The Garage School

ylh #: 35

PAF is not able to even pirate a training manual properly. They even copied the spelling mistakes. They can`t even create their own text. I will be proud of that!!

``Pakistanis - Sikh`s - Hindu`s - Muslim`s - Indians - all happen to be human at the end of the day.``

That is why none of us should be Pakistanis, Sikhs, Hindus, Muslims, Indians. That is why all of us should be human beings first and NOT Hindus, NOT Sikhs, NOT Muslims, NOT Indians, NOT Pakistanis. We should all be human beings first. NOT ``pure`` human beings, not ``dirty`` human beings - but JUST human beings - with all our complexities - MINUS all our old religions but PLUS our active minds replacing the old and outdated with the new ideas , morals and values.

``Donot always attribute human nature to culture, society, sect and religion.``

Is it human nature to kill ? No. It is religion, sectarianism, social pressure, communal anger, collectivism in particular that gives birth to violence and evil.

Is it human nature to force people into converting to Islam ? Is it human nature to rape women and treat them as ``anfal`` (war booty) ? Is it human nature to genitally mutilate girls and children ? Is it human nature to discriminate ?

Evil is often engendered - pain is created by inserting and injecting evil it into the minds of people through brainwashing (as is done in Islam). Do read papers by Dick Stuphen on brainwashing and by a Muslim Doctor (Dr. Abdullah) on Cultic practices incorporated into Islamic rituals (titled cults and thought control).

Some of the characteristics are :

Mind-numbing techniques (such as meditation (prayers), chanting (tasbeeh), speaking in tongues (arabic), denunciation sessions (anti -west propaganda , anti hypocrite , anti non muslim), debilitating work routines (fasting, 5 time prayers etc.) are used to suppress doubts about the group and its leader(s).

The leadership or idealogy dictates sometimes in great detail how members should think, act, and feel (for example: members must get permission from leaders on who to date, which jobs to do, who to get married to; leaders may prescribe what types of clothes to wear, where to live, how to discipline children, and so forth. (All these are prescribed in the Quran and Sunnah and the rest are defined by the Faqih and Muftis who come out with their Behshiti Zevars every other week - also known as catechisms).

The group is elitist, claiming a special, exalted status for itself (the chosen people- Muslims will go to heaven) its leader(s), and members (for example: the leader is considered to be of extra importance (the seal of prophethood); the group and/or the leader has a special mission to save humanity.

The group has a polarized us- versus-them mentality, which causes conflict with the wider society. (this one can be referenced from the Quran and the behavior of Muslims).

The group`s leader is not accountable to any authorities (except their God) e.g. Prophet allowed to break the 4 wives rule, Prophet allowed to marry the wife of his adopted son etc.

The group teaches or implies that its supposedly exalted ends justify means that members would have considered unethical before joining the group (for example: terrorism, bombing, killing your own relatives just like the Sahaba killed their own uncles etc.)

The leadership induces guilt feelings in members in order to control them. (oh you are such a bad Muslim you don`t even pray 5 times a day!)

Members are encouraged or required to live and/or socialize only with other group members (again the Quran orders this).

Those who do not follow the injunctions of the cult of Islam are found to be milder, more cheerful, more friendly and more successful human beings. Their innate goodness remains uncorrupted by religion.

Ah.. we had just gotten over the Punjabi-Sindhi issue in ``When Pinky Broke My Heart`` paaaleeease.. get over history.. We cannot change the past, if somebody has made an effort to better one`s future, donot make it a convoluted affair. Donot spoil the spirit by digging up sad instances of history.

We all understand and accept the hard facts of life and the reality of it all. Pakistanis - Sikh`s - Hindu`s - Muslim`s - Indians - all happen to be human at the end of the day. Donot always attribute human nature to culture, society, sect and religion. Good and Evil are present in all forms and will continue to do so.

Stop it!!

Samuel-

Friend

Ok but what are you trying to prove...

Are you trying to deny that Pakistan Air Force

1) Had the fastest conversion rate on the F 16?

2) The figures which show the kill ratio of the PAF to be much higher than that of India... according to Indian statistics?

3) Yeager`s admiration for PAF? His analysis that the skill level puts PAF at no 1 slot in the world

4) The first kill by an F 16 was by PAF?

Please tell me what exactly you are trying to prove....

Just because IAF is a sure shot suicide... with 19 air plane lost 2000 alone ... ?

``Please dont let this board become a Sikh-Muslim beat-em-up. `` - Harpreet

Why don`t you share with us the ``friendly`` relations between sikhs and muslims / pakis in Britain ?

When the ``Pakis`` are not making fun of their ``piyaz`` (onions) and ``tamatar`` (tomato) and all the ``bara bajay`` (12 o clock) jokes they are telling their children about how bad the Sikhs are. After all it was the Sikhs who were at the forefront of any militant opposition to Muslims / Pakistanis.

Anyone who is even slightly honest with themselves will recognize the atrocities committed against the Sikh. They are cordial with sikhs now because they think they can use the Sikhs to weaken India.

As far as treatment of Sikhs is concerned. Sikh guru Tegh Bahadur on refusing to accept Islam, was brought to the prison in a cage. Three of his disciples were murdered in front of him. One of them was Bhai Mati Das. He was sawed (amputated) alive. The other was wrapped up in cotton and burnt alive. Bhai Dyala, the third one, was boiled alive. Guru Tegh Bahadur himself was brutally tortured and killed in a similar fashion. We see further support of these types of torments in the verses below.

Quran 5:33 The only reward of those who make war upon Allah and His messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be that they will be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet on alternate sides cut off.

XLIV/43-50: LO! the tree of Zaqqum (The tree that grows in the heart of hell bearing fruits like devil`s heads) - the food of the sinner. Like molten brass, it seetheth in their bellies as the seething of boiling water. (And it will be said): Take him and drag him to the midst of hell, then pour upon his head the torment of boiling water. Saying: TASTE! LO! thou wast forsooth the mighty, the noble! Lo! this is that whereof ye used to doubt.

IX/123: O ye who believe! Fight those of the disbelievers who are near to you and let them find harshness in you and know that Allah is with those who keep their duty (unto Him).

IX/29: Fight those who do not profess the true faith (according to them : Islam) till they pay the jiziya (religious tax) with the hand of humility.

IV/144: O Ye who believe! choose not disbelievers for your friends in place of believers. Would you give Allah a clear warrant against you ?

A practising Muslim can never be a friend of a person of another faith. People who believe otherwise are non practising or ignorant of Islamic teachings (90% of Muslims find Islam too impractical to practice).

--

FORCIBLE CONVERSIONS (LYALLPUR)

The Hindus and Sikhs resident of Chak No. 23 W. B. requested Mohd. Hanif Shah, Superintendent, to arrange protection of their lives and property, and the Superintendent gave full assurance that he would do his best. On 27-8-47 in the morning again it was repeated by him, they were given full assurance of their safety. But in the afternoon on that day, it has been alleged that under the instructions of the Superintendent, the Muslims of neighbouring chaks collected and the Muslims of Chak 23 W. B. were ordered to stand around the chak. They gave the Hindus the threat either that they should embrace Islam or they would be killed along with their families.

They said the womenfolk would be ill treated, their breasts, ears and noses would be cut off. On this they approached the Superintendent and reminded him of his promise. His advice was to embrace Islam and thus secure safety. So there was forcible shaving of the head hair and beards of the Sikhs from 7 to 10 p.m. and they all had to embrace Islam.

Note: (In some other cases, circumcision was also insisted on and performed in public).

--

FROM THE CIVIL AND MILITARY GAZETTE (OCTOBER 1947)

A senior Sikh Military officer was virtually ejected from a leading Hotel in Lahore on Wednesday night because Muslims present there insisted that a Sikh should not be allowed entry to a Public place in Pakistan, says a Press Note from the Office of the Deputy High Commissioner for India in Pakistan. This, the note continues, is an interesting sequel to the communal harmony propaganda of Mr. Ghaznafar Ali Khan, Food Minister of the Pakistan Government.

The Sikh Officer, accompanied by another Indian Army Officer, and two ladies went to this Hotel for dinner. He had been there hardly for ten minutes when the manager of the hotel approached him and said, “I admire your courage, but I am very sorry that the Muslims around here object to your presence”.

“The Manager, who was a European, was very apologetic about the attitude of the people, but he said it was advisable for the Officer to leave the hotel in order to avoid any unpleasant incident.

“The Sikh officer, much against his will, agreed to leave. Meanwhile, the other officer with him went around and talked to the people who had objected to the presence of the Sikh officer in the hotel, but their attitude was extremely unreasonable. They threatened to shoot the Sikh officer if he did not remove himself immediately.”

In connection with the above incident the author of “Inside Pakistan” has this to say:

“I personally verified the truth of the above report from the Manager of the Falettis Hotel, where the incident took place. The Press report might well have added that the Sikh officer concerned was a Colonel and had that day arrived in Lahore after guarding a convoy of Muslim Refugees from East Punjab and saving their lives several times on the road.

The incident created a bad impression in Delhi where Muslims were and have always been welcome to the Maidens and Imperial Hotels and the Associated Hotels in Simla and elsewhere. From personal knowledge the author can say that but for the courtesy of the management of the Associated Hotels in Simla during last summer, several Muslim families and particularly ladies whose men-folk were in Pakistan, would have been murdered.

The Sikh staff did everything possible to protect Muslim residents in the Hotels.”

--

CIVIL AND MILITARY GAZETTE REPORT

“A batch of 291 Hindus and Sikhs abducted persons including a number of children arrived at the Ganga Ram Hospital Transit Camp in Lahore on Sunday, February 29, from Campbellpur and Kunjah refugee camps. Seventy-six of these persons came from Campbellpur and the rest from Kunjah.

“These rescued women and children appeared to have been better fed and looked after than the previous group of 694 persons. They were clad in comparatively cleaner clothes and did not present an unrelieved picture of misery and starvation as the previous batch strikingly did.

“One of the women told a pressman that they had been supplied with improved diet in the Camp at Kunjah during last week.

“The Pakistan Government commissioned a regular force of Maulvis to work their magic on the “Younger and more acceptable” type of abducted women. The aged and infirm remained “unblessed.” No arguments and persuasions are spent on the latter to make Pakistan their home.”

--

There are entire libraries of accounts of atrocities committed against Sikhs in Pakistan. Muslims have been ``friendly`` with Sikhs by rioting against them in places ranging from Bradford England to Pakistan and Kashmir.

YLH,

It seems that even US Air Force is copying from PIADS web site.

http://hqin.inhuf.ang.af.mil/f16/tactics/AFT.htm

What surprises me is how US site created 4 years ago could copy from PIADS site released in 2000!

Czech site is 2 years old!!

Shandana #28,

Slink, jinda rao

harpreet

Please dont let this board become a Sikh-Muslim beat-em-up.

For some reason this story has really moved me. In Britain we take so much for granted, even our education. In India/Pakistan there are people who can make a difference and they do. These people are truly blessed. I think in the future I would like to become involved in educational issues of the sub-continent, in a practical way.

Imagine if a pupil at the garage school became leader of Pakistan.

I think that it is a great, empowering message here, that one person can make a difference, that things can be done. You are literally opening these childrens eyes, showing them the whole world. Can there be any greater, any more sacred task than that?

Shandana, maybe they could set up a pen-pal scheme with a similar school in India?

regards,

Harpreet

Friend

Quite clearly your sarcasm is misplaced. The fact that an amatuer site stole a few things from the PIADS site has no consequence what so ever,... I still didnt quite understand what you were getting at?

Pakistan Air Force had the fastest conversion rate on the Falcon or the Viper ... and yes Pakistan was the first Air force to use the F 16 in combat, the first one to score a kill with the F 16 ... soviet 1987 ....

So if you are trying to infer something please get your facts straight.

Yasser Latif Hamdani

PS I thought Yeager`s recommendation would be worthy enough.

One of the seldom reported many uplifting stories of our great awaam.



Ehsaan Daanish,one of the doyen(Asathza) poets of Pakistan was self schooled.He was a brick layer and manual labourer right from his childhood.He could never find time or money to go to school.But,he was determined to impart education to the neighbourhood children.

So in later years he opened Danishkada,a free one-room class/school where he himself was the teacher and there was no money or material involved.A storefront was made available to him and the local mohalla vallas were his moral spine and zakaat & food donors.

His was a tremendous impact on many.

The ``progressives`` sneered at him.

__________________________________________________

dear Kant Patel,

i don`t have a sulekha addy, i do have a chowk addy though, shandana@chowk.com, do forward your earlier mail to me, if possible, and i shall fire off a reply at the speed of light, or rather the speed of someone who has just woken up and burnt her tongue on a hot cup of tea. braack!

anyone interested in contacting the garage school can do so at garageschool@hotmail.com

someone wrote how nice it was that a widow who lost her husband in the 71 war bears no ill will towards those of a different religion. i think this is probably because, having experienced the death of a loved one, she understands how pointless such superficial divisions are. we are all equally vulnerable are we not, regardless of what badge we wear or the cholestrol content of the heart pinned on the sleeve? death can come anytime, to anyone, of any religion, for any reason or no reason at all. no barrier we create will hold it off, no emotional fences we erect will drive it away, so why indulge in pointless hostility that only increases the likelihood of meeting it in a dark alley and emerging in a bodybag? why must people sacrifice themselves for vengance? why cant they work for the living? why can`t they devote their lives to the pursuit of truth in non-violent ways? why cant they aim for truth and beauty rather than power and discord? and why do some of us swallow their rhetoric so easily?

ylh#17

I am also proud of PAF. Look what great training manual they printed at http://www.pakdefencenews.org/piads/bftm1.html

I was very disappinted to read that now Czech are copying material from your PAF site.

http://www.voodoo.cz/falcon/AFT.html

regards

Ref #22 and #25,

It is amusing to note that Pakistani Muslims feel so pally with sikhs these days. Not long ago (and even now) they were crying about badshahi mosque being covered with cow dung. People who suffered most during partition were sikhs. People who organized themselves against Muslim atrocities during mugal rule were Sikhs.

Good that there is someone in India with whom our neighbours can identify with.

regards

PS: BTW, part of my family is sikh.

re solitude #22:

OK this guy has issues to deal with. I just want to warn the unsuspecting reader out there to take everything he says with a grain of salt. Take his latest gem for instance. If he had any interaction with a reasonable number of Sikhs, he`d know that Pakistanis and Sikhs get along fabulously. I`ve yet to come across a single instance where there was bad blood between the two of them. This, on the other hand is not unusual amongst Indians and Pakistanis of other backgrounds.

The `new` economy with its abundance of $200/hour jobs in NYC has produced a bunch of impotent losers who think getting sloshed at Life or Tunnel over the weekend and getting laid with anything that moves in a tight skirt occasionally makes them super-jocks. Sadly their day of reckoning is getting closer and closer.

See ya in a years time buddy!!

later

-sac

re. Adnan_672 (#15)

``So while we should be tolerant we should not DENY that ISLAM is the only true religion and that all other religions are in our view false and misleading``

Adnan, you seem to be as ignorant of Islam as you are of the other religions.