Enough is Enough
Shankar December 30, 2001
#6 Posted by shammi on January 1, 2001 12:50:32 pm
Re: Shankar
``...Youre goddamned right I ABJURE it!...``
Good. Now, do you concede that there is low intensity warfare being waged by Pakistan against India (a la against Afghanistan -- actually Pakistan `took over` Afghanistan through proxies)?
``...Youre goddamned right I ABJURE it!...``
Good. Now, do you concede that there is low intensity warfare being waged by Pakistan against India (a la against Afghanistan -- actually Pakistan `took over` Afghanistan through proxies)?
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#5 Posted by Deodrant on January 1, 2001 12:50:32 pm
India pullout troops from the borders
Nuclear Threat make Hindians Buckle ....he.he..he..he
India welcomes Pak action against terrorist
leaders
NDTV Correspondent
Monday, December 31, 2001 (New Delhi):
India has termed reports from Pakistan on arrests of leaders of terrorist outfits as a ``step forward in the correct direction``. India has blamed the Pakistan-based terrorist outfits, Jaish-e-Mohammad (JeM) and Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT), for carrying out the December 13 suicide attack on Parliament.
``If this information is confirmed, then it is a step forward in correct direction,`` External Affairs Minister Jaswant Singh told reporters after a one and-a-half hour long meeting of the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) chaired by Prime Minister Atal Behari Vajpayee.
He was replying to a question whether New Delhi was satisfied with actions being taken by the Pervez Musharraf regime against JeM chief Maulana Masood Azhar and LeT founder Hafiz Mohammed Saeed.
Singh said India had received information about ``some action`` having been taken by Pakistani authorities against LeT and JeM including arrest of leaders and raids being conducted on some premises of these organisations.
``We hope that such actions against terrorist groups targeting India including Jammu and Kashmir would be pursued vigorously and cross-border terrorism eliminated``, Singh added.
On the Pakistani demand that India should furnish evidence against these terrorist groups, Singh said ``It is strange to talk about this`` when the country was a victim of terrorist aggression.
``So far as the evidence of terrorist activities is concerned, it has been provided in a sufficient manner to international community``, he said adding it was largely on that basis that Islamabad had taken action against the terrorist outfits.
Singh said India would be handing over a list to Pakistan High Commission here of terrorists and criminals, who had taken refuge in that country. He, however, did not give out any further details including the number of terrorists and criminals named in the list.
He said India has been informing the Interpol about the activities of these terrorist outfits leading to ``red alert`` being issued against them by the Paris-based organisation.
On whether the government was satisfied with the US efforts to contain Pakistan sponsored cross-border terrorism, the External Affairs Minister said Washington had made a clear commitment to stamp out terrorism globally.
The Cabinet Committee on Security discussed essential issues concerning India`s security in view of the December 13 attack and also the international and regional developments after the incident.
Diplomatic means
Defence Minister George Fernandes today said while India was trying to make Pakistan accede to its demands over terrorism through diplomatic means, New Delhi would take whatever steps which become essential if these attempts failed.
``So far we have concentrated on the diplomatic offensive and this will continue till one concludes there is an end of the road in terms of diplomacy,`` he said.
Addressing troops of the Army and Air Force at several forward locations in the Western Sector, Fernandes said the diplomatic efforts were ``perhaps likely`` to bring results ``but in an unlikely event of this not happening, then one will have to take decisions and these decisions will be very demanding``.
He also took a broadside at the US, saying its objective in the war against terrorism was limited to catching or killing Osama bin Laden and had done nothing ``more than rhetoric`` in ``making Pakistan understand``.
Asserting that no decision had been taken so far on whether India should go to war to achieve a win against terrorism, Fernandes said ``efforts are on to resolve the situation through diplomatic efforts`` and Prime Minister Vajpayee and External Affairs Minister Jaswant Singh were engaged in it at the moment.
Stressing that Pakistan still did not appear to be honest in its actions against terrorists, Fernandes said it ``should understand and accept how big a sin it has committed``.
``We don`t want any such situation where there could be a lot of loss in this region,`` he said, adding Pakistan has thrust the proxy war on India over the last decade and the world should see and make Islamabad desist from it. ``If it is not done, we will do whatever is needed,`` he asserted.
Lauding the G-8 statement asking Pakistan to meet the demands of India, he said it indicates ``we are on the right track``. He said the European Union, the US and the UK have also told Pakistan to act against terrorists.
Jaitley tells Pak to tackle terrorism on its eastern border
India has said that it has given Pakistan a list of terrorists involved in crimes in India and demanded they be handed over for trial.
``A list of terrorists involved in crimes in India has been given to Pakistan. If these terrorists are handed over, then certainly I think a situation more conducive to both the countries (for talks) can arise,`` Union Law Minister Arun Jaitley told CNN`s ``Late Edition`` programme.
Jaitley made the remarks when asked how close India and Pakistan were to a war. ``We do hope that such a situation does not arise where we have to go to a war. But the entire onus of that will depend on the kind of stand Pakistan takes,`` he said.
Asked if Prime Minister Vajpayee would talk to Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf at the Kathmandu SAARC summit next month, Jaitley said, ``Well, it does not appear that the situation Pakistan is creating is conducive to a dialogue.``
``Pakistan can`t be encouraging this kind of cross-border insurgency. In the attack on Parliament, all the five terrorists killed were Pakistanis. There has been voluminous evidence of involvement of organizations within that country (Pakistan) in this attack and then they say: Let us have a dialogue,`` the Law Minister said.
Referring to Pakistan Foreign Minister Abdul Sattar`s demand for evidence for acting against the terrorists, Jaitley said Maulana Masood Azhar heads an organization, which is responsible for the attack on Parliament and was released from Indian prison through ``the coercive process of hijacking a plane``.
``Does the Pakistan Foreign Minister still need evidence?`` he said. Jaitley said actions by Pakistan against terrorists could not be ``ornamental in terms of making public announcements and after a few days freezing their (terrorist groups) accounts allowing money to flow out``.
Jaitley said while Sattar had agreed to hand over Osama bin Laden, if apprehended in Pakistan, to the US, he cannot have a different standard when it came to terrorists on Pakistan`s eastern border.
Asked what India expected US President Bush to do to reduce Indo-Pak tension, he replied that the international community should have the same yardstick and same standard which was adopted for the Taliban and bin Laden in relation to the September 11 attack on US.
``Whichever part of the world terrorists commit offences should be treated at par and we expect the same standard to be applied.`` Jaitley added that greater pressure should be brought on Pakistan to act against terrorists and their organizations operating on its soil. (With PTI inputs)
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Nuclear Threat make Hindians Buckle ....he.he..he..he
India welcomes Pak action against terrorist
leaders
NDTV Correspondent
Monday, December 31, 2001 (New Delhi):
India has termed reports from Pakistan on arrests of leaders of terrorist outfits as a ``step forward in the correct direction``. India has blamed the Pakistan-based terrorist outfits, Jaish-e-Mohammad (JeM) and Lashkar-e-Toiba (LeT), for carrying out the December 13 suicide attack on Parliament.
``If this information is confirmed, then it is a step forward in correct direction,`` External Affairs Minister Jaswant Singh told reporters after a one and-a-half hour long meeting of the Cabinet Committee on Security (CCS) chaired by Prime Minister Atal Behari Vajpayee.
He was replying to a question whether New Delhi was satisfied with actions being taken by the Pervez Musharraf regime against JeM chief Maulana Masood Azhar and LeT founder Hafiz Mohammed Saeed.
Singh said India had received information about ``some action`` having been taken by Pakistani authorities against LeT and JeM including arrest of leaders and raids being conducted on some premises of these organisations.
``We hope that such actions against terrorist groups targeting India including Jammu and Kashmir would be pursued vigorously and cross-border terrorism eliminated``, Singh added.
On the Pakistani demand that India should furnish evidence against these terrorist groups, Singh said ``It is strange to talk about this`` when the country was a victim of terrorist aggression.
``So far as the evidence of terrorist activities is concerned, it has been provided in a sufficient manner to international community``, he said adding it was largely on that basis that Islamabad had taken action against the terrorist outfits.
Singh said India would be handing over a list to Pakistan High Commission here of terrorists and criminals, who had taken refuge in that country. He, however, did not give out any further details including the number of terrorists and criminals named in the list.
He said India has been informing the Interpol about the activities of these terrorist outfits leading to ``red alert`` being issued against them by the Paris-based organisation.
On whether the government was satisfied with the US efforts to contain Pakistan sponsored cross-border terrorism, the External Affairs Minister said Washington had made a clear commitment to stamp out terrorism globally.
The Cabinet Committee on Security discussed essential issues concerning India`s security in view of the December 13 attack and also the international and regional developments after the incident.
Diplomatic means
Defence Minister George Fernandes today said while India was trying to make Pakistan accede to its demands over terrorism through diplomatic means, New Delhi would take whatever steps which become essential if these attempts failed.
``So far we have concentrated on the diplomatic offensive and this will continue till one concludes there is an end of the road in terms of diplomacy,`` he said.
Addressing troops of the Army and Air Force at several forward locations in the Western Sector, Fernandes said the diplomatic efforts were ``perhaps likely`` to bring results ``but in an unlikely event of this not happening, then one will have to take decisions and these decisions will be very demanding``.
He also took a broadside at the US, saying its objective in the war against terrorism was limited to catching or killing Osama bin Laden and had done nothing ``more than rhetoric`` in ``making Pakistan understand``.
Asserting that no decision had been taken so far on whether India should go to war to achieve a win against terrorism, Fernandes said ``efforts are on to resolve the situation through diplomatic efforts`` and Prime Minister Vajpayee and External Affairs Minister Jaswant Singh were engaged in it at the moment.
Stressing that Pakistan still did not appear to be honest in its actions against terrorists, Fernandes said it ``should understand and accept how big a sin it has committed``.
``We don`t want any such situation where there could be a lot of loss in this region,`` he said, adding Pakistan has thrust the proxy war on India over the last decade and the world should see and make Islamabad desist from it. ``If it is not done, we will do whatever is needed,`` he asserted.
Lauding the G-8 statement asking Pakistan to meet the demands of India, he said it indicates ``we are on the right track``. He said the European Union, the US and the UK have also told Pakistan to act against terrorists.
Jaitley tells Pak to tackle terrorism on its eastern border
India has said that it has given Pakistan a list of terrorists involved in crimes in India and demanded they be handed over for trial.
``A list of terrorists involved in crimes in India has been given to Pakistan. If these terrorists are handed over, then certainly I think a situation more conducive to both the countries (for talks) can arise,`` Union Law Minister Arun Jaitley told CNN`s ``Late Edition`` programme.
Jaitley made the remarks when asked how close India and Pakistan were to a war. ``We do hope that such a situation does not arise where we have to go to a war. But the entire onus of that will depend on the kind of stand Pakistan takes,`` he said.
Asked if Prime Minister Vajpayee would talk to Pakistan President Pervez Musharraf at the Kathmandu SAARC summit next month, Jaitley said, ``Well, it does not appear that the situation Pakistan is creating is conducive to a dialogue.``
``Pakistan can`t be encouraging this kind of cross-border insurgency. In the attack on Parliament, all the five terrorists killed were Pakistanis. There has been voluminous evidence of involvement of organizations within that country (Pakistan) in this attack and then they say: Let us have a dialogue,`` the Law Minister said.
Referring to Pakistan Foreign Minister Abdul Sattar`s demand for evidence for acting against the terrorists, Jaitley said Maulana Masood Azhar heads an organization, which is responsible for the attack on Parliament and was released from Indian prison through ``the coercive process of hijacking a plane``.
``Does the Pakistan Foreign Minister still need evidence?`` he said. Jaitley said actions by Pakistan against terrorists could not be ``ornamental in terms of making public announcements and after a few days freezing their (terrorist groups) accounts allowing money to flow out``.
Jaitley said while Sattar had agreed to hand over Osama bin Laden, if apprehended in Pakistan, to the US, he cannot have a different standard when it came to terrorists on Pakistan`s eastern border.
Asked what India expected US President Bush to do to reduce Indo-Pak tension, he replied that the international community should have the same yardstick and same standard which was adopted for the Taliban and bin Laden in relation to the September 11 attack on US.
``Whichever part of the world terrorists commit offences should be treated at par and we expect the same standard to be applied.`` Jaitley added that greater pressure should be brought on Pakistan to act against terrorists and their organizations operating on its soil. (With PTI inputs)
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#4 Posted by AAmir on January 1, 2001 12:50:32 pm
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#3 Posted by chandan on January 1, 2001 12:50:32 pm
``Peace`` vigil in San Jose:
I attended the ``peace`` vigil held in San Jose. Following were the salient features:
1. I was the only Indian ``present`` there. Everyone else was from Pakistan. Rest of the people present there were pretending as if they were representing American Indian voices too. They could not even bring any of their Indian friends (if they have any). Carrying the Indian flag they wanted to pretend to passing by people that they were mixture of Indians and Pakis.. This thing was really deceptive.
2. There was not a single mention of terrorism in the placards. As if to say that there is a war to start in South Asia out of blue, may be just because Indians and Pakis hate each other. Basically agenda rather than ``peace`` was ``save pakistan``.
3. I had a poster criticizing ``military dictatorships`` and saying ``Indians and Pakis are one``, I was accused of being ``divisive``, ``anti-peace`` and ``with hidden agenda``. So I guess another agenda was ``save mr. musharraf`` and keep floating the theory that muslim-hindu are separate people.
4. One of the organizer tried to read some crappy article from WPost basically whose import was ``hey Indians are basically Hindus and India-Pak difference is between hindus and muslims..``. When will Pakis start looking at the census figures. Sorry to break the news guys. For decades in India more muslims live than in Pakistan and even so more peacefully than any where, with more democratic rights than anywhere. So please stop giving BS that India-Pak dispute is abt Hindu-Muslim.
5. It seems organizers had special affinity to ``two nation theory``. The basic point was even if a nation is attacked and engaged in proxy wars for years, it should still maintain ``peace``. I Wonder organizers ever called for peace when innocent people get butchered by terrorists. Only when there is talk of retaliation from India, it seems they hear their scared relatives in Pakistan and then come out to talk about ``peace``.
6. Also common goal of meeting organizer was to beg Mr Bush to do some thing about South Asia. This shows how much ``peace`` they can achieve from this Bush the ``messiah of peace``.
Ok guys lick the * *lls of Bush or whoever powerful you can find around the world to save your terrorist regime or jehadi brothers.
But let me tell you if you expect India would behave cowardly just to give ``peace`` to terrorists, forget it. I dont care abt holocaust, even if all my near and dear ones might get affected, but we do need to respond to this fascist evil scourge of Jehadism and free our Paki brothers from it too. So yearn for the final war, so that your dear ones back in Desh have future in peace and prosperity.
Well founder of ``Chowk.com`` was also there. I complemented him on having a great website. Hope he does not completely share the views of rest of the organizers.
I attended the ``peace`` vigil held in San Jose. Following were the salient features:
1. I was the only Indian ``present`` there. Everyone else was from Pakistan. Rest of the people present there were pretending as if they were representing American Indian voices too. They could not even bring any of their Indian friends (if they have any). Carrying the Indian flag they wanted to pretend to passing by people that they were mixture of Indians and Pakis.. This thing was really deceptive.
2. There was not a single mention of terrorism in the placards. As if to say that there is a war to start in South Asia out of blue, may be just because Indians and Pakis hate each other. Basically agenda rather than ``peace`` was ``save pakistan``.
3. I had a poster criticizing ``military dictatorships`` and saying ``Indians and Pakis are one``, I was accused of being ``divisive``, ``anti-peace`` and ``with hidden agenda``. So I guess another agenda was ``save mr. musharraf`` and keep floating the theory that muslim-hindu are separate people.
4. One of the organizer tried to read some crappy article from WPost basically whose import was ``hey Indians are basically Hindus and India-Pak difference is between hindus and muslims..``. When will Pakis start looking at the census figures. Sorry to break the news guys. For decades in India more muslims live than in Pakistan and even so more peacefully than any where, with more democratic rights than anywhere. So please stop giving BS that India-Pak dispute is abt Hindu-Muslim.
5. It seems organizers had special affinity to ``two nation theory``. The basic point was even if a nation is attacked and engaged in proxy wars for years, it should still maintain ``peace``. I Wonder organizers ever called for peace when innocent people get butchered by terrorists. Only when there is talk of retaliation from India, it seems they hear their scared relatives in Pakistan and then come out to talk about ``peace``.
6. Also common goal of meeting organizer was to beg Mr Bush to do some thing about South Asia. This shows how much ``peace`` they can achieve from this Bush the ``messiah of peace``.
Ok guys lick the * *lls of Bush or whoever powerful you can find around the world to save your terrorist regime or jehadi brothers.
But let me tell you if you expect India would behave cowardly just to give ``peace`` to terrorists, forget it. I dont care abt holocaust, even if all my near and dear ones might get affected, but we do need to respond to this fascist evil scourge of Jehadism and free our Paki brothers from it too. So yearn for the final war, so that your dear ones back in Desh have future in peace and prosperity.
Well founder of ``Chowk.com`` was also there. I complemented him on having a great website. Hope he does not completely share the views of rest of the organizers.
#2 Posted by pmishra2 on January 1, 2001 12:50:32 pm
romair #23 writes:
[begin quote]
If Pakistan was to threaten India with a military offensive of any kind, I would certainly speak out against it. I did it during Kargil. As would a lot of other Pakistanis. I would not call it a mutual problem. I would blame it specificially on Pakistan. Isn`t it about time, the Indians blamed the current military build up specifically on India?
[end quote]
You must truly be in a dream world. Indians are
murdered by the dozen by terrorists funded by
the ISI and ``tolerated`` by the Pakistani
goverment. The Srinagar Assembly is attacked
by a Pakistani suicide bomber with 38 killed;
the indian parliament is attacked by five
pakistanis with 10 killed. And you consider this military buildup
as some kind of excessive response! Wow, what
should the indians do, wait for their parliament
building to be fully destroyed first?
Let me turn this around: should extremists
from India ever attack any civilian institution
in Pakistan, I would personally lead a delegation
to our embassy demanding their extradition to
Pakistan. Of course, we will never hear the
converse proposition from any of you guys.
Why? Because you see, there are no extremists
in Pakistan, only freedom fighters!
[begin quote]
If Pakistan was to threaten India with a military offensive of any kind, I would certainly speak out against it. I did it during Kargil. As would a lot of other Pakistanis. I would not call it a mutual problem. I would blame it specificially on Pakistan. Isn`t it about time, the Indians blamed the current military build up specifically on India?
[end quote]
You must truly be in a dream world. Indians are
murdered by the dozen by terrorists funded by
the ISI and ``tolerated`` by the Pakistani
goverment. The Srinagar Assembly is attacked
by a Pakistani suicide bomber with 38 killed;
the indian parliament is attacked by five
pakistanis with 10 killed. And you consider this military buildup
as some kind of excessive response! Wow, what
should the indians do, wait for their parliament
building to be fully destroyed first?
Let me turn this around: should extremists
from India ever attack any civilian institution
in Pakistan, I would personally lead a delegation
to our embassy demanding their extradition to
Pakistan. Of course, we will never hear the
converse proposition from any of you guys.
Why? Because you see, there are no extremists
in Pakistan, only freedom fighters!
#1 Posted by SameerJB on January 1, 2001 12:50:32 pm
Good to her that the new Afghan government has decided to erect the Bamiyan Buddha again (or a replica of roignal ones). This is in marked contrast with anti-statue Islamic culture and must be one of the few moments from the history of muslim majority nations to erect a statue of a non-Muslim relgion-founder. Happy New Years, yo all Afghans out there. Now teach Pakistanis how to erect a statue of Ashoka in Gandhara. It is a good start Afghanis. You must decide whether you would like to live in peace with yourself and your surrounding or keep fighting (jehad) against evil, fighting against enemies and fighting against ``Nafs`` including penis erection before marriage and restricted to in-bed only. Yo Afghans, erect Bamiyan Buddha and erect democracy, human rights and consensus based rule - way to go!!!!
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