The Chowk Jam!

You expressed the purpose of establishing Chowk in a precise but effective way that one would want to spare more space. This is the elegance of the Chowk that everyone is welcome with any race, color and creed where knowledge is shared and appreciated, ideas and logics are weighed, discussed, accepted and rejected. The combination of such a diverse backgorunds erected the Chowk to an open place where no one would want to walk without evesdropping. Good work.

regards

MAK

SR/SS/FK/BG/ and others:

Instead of voting process that maybe inherently flawed, can I humbly suggest another decision making process that can satisfy both the contestants as well as the participants?

Let us have a gladiator like contest, with the weapons of participant`s choice. The Cricket or Football stadiums can serve as the coliseums. All spectators should be charged ongoing major league
ticket prices, with proceeds going to charities.

regards

SR writes:

``Whenever such a things happens, all readers should get a chance to vote ``right`` or ``wrong`` in favor of or against the fuding parties. :)``

A well-intentioned idea, Sohail, but I see some problems:

1. Popular opinion is not necessarily the right one. Perpetuation of slavery and election of Benazir are good examples.

2. Jury opinion is not necesarily the right one. O.J. Simpson verdict is the clearest example.

3. There is no way to ensure that ALL readers will cast a vote. The poll can be highly skewed if one party inspires more visceral support.

4. Because of fictitious names and hotmail accounts, there is no way to ensure one man, one vote.

Saad

dear cheeno,

i dont know if its you, or your poem, or the weather,(probably all except the weather) but the interactions in your poem are hilarious and light hearted, and i`m certainly enjoying them.

re SR
i know you were not entirely serious when you suggested voting, but forgive me while i respond a little sersiously because i am interested in the conceptualization of `democratic` decision making.

you know on the face of it voting sounds like a good `democratic` idea, but here are the problems:

1. very easy to rig with bogus votes
2. extremely divisive politically -- forcing people to take sides and silencing the minority view point or `dissent`, which could ultimately lead to resentment becuase the minority is merely silenced and not convinced. especially, if the minority is forced to make a public apology !! :)

i am personally in favor of consensus based decision making. more work, but works better.

sorry for the tangent.

`later,
bg

Re: Chenno post # 17

Just what word is ``Vfehlempt``? What does it mean? If you know the meaning, maybe I could help you.

There is a German word, or as they say, ``ein deutschen worten`` called ein fingerspitzengefuhl which in English means a sixth sense. Is that what you were after in regard to SR`s insights, because it does imply an uncanny sense, of finding the right pulse, of a situtation. There is another one called ein logikpermanenz, which suggests an undying source of knowledge or logic.

If there is a world called, ``vfehlempt``, chances are that it starts with a ``F`` and not a ``V``. Since in German, ``V`` is pronouced with a ``F`` sound. For example, the German word ``von`` as in Count Clemens von Metternich is pronounced as Count Clemens fon Metternich. Also, in case you are wondering, the German word ``von`` means ``of`` in English. Example, Chenno von Chowk simply means Chenno of Chowk; Temporal von Toronto; Fraulein Zehra von Hijabistan!

As to your other suggestions: No! No! No! No! and and No! No! No!

Please don`t encourage Frau Doktor Anita Zaidi to discuss BG and Random issues again! I beg you in the name of a merciful Allah, please don`t even think that, because it is like decending into Dante`s inferno; there is no end to it and it is beyond all tolerances of human suffering!

As to your idea of a High Court of Chowk ajudicating InterActs, where Chowkwallahs can bring defamation charges for libel and slander and be judged by a jury of Chowkwallahs; it is good idea, but a bad starter. First of all, there is going to be an instant backlog of cases, since Anita, BG and Random are going fill up the court`s schedule with their periodic and on going libel and counter-libel suits.

Secondly; by doing this you will be in effect be creating a class of lawyers on Chowk. An idea which is extermely verboten; forbidden. Otherwise, we all will be running around Chowk quoting Shakespear: kill all the lawyers!

Lastly; Some of us like the anarchy of Chowk and folks like Temporal and myself can not afford legal representation everytime we make a statement.

I know and I understand your intentions were noble and honorable, but then again, Brutus was a honorable man too! Besides, we all know where the road paved with good intentions ends......

Auf Wiedersehen mein Freund!

I haven`t been around much lately but I see a lot has been going on as usual. It`s good to see the chowk community is alive and well (and kicking each other.)

Great poem Cheeno. Welcome to chowk! I must say that your reply #17 about having time is very interesting. I sometimes wonder about it myself. But I do know that most of the chowkwallas are well educated professionals with high-paying jobs. Many people go to bars, cafes, etc to socialize. We come here to do the same. Only its more convenient.

My father sometimes talks about the early days in Pakistan when intellectuals, poets, writers and students used to gather at cafe Sheezan in Sadar, Karachi. Most would come and go after a brief sitting and a cup of tea. And some would sit there for long hours and debate about the issues of the day, politics, religion, poetry, literature, waghera waghera. Of course, they didn`t have jobs but they were the idealists who never cared a damn about money. I sometimes wish I could`ve been there with them. Like I wish sometimes I could`ve been around in the 60s here in the US. Anyhow, chowk is the closest thing to Sheezan. Have some chae, it`s on me. :)

---Rehan

An interesting suggestion regarding `tiffs` between various Chowk personalities.

Whenever such a things happens, all readers should get a chance to vote ``right`` or ``wrong`` in favor of or against the fuding parties. :)

Thus we can have a special vote (annonymous if possible) like the survey is, where voters take sides and give the verdict. Then the ``looser`` makes a public apology and life moves on. What do you say, Ms Agha? You started this, so take the lead, if you please.

...SR

Re: cheeno

``I`m reeeeeally curious about something--would you indulge me? Tell me something: do you really think you have a right to know whether Random and BG are the same person, or are you carrying on just for kicks? I would love to hear an honest answer, although I`m having fun either way!!``

Aha, so the true motivation comes out! And here, we`ve been trying to bury the hatchet!!!

No, I don`t think they are the same person, but beyond that my lips are sealed:)

Anita

Poetry is usually about feelings therefore words simply cannot do it justice. This poem, however, is an exception. Its a very apt and timely portrayal of the InterActions and the players involved on Chowk. You have depicted the goings-on in this cyber kanji-house very astutely with great insight. Absolutely remarkable.

...SR

SR: I`m vfehklempt (sp?), yaar. A huuuuge fan of your writing, although I`d say your strength lies in your replies (as opposed to your posted articles). Can I ask a couple of personal questions before proceeding to the question of votes? (Of course, you can just refuse to answer anything, and I`d understand perfectly). OK then. What do you do for a living, and how much time do you spend reading? Also, did you grow up in a liberal family?

Yaar, this whole feuding thing truly is a lot of fun, but it makes me wonder where people get all this time in a rat-race society such as this. I`m a bit weary of getting addicted myself, so I`ve vowed to keep my interactions limited to times when one of my writings is posted (okay, maybe also if I see something I absolutely love and feel the need to `shabash` the writer).

The voting part is a great idea, although I don`t know whether the egos involved will ever submit to `public` apologies. I think Chowk readers should be allowed a for/against vote and a few lines of commentary, all of which should be posted eventually on the front page for all to see. What fun!

anita zaidi: Come on, unseal those lips! So you think they`re related, then? Also, I actually asked whether you thought it was your right to know, or you were just having fun.

anita zaidi: Doctor Sahiba, I forgot to mention earlier that the bigger ``tiff`` going on between you and BG and Random also provided a big chunk of the fuel for this poem. Glad to know you liked it. I`m reeeeeally curious about something--would you indulge me? Tell me something: do you really think you have a right to know whether Random and BG are the same person, or are you carrying on just for kicks? I would love to hear an honest answer, although I`m having fun either way!!

Cheeno

Re: Zehra

Trying to keep this thread within this discussion, thanks for eludicating on the ``meaning of brown``. Yeah, I would concur on that too, I like my friends like my tea: brown and sweet!

BTW, what do you mean....remind you not date me! :)

Just what did I say that promted you draw that conclusion....

A) Labelling you as a Chowk activist
B) My Valentine`s dating options
C) You having the hots for Alan Greenspan
D) A and B
E) All of the above

Zehra, just think about it....after dating me, you`ll be appreciative of any guy who dated you! Isn`t that worth the risk? :)

ferozk: the dating options for valentines :) i like to actully be heard when im talking and if people are going to say things like no, really? you`re kidding! uh huh..i stop speaking (you are taking notes right?) anyhow, is carnival over? i really wanted to see bonhomme carnival fer real instead of my french book this year. challo, mebbe next year...

cheeno..tiff? koon sa tiff? kaisa tiff? ``you aint seen nothing yet`` (c. ferozk). we`ve come along way baby.

z for zesty rizvi

Re: Cheeno,

Great start, Cheeno! I`ll now have to go and see what Feroze and Zehra have been saying to each other in the ``Growing Up`` article :)

Anita

re cheeno
``even though I think
you tend to go to looney extremes sometimes``

that really cracked me up. thanks for the candor. i have been accused of that before, but gotta keep pushing the envelope.

welcome.

Re: Chenno post # 7

Bravo Chenno! Welcome to Chowk....where have you been hiding yaar! Compared to your poem, a gourmet meal, my post on the Chowk was like British food - boiled and bland with a dash of salt and pepper for taste!

Good show! Glad you could join the regiment!

Tiff with Zehra....? You ain`t seen nothin` yet!

Don`t be shy, look me up if you get the chance...I am always in the neighborhood!