A Different Story

What is happening to us?! We are supposed to be the ``cream`` of our respective countries--the educated, middle class elite, the intellectual class.

If we are reduced to a bunch of mindless mudslingers, then there is no hope for our countries. It seems that almost every political article on Chowk is being reduced to this sort of nonsense. Its one thing to disagree with each other , but this is getting ridiculous.

Please. Let us all take a break & reflect on what the 2 Ahmads (Bilal & t-321) are imploring us to do. If this keeps on going, the finest ineractors are going to get disgusted & leave Chowk. I`m afraid some of the best have already done so.

Peace.

THE LAW OF 2%,

This item from dawn of today shows how wide spread the jihadic machinery is, and shows the deliberate attempts by the pakistanis on chowk to hide the reality,

The high cost of jihad

THE article by Mr Irfan Hussain, ``The high cost of Jihad`` (Dawn Oct 28) is indeed a plain reality. I fully agree with the writer, as this unbridled Jihad will take us nowhere. The modern concept of strength of nations is education, economics and development.

About six months back, I came across a similar leaflet in my morning newspaper whilst I was in Islamabad. It gave a detailed breakdown of the prices of all weaponry from a bullet to a hand grenade to Klashnikov.

The question which arises is how will these weapons be procured by the Jihadi organizations? What is the surety that all of these will end up in the specified area of operation and not filter down to our cities and towns and be used for terrorism?

If these organizations are advertising these messages so openly, I am sure they have the requisite pipeline to ensure supply of these weapons. On the one hand we hear the authoritative messages from the Ministry of Interior of de-weaponisation and on the other, the free availability of such weapons and their procurement is explained by some organizations.

SYED GULREZ AKHTER

Karachi

14 AUGUST 1947,

What does the above date mean for pakistanis, nothing much. It was definitely not an `independance ` day, they have ignored their martyrs, the men and women who fought the british for it. For the pakistanis, it was just the creation of the islamic state. How else would one explain that there are no pensions for the freedom fighters, no land alocated to them, it is only Jinnah. It was just the political astuteness of Jinnah that delivered them the land of the pure, otheres were just nothing, zilch, the day only stand for the liberation from the hindu `dominance`, success of TNT. Just think about it YLH and the Bilals and the Ferozks.

Bilal #165

Well said!

Karakoram #162:

``On a side note, I think the majority consensus in Pakistan (wisely or not) was that Pakistan should conduct its tests immediately. Indians for all their democracy were not even aware that their government intended to conduct tests. Would the Indian populace have agreed to Nuclear tests had they known about them?``

Nuclear tests and declaration of India as a nuclear weapons state were part of the BJP`s election manifesto. So, it was not a big surprise that they tested a month after they came into power. Previous non-BJP govts too have been wanting to test since 1989 but US pressure and lack of political will stood in the way. When the tests happened, most Indians welcomed the tests. India may not be a perfect democracy, but the nuclear tests are not a valid point in this regard.

Cheers.

Pankaj, I think I left a note for you probably in Bina`s board by mistake. It is trivial any way.

Bye.

Dear Bilal

I have no intention of saying that Gandhiji was a God. Infact the thing that I like most was his capability to eveolve. He literally read out his thoughts and their development in his autobiography. He regarded life to be an experiment with his ideas. A lot of his ideas are debatable and they can be debated analytically. So what repels me is the way some people try to put him down without a thorough analysis and go on repeating(parrot like) their thoughts(infact not their own but of other people`s) without any ``rethinking``. Anyway this is life and everybody is free to do/say whatever he/she likes. I urge sensible people not to involve in a tit for tat exchange and I will also try to keep away from it.

Sincerely

Mac@149

[Yes, that is the CE for you -- we want mediation, but will accept what the mediator says only if it is favorable to us.]

since when are you taking this ce character seriuosly, mac ?

it`s the kashmiris who are fighting but it`s the ce who wants a favourable solution...

it`s an indigenous freedom struggle but it`s the ce who`s taking pains to differrentiate jehad and terrorism...

it`s the indian forces that is demoralized and defeated but it`s the ce who wants a no-war pact

it`s india that is getting screwed and it`s the ce who is wreathing in pain........

Dear Bilal #165

I can not have said better. The vicious cycle of ``An eye for an eye`` only perpetuates our mutual prejudices by periodically reinforcing them. It does not promote any real understanding of the issue but clutters one`s mind with prejudiced emotions. The author Ferozk has indeed made a good effort in clarifying issue but it is sad to see that his effort is being wasted. I have not seen any sensible post till now(and I am also guilty of that). However I also admit it is futile to discuss with some people who have one point agenda to denigrate a great soul or generalise their observation of some people of nationality ``A`` in their pompous way. May be I should learn to simply overlook/ignore some people.

Sincerely

Re: #165 ahmadb

Professor, you are much too restrained and polite to even be peaking at this particular board.

-RS

I have been visiting this site for quite some time.Some time back there was a discussion that Pakistanis are fed on lies by their Govt. The author probably subcontinental rightly argued that they have the right to know the truth, at least if not truth they should not be lied by the Givt. But some people like Urstruly smelled a conspiracy theory in it and dismissed the argument. A link below is testimony to what subcontinental suspects.

http://www.dawn.com/2000/11/02/letted.htm#7

Exaggerated software export figures

THE Chief Executive, General Pervez Musharraf, while inaugurating the Conference of Experts at COMSATS Institute of Information Technology recently has called the present level of software exports from Pakistan at US$300 million as disgraceful. He has exhorted the need for making a quantum increase of 300% by aiming at US$1 billion export mark.

I was appalled that how the Chief Executive was misled by whoever, that Pakistan`s present level of software exports is anywhere in the vicinity of US$300 million. While I fully endorse the need for increasing software exports and the government has taken positive measures in this direction I would like to place some facts in this regard.

The software export earning figure that I obtained as Chairman, Export Promotion Bureau, from the State Bank of pakistan were US$4.5 million and US$5.00 million in the years 1997-98 and 1998-99 respectively. If we are at the level of US$300 million this should be a cause for celebration. I cannot comprehend that how the Chief Executive of the country could be given such highly exaggerated and astronomical figures.

These software export figures do not appear on the monthly data as released by the Department of Statistics because there is no physical movement of goods involved for which the shipping bills are to be filed. I would therefore suggest that the State Bank, which keeps the record of such receipts and all other payments received in lieu of services, consultancy and commission be released every month. Also most of the earnings of the software exports are not reported to the State Bank and payment received is either shown in some other head or through overseas offices.

The government must look at this aspect and provide incentives so that the software export proceeds are brought to the country. The government has also from this year exempted from income tax completely the income from software exports and the exporters should reciprocate this incentive. This will also help their entitlement for obtaining concessionary export finance at 8%.

Another astounding distortion of figures was recently witnessed when the press repeatedly reported Pakistan`s mangoes exports at US$698 million, whereas the figure is around US$6.98 million. I am surprised that no clarification or rectification of these figures was issued. Even in this US$6.98 million exports of mangoes, at least 2/3rd of the earnings go to the airlines which are to be paid in foreign exchange, so the net earnings would be around US$2.5 million FOB.

I hope someone will come forward and give the correct data.

WAJID JAWAD

Former Federal Minister and Chairman EPB,

Karachi

Pankaj,

I seriously quote the other source right now, but you are bound to stumble upon this quote.

The purpose of the quote is not to show you Gandhi was a bad person but that the differences were so extreme. Ofcourse I am also aware that the very next year Gandhi participated in the Pan Islamic Movement for Khilafat. So no one is accusing you of being a bigot.

Tell you what, I have one regression analysis to do tommorow but as soon as I get the time I ll bring you a credible source.

Yasser Hamdani

Nothing to do with Kashmir, but the winds of change are certainly blowing :

http://www.rediff.com/news/2000/nov/01mik.htm

-arun gupta

Chowk champion @157:

[My Hindu friend Prem went to Pakistan and he didnot find anything particularly fundamentalist or fanatic about Pakistan.]

huh ?.. next time prem comes to pakistan, give him a large placard that reads ``stop the jehad in Kashmir`` and take him to the streets. i`m sure he`d find pakistan breathtaking. literally.

no wonder RSaxena is so mesmerized by your intellectual depth ;-)

In reply to Karakoram :

You may want to look at http://www.stimson.org/cbm/sa/indus.htm for the role of a mediator.

It was very much on the BJP`s agenda to do nuclear tests. All previous governments were ready to test if the time was opportune. The Indian public may not have known exactly when the tests would occur, but they supported it nonetheless. I don`t recall Sharif undertaking a referendum on testing, by the way.

As to why the BJP did this -- the situation of nuclear ambiguity was hurting India more than helping. There was really no pressure on China to stop arming itself or to stop proliferating. Only after the Indian tests did Chinese proliferation become a political issue in the US -- they are the only folks with possible leverage in the matter.

And Pakistan had nuclear deterrence anyway, with none of the penalties of having tested.

There were various treaty deadlines coming up as well.

That is why India tested.

-arun gupta

Ylh @141:

[English is not the big thing with Indians ... but there is no such thing as a theologist.. the word I believe is different ... theologian.... !]

don`t worry about the english. its just the fallout of reading too much of krashid`s garbage of late.