Searching for my identity

Re :kamran9999

`` But are you happy, Abdul-Hakim? ``

Why is there the question of happiness ?

BTW , what are you trying to prove Kamran?

Its just about chosing something that`s all.

You don`t go around and ask people every time

they make some decision. And what if Abdul

tells you he is happy? Will it change

the way you think?

Happiness/Sorrow is a way of life , nothing

sticks forever.

Take Care

Javed Akhtar

Sohail Rabbani Sahab, thanks give me your email address and I will explain the whole affected writing style thingy... I don`t think Chowk can handle my ideas or my style. This place is a little too uptight and would only censor me (like the last time... and completely lock me out again before they would allow anything by me to sully the pure sensibilities of the pakeeza ... )

Re: Solitude

Please write a full length piece and submit it to the editors. Your `verbal` style is par excellence.

Haiii Rabba mai mar gaye!

...SR

One last thing, I always believe if the man love me he marry me no matter how many wives he has (actually four is the limit set by rasool allah so I will have to think very very hard if you have more than four)... Look, one more thing I wear hijab (just like the rasoolallah ordered) baat, I dont talk like hijab, I dont walk like hijab I dont even *look * like I wear hijab ... I love cone-fusing people like that :O (look I pout pout again) Why ? because I ahhm a b-i-t-c-h, I ahm a laaver, I ahm a children and a I ahhm mathar, I ahhm everything in between and more and you know you would not want me any ohther waaaay...

You brown maulana belong to mama baby, so dont go around running after memsahibas, promise? I white Pakistani garl- so I go to white and I can go to brown if I want but you brown so stay brown, ok ? I know some bad boys who dye hair blonde like white girls die hair black and brown and blonde. You boys on this channel very very sure about identity and roots and my dil is winning (by all you boys, black and brown and white) because of that.

Hai Rabba! I have found maa soul mate! Haaaiiiiiiii! Mera dil to dharkam dharkam (my heart goes bum, bum, bum, bum !) all the time-ummm ... hai meray gabroo darhyal(with beard?) jawan ... I was talking to my saheli (garl friend?heehee) and she said men with beards give good head in marriage ... aray maa angreji not so good good.

Aji, so original - just like the fifty or so jawan and virile boys who flock to our evening Tablighi Jamaat gathering. Well us girls like to sit at the back so that we can watch their backs (heeeheeeheheee Hai Allah bless all that alloo ki puri) So tell me yaar, you part of MSA? or harakatul ansar or some other nice Islamiat organisation who want to convert Bartania into afghania? (specialy those blonde and gori memsahabas, no?)

``You can either become browner than brown or whiter than white. I did neither and took a third path. I became a practisin Muslim.`` - Yes Islamic militancy demanding banning of music and evolution from the innocent minds of our nanhnay mujahid much much diffarant yaar! ``Everything British must be Devilish and accursed, and everything Muslim must be perfect and Angelic. `` - Haii, I am thinking if you want to bring another woman in our bed ... let me tell you I might wear hijab peeshab but I very very experimenting aaall the time! with the qari, with the imam, with my abbu jan. I test them and ask probing quechions every day like ``If I become my huband has three wives instead of the four- how will we equally divide 7 days into four equal parts?``

But congratu- lachu- lachu-lachu lations on being a rebel ! you have chosen the straight path and I promise to wait for you at the end of it with the rest of your wives and the 70 houris dripping in honey ... I will even apply some honey in naughty places for you ... but only ...

``Islam doesn`t require you to forsake your culture and accept an Arab one `` - look you talking from your brainwashed British head now so please angreji babu reconsider for me :o (-- I pout pout here) So your culture is now british haan? you are sooo cone-fused ! so you give up your culture haan? so you think salamalaikum british greeting haan? those british took tachnolagy from us during kala (dark) age and all the science - now they are after salam alaikum! aray salam alaikum, the quran, the bootiful language of the quran, your prayers everything Arabic, even allah arabic (some say he has pakistani mother living in the deserts of sindh in a big palace) Is it because you have bad experience with Qari Sahab?

Haii, we all do. The rod he stick it to you good for you. It made your parents wealthy so you get education. My qari sahab stick it everywhere in my body ... stick it in my ears, my back , my tummy...[pause for breath] even my mummy .. stick it everywhere .

Spare the rod spoiled the child - good angreji wisdom for cone-fused angreji baboo :) Our only identity what our nice abba hazoor and amma hazoor tell us in childhood, okay because they our best helpers after allah and prophet. Simple math exercise : they tell us we Muslims NOT hindus NOT jew NOT kafir NOT human being but Muslim! Others maybe hindu maybe Human being maybe jew maybe kafir but NOT muslim. You see what common between them and us (Answer : !!!GNIHTON read backwards).

Re: Abdul-Hakim

I liked the article and your honest feelings that showed through.. I dont particularly like the notion of diversity everyone seems to rebound to-its almost seems kind of patronizing sometimes... but something which in context of the article comes to the same implications- tolerance. You can refuse to assimilate or refuse to continue the traditional way of life kept by your parents but by bringing them both together and learning and choosing from one and the other you are at the same time learning to tolerate and go with who you were, where you are and where you came from to get to who you are today.

nice piece :)

Re: sakina

I have to agree with you-- every discussion on culture and identity always comes back to hijab or ``veiling``.

the choice of hijab is exactly that: a choice. It should by no means be a forced decision. Since this is a religious concept i wont hesitate to draw ppls attention to the part in the Quran itself that discusses the notion of hijab--ie: modest dress and right after it says that God is merciful and forgiving.. (and no i did not go look that up esp for this reply.. im a women`s studies, middle eastern studies and comparative religions major.. so ive done research on much of what was covered in the discussion before :P)

Academically and in various interpretations that means that if due to a human weakness a woman(or a man since there is a separate form of hijab for men that never gets discussed) does not implement hijab God is still understanding and merciful. Now whether or not you (meaning ppl in general) believe in God or the authority of the Quran is something im not here to argue.. the discussion is on the choice and implementation of hijab and not personal beliefs in God.

In terms of case studies about hijab and choice the example of france is definitely a good one but there are undeniable more (khomeini vs the shah-- forced on either end. Just approaching the matter on a women`s rights level shows that neither give the woman herself any choice but beyond that even dehumanizes her. Both imply that women are too stupid to decide for themselves what they want to do.) However in other religious matters there isnt as much monitoring. It seems that women threaten the very structures of the ``Islamic societies`` or even any of the Middle Eastern societies today (MENA-Middle East North Africa is the academic characterization of what is generally called the middle east and all extends to Pakistan and parts of India.)

I dont think that women`s bodies are exploited by using them as the symbol behind every discussion concerning a religious identity because the hijab (in all its different forms) is the only one unifying physical manifestation that can be alluded to in the form of a religious dress and hence important to the formation of a religious identity.

Re: RV and Zeemax

I dont know if RV is so off the bat on this one: everyone does have different views of hijab. Hijab isnt the same for me or Zeemax or Zehra or for that matter anyone on here. Each of us have a different vie on what hijab entails and what is means. Im not sure i personally agree with the way RV expressed his opinions.. but whatever.

Re: mubbashir

I agree with you that hijab in the West does attract more attention but maybe it’s the curiosity that allows ppl to question and learn to relieve themselves of the ignorance of difference.

Oh and btw someone had cited the lack of male self-control as the unreasonable factor for male dominance and female seclusion.. the reverse is often cited in academic journals.. that women are the ones that lack self-control over their sexual appetites and that if they were let loose in society it would create social chaos (fitna) so women are secluded and guarded... use the rationality from each argument on the other.. and you can get the opposite result; that men need to be protected in the private sphere either because they have the lack of self-control or because women do..

What it boils down to is not a question of religious practice but social hierarchies developed around patriarchal societies that support male dominance in all spheres.

Re RV:

[(religion is so un-cool (read load-of-sh_t). A humane identity is a better goal)]

You`re full of sh * * RV .. you`re so lost in being an ABCD that you don`t have any bearings left .. so you belong where you are .. just keep your opinions to yourself .. !

I guess everyone has one?s own view of hijab (burka, veil, etc...)

For Zehra its like ``miracle bra`` (Zehra, how about going to nude beach with veil on. It will be sensational)

For Zeemax its like ``Viagra`` (and it doesn?t cost the user a dime...)

For Godot its ``Islamic Identity`` (religion is so un-cool (read load-of-sh_t). A humane identity is a better goal)

For MCPs it is something that protects men from ``EVIL`` women body (they believe men are mentally challenged species, ready to mount a women at the sight of her face...basically dick-heads)

And for me... Its an evil concept that insults women?s body and a men?s mind.....

Re: Zehra, #43

``as godot has been mentioning..it is an acessory of sorts``

I count a grand total of one post re hijab that I posted. How many have you counted?

re: SR

i remember how i got jumped upon when i came out to chowk as a hijabi. it was awful. i was completely thrown off..whereas i has expected that by that point, chowkwalas had come to know me for me, the hijab became an issue and took over who i was. assumptions were made about me, who i was, how i was forced to wear hijab and how i probably didnt move an inch without my parents permission. i was also accused of being contradictory because as somone who came across as a feminist in terms of her writing and stance, i was betraying the feminist cause by wearing hijab ( this was mostly men letting me know about me). i used to frequent these discussions because i thought i could prove sumthing. i thought i could prove those who do treat hijab as a patriarchal form of oppression that there are women who will not be oppressed and those who wrongly view all hijab as a patriarchal form of oppression that there were women like me out there. failed miserably in both cases and had to bukhtofy it from both sides.

i do come across as a `non hijabi` and i love that it can throw people off that i wear hijab...

as godot has been mentioning..it is an acessory of sorts..i find that it complements my navel piercing real well ( how many comments will i get on this one..sister! you cant dishonor the hijab this way! ). tattoo is next..and i`ll make sure that unlike the piercing, i can show it off :).

hijab makes me an easy target. and im ok with that cuz i like the attention i can draw from it. i am one of the most unhumble, immodest woman i know..and i do work the hijab. and i freely admit to it. i like the fact that i am easliy recognizable. there was a time in my life that i was known on campus as the hijabi with the lip ring. i would get interested, horrified, puzzled and completely bewildered looks all the time..and i loved it.

its all about what works for the individual..and above all, i think its about what is between you and your God. involving middle men is always a problem.

rizvi

Re: RV (the clueless)

You haven`t a foggiest idea of what I said. SR understood it quite well. I thank him for trying to explain me to you because I sure can`t.

RV #36

Whether or not Godot’s intentions were sincere only he knows. We can only go by what he says. If he secretly wishes to keep women ‘in their proper place’ by imposing upon them a dress code which consisting of hijab, then he didn’t not come outright and express himself clearly. That is what I was saying. Perhaps there is some background to your acrimony that I am unaware of, and if that’s the case, that’s a different matter and only you two can duel it out.

Additionally, I endorsed his analogy of men’s ear-rings and tattoos with hijab. To this you respond:

[“…Where do you see the similarity? Does an earring prevent a men from biking, driving, running, swimming, playing.....???? Does it? …You have to wear hijab for one whole day to realize its horror. …In this black-and-white issue there is no room for gray. …”]

Let me use the term ‘veil’ and not ‘hijab’. The use of hijab, as a noun, depicting a face covering garment, is IMHO an improper use of language. But I’m getting off on a tangent, so back to the comparison between the veil and an ear-ring.

Having not had the occasion to “wear hijab for one whole day to realize its horror” my only recourse is to defer to the opinion of those who have worn this accessory garment. There is one Ms. Z. Rizvi (she sometimes frequents these discussions) who once went to great length in explaining her choice to wear the veil. This person, as judged from her postings, appears to be independent minded, smart and self-assured. I doubt if her accessory garment prevents her from “…biking, driving, running, swimming, playing…” Had she not revealed it, one wouldn’t have guessed. She does not fit your implied model of an exploited and repressed woman because of her veil. She might easily have been someone wore a tattoo or a Mohawk hair style instead. I tend to agree with the comments of mubbashir # 37 [“… hijab (in the west) … attracts more attention and is more of an object of curiousity than modesty. ..something that is tantalizingly inaccessible in a society that is so overexposed…”]

You are right, this is a black and white issue. In South Asia there are only black or white (shuttlecock) burkas. This `hijab` business, however, is multi colored. I actually saw a woman once who had a multicolored veil, and no, she wasn`t wearing a mini skirt.

…SR

Re RV #36

What makes Hijabans truly beutiful is certainly not only the physical aspect of their facial features glowing like a full moon in the sky of the hijab .. more so it is their whole attitude .. their downcast eyes, their politeness, courtesy and self-confidence. Simply purity personified. A quality similar to the hippy girls of the 60`s (no other similarities though).

I was a strong opponent of the Burqa, and I`m a staunch supporter of Hijab. RV if you`re a girl you should take it up too !

Are there many Hijabans now in the US ? Get me a seat on the next flight out.

Zeemax

this is a dillema which many of us are faced with. Who are we really? What I have been able to figure out and am still trying to figure out is that I am me. I am trying to put together the good of both cultures with a mixture of Islam. I want and believe that our values are really what difines us. try to be comfortable in your own skin regardless of it`s color or lack of it. Respect both cultures, but know that you will neither be exactly like either of them.

The idea of seperating culture from religon is something a lot of muslim children who`ve grown up

in Canada/US do. However just as how Islam is practiced in the subcontinent is distinctly different than how it`s practiced in the Middle East, Indonesia and Africa, eventually a very

North American form of practicing Islam will emerge in a few generations.

It doesn`t mean they are any less ``Muslim`` than those in other parts of the world. Practicing Islam emcompasses many everyday aspects of life.

And as such the North American Environment will

influence it greatly. Everything from Marriage

customs to other major milestones in people`s lives (graduations, birthdays, etc).

Regards,

Fozia Zaidi

on hijab rights and wrongs:

i agree that a person should have the right to wear hijab if s/he chooses to, or for that matter any kind of personal choice in how one presents oneself is up to them. but that doesn`t mean that those of us who think that such practice have incredably negative repercussions on how women`s roles get structured and defined in society don`t have the right to challenge and criticize such practices (i am not picking on any individual here but overall general practice). this is kind of comparable to how racists have the right to publish their rhetoric but that doesn`t protect them from being challenged.

purdah or hijab in the diaspora might have many different connotation than it does in Pakistan or anywhere else in the islamic world where it is not seen as a progressive practice or as an assertion of a politicized muslim identity. here one can justify many different practices under the banner of ethnic sensitivity or multiculturalism but in the end it doesnt hide the fact that the main premise (reasons for hijab) are incredably patriarchal in nature; i.e the assumption that women`s body is dangerous, prone to bringing out licentiousness in men and causing tremors in society...i.e. this argument bascially gives men the license to ogle at women, assumes that women themselves dont have sexual desire that they don`t look at men (or women) and in the end it assumes that sexual desire as natural as it might be is a dirty thing (only for your husband) and should be controlled by keeping women covered.

as far as choice very few women have the luxury to choose on whether or not they have to cover themselves. just because some women choose to do hijab does not make it right. i am not saying that as a man i know what is best for all women. everyone has to negotiate through their realities, parents, community, etc. throughout the struggle for women`s some of the most vocal opponents against womens rights have been other women, who are reared to be the vessels of tradition, and `propriety`. this was true in womens struggle to gain the right to vote in america, the campaign to end female castration in Africa, and the work being done to stop ``honor`` killings in Pakistan and Middle East (remember that it was the mother of Samia who assisted in her murder in Hina Jillani`s office).

p.s. ironic thing about hijab (in the west) is that it attracts more attention and is more of an object of curiousity than modesty. what can be more sexier that something that is tantalizingly inaccessible in a society that is so overexposed.