a knock on your door and you will be dragged off and buried in a dark prison - you are in an Arab country…

"When fear constantly lives in the eyes of the people - you can be certain that you are in an Arab country."

Re: # 30 Prof. What happens to palestine is important but most important is Kashmir and he is backstabbing GOP. You are american so its is important to you but kashmir more important here and he is backstabbing after harvesting Muslims votes in usa. He has forgotten ladder he used to climb. Not fair not moral to treat second most partner on WOT after usa itseo obama will not abandon us. How you think about requesting col Gadaffy to arbritation ?Kindly read his article on this topic and comment. Thanks will wait for you opinion on Col G for helping both sides.
Good day

Today news says "US will not meddle in Kashmir, says Riedel"

What all this fuss about Obama, he is not going to keep his election promise to lean on India to solve problem.
Before WOT started by GOP it was promised to work on "Kashmir" problem and make India flexible to accomodated interests of pakistan. That was all bluff just get muslim votes in usa and he has achived not shaft for all muslims who voted for him. Now as war stated by GOP can not go back for peace as wonded tiger of TTP is now most dangerous. Again follow international thug as junior partner and he does not value largest partner.
Only way is solve problem is to have Col Gadaffy like person who is very smart and sympatheic to pakistan and has excellent relationship with India can do miracles, he has changed lot. He was sorry for many past things, left nuclear weapons, he said he has respect for mr.Gandhi etc so can cajole india.
He can be good messenger of peace. Please read his / Gadaffi's article on Kashmir.
Good day

Re: # 29
malikrashid,
I agree with your sentiments about Obama and his speech. But, seen from the American political context, I think he went further than anyone thought he would, or any American president has in recent history.

He pushed all the right buttons for his multiple audiences, and earned generally positive reviews with the exception of extreme right. But then extreme was not the people he was appealing he was appealing to. He was looking for support from the mainstream of America and Islam.

I am hopeful that Obama will follow this up with real action. He has already started by pushing Israel on settlements. But he has huge obstacles ahead. Only time will tell if he can succeed.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

PREACHING FROM THE TOP

Do Muslims view the West as hostile because of modernity and globalization?
It is hard to find a Muslim who hates telephone, radio, air travel, news-papers, computers, television or films. There could be some Amish among Muslims but they would be an exception.
If the President was referring to the absence of democracy among Muslims as a sign of their aversion to modernity, his mention of US role in ousting of Mussadeq provides the right answer.
Globalization has not found many opponents among Muslims yet because the US war on terror received all attention in recent years. The President said, �…Muslim majority countries were too often treated as proxies without regard to their own aspiration.�
The President mentioned founding of Israel as the cause for displacement of Palestinians. Instead of a shy admittance, USA and Britain could accept responsibility along with Israel for the death, destruction and displacement of Palestinians. That could be a starting point towards building a bridge to peace.
On the nuclear issue, the President sounded accommodating of Iran’s use of peaceful nuclear energy but insisted on implementation of NPT. Israel’s nuclear weapons were not mentioned.
President Obama declared that US does not seek permanent bases in Iraq or Afghanistan. US insistence on entrusting India with the Afghan affairs is a cause of major concern for Pakistani establishment
The President announced support for education, health and economy in the Muslim countries. He reiterated US resolve for gender equality but his support for democracy seem to allow for dictators and monarchs as long as they pledge a peaceful evolution of participation in governance. Isn’t it the same old policy of condoning dictators?
The President however did cast USA as a Muslim inclusive country in his speech, instead of a Judea-Christian imperialist power. He pleaded for tolerance of other faiths among Muslims and asserted that moral authority can not be claimed by violence.
Moral authority is what the USA needs, to re-establish itself in the Muslim world, as a friend and a partner.



.

#25 Posted by RiazHaq on June 6, 2009 6:43:23 pm

"Significant part of the acceptance of sycophantic culture in India comes from the inhumane system that legitimizes exploitation and abuse of one group of human beings by another group, simply based on the accident of birth. They all know that George W. Bush was born with a "silver foot in his mouth", as former female Texas governor Ann Richards described it."

Riaz, just to help you rebuild your credibility ...

Ann made those comments about Bush Sr and NOT George W, whom you hate so much :)

Riaz Haq sahib ... this 'pak alumni worldwide' thingy ... can we drop that please ...

... unless you claim to represent all the Pakistani alumni worldwide ... I am a Pakistani alumnus (so to speak) and you certainly don't represent me

let's interact here as ourselves rather than claiming to be someone we are not

Thank you and kind regards

"isreal is not going anywhere"

I have been saying this for a while now and I say again,if the muslim world make peace with this fact & recognise that, alot of problems will be solved in no time.

Significant part of the acceptance of sycophantic culture in India comes from the inhumane system that legitimizes exploitation and abuse of one group of human beings by another group, simply based on the accident of birth. They all know that George W. Bush was born with a "silver foot in his mouth", as former female Texas governor Ann Richards described it.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 23
Not all Indians, but some horrible ones lick shoes and unmentionable parts of the anatomy.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 20Riaz...Indians know how to lick shoes of people in power.
http://pukhtunkhwatimes.blogspot.com/

An essay on TwoCircles.net by Yoginder Sikand describes the deteriorating human rights situation of Indian Muslims. America's 'global war on terror' has provided a convenient cover to the Hindutva lobby and to fiercely anti-Muslim elements within the Indian state machinery to launch a concerted campaign of terror against Muslims. Large numbers of Muslims in various parts of India continue to languish in jails on trumped-up terror charges, suffering brutal torture as well as routine insults to their religion by police officials. Meanwhile, Hindu terrorists, often in league with the police and the state machinery, are allowed to run riot, unleashing violence and bloodshed on a frightening scale, while the state, the police and the courts take no firm action against them. Bomb blasts that are now occurring with frightening frequency, whose perpetrators remain unknown, are automatically blamed on Muslims, while some of these might possibly be engineered by Hindutva outfits or by elements within the state apparatus, or even by foreign intelligence agencies like the CIA or the Israeli Mossad who have a vested interest in demonizing Muslims and thereby driving India closer into the deadly American-Israeli embrace. That, in brief, was what numerous social activists as well as dozens of Muslim victims of police and state terror testified to at a public hearing on brutalities against Muslims in the name of countering 'terrorism' recently organized in Hyderabad by a group of noted human rights' activists. Going by their depositions and the verdict of the jury of eminent social activists, journalists and retired judges, it appears that powerful elements within the state apparatus are deeply implicated, along with Hindu terrorist groups, in a witch-hunt of India's Muslim citizens.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 20
"Because it gave India the gift of "war on terror" that Indians thoroughly abused to kill their own Muslim citizens"

A sure sign that the poster is rapidly moving to a state of senility.

Re: # 18
Mr. Foul Mouth, Here are the facts about "India's deep love" for Bush:

"The people of India deeply love you", said Indian Prime Minister Manmohan Singh to President Bush on a visit to the White House late last year.

The Prime Minister continued with the theme of affection and gratitude by adding, “In the last four and half years that I have been Prime Minister, I have been the recipient of your generosity, your affection, your friendship. It means a lot to me and to the people of India.�

Later, India's Foreign Secretary Shiv Shankar Menon explained: “I think, if you look at the public opinion polls, the ratings for President Bush are higher in India than in any other country. That is the factual basis.�

Let me explain: Bush was far more popular in India than anywhere else, including his own country. Why? Because it gave India the gift of "war on terror" that Indians thoroughly abused to kill their own Muslim citizens.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 18
In fact it is the Pakistanis that would have been happy when Bush attacked Iraq, because Saddam was a friend of India and he always supported India's position on Kashmir.

Re: #6 "As to the reaction across the border in India, it is well known many Indians loved Bush and cheered him on in his failed policies of war against the Muslim world."

This is talking through one's ass at its best. Bush's antics in Iraq is seen for what it is- a hypocritical attempt in the name of "freedom" to gain control of oilfields and expand American commercial interests in that region. I am not a Muslim but find all this "addressing the Muslim world" stuff highly patronising. But I guess its worth it if some jihadis buy into it and stop blowing themselves and us up. So I am with Obama on this.

Re: # 5

Bhatti Sahib

I second that, Obama Muslim world speech overload.

Here is an excerpt from NY Times report talking about public anger against the Taliban:

A year ago, the Pakistani public was deeply divided over what to do about its spreading insurgency. Some saw the Taliban militants as fellow Muslims and native sons who simply wanted Islamic law, and many opposed direct military action against them.

But history moves quickly in Pakistan, and after months of televised Taliban cruelties, broken promises and suicide attacks, there is a spreading sense — apparent in the news media, among politicians and the public — that many Pakistanis are finally turning against the Taliban.

The shift is still tentative and difficult to quantify. But it seems especially profound among the millions of Pakistanis directly threatened by the Taliban advance from the tribal areas into more settled parts of Pakistan, like the Swat Valley. Their anger at the Taliban now outweighs even their frustration with the military campaign that has crushed their houses and killed their relatives.

“It’s the Taliban that’s responsible for our misery,� said Fakir Muhammed, a refugee from Swat, who, like many who had experienced Taliban rule firsthand, welcomed the military campaign to push the insurgents out.

The growing support for the fight against the Taliban could be an important turning point for Pakistan, whose divisions about its Islamic militancy seemed at times to imperil the state itself.

Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/05/world/asia/05refugees.html?scp=4&sq=Taliba n&st=cse
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

#6

Now you are trying to figure out how Indians are thinking?

Here's the Editorial from Times of India

{{http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Editorial/EDIT-Statement-Of-Purpos e/articleshow/4622168.cms}}

{{That seem to be the only option. De-nuke, fence pakistan and throw in some strilising kind fo food to them }}

You will continue to remain a moron

Re: # 12

very true. The educated paki on chowk always attributed jihadis and madrassas of pakistan that produced the jihadis to the afghan war and afghan refugees.

Now teh swat refugees and lack of money given to support them will be the cause of more jihadis.

The good part is that the paki economy will continue to deline, more dependance will be on aid and food aid...and hopefully some day some additive could be added to teh aid food to reduce the islamic re-production rate.

That seem to be the only option. De-nuke, fence pakistan and throw in some strilising kind fo food to them

In the foreseeable future Pakistan will continue to hunt with the hound and run with the hare. While the Pakistan army makes a big show of its 'fight' against its own creation, the Taliban, to get more alms ( and of course arms) from the Western donors, the IDP camps will become nurseries tended by ISI to produce more terrorists who will be trained to bite the hand that feeds and of course wage Pakistan's 1000 years war with India.

Re: # 9

Any how, you can always hope by denying the truth about TNt version of islam. At some stage, you have look at and explain why the most virulent starain of islam came out of the paki madrassas.

How come the large part of thetaliban are from lahore. Why do teh so called no jihadi paki political parties support taliban. Whay was the surrender of swat to pakistan accepted by all the so called liberal paki parties. what the attack on swat taliban is linked to yankee money and that too hardly any taliban fighters are killed, they are only moved to karachi and wazirostan etc.

The pakis how come they did know even how to jam FM transmissions. The jinnahic version of islam, also known globally as teh TNt strain is teh most viruleny form and will have to be contained through fencing of pakistan. Now hardly any visas are given to pakis...there need to be more restrictions on paki movements.

Re: # 7

With cynics and skeptics like you, it is going to be hard for any one to make a clean break with the past. You shall remain stuck in the cesspool of history, unless you open your eyes and embrace change. Let's hope Obama can still succeed, in spite of fanatic Muslims, bigoted Hindus and right-wing Jews with the ridiculous Biblical claim on Palestine.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Re: # 8

I can see how miserable you are now.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

Finally obama has told the truth. The slaughter of muslims will stop only when the so called majority muslims stand up and oppose the terrorists. Well that is not going to happen, what the west call as terror is jihad for true muslims. Then he also talked about freedom of choice for religions...well that means conversion from islam to other religions in pakistan...that is not going to happen. Obama has told categorically...if tehse conditions are not met, teh slaughter will continue.


This is all good news for pakistan. The so called attack on the taliban has been made into a refugee problem...more money....they want to be paid for killing taliban...sorry they are only being moved to karachi....the paki troops will move out of swat as soon as teh yanks make the payments...and the cycle continues.

All are happy...the jihadis are happy..they got to intriduce jazia on teh sikhs of swat...the paki army is happy..they have got the dollars.

Isalam is a way of making a living ... no doubt

Sometimes it just boggles my mind to see the sychophancy of the chamcha group, who take money to kill their fellow citizens. Well the Negro Bush sure has shown promise by making 3 million people refugeee and tens of thousands killed in his first six months. He has kept the fine tradition of all his predecessor psychopath presidents.

The simplest way to interprett an american presidents bologne speeches is to turn affirmatives into negetives and vice versa. For eaxmple, when a US president says "lets have a new beginning, we want to establish good realtionship with Muslim". The no nonsense translation would be "there is nothing new, we will keep the status quo and you fukks (refering to corrupt ruling elite of Muslim lands) you will keep doing what we tell you to do and you are gonna like it".

The phrase "the solution for middle easdt is two state solution"

Translation: "go fukk yourselves; the way it is is how its gonna be".

The phrase "Islam, Judaism and Chritianity all have teachings of peace"

Translation: "and we are fukking capitalists, money is our god, and we kick everybodys butt who doesn't give us his money and does not like it"

The phrase " Guantanamo bay will be closed down in a year"

Translation "Yeah we are outsourcing our torture cells to godfrosaken countries like pakistan, romania, germany, and poland. It will take a year to complete the outsourcing".

This lesson was brought to you by "Interpreting US Presidents for Dummies"

As Muslims, let us begin by acknowledging that President Obama is saying all the right things, and hope that his words will soon translate into good deeds on the ground. He's only been in office just a few months, let's give him a little more time before we pronounce judgment on his performance.

As to the reaction across the border in India, it is well known many Indians loved Bush and cheered him on in his failed policies of war against the Muslim world. In fact, Bush's popularity was much higher in India than anywhere else, including the US. So it is not a surprise that many Indians do not like Obama's new and enlightened approach to find success in dealing with the Muslims.
Riaz Haq, PakAlumni Worldwide

i have read/heard so many reviews of Obama's speech that any new one seems plagiarism....

All these lectures is one voice among 300 million American or 6 billion people of the world.

Kennedy said "ask not what your country do ....."
The AIG Lehman Bros Bank of America G.M. did ask the country and got more than those who DID NOT ask ......santa clause walla icon

http://view.break.com/578969 - Watch more free videos

I admire Obama for doing this speech. Brilliant speech, it was a fantastic speech.President Obama has been willing to speak hard truths over and over--in Philadelphia during his speech on race, at Notre Dame when he spoke about abortion, and now in Cairo as he described the state of relations between Muslims and America.
"Blessed are the peacemakers for they shall see God".
President Obama is a peacemaker and a good and honest man, and one of the most intelligent men ever to hold the presidency.
In a troubled world, a soothing sane voice indeed! Coming as it is from the most powerful man in the world, it is reassuring. As expected,President Obama has clearly laid out his vision in his speech. Obama's Cairo address to the Muslim world offered a 'vision of a better world.

http://thepathans.blogspot.com/
http://pukhtunkhwatimes.blogspot.com/

The Mrikan policy towards Muslims and their wealth will remain unchanged no matter who talks or quotes the Qur'an dressed as a sympathizer!

Yah Ummah kind of sucks....Obama is right