An Equal Reaction

tvarad # 333

[``Just as I thought. When a mirror is placed in front of you so that you can see the warts on your face, you claim that it is not your face.``]

Oh please, cut this sanctimonious BS. Take your mirror and use it to see your fat banya behind, if you want to look at some real oozing warts.

re: harimau

{{Unlike the Bengali bhadralok of Calcutta who whiled away their time drinking tea and eating rossogolla and puris while attempting to solve the problems of the Vietnam War (remember `amar nam, tomar nam, Viet Nam`?) or the plight of the landless (`amar bari, tomar bari, Naxalbari`) even as Calcutta was drowning in garbage, the Maharashtrians are hardworking people who just went about earning an honest living. Thanks to them, Bombay will not sink to the level of Calcutta.}}

i love bombay, but its infrastructure is rotting at the core...it is becoming filthier each day...what are the maharashtrians doing about it?....actually, what CAN they can do about it?...bombay draws india`s poorest in search of jobs that don`t exist...but they settle into the squalor anyway...and unlike in china where even citizens need permits to move about in the country, in india we cannot stop people from moving to bombay...it is their country, and they can go wherever they hell they want to go...

dost-mittar #336 you write ``and the willingness of the Congress govt. to bow under the Muslim pressure to change the constitution rather than stand by the Supreme Court decision, they (hindu elite) resented it. ``

I think the Indian Constitution is the most effective defense against the forces of chaos whether coming from the muslim side or the hindu side, and you quite rightly point to it`s importance. The disdain for the constitution shown by our leaders in Pakistan has definitely gone a long way towards weakening the state and giving rise to a host of problems. There should be no room for political correctness or political expendiency (e.g. bending the constitution in case of the shah bano case - of which i have heard a little bit about) in a matter that is central to the emergence of a civilized society in any country.

Cockroach # 326

You are ghatiaappa personified cutie.

nasah

your post made me angry..see, if you really mean what you say, i.e. that you mean pakistan well, please try not to sound as though you are deriving immense pleasure in its pitfalls..a great many of your posts are thus designed which is sad since you make a lot of sense in other areas of discussion on chowk...let me explain k...if i have two friends and i`m horribly ill tempered and one tells me to work on it because its going to do me harm in the long run and that i should try and get on with ppl regardless of how annoying they might be, i will listen to her...i may try and work on it because she means well...if the other tells me i am an idiot who is doomed since i cant bloody control my temperement and that if i speak to her like i do with others, she`lll break my nose, I dear nasah will break her face and not even THINK about listening to her inspite of knowing that she loves me crazy and is speaking only for my own good..the difference (im sure u know what im getting at) is the way one is told about ones mistake..i for one will not listen to a word of what these nutcases audio video or ali2 might have to say or even our very own gadha, urstruly..because i dont respect what they have to say and HOW they say it..yeah?.also hasansaab, most of us are proud, egoistic, cocky, arrogant, ziddi, sensitive etc and therefore many times find it hard to accept that things are wrong with the place/ppl we love...if you come at us nicely, thora considerately we WILL listen...but if you will talk nasty about my country and its ppl (we`re not backward OKAAY?) and talk down about how we hate all things hindu and all things good for us, my apologies but ill do the chowk equivalent of breaking your nose..i will be rude, budtameez and nasty which is not such a bad thing you may say but then i will also not listen to you which makes this whole excercise kinda stupid, haina?

:)

tahmed saabs post was the cyber bloodying of your nose- im sure if i said all indians are wimps who couldnt do a damn thing all those centuries the mughals ruled them aur ab chaar din kee chandnee hae tau khush horahae hain, let us see you when the andheri raat comes, nobody from india will like it..its a nasty and b!tchy thing to say...sooo the bottomline is that if you wish to make a difference i.e. be listened to by the pakistanis who worry you so, pls be nice and not nasty

thankyou and goodbye

dostmittar and spm

hai haath dukh gaye type kar kar kae

foremost, dostmittar, pls dont feel bad...good n bad ppl everywhere...my babies were on the way back from school when hell broke lose in the area and a hindu friends mum took them all in since they all went back in the same school bus or something (big bloody tappar they are...6 little BRATS from hell..god bless her soul forever and ever)...they stayed the night there and were spared the raat ka bad scene so its really all good.:).i wish you wouldnt feel so hopeless and sad like you sound..if nice ppl will start to lose hope and idiots like urstruly and arjunm will be allowed to feel good about all this hate doing the rounds, then it really will be the end of us all..please put on some papa winnie and smile yourself silly..haR takleef kae baad asaani hae

(philosophical im becoming man)

now then london..i dont know how, i swear, but in 10 days there i gained more weight than ever before in my life..semi, whats that you were saying about brocolli or celery being good for diets? like i neeeed help..if im not careful, will start looking like baby potato very soon..rest was fun..met lots of really crack ppl..we had a blast walking the streets of england all night every night...and babe, i fell asleep in the HOUSE of BLOODY LORDS..yes yes..we had not slept in two nights and so exhausted i thought id rest my head on the nicely carved table in front of me..if that wasnt embarassment enough for a lifetime (waisae 6, 7 other ppl also fell asleep while the boring MPs ate our brains out), i was saved by less than a few inches from falling into the thames by an adorable little (6 feet 4 waisae but so sweet he`s like a little baby) nigerian boy who is now officially my best friend in africa..will write smthg for chowk but am totally behind on stuff at school and work both...need to catch up quick...in a few weeks inshaAllah :)

saxena:

thank you for that reply..i appreciate it..am glad to know you are ashamed of the madness going on

Ref Anoop Bhat #: 150

[Delayed response harimau]

I respond in kind by delaying my response! No, no; it is just that I am travelling and do not necessarily have access to the Internet on a daily basis.

[I think Bal Thackeray is dead right when he demands Dawood`s extradition from Karachi where he lives under ISI protection.]

Agreed.

[Though I am not so much in favour of him (or the Government) linking this to cricket or train routes or trade.]

Agreed again.

[Eventually the irony is that real progress can only happen by a meeting of minds, which is facilitated by all of the above activites.]

Again, you are right.

[I am completely in support of banning Pakistan tours on the grounds that they are a security hazard.... God forbid that the LeT or JeM should target one of our heroes next.]

Not at all. I think our police can do a good job of tracking any criminals provided their hands are not tied behind their backs by our politicians who want to play both sides against each other.

[Re: prosecuting Thackeray, I am not so sure. Admittedly he has made provocative statements against the Muslims, most of them in times where a cool head and restraint would have served us all better. But it`s really tragic that someone of ``hrudaya samrat`` Balasaheb`s influence doesn`t quite know how to use it in the pursuit of good. Which is NOT to say that everything the Sena does is bad-- they have a number of schemes: zunkabhakar kendras, free newspaper stalls in mohallas, free ambulance services -- that have greatly benefited the great Maharashtrian lower and middle classes-- but surely there`s scope for more good to happen. Believe it or not, Thackeray`s leadership and man-management skills would be the envy of any corporate climber. Read Harish Nambiar`s article on chowk about how the Sena functions, an article that was unfortunately hijacked by interactors into some kind of Sena bashing exercise while missing the point completely. Which point is: there is a lot to be learned from the grassroots operational strategies of the Shiv Sena...]

All the good deeds could be done without any of the political baggage. Like Edhi Sahib is doing in Pakistan. It is entirely possible to motivate people to do good without appealing to their baser instincts like Thakre has been doing. I personally think that Thakre is one of those men with small penises who is trying to compensate for his shortcomings. He has delusions of grandeur and the sooner somebody crushes him the better it is for Bombay, Maharashtra and India. It is really unfortunate that he has been allowed a free rein far too long.

[...though oftentime their ideology is highly misguided (as a ``Madrasi`` accused of stealing the bread from the mouths of the sons-of-the-soil in the 60`s, you surely cannot consider the Sena your buddies!).]

I usually do not consider people of diminished mental capacity to be my personal buddies.... people to be pitied, to be helped, yes.

[Thackeray has some good ideas: his views on how Mumbai must be administered to prevent it from slipping into becoming another Calcutta for example, must be heard to be believed.]

You don`t need Thakre to tell you anything about that. Unlike the Bengali bhadralok of Calcutta who whiled away their time drinking tea and eating rossogolla and puris while attempting to solve the problems of the Vietnam War (remember `amar nam, tomar nam, Viet Nam`?) or the plight of the landless (`amar bari, tomar bari, Naxalbari`) even as Calcutta was drowning in garbage, the Maharashtrians are hardworking people who just went about earning an honest living. Thanks to them, Bombay will not sink to the level of Calcutta.

[Such as sending a vigilante team over to Karachi and slipping Dawood out across the border? If the Israelis could do it with Eichmann and get international kudos, why not us? :)) ]

Because we are NOT Israelis but Indians.

Regards.

Zafar Al-Talib # 329

Avashya, avashya; zaroor, zaroor.

Besides, we can employ a lot of people, reduce poverty, and require all our employees to behave as good Indians/human beings.

No freedom to our workers to preach hate and fanaticism. It is logically absurd and morally dishonest to use current freedoms to try and end them.

RE: Reply #: 287 soysauce

``You mentioned Shah Bano as the turning point. I don`t think so. In fact it would be odd for a people that barely register a protest (almost all the protest comes from women`s groups) -when thousands of women are killed every year in kerosene-stove accidents- on something as esoteric as a muslim woman not getting alimony.``

The Shah Bano case was pivotal because of what the Muslim extremists did with it. They converted what was essentially a civil dispute into a religious one and succeeded in changing the laws of the land to put such disputes outside the common courts. That was what was so egregious about it. In the process, they also succeeded in providing fodder for Hindu extremists to say that Muslims were being molly-coddled were a law unto themselves. This fodder is still used as kindling for Hindu-Muslim riots.

nasah #297 you write ``Now what an ignorant foreigner like me is supposed to conclude from such “self hating” posts of yours..``

This is how: read the last sentence of that post of mine. Anticipating a reaction like yours, I had specifically explained in that last sentence that this was a joke (I am well aware by now that some people on chowk wont get a joke without a surgical operation that implants it in their head). Seems like even that explicit statement did not register with you.

Being able to laugh at oneself is not the same as self hating, as your post clearly indicates you think. Indeed it is the opposite. Being able to laugh at oneself is a strength, not a weakness. Ridiculing others is a sign of weakness (in addition to being downright rude), not strength, and you may wish to review your posts in this light and try and judge for yourself where you stand.

Urstruly; Anny,

You`re both wrong. It was actually Van Morrison.

RE: Reply #: 313 ali1

``Personally, I think Pakistani Army did overstep its mandate in fighting the Mukti Bahini terrorists and Indian Army/BSF regulars in their ranks, but these numbers are absurd to say the least.``

Just as I thought. When a mirror is placed in front of you so that you can see the warts on your face, you claim that it is not your face. So much for your crocodile tears for Muslims in India or elsewhere.

re: Zafar

{{One thing the Sena definitely did was economically empower Marathi speaking people in Bombay – though perhaps it’s more accurate to say that the Sena spearheaded that movement. And the fact that this movement was so popular speaks volumes about the position of Marathi speakers in what used to be in many economic arenas a Gujarati (for example) speaking city. Meaning the Sena’s success stemmed at least in part from the failure of other groups to deal with the issues of Marathi speaking people}}

there is no reason for the sena or any other nuts to do anything to uplift people...that is the government`s job!...how sad that it doesn`t do its job, and these groups are fill that void but onyl while pushing other agendas...

Saw this article today. Somehow, this close to a 100 year old piece seemed awfully timely. Wanted to share with you all.

THE WORLD’S RELIGION by M K Gandhi dated 26-8-1905



The time has now passed when the followers of one religion can stand and say, ours is the only true religion and all others are false. The growing spirit of toleration towards all religions is a happy augury of the future. An article appeared recently in the columns of The Christian World, a London religious weekly, over the signature of “J.B.”, one of that journal’s regular contributors, on this question, extracts from which I intend to quote.

The writer, in a most liberal and generous spirit, reviews the question from the Christian standpoint, and shews how the world’s religions are linked one with the other, each having characteristics common to all others. The appearance of such an article in the Christian Press is worth noting, and shews that it is moving with the times. A few years back, such an article would have been classed as heretical teaching, and its author denounced as a traitor to the cause.

After remarking upon the new spirit which was changing the attitude of Christians to other religions, and pointing out how, a few years ago, the idea prevailed of the Christian religion standing out [as] the only true religion amongst a multitude of false ones, he goes on to say:

There has been an immense revulsion, and one of the features of it is the discovery, so vastly surprising to the average man, that the doctrine he was brought up on was not the earlier Christian teaching at all. The noblest of the old apologists thought very differently, he finds, of the outside races and faiths, from what he had been led to imagine. He hears of Justin Martyr, standing so close to the apostolic age, who regards the wisdom of Socrates as inspired by the ‘Word’; of Origen, and Gregory of Nyssa, whose teaching is of the entire race of man as under the Divine tutorship; of Lactantius maintaining that belief in Providence was the common property of all religions... ...The finer Christian minds have, in fact, in every age gone more or less along this line. It needed only that men should come into contact with these outside races, whether in their literature or face to face, to realise at once that the ‘impassable gulf’ theory between one religion and another was false to life and to the soul...

...Religion, by a hundred different names and forms, has been dropping the one seed into the human heart, opening the one truth as the mind was able to receive it. “J.B.” points out that many of the Christian institutions and doctrines were born of the knowledge of other religions. Many of the symbols are relics of ancient days. How marvellous, too, in this connection, is that ancient cult of Mithras in Persia, where, as M. Cumont says: ‘Like the Christians, the followers of Mithras lived in closely united societies, calling one another father and brother; like the Christians, they practised baptism, communion and confirmation; taught an authoritative morality, preached continence, chastity and self-denial, believed in the immortality of the soul and the resurrection of the dead’. It is not surprising that the writer should claim for the Christian religion the premier position, but it is gratifying to find such a broadminded attitude taken up by Christian writers and the Christian Press.

To Europeans and Indians working together for the common good, this has a special significance. India, with its ancient religions, has much to give, and the bond of unity between us can best be fostered by a wholehearted sympathy and appreciation of each other’s form of religion. A greater toleration on this important question would mean a wider charity in our everyday relations, and the existing misunderstandings would be swept away. Is it not also a fact that between Mahomedan and Hindu there is a great need for this toleration? Sometimes one is inclined to think it is even greater than between East and West. Let not strife and tumult destroy the harmony between Indians themselves. A house divided against itself must fall, so let me urge the necessity for perfect unity and brotherliness between all sections of the Indian community.

Indian Opinion, 26-8-1905

Reply Soysauce # 288

“1) Hindus are tolerant when they are not threatened.”

Who isn’t? And who is when they are?

“2) Religions don`t make people good or bad. People are good despite their religious beliefs.”

Actually maybe their beliefs (not religions) reflect their virtue?

Reply Prem # 290

“How do we create this commitment?”

Hamare restaurant pe monthly contest shuru karen?

Reply Dost-Mittar # 315

“We are in mourning here and the only reward is tears.”

Mashallah, your handle was well chosen.

Reply Stuka, Semipreciousme # 316

“….it’s a woman thing…. “

“methinks you have not heard of Indira Gandhi!!!”

Kya? Indiraji was a woman????? Aap ko ghalath fahmi…(vaisai, closer to home Mme SPM, can I refer you to Pinky B….)