Is Jehad Passe’?

CHILDREN OF TNT,

The education system since 1970 has delivered these children with a jihadic world view that even US education seem to have no impact. Jay sorry, jai to YLH, sarwari etc.

`But this fundemantalism is now deeply

embedded in the socio-political psyche of sizeable numbers across ethnic,

sectarian and linguistic divides. And the peculiar world-view spawned by

this religious orthodoxy is not only worrying but seems too rigid to lend

itself to sudden policy shifts.`

EASTERN ALLIANCE,

there was a news item from an italian agency stating that osama has moved to pok since dec 12. This is a deliberate ploy by the indians. They expect a eastern alliance to take over pok while the US bombs the suspected osama hide outs.

Nobody should believe this report.

Dear ppl.....

I am very sad. In karachi in soljer bazar the bhai of home chief Moinuddin hyder was slaughtered by indian agent RAW member cruelway type.. I got from ex Fauji sources its india operation-murder. its sad india attacks like this. now raw will not say it but its open secret.

We need to give extra protecsion for our famous connected ppl. I think this hibdu or raw agents in sindh-karachi have raw connection.It is said there are 800 agents and need to be caught. ok.This sad in karachi it can happen. he was not politic man. Is it to Punish Haider?

ana: ``not just the military``

What kind of problems is the women`s movement facing from the military? Could you highlight.

My own experience has been that the military bases, and the women there, were far more protected, liberated, open, educated and, ``free`` than most women I encountered as a civilian. Women used to be able to walk around in military bases, in the middle of the night, without any fear, etc. And they are generally considered the most respected people in a military establishment. This is military tradition.

Dear Aqil Sahab,

A very balanced essay on the current situation Pakistan finds itself in. But one must also remember that the jehad option is like a drug that the Pakistani army has been taking for some two decades now. When it first became a possibility, it seemes like the panacea for all of Pakistan`s problems. It was the perfect way to pay back India, keep its army tied down, provide an escape hatch for the disillusioned and poor at home, generate nationalistic fervour, and best of all, didn`t even cost much!! But like all drugs, it has now become an addiction, a weakness which is destroying Pakistan from within. Unfortunately it is not going to be easy for your nation to purge it out of its system. There are no easy choices left.

-narain

Interesting article.

The crisis confronting Pakistan started, when jehadi groups were allowed to dictate national policy. The crisis was bound to happen and could not be delayed forever.

Whatever happens in the future, the time has come to settle the issue of whether Pakistan is a progressive state or a theocratic state.

There is no going back now...all the bridges are burning...

Ciao

India finally does the needful in breaking diplomatic ties with Pukistan...they are pointless given the continued state of hostility...all Indian consulates should also be closed and flights, if there are any, should be cancelled, in addition to the already cancelled rail and road links...the only cross-border transport should be military transport planes carrying Kashmiris hell bent on becoming Pakistanis...surely Pakistan will receive them with open arms, won`t it?...Israel is already providing India the high-tech means to monitor incursions of Pakistani terrorists into India from Pakistan-Occupied Kashmir...shoot the mofos on sight...complete isolation...

Ferozk:

I think that Musharraf`s game on `freedom struggle` is up. It seems that nobody in Washington is believing it either. Musharraf could have earned worldwide platitudes by moving on his own initiative rather than on proddings from outside, but he chose to seek confrontation rather than reconciliation. History will exact a price. Washington now joins Kabul and Delhi in refusing to believe Musharraf:

``...U.S. President George Bush urged Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf on Friday to crack down on the two groups and promised U.S. help in the effort...The president calls on him to take action against the Lashkar-e-Taiba, the Jaish-e-Mohammed and other terrorist organizations, their leaders and their finances,`` White House spokesman Ari Fleischer said.`` http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/world/international-india-pakistan-demand.html

``...But now, Mr. Bush appears to have sided with India, and has told Pakistan that any further backing for armed Islamic militant groups operating in Kashmir will be tantamount to supporting terrorism. In effect, General Musharraf appears to have been told that Pakistan, after more than 50 years of battling India over Kashmir, must now abandon the armed struggle there, and rely henceforth on political means of confronting India. The question now is whether the general will comply, and whether he can carry Pakistan`s masses with him if he does...``

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/12/21/international/21MUSH.html

``...Because General Musharraf has made the Kashmir cause his own, American pressure on him to crack down on a Muslim extremist group directly involved in the conflict with India is likely to challenge further the political balancing act he has performed since siding with the United States soon after Sept. 11. But Mr. Bush, his aides say, saw no alternative. ``We would be hypocritical if we didn`t do it,`` a senior aide said...``

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/12/21/international/21PREX.html

A.Shah are you indian prohindu, sexpervert,liberal hindu? Jinnah Sahib has asked pakistan for liberation of kashmir. We can not abondan- leave kashmiri muslims as we made oath to jinnah sahib not to rest till the problem is solved ok. if general ( or any general over years who will be presidents) tries to stop kashmir liberation movement ppl will start rioting.The stakes are big. without K. pakistan will not be complete. For k. we made lot expences in blood and mony, E.Pak. was scrafise for K. do not forget it. Without K. Pakistan is nothing. like lead without pretty eyes. it is bindig thing. Sindhis,punjabis.... may not agree on nothig the agree only onone thing. you know it. what army,has done so you critic fauj. it defends against indian tank thrust in pak. provided you are not like expak who live to states for pure simple mony.We pakis has friends like rsaxna, jay , harimau and fascists chhap, but now we need no trators like you. if you say good about fauj then shut up. too much talking spoiled expaks. i get mad. You people are lucky,good food, fast cars,big house and you wish break unity of ofpakis. Shame on this type HINDUCHHAP expaks

Dear Aqil Shah:

Your column certainly reflects royally -- your name.

The wonder is that in spite of such excellent diagnosticians in Pakistan -- why Pakistan is in such a mess.

You are right -- Pakistan since its inception has grown addicted to the amphetamines of India bashing -- and hindu hating -- it`s an addiction that is so difficult -- but not impossible to get rid of.

You are right in suggesting that instead of the 52 years of this knee jerk failed policy of India baiting -- why not try for a change -- the opposite – friendship with India -- where almost half of Pakistani relatives live -- and see what happens -- a “gamble” worth taking.

I think it s tall order but still doable.

Pakistan has been so generous with the strangers Chinese -- in bestowing upon them part of Kashmir as a free gift -- why it should be difficult to part with a portion of Kashmir to its own relatives in India?

Thanks for a very insightful introspective self analytical column on Indo/Pak relationship – you’re definitely not indulging in blame game.

Regards

hasan

A.Shah... i am against terror. Can tell hindus to do same. I was depressed to see. On PTV christian poor people leaders said INDIA KILLED CHRISTIANS IN BAh. pur killings. Jay.Rsaxsena, harimau, do you think all christians are liers?

I want answer what you get by killing christians?

ahmed madani # 22

“A.Shah... i am against terror. Can tell hindus to do same. I was depressed to see. On PTV christian poor people leaders said INDIA KILLED CHRISTIANS IN BAh. pur killings. Jay.Rsaxsena, harimau, do you think all christians are liers? I want answer what you get by killing christians?”

Read angrezi chhap paper (The Friday times) for the answer you are looking for. Let us know what you think about your PTV or jihadis after reading this.

Take care.

* * *

What will happen to Pakistan after Osama? Khaled Ahmed`s A n a l y s i s (Dec 21-27)

... The massacre of innocent Christians in Bahawalpur was the last hurrah, for the time being, of the jehadis. When it happened, the PTV went through the shameful exercise of bringing Christian leaders on the screen and making them say that the Indians had done it. Later of course the jehadi thugs who had actually sent the message of you-kill-innocent-Muslims-we-kill-innocent-Christians to George Bush were caught. No one in the PTV apologised for humiliating the defenceless Christians by making them say that the Indians had done it. ...

http://thefridaytimes.com/

In a recent exchange of interacts, sac and I took the position that most international and many internal problems of Pakistan with ideology and Islamic tilt have nothing to do with feudalism, feudals or majority of poor and illiterate people living in villages. Cities have become hotbed of high entropy and low rationality mindset hurting Pakistan and Pakistanis at large. We discussed how cities like Lahore and Karachi support large madrassah and madrassah based mindset. That is why parties like JI have won Mayorship of Karachi and quite popular in certain areas of Lahore. I believe this mindset is the product of our education curriculum and government inspired media to present a closet view of the historical realities. Here is a survey of public opinion from BBC World Service based on interviews in cities like Karachi, Lahore, Islamabad and adjacent Rawalpindi.

[There is strong continuing support for the Taleban among ordinary people in Pakistan, according to a BBC World Service opinion poll.

Who should govern Afghanistan?

The Taleban: 43%

Interim govt: 32%

Taleban/Northern Alliance:7%

Northern Alliance: 3%

Face-to-face interviews were carried out with 500 men and 500 women.

The poll indicates that there is little difference between men and women in their support for the Taleban.

Forty-six per cent of the men and 40% of the women questioned supported the Taleban.

The poll was carried out over the period of a month beginning on 12 November.

Most of the interviews were conducted before the fall of the last Taleban stronghold - Kandahar - on 7 December.

The poll was undertaken by research company A C Neilson in the Pakistani cities of Karachi, Lahore, Rawalpindi and Islamabad.

Strongest support

The strongest support for the Taleban was in Rawalpindi and Islamabad in Punjab province.

Fifty-four per cent of those questioned in the two cities were in favour of the Taleban governing Afghanistan.

The survey also revealed a fair degree of hostility towards the US.

Forty-three per cent of those interviewed described the United States as an arrogant superpower, while 40% said it was not a reliable friend to Pakistan.

Questioned about the policies of the Pakistani President, Pervez Musharraf, 57% said he should support the US war on terrorism, but should have opposed the bombing of Afghanistan.

Twenty-six per cent were opposed to the US action while 9% supported it unconditionally.

Pakistan witnessed a number of pro-Taleban demonstrations after the bombing of Afghanistan started in October - some of which turned violent.

However, as the US campaign continued, the protests became fewer.

The Pakistani Government expressed its full backing for the American campaign against al-Qaeda and the Taleban - despite having forged strong links with the Taleban leadership.]

Mr.Pardesi...... Thank you sir,thak you. Pres4ently i am busyness peak time ok, it christmas time ok. We are big hotel on Dr.Ziauddin road,Karachi we have foren christen guests , no time ok.I thinking is you have no that type hotel in india, ac hot water 24 hours ok.Even hindu guests said this classy hotel. all types of foods ok. ay way.

i read frday time also. Its sethi is open india agent, feeding on india connection.he was arrested for talk in india against pak ok. he was let go as he is from very very importence family and same with his wife ok, they are top punjabi khandan rich foren returned ppl. They is lot of hanky panky sex thigs going people working there ok its not point here. there is attitudae is different o muslim more hindu type liberal.you did not answer why christen killedby india? that is questio point i ask harimou, jay type fanatic hindu fascist , sex liberal antimuslim , antipakistani people ok. good bye busy now. good chrtstmas to indian christia hope bal thakray or bjp do not kill christen for fun. good luck christmes.

ADDRESS BY MUSHERAFF,

`` the great people of pakistan, the decendents of the moghuls and the gaznavis. Pakistan is an islamic secular republic according to the book, and I am reminded of the speach of jinnah, ` you are free to live any religion you choose`, that was his one speach all of the ducated have reapeated fpr so long even though it makes a mockery of the division of india and the great theory of TNT that jinnah exposed. But the great people of pakistan have repeated that so much it is as though I got tinniates, the ringing in the ear decease. For the first time for a pakistani leader, I am goint to exyend a merry christmas and happy new year to the christians of pakistan. I hate to see the indians talking of eid, especially the BJP vajpaye.

I know very well that I could be violating the blasphemy laws by doing this, what the hell, I am a self made ruler, I make the laws. I say hello to the christians. I am a kemalist anarchist.

Pakistan paindabad.

YLH for presidency.

Imran khan for more wives.

BOOO! Islamic parties! Booo! patriotic armed forces of Pakistan. Booo!

Be Afraid, very, very afraid.

Vajpayee, Advani, Sonia and Qanooni - rainbows appear when this constellation is conjured.

Indians are our friends, like the Northern Alliance, another ``liberal`` bunch. But we must listen to these voices; we picked a team that would delivery stability by imprisoning it`s nation in non-reason. We picked wrong (we, does not include the courages Pakistani ``Liberals``)

Pakistani liberals in the drivers seat, everything would be right as rain,(``for things to stay the same, things will have to change``) The religious parties rejection of ``modernity`` has brought ruin to itself - perhaps adaptation may be the next strategy - the armed forces that restored order, brought about international credibility, made painful decision that the ``politicians`` (feudals, sorry ``Liberal`` feudals) would not make - discredited, captive kashmiris will have to wait to taste freedom.

These are imperatives for the Pakistani state, Jihad and freedom do not go together, today. I`ll make you a prediction, keep in mind that there are no poor ``liberals`` in Pakistan (they have the courage to refer to themselves as marxist and socialists) - the Pakistani ``Liberals``, will soon make commmon cause with the same ``upstart`` religious parties - very soon! there`s money in it and these ``Liberals`` have better olfactory senses when it comes to money than sharks do with blood.

See the only actors on this stage who bear responsibility are the religious parties and the patriotic armed forces - Indians also reek of good intentions, much like the Russians and perrenial ``good`` guys, the anglo-sax techno-war race, whose left over the leeches, sorry ``liberals`` will feed on.

All these Pakistan will endure, yet our national nightmare will only end when we can see ``liberal`` Pakistanis for what they are: gutless wonders, still wondering why the 7 sins should even apply to them - sins? who dares accuse them? who dares judge them? Judgement has already been passed on them - it is the sentence that is held in abeyance - pending one last chance to play by the rules of obligation to the nation.