Study in Black
Bina Shah March 12, 2000
#56 Posted by zensufi on March 17, 2000 8:22:45 pm
Hallo - yup, who are we to pass judgment? Have you read the book, ``Price of Honor`` ? Great book about the plight of Muslim women in the middle-east and beyond. Also check out, ``Nine Parts of Desire`` ...a book which wakes us up to the realities in the Muslim world.
One hears all this talk about Islam giving the woman equal rights, but yet, it is so pathetic that we live in a male dominated patriarchial society! As for the hijab/burqa/scarf... in my opinion, it is classified as a personal choice AFTER a person has been educated about the other side of the fence. Force is not the solution... choice is.
=zensufi=
One hears all this talk about Islam giving the woman equal rights, but yet, it is so pathetic that we live in a male dominated patriarchial society! As for the hijab/burqa/scarf... in my opinion, it is classified as a personal choice AFTER a person has been educated about the other side of the fence. Force is not the solution... choice is.
=zensufi=
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#55 Posted by mjkpgzjz on March 17, 2000 5:46:14 pm
On reading your post and brief reflection, I am reminded of an incident some years ago on the train from Manchester to London. I was a young Pakistani student fresh from the Land of the pure here on a scholarship of my dreams.
Feeling rather bold and sociable, the briton sitting across me in the cabin asked me where I was from. The word `Pakistan` evoked an immediate reaction from him. He pulled out a copy of the Daily Telegraph to reveal a picture of Benazir Bhutto on the front page carrying some flowers and walking purposefully by her side was the Duke of Edinburgh.
`How graceful she is, in her head scarf and this `robe thing` from head to toe`. Of course this was my cue to launch into a brief description of the Islamic injunction on Hijab and why it is worn. Of course, it seems from Bina Shah`s post that like most Pakistani women she has little knowledge of the reason why Hijab is compulsory for muslims. Little knowledge, as they say, is a dangerous thing.
The sociable briton was now curious as well and after a long discussion on the role of women in Islam vs. Western society, he exclaimed quite loudly (which is quite embarrasing on British trains), `You muslims have something really precious, and yet you yourselves do not realise it, rather try and demean it in the eyes of the world`.
I realise the sister has valid concerns about the hijab, since in our Pakistani society, Islam is often quite distorted and misunderstood. Let us just remember what the Holy Prophet (SAW) had to say about women in his last khutba (address):
`O people, it is true that you have certain rights with regard to your women, but they also hav a right over you. If they abide by your right, then to them belongs the right to be fed and clothed in kindness. Do treat your women well and be kind to them for they are your partners and committed helpers. And it is your right that they do not make friends with anyone of whom you do not approve, as well as never to committ adultery`.
Feeling rather bold and sociable, the briton sitting across me in the cabin asked me where I was from. The word `Pakistan` evoked an immediate reaction from him. He pulled out a copy of the Daily Telegraph to reveal a picture of Benazir Bhutto on the front page carrying some flowers and walking purposefully by her side was the Duke of Edinburgh.
`How graceful she is, in her head scarf and this `robe thing` from head to toe`. Of course this was my cue to launch into a brief description of the Islamic injunction on Hijab and why it is worn. Of course, it seems from Bina Shah`s post that like most Pakistani women she has little knowledge of the reason why Hijab is compulsory for muslims. Little knowledge, as they say, is a dangerous thing.
The sociable briton was now curious as well and after a long discussion on the role of women in Islam vs. Western society, he exclaimed quite loudly (which is quite embarrasing on British trains), `You muslims have something really precious, and yet you yourselves do not realise it, rather try and demean it in the eyes of the world`.
I realise the sister has valid concerns about the hijab, since in our Pakistani society, Islam is often quite distorted and misunderstood. Let us just remember what the Holy Prophet (SAW) had to say about women in his last khutba (address):
`O people, it is true that you have certain rights with regard to your women, but they also hav a right over you. If they abide by your right, then to them belongs the right to be fed and clothed in kindness. Do treat your women well and be kind to them for they are your partners and committed helpers. And it is your right that they do not make friends with anyone of whom you do not approve, as well as never to committ adultery`.
#54 Posted by fairdinkum on March 17, 2000 12:54:22 pm
Re: Zehra #50 & Sobia #48
Under Nazis, swastika became a symbol of injustice and oppression…. In our times, Islamic beard, and hijab have become symbols of hypocrisy, injustice, and intolerance toward fellow human beings. They are an expression of the fact that Islam is now in the hands of self-proclaimed pious (fundamentalists is another term for them) who, according to Tagore,
“have jealously erected boundaries so rigid, that it excludes all spontaneous movement of the living spirit. These bigots have an implicit belief that God can be kept secured for certain individuals in a cage, which is of their own make. This is a perverse form of worldliness in the disguise of religion; it breeds a narrowness of heart in a greater measure than the cult of the world based upon material interest can ever do. “
I do understand your argument in favor of hijab, but you know, you are preaching freedom of expression by wearing swastika under Nazis, and not only voluntarily, but with pride.
Under Nazis, swastika became a symbol of injustice and oppression…. In our times, Islamic beard, and hijab have become symbols of hypocrisy, injustice, and intolerance toward fellow human beings. They are an expression of the fact that Islam is now in the hands of self-proclaimed pious (fundamentalists is another term for them) who, according to Tagore,
“have jealously erected boundaries so rigid, that it excludes all spontaneous movement of the living spirit. These bigots have an implicit belief that God can be kept secured for certain individuals in a cage, which is of their own make. This is a perverse form of worldliness in the disguise of religion; it breeds a narrowness of heart in a greater measure than the cult of the world based upon material interest can ever do. “
I do understand your argument in favor of hijab, but you know, you are preaching freedom of expression by wearing swastika under Nazis, and not only voluntarily, but with pride.
#53 Posted by amit on March 17, 2000 12:54:22 pm
Re:Hamidm#39
There is one very good reason why muslim women need to be covered up - a large fraction of them are stunningly beautiful. This is especially true of those who have considerable extent of Persian, Central Asian or Afghan ancestry. I think the combination of desi attributes with some amount of Central Asian blood really leads to incredible beauty, especially by South Asian standards.
Take Bollywood for example. The most beautiful women there have always been muslim women such as Madhubala, Meena Kumari, Saira Bano, Waheeda Rehman etc and they easily outclass the Madhuris and Aishwariyas. In fact, I consider Madhubala, a muslim woman from NWFP, to be the most beautiful woman I have ever seen. A lot of people may not know this, but her husband was the actor/singer Kishore Kumar. Kishore was a Bengali Brahmin, but he converted to Islam to marry Madhubala. Heck, I would have done the same if I had that opportunity. Maybe the jehadis in Pakistan could consider this sort of tactic against us pagans :-)
While muslim men should control themselves, they are just human. How many men can control themselves, if they are faced with a truly beautiful woman ?
There is one very good reason why muslim women need to be covered up - a large fraction of them are stunningly beautiful. This is especially true of those who have considerable extent of Persian, Central Asian or Afghan ancestry. I think the combination of desi attributes with some amount of Central Asian blood really leads to incredible beauty, especially by South Asian standards.
Take Bollywood for example. The most beautiful women there have always been muslim women such as Madhubala, Meena Kumari, Saira Bano, Waheeda Rehman etc and they easily outclass the Madhuris and Aishwariyas. In fact, I consider Madhubala, a muslim woman from NWFP, to be the most beautiful woman I have ever seen. A lot of people may not know this, but her husband was the actor/singer Kishore Kumar. Kishore was a Bengali Brahmin, but he converted to Islam to marry Madhubala. Heck, I would have done the same if I had that opportunity. Maybe the jehadis in Pakistan could consider this sort of tactic against us pagans :-)
While muslim men should control themselves, they are just human. How many men can control themselves, if they are faced with a truly beautiful woman ?
#52 Posted by hamidm on March 17, 2000 12:54:22 pm
Omar #41
May Allah be with you .... Take care and stay away from university campuses in Pakistan, Raiwind, Mansoora, congregations of four or more persons with beards, the soccer field in downtown Kabul, the Institute of Policy Studies in Islamabad, green turbans, Asma Jehangir`s shadow, Dr. Hoodbhoy`s street, Taliban reunions and the Grand Madrassa at Faisal Masjid.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * Sobia
``You might find this very hard to belive but there ARE women whotake the hijab voluntarily, under no pressure from their husbands/fathers or family.``
No, I don`t find it hard to believe....but then these women MUST also accept the fact that their testimony in court is only worth half that of Boota Khan; they cannot pretend that your burqa is a judge`s robe; they cannot go to Auntie Rosie`s house, or for that matter to the House that Abraham built, without being accompanied by a Mehram; they cannot go to the masjid; they cannot have a headache; they have to accept a light beating from the master if you are bad; they cannot teach middle school boys and they cannot do this and you cannot do that .... they can`t even pray while the Devil is visiting them!.
Like I said before .... you cannot have your halwa and eat it too.
May Allah be with you .... Take care and stay away from university campuses in Pakistan, Raiwind, Mansoora, congregations of four or more persons with beards, the soccer field in downtown Kabul, the Institute of Policy Studies in Islamabad, green turbans, Asma Jehangir`s shadow, Dr. Hoodbhoy`s street, Taliban reunions and the Grand Madrassa at Faisal Masjid.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * Sobia
``You might find this very hard to belive but there ARE women whotake the hijab voluntarily, under no pressure from their husbands/fathers or family.``
No, I don`t find it hard to believe....but then these women MUST also accept the fact that their testimony in court is only worth half that of Boota Khan; they cannot pretend that your burqa is a judge`s robe; they cannot go to Auntie Rosie`s house, or for that matter to the House that Abraham built, without being accompanied by a Mehram; they cannot go to the masjid; they cannot have a headache; they have to accept a light beating from the master if you are bad; they cannot teach middle school boys and they cannot do this and you cannot do that .... they can`t even pray while the Devil is visiting them!.
Like I said before .... you cannot have your halwa and eat it too.
#51 Posted by krashid on March 17, 2000 12:54:22 pm
Another excellent post by Bina Shah.
Your writing is very absorbing. Particularly to write on such a topic and keep the interest alive.
I agree with the basic theme, by many women folk, that it should be the choice of women and should not be imposed.
As far as burqa or clothing are concerned, there is a strong social factor and peer pressure. For example what is the minimum cloth allowed. Even in as independent (mather and Padr Azaad) a country as America, you can go in bikini on beach but not in Bazaar. That is a custom. Women wait for summer to show their legs in miniskirt or very short shorts. But many women from Pakistan will be content to wear sleeveless and jeans or long skirts. In the same way without any pressure some women take Hijab and have fought battle in court for their right to wear hijab during job.
Situation in Pakistan is a male dominated patriarchial society where male folks want to impose their will on women. Although, it should be more of a social and peer pressure.
Your writing is very absorbing. Particularly to write on such a topic and keep the interest alive.
I agree with the basic theme, by many women folk, that it should be the choice of women and should not be imposed.
As far as burqa or clothing are concerned, there is a strong social factor and peer pressure. For example what is the minimum cloth allowed. Even in as independent (mather and Padr Azaad) a country as America, you can go in bikini on beach but not in Bazaar. That is a custom. Women wait for summer to show their legs in miniskirt or very short shorts. But many women from Pakistan will be content to wear sleeveless and jeans or long skirts. In the same way without any pressure some women take Hijab and have fought battle in court for their right to wear hijab during job.
Situation in Pakistan is a male dominated patriarchial society where male folks want to impose their will on women. Although, it should be more of a social and peer pressure.
#50 Posted by farangi_kush on March 17, 2000 12:54:22 pm
ZAHRA:#51
Happy Eid-ul-Azha
Please do not address me as `Sir`.Even as a sarcastic statement(and I believe it is not meant to be so ) it is an misfit with a `name`like mine!;-}
I agree with you in a certain way and I do not want to `de-sensitise` the issue.So let us leave it at that.
Your comments are,as you say,have already been voiced by so many others,including myself.Therefore I believe,you should have directed them to the author of the article than me.I am not the transgressor of the `arrangement`.
I thank you again for the hints you have given me to keep it cool,and I get your message loud & clear.
Please write about the oppression of women on this matter in countries like Turkey,Algeria,France,and USA & Canada---among many others.Oppression as a government policy is much more heinous than that by individuals.
I thank the other girls too who exposed the inferiority-complex of the author.
Thanks again and nothing more for me to discuss.
wassalaam.
Happy Eid-ul-Azha
Please do not address me as `Sir`.Even as a sarcastic statement(and I believe it is not meant to be so ) it is an misfit with a `name`like mine!;-}
I agree with you in a certain way and I do not want to `de-sensitise` the issue.So let us leave it at that.
Your comments are,as you say,have already been voiced by so many others,including myself.Therefore I believe,you should have directed them to the author of the article than me.I am not the transgressor of the `arrangement`.
I thank you again for the hints you have given me to keep it cool,and I get your message loud & clear.
Please write about the oppression of women on this matter in countries like Turkey,Algeria,France,and USA & Canada---among many others.Oppression as a government policy is much more heinous than that by individuals.
I thank the other girls too who exposed the inferiority-complex of the author.
Thanks again and nothing more for me to discuss.
wassalaam.
#48 Posted by Bina on March 17, 2000 8:17:10 am
Dear Zahra
It`s my story, ``The Marriage Trap 2``, where two friends who are joking that the conservative sisters will shun them for their sleeveless dresses. Tsk tsk! Before you cry stereotype, don`t tell me that conservative women have never ever ever in their entire lives looked down upon, castigated, or otherwise verbally disapproved of women who chose to dress less conservatively. Women who don`t wear hijab, who don`t wear burqas, who want to wear sleeveless outfits, and everything else, know from experience that they are rarely received with open arms and full appreciation, and women AND men are just as likely to criticize these women`s choice.
Zaynab:
Yes, there is an inbuilt prejudice in our part of the world (and elsewhere!) that white = good and black = bad. But do you really think that if the burqas were in blue, I would hesitate to call my piece ``Study in Blue`` or any other color? And furthermore, if black is so desirable and lovely, why don`t we see men donning it - especially in the Middle East, where at least half the imagery of this piece comes from? Sorry, Zaynab. I think your subtle accusation that I`m being racist (or perhaps colorist is a better word) by observing this phenomenon, is misplaced.
As for freedom of choice as far as the burqa is concerned... I don`t think we have true freedom of choice in our society, at least with this issue. There are layers upon layers of coercion and force operating here, and I would argue that when a woman makes the choice to wear a burqa, at least in Pakistan, it is rarely a true free choice, even if no one`s holding a gun to her head. Take away the insecurity, societal pressures, religious mores, family opinion etc. etc. etc. and then let`s see how many women voluntarily don the burqa (Not hijab).
Too many times, in our country, choice is a luxury that we women simply don`t have.
It`s my story, ``The Marriage Trap 2``, where two friends who are joking that the conservative sisters will shun them for their sleeveless dresses. Tsk tsk! Before you cry stereotype, don`t tell me that conservative women have never ever ever in their entire lives looked down upon, castigated, or otherwise verbally disapproved of women who chose to dress less conservatively. Women who don`t wear hijab, who don`t wear burqas, who want to wear sleeveless outfits, and everything else, know from experience that they are rarely received with open arms and full appreciation, and women AND men are just as likely to criticize these women`s choice.
Zaynab:
Yes, there is an inbuilt prejudice in our part of the world (and elsewhere!) that white = good and black = bad. But do you really think that if the burqas were in blue, I would hesitate to call my piece ``Study in Blue`` or any other color? And furthermore, if black is so desirable and lovely, why don`t we see men donning it - especially in the Middle East, where at least half the imagery of this piece comes from? Sorry, Zaynab. I think your subtle accusation that I`m being racist (or perhaps colorist is a better word) by observing this phenomenon, is misplaced.
As for freedom of choice as far as the burqa is concerned... I don`t think we have true freedom of choice in our society, at least with this issue. There are layers upon layers of coercion and force operating here, and I would argue that when a woman makes the choice to wear a burqa, at least in Pakistan, it is rarely a true free choice, even if no one`s holding a gun to her head. Take away the insecurity, societal pressures, religious mores, family opinion etc. etc. etc. and then let`s see how many women voluntarily don the burqa (Not hijab).
Too many times, in our country, choice is a luxury that we women simply don`t have.
#47 Posted by Zahra on March 16, 2000 10:22:55 pm
Sir Farangi-Kush:
I thought that I will logon today and clarify the myth behind the ``sensitivity issue`` and fortunately, I was saved from doing that. I think the responses of different participants` are more than enough, to make us realize that we are dealing with a ``very sensitive`` issue. :-)
The most annoying part is having men commenting how women should or should not cover themselves. It is mere NONSENSE! I think for a change, women should start focusing on men. That will be the only way that one side will realize the other`s perspective.
It is a woman`s right as an individual to cover the way she wants to. Be it a Burqah, an Abaaya, a Chador, a Topi, a tent-Numa Burqaa`, a Kumbal or a Razaii`. Leave it to them, guys!
It is interesting to skim through the Lum`bee Kaha`nee`yaan and Dee`waan being written on what women should do and how they should appear or/and disappear :-(
I will agree with Sobia that many women go for Hijab by choice. From a guy`s perspective, I feel they perceive the person in that Hijaab, as a stuck-up fellow and under some external pressure. Probably it is time that men(who hold these views) should wake up and smell Beugmont or Ylang Ylang and realize that there ARE many women, WHO pursue,What they believe in and ARE COMMITTED to their STANCE.
Take Care Readers and Happy Eid to All,
Zahra Jamshed
I thought that I will logon today and clarify the myth behind the ``sensitivity issue`` and fortunately, I was saved from doing that. I think the responses of different participants` are more than enough, to make us realize that we are dealing with a ``very sensitive`` issue. :-)
The most annoying part is having men commenting how women should or should not cover themselves. It is mere NONSENSE! I think for a change, women should start focusing on men. That will be the only way that one side will realize the other`s perspective.
It is a woman`s right as an individual to cover the way she wants to. Be it a Burqah, an Abaaya, a Chador, a Topi, a tent-Numa Burqaa`, a Kumbal or a Razaii`. Leave it to them, guys!
It is interesting to skim through the Lum`bee Kaha`nee`yaan and Dee`waan being written on what women should do and how they should appear or/and disappear :-(
I will agree with Sobia that many women go for Hijab by choice. From a guy`s perspective, I feel they perceive the person in that Hijaab, as a stuck-up fellow and under some external pressure. Probably it is time that men(who hold these views) should wake up and smell Beugmont or Ylang Ylang and realize that there ARE many women, WHO pursue,What they believe in and ARE COMMITTED to their STANCE.
Take Care Readers and Happy Eid to All,
Zahra Jamshed
#46 Posted by Zehra on March 16, 2000 2:36:54 pm
sobia,
hear hear.
its just as wrong to force hijab on women as it is to force it off women.
most women when looking at another woman wearing hijab dont think it`s of free will. they feel that the woman wearing hijab is making unfair generalizations about them..they never consider the situation reversed.
i had read a story somewhere about a woman who was `joking` with her friend about her sleevless clothes and how their more conservative sisters would shun them...never realiing ofcourse that she was making a gross generalization and helping perpetuate false sterotypes that follow women in hijab. imagine not only wearing hijab in a society that wont accept you but also having to defend it to every muslim/person you come across....cant we just let people make their own choices and leave them to it?
hear hear.
its just as wrong to force hijab on women as it is to force it off women.
most women when looking at another woman wearing hijab dont think it`s of free will. they feel that the woman wearing hijab is making unfair generalizations about them..they never consider the situation reversed.
i had read a story somewhere about a woman who was `joking` with her friend about her sleevless clothes and how their more conservative sisters would shun them...never realiing ofcourse that she was making a gross generalization and helping perpetuate false sterotypes that follow women in hijab. imagine not only wearing hijab in a society that wont accept you but also having to defend it to every muslim/person you come across....cant we just let people make their own choices and leave them to it?
#45 Posted by farangi_kush on March 16, 2000 2:36:54 pm
FEROZE-K:#46
Thank you for your informative response.Now this kind of info one expects at least a majority of inter-acters to be aware of.This is basic stuff!!
Also,since you are reasonably well-informed please enlighten about the origin of the following words: Slave,Ghulam (hint:golam),Abd.
Now words and their origin have an almost miraculous ability to speak the truth.Words get adopted out of a persons desire to inter-act(in daily commerce) with others in a surreptious (in a good sense) way.There is seldom a long term `motive` `purpose` or `design,scheme` in doing so...by the common man.
What I am trying to drive at is the absence of such words in the lexicon of the sub-continent & middle-east(the ones within my limited grasp--there is one exception,I want YOU to tell us).Bonded labour words yes--like Haris,Dalits & shudr yes --as organised aparthied,but I am refering to the TRADED kind.
Also how was it possible for the turkish `slaves` to become rulers of hindustan,How did a Habbashee(meaning from Habsha----old name for Abbysinia till the 40s,now Ethiopia) commander became sultan of Bengal(former slave)....Pl. enlighten us on the SYSTEM and not the judgemental scorn about the practice.
I do not intend to let this digression lead to a FISHAAR so please bear with me for only this one infraction of the `code`.
For those interested I can give excellent sites available on this subject.
wassallaam.
PS:Feroze: welcome back and I look forward to your postings.
Thank you for your informative response.Now this kind of info one expects at least a majority of inter-acters to be aware of.This is basic stuff!!
Also,since you are reasonably well-informed please enlighten about the origin of the following words: Slave,Ghulam (hint:golam),Abd.
Now words and their origin have an almost miraculous ability to speak the truth.Words get adopted out of a persons desire to inter-act(in daily commerce) with others in a surreptious (in a good sense) way.There is seldom a long term `motive` `purpose` or `design,scheme` in doing so...by the common man.
What I am trying to drive at is the absence of such words in the lexicon of the sub-continent & middle-east(the ones within my limited grasp--there is one exception,I want YOU to tell us).Bonded labour words yes--like Haris,Dalits & shudr yes --as organised aparthied,but I am refering to the TRADED kind.
Also how was it possible for the turkish `slaves` to become rulers of hindustan,How did a Habbashee(meaning from Habsha----old name for Abbysinia till the 40s,now Ethiopia) commander became sultan of Bengal(former slave)....Pl. enlighten us on the SYSTEM and not the judgemental scorn about the practice.
I do not intend to let this digression lead to a FISHAAR so please bear with me for only this one infraction of the `code`.
For those interested I can give excellent sites available on this subject.
wassallaam.
PS:Feroze: welcome back and I look forward to your postings.
#44 Posted by Sobia on March 16, 2000 10:16:47 am
Hamidm:
*.....and please, don`t tell me it is a matter of personal choice! What sane person would envelope herself in a suffocating tent when it is a hundred and twenty degrees outside.... *
You might find this very hard to belive but there ARE women who take the hijab voluntarily, under no pressure from their husbands/ fathers or family. They have their own reasons to do so. I`m not one of them but I think that they have every right to do so and should not be judged as oldfashioned, stupid or repressed. I think personal choice IS important and should be respected, not criticized.
#43 Posted by OMAR1974 on March 16, 2000 4:13:25 am
A Nugget from TFT
Shariat Court remarks laughable
Quoted in daily Din, PPP leader Iqbal Haider said that the Federal Shariat Court allowing unfettered rights to men to marry again and again could be challenged because the Court had no jurisdiction in the matter of Family Laws Ordinance 1961. He said remarks given by the judges were laughable. For instance, unfettered polygamy was allowed `because there were more women than men in Pakistan`, meaning that men could marry many times to `fill the gap`.
Shariat Court remarks laughable
Quoted in daily Din, PPP leader Iqbal Haider said that the Federal Shariat Court allowing unfettered rights to men to marry again and again could be challenged because the Court had no jurisdiction in the matter of Family Laws Ordinance 1961. He said remarks given by the judges were laughable. For instance, unfettered polygamy was allowed `because there were more women than men in Pakistan`, meaning that men could marry many times to `fill the gap`.
#42 Posted by ferozk on March 16, 2000 2:33:39 am
RE: OMAR1974
Omar, leave F-Kush alone! As for the Brits chasing the slave-ships down, it had more to do with acts of piracy than a concerned conscience, because the Brits were losing money on the deal since they could not regulate it.
As for Abe Lincoln fighting the American Civil War (1860-1865) to free the slaves, that is a myth taught in American high schools. Lincoln freed the slaves to keep the Brits from entering the war on the side of the Confederacy, because British cotton mills have losing business due to the Yankee blockade of the South, which was preventing exports of cotton to England. By doing so, Abe was appealing to the ``moral majority`` in England and its Prime Minister, William Gladstone.
Ask yourself; if Abe was so concerned about the slaves, why did he not free them in 1860 instead of 1863? The reason being that, though slavery was a cause, the real reason for the war was a consititutional problem between the South and the North on matters of political representation in Congress. Who was pushing for the war using slavery as a caus belli?
Sorry for this tirade, but I had to set the record straight!
Bet you might be regreting my return to Chowk :)
Omar, leave F-Kush alone! As for the Brits chasing the slave-ships down, it had more to do with acts of piracy than a concerned conscience, because the Brits were losing money on the deal since they could not regulate it.
As for Abe Lincoln fighting the American Civil War (1860-1865) to free the slaves, that is a myth taught in American high schools. Lincoln freed the slaves to keep the Brits from entering the war on the side of the Confederacy, because British cotton mills have losing business due to the Yankee blockade of the South, which was preventing exports of cotton to England. By doing so, Abe was appealing to the ``moral majority`` in England and its Prime Minister, William Gladstone.
Ask yourself; if Abe was so concerned about the slaves, why did he not free them in 1860 instead of 1863? The reason being that, though slavery was a cause, the real reason for the war was a consititutional problem between the South and the North on matters of political representation in Congress. Who was pushing for the war using slavery as a caus belli?
Sorry for this tirade, but I had to set the record straight!
Bet you might be regreting my return to Chowk :)
#41 Posted by the_happy_one on March 16, 2000 2:16:39 am
Re: Hamidm
Very well said, my good man!
A good read too! Keep `em comin`.
Very well said, my good man!
A good read too! Keep `em comin`.
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