The Mahatma’s Progeny

re: the Chowk`s clown

Guys,

We have this clown (you know who i am talking about)who has been raped and sodomised by everyone on board. Yet he refuses to learn. The only thing he can do is to demean others. So he goes about demeaning me. I do not even read his posts seriously because they are, as far as i am concerned, pure excrement. I have no intentions of ever interacting with this clown again.

This clown hates a figure who the rest of the world reveres. I can imagine Gandhi shaking in his grave and begging this clown to change his opinion of him! This clown needs a break. Let us all leave him alone for sometime. Probably, better sense will prevail.

Sridhar

chowk staff:

…..how many more ‘progressive’, mile long cut-n-pastes must we endure before you guys wake up?…

Tantrumologician,

A few cosmopolitan phrases do not a rebuttal make; and your posts seem awfully derivative of most of my metaphors. Dude, if you want to play this game, be thorough. The insults come after you have answered the questions (even to the best of your limited abilities). Announcing (to whom are you making your little pronouncements to? Do you think other Chowkies cannot understand what`s happening? Desperation, desperation)that you have made someone ``squirm`` when clearly they continue to ask you the same question repeatedly does not fool anybody. Descending to cursing and namecalling (bechara) illustrates how out of control you clearly are. You`ve hit all the strategies of a third rate cyber bully-what`s next?

Why not just answer the question?

How old are you anyway?

PS If Gandhi`s promoting Mullahs is `defending the honor of Islam` then as a Muslim, I don`t want to defend the Honor of Islam thankyou very much. Gandhi could CARE less.. he saw an opportunity to become a demagogue and he took it... sabotaging the aspirations of millions to self government under constitution of a dominion of India together as Hindus and Muslims.

Sadna,

1) Gandhi`s lies are well known. He was a hypocrite... his occasional lip service to muslims doesn`t count... he was a Hindu fanatic as Dr.Ambedkar clearly proved. Dr Ambedkar CALLED him a Hindu FANATIC! That is a fact.. there is no explaining away of that. Gandhi was a gureilla who sat down on rights of dalits, muslims etc. Ambedkar thought of Gandhi as a Hindu fanatic and nothing you can say will change that.

2) It was not about support total independence or dominion status.. but the fact that Gandhi`s stupid noncooperation movement in the early 20s created an unsavory situation for the tranfer of power.

3) My `dominion` status issue does sit well with Ambedkar`s book.. what I am talking about the actions of non communal Parliamentary swaraj Bloc in which Jinnah, CR Das and Motilal were involved in 1924 which would have guaranteed independence as a dominion, and not about Hindus and Muslims as groups...

I am very sorry to say that You are a dishonest liar, and I think by now you know it very well. I fear that you don`t see anything wrong with it.. because being a Gandhian, it seems you have internalized your lying.

``And why complain now, YOU are the person who first brought up Gandhi`s poor goat not anyone else.``

Because that is not the only point I brought up and you are obsessed with Gandhi`s goat, where as I mentioned it in passing.. Since you have only pathetically tried to defend one point about Gandhi`s hindu fanaticism, I will take it that you agree with the rest of the points I have put up...

Sincerely

-YLH

PS: And why complain now, YOU are the person who first brought up Gandhi`s poor goat not anyone else.

ylh #964
`` 1) He was a Hindu fanatic because he wanted to place Hinduism above all else (As per the evidence of Ambedkar, the principal architect of the Indian constitution).``

Only a dishonest person like you IGNORES Gandhi asking Hindus to die to `uphold the honor of Islam`. I already quoted from the book Pakistan in which Ambedkar provides more details about Gandhi`s efforts to forge Hindu-Muslim unity, even saying, regarding what Ambedkar called the separate `channels` of the Congress and the Muslim League, that in in the entire period of early 1900s-Independence :
`only during the Khilafat agitation did the waters of the two channels leave their appointed course and flow as one stream in one channel. It was believed that nothing would separate the waters which God was pleased to join`.

Its clear that Gandhi was not `a Hindu fanatic` `who put Hinduism above all else`. The fact that Gandhi and Ambedkar peacefully coexisted the way they did inspite of their strong convictions is testimony to each`s respect for the other`s sincerity of purpose toward their nation`s future. Gandhi even said ``..That he[Ambedkar] does not break our heads is an act of self-restraint on his part``. That Ambedkar called Gandhi a `Hindu fanatic` because Gandhi didnot agree to Ambedkar`s presription for safeguards for Dalits is a smaller detail in the larger picture of their mutual complementary coexistence in the Independence movement and in the framing of the Indian Constitution later.

Your point about Dominion is also not borne out by the `National Frustration` chapter of Ambedkar`s book Pakistan. Here he has Gandhi and the Congress supporting Dominion status till the late thirties and the Muslims dissenting and talking of `full independence`.

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Response to saminashah #953

Saminashah falsely charged me with calling Ferzie ``disloyal`` and ``unpatriotic`` and now that her lies have been called she hides under more of her pile of refuse. The constipated Saminashah is a fluent liar. And she has not the courage to admit to her lies even when she is caught with her hand in the cookie jar (which she must not go near if she is to fix her clogged colon) in full view. I had quite a chortle at the sight of this crooked constipated babe squirming and wriggling after being found in flagrante delicto. Liar Saminashahshithead, now go home and change your wet, soggy nappies and fix up that appointment with your proctologist real quick.

tantralogician

Sadna,

That you have taken my entire objection to Gandhi as being to `His goat`.. shows how mischieviously you are trying to change the topic. This is why I call you a dishonest liar!

My objections to gandhi have nothing to do with his goat or his dressing sense:

I hate Gandhi because:

1) He was a Hindu fanatic because he wanted to place Hinduism above all else (As per the evidence of Ambedkar, the principal architect of the Indian constitution).

2) He stood against modernity and civilization.

3) He hated Modern Education.

4) He hated Modern Medicine.

5) He was against Women`s suffrage movement

6) He used a stupid Islamic religious movement like the Khilafat Movement for his own mischievious ends, thus bringing Mullahs forever into Politics.

7) By using his bigoted ancient hindu philosophy he delayed Independence by 22 years.. remember I have shown very clearly that Motilal Nehru, C R Das and Jinnah`s independent bloc had virtually guaranteed the `Dominion` Status in 1925... given that eventually it was the `dominion status` that India got.. Gandhi`s achievement is NAUGHT!

8) His pacifism in WW2 was Objectively pro-Fascist.

None of these have anything to do with Gandhi`s goat ... and you know it very well. You can`t answer it, so you spend time refuting my occasional reference to Gandhi`s Goat!

-YLH

Response to #945 saminashah:

Tantrumologician: ``After mistakenly imputing to me someone else`s remarks made about Ferzie (``disloyal`` ``unpatriotic``) Saminashah declares that she is severely constipated!``

What can be expected from someone who names himself after the illogic of his debating skills? If memory serves, or a quick look at this board shows, FV has not appreciated some of comments; in fact, you have been offensive to her. Plus, your inability to address or denounce the rightwing device of demanding no dissent or critique of India`s national institutions or legacies says more than anything you have written.

Again, what have you got against FV raising her points? Why did you ridicule her for doing so? All else is moot until you answer that question in an intellectually honest manner (and here, in posing this question to you, I am making a leap against all odds, that you are able to answer it)

Once more, I commend you for your knowledge on the inner workings of your intestinal system. As I had suggested, perhaps you can flush the waste from your mind in a similar manner. But we know how resistant you are to that, so happy stinking...

``And next time, don`t bring your personal hygiene and scatology to CHOWK. This is a family forum, you idiot.``

Tantrum, you are WAY out of your league if you want to play the Dozens with me (look it up, Brainiac). If any of us (including Chowk children and interactors who meet the criterion of being children) check your previous posts, they`ll notice that YOU brought up the daddy metaphor in hopes I`d ignore you and you`d have ``won`` by bad taste and bathameezi. But, I guess when the juta`s on the other foot, you cry....we`ll be looking for you in the next Nambla issue!

tantralogician

The Dirtiest Engagement of Indian Diplomacy: Operation Toilet

Basil Fernando, AHRC

A letter in reply to Soli J Sorabji, Attorney General of India.

The regional preparatory meeting in Tehran, Iran for the forthcoming World Conference against Racism, Racial Discrimination, Xenophobia and Related Intolerance in Durban, South Africa, in August and September witnessed a repetition of the Indian government`s position against the inclusion of caste on the agenda of this conference. India`s attorney general, Soli Sorabji, in a Times of India article entitled ``Racism, Name- Changing Toilets`` has revealed the reason for this stance, which may have turned Mahatma Gandhi in his grave. In his article, the attorney general says, ``None of this capitalist obscene toilet opulence for socialist India though. We will rest content with clean- functioning toilets. Is this utopian fancy``?

A video production entitled Less than Human has depicted the way Brahmanism has condemned vast sections of Untouchables to just collecting s/hit pit. The attorney general is basically saying, ``That is how it`s going to be in the future also.`` To prevent the Untouchables from walking out of their toilets is what the Brahmins and their spokespeople are struggling for at this conference and in other forums. A world where caste will ne annihilated is seen by them as a Utopia for these discriminated masses and as a smelly place for themselves.

The Indian caste system has been the means by which vast sections of the Indian population have been submerged into a condition of servitude to satisfy the interests of a small minority who have claimed their privileges on the basis of the special birthright through the mouth of their god. However, the real issue has not been from where they were born but who could possess land in India. So long as the Untouchable was confined to the toilets, they were also confined to the Indian Ghetto. Thus, land, sand everything that goes with it, were in the easy possession of a minority.

A few days after the publication of the attorney general`s letter on toilets the Washington Post revealed that a four day meeting intended to bring some coherence to the agenda of the upcoming international conference on racism in August ended on March 9 in Geneva without success. One of the few vocififerous countries at the meeting was India whose sole interest was to prevent caste from being discussed at the world conference. Battalions of Indian diplomats are now being put to this task. The reason for such a massive operation is not difficult to understand. Many of India`s claims are under threat of being exposed: that is the world`s largest democracy, that it has a great civilization, that it even has a right to a permanent seat on the U.N. Security Council. Thus, the face that has practiced one of the crudest forms of discrimination for millennia can make these entire claims sound hollow.

Like the Attorney General, everyone has only one argument: caste and race are different. These good men are only opposed to name changing. What they seem to forget is that, whatever the name, the game is the same: a type of discrimination that is similar to, or worse, than apartheid. The Attorney General even tries to cite the Indian Constitution in his favour. In this endeavour, he gets into serious difficulties though with anyone who knows this Constitution and its history, for the drafts of the Indian Constitution exhibited some degree of idealism. The Constitution idealized castes as a curse of India and deliberately tried to address the issue. Running through the constitution is the theme of equality and ways to address the problem. The fact that these founders who represented divergent opinions agreed to have B.R. Ambedkar, an Untouchable and the undisputed leader of this marginalized sector of society, be the chief draftsman of the constitution showed a remarkable degree of appreciation of the caste issue in the Indian nation.

Such leaders as Swami Vivekananda and Mahatma Gandhi, two great influences in the Indian independence movement, reflected this idealism. Swami Vivekananda wrote, `` Unless they (Untouchables) are raised, this motherland of ours will never awake.`` His remarks on caste discrimination remain a bitter critique of the Indian hypocrisy on this issue. Mahatma Gandhi, who liked to be seen as the champion of the untouchables, condemned caste discrimination as a form of leprosy. Though their vision for the eradication of caste may have been limited, their acknowledgement of caste as the great Indian contradiction cannot be denied.

This Indian idealism is now dead. The fundamentalist Hindutva movement represents the contemporary equivalent of the ideology of Godse, Mahatma Gandhi`s assassin. This ideology is no different to the ideologies of white supremacy movements. It is an ideology of complete racism. What this ideology represents is not India`s pride but its shame. Damn the nation and save caste is in short, the ambition of those who represent this ideology. It is the ideology of India`s current ruling party- the Bhartiya Janata Party or BJP

The Attorney General and Indian diplomats derive their mandates from this vicious ideology. They are wholeheartedly committed to preventing a global debate on the most wretchedly committed to preventing a global debate on the most wretchedly exploited sections of Indian society, who constitute atleast 160 million people. The efforts and expenditure that are put into this operation are enormous.

However, in their great enthusiasm to make Untouchables invisible, they have already lost the battle. The world now knows about the deep divisions that exist in India on this issue and how sensitively the present BJP government perceives the issue. If someone thought that caste is something of the past or an exaggeration of oppression, they will now know that their perceptions are wrong. The realisation that this most primitive type of exploitation still exists, affecting a large section of people as they read their newspapers or see TV screens reporting on the World Conference against Racism. Indian diplomacy has been counterproductive for the BJP government. However, it has unwittingly contributed to the expansion of the campaign against the caste system.

The Attorney General`s article ends with a pathetic question: ``Is this a utopian fancy?`` Keeping caste in place and enjoying the privilege of other people cleaning his toilet has the quality of a utopian dream to him and those like them. Will this be lost? It simply is inevitable. It is time for him to find another way to keep his toilet clean.

Vedic Dark Ages

The barbaric Aryans invade India in ca. 1500 BC, destroying the glorious Sudroid (Kolaro-Dravidian) Indus Valley civilization and exterminating the indigenous Negroid-Australoid peoples in one of the worst ethnic cleansing operations in human history. The leaders of these savage Aryans and the masterminds of this terrible holocaust are the Brahmins. The Brahmins are the directors of the Vedic Holocaust, commanding the Aryans to massacre the Sudroids and exhorting them to annihilate all traces of the `Dasyu` civilization they encountered. The first Brahmin conspiracy on record had claimed its victims. This was the first great purushamedha, or Brahmin human sacrifice.

After this event, the Brahmins spread the horrific customs of purushamedha and ashwamedha - horse sacrifice - in order to consolidate their vicious grip on society. A section of the Dravidians who fled the Aryan onslaught adopted these savage customs, continuing them for centuries until discovered by British anthropologists. For one thousand years all of South Asia was plunged into a dark age.

One group of the triumphant Brahmin leaders settled along the devastated Sarasvati River in what is now East Punjab, and another settled in the modern Kannuaj region. From this time dates the first sub-division of the Brahmin people into so-called Saraswat Brahmins and Kanyakubja Brahmins. As more and more Brahmins settle and devastate the country, the Sarasvati River region becomes a desert.

The Thar desert, which was extremely fertile prior to the barbaric Aryan invasion, becomes the huge desert it is today as marauding Aryans, goaded on by their fanatic Brahmin priests, lay waste the entire region, destroying all life forms in it.

The annihilation of Sudroids in the Northern Indus-Ganges valley necessitated the creation of a new slave class; thus the Brahmins degrade the status of the Aryan Vaishyas to that of Sudras. By the Upanishadic Age, the Aryan Vaishyas are repeatedly ranked as being nearly equal to the Negroid Sudras in the Brahmanic scriptures. Brahmins slowly squeeze out all other Aryans from the knowledge industry, and soon have a monopoly of literacy. By the end of the Vedic age, literacy - previously an Aryan privelege - has become a Brahmin monopoly.

By charles on Thursday, February 28, 2002 - 07:41 pm:

ca. 500 BC - 200 BC

Buddhist Golden Age

As a result of the terrible soul-destroying tyranny imposed by the Brahmins over the non-Brahmin peoples, a series of anti-Brahmin movements arise both among the Aryan and non-Aryan populations. These include Buddhism, Jainism, Carvakism, Atheism and Materialism. Shaivism - the Negroid Dravidian religion - and Shaktism - the Mon-Khmer religion of Bengal - experienced spectacular revivals as the oppressed non-Brahmins rise up against the Brahmanic tyranny.

The horrific varieties of Brahmin ritual murder - Vedic purushamedha, aswhamedha and naramedha - which claimed lakhs of human and animal lives are also among the causes leading to the rise of anti-Brahminism. Buddhism came to be the most spectacularly successful of these.

With the destruction of Brahmin tyranny, civilization slowly returned to the devastated and depopulated South Asia. Buddhism spread amongst the Aryan Kshatriyas and Aryan Vaishyas, with even a substantial number of Sudroids adopting the faith. Urbanisation proceeded apace, and Prakrits developed. A Golden Age of civilization was ushered in, with peace and prosperity reigning as evidenced from the numerous archeological remains of the Maurya empire.

Science reaches unprecedented heights as mathematics, physics and biology develop, free from Brahmin shackles.

By charles on Thursday, February 28, 2002 - 07:36 pm:

ca. 200 BC - 100 BC

Late Buddhist Golden Age

Realising that they could not defeat Buddhism from the outside, the Brahmins resort to destroying it from within.

The Brahmins slowly infiltrate Buddhism, with the aim of undermining it from within. Brahmin `converts` to Buddhism start to attack each other, thereby splitting Buddhism into several warring factions. Foremost of these Brahmin conspirators is Nagarjuna, who succeeded in sounding the death-knell of Buddhism by expending all his energy in vitriolic attacks against other Buddhist sects. Buddhism splits into innumerable perpetually warring sects; the confused population is left bewildered, and the world`s greatest anti-Brahmin movement is soon destroyed from within.

After the rise of the fanatic Brahminic Guptas, all traces of Buddhism are destroyed in India.

Revival of Brahmanism leads to the decline of science.

By charles on Thursday, February 28, 2002 - 07:33 pm:

323 BC - 100 BC

Greek Empires

The Greek invasion of Alexander is engineered by the Brahmins. Pandit Kautilya, author of the Arthashastra, financed and armed the invaders in order to overthrow the Sudroid Nandas.

320 BC - 140 BC

Magadhan Empire

Pandit Kautilya organises a massive famine, which destroys more than 90 % of the population.

Pusyamitra Sunga the Brahmin takes over as King, begins exterminating the Buddhists.

The Brahmins destroy the Magadhan Empire of the Mauryas due to their support for Buddhism.

The unity of Dravidians is destroyed by creating Malyalali, Telugu and Kannadiga by Sanskritising the language. In Kerala, Namboodiri Brahmins invent the Malayali language. Casteism was introduced in order to keep the Dravidians divided.

By charles on Thursday, February 28, 2002 - 07:29 pm:

200 AD. -1000 AD.

Puranic or Brahmanic Dark Age

The Devadasi cult is started by Brahmins, using the enslaved low-caste Sudra women as prostitutes. These girls and women are raped by the beastly Brahmins, who satisfy their lecherous and perverse lusts in the temples. Brahmins grow still richer from the proceeds of this immoral trade. By contrast, Brahmin women are locked up at home, prevented from even seeing a low-caste man.

The Hijra cult is started, a horrible invention of the diseased Brahmin mind, to exterminate Sudra males. Located in South India, where the abundance of healthy Sudra black males was the raison-d`etre of the cult, it spreads northwards. Thousands of healthy Sudra male children are forcefully castrated in honour of a ``god``. The cult serves to emasculate Sudra manhood by depleting the number of Sudra males in order to compensate for the large number of abducted Sudra women who are forced into the cruel Devadasi system.

Brahmins screen all members of their caste for IQ and genetic defects. Those among the subjugated populations who display intellectual aptitude are absorbed into the Brahmin community, depleting the enslaved masses of their intellectual stock.

Brahmins with low IQ and other genetic defects are expelled into the general population, spreading their ghastly diseases.

By Dr Chatterjee on Wednesday, February 27, 2002 - 05:36 pm:

Myth of One Hindu Religion Exploded

3.1 The Different Indian Races

Sometimes definitions are put forward hypothesising that `Hindu` is a racial term, and that there supposedly exists `A Hindu Race`. This is a completely false guess, and this chapter explodes this myth of `One Hindu Race`. Indeed, there are a whole multitude of completely different races confouned under this hypothetical `Hindu` race :

Sudroids are Africoid - Anthropological investigations have revealed that the Sudras consist of several Black races, some akin to Australoids (the Kolarians or Austric speakers) and some akin to the Africans (the Dravidoids). Recent genetic analyses have confirmed this view, and much evidence from archaeology, physical anthropology, etc. prove this fact [ Sud ]. The view that the Sudras represent a differentiate of the Aryan race is wholly false, as it cannot explain differences in physical anthropology such as the flat Sudric nose (plattyrhinism) and thick lips.

Indo-Aryans - The Indo-Aryans are of Caucasoid stock, quite unrelated to the black-skinned aboriginal Negroid-Australoids. Linguistically, physiognomically and genetically the Indo-Aryans are closely related to Europoids.

Rajputs are Scythian - The Rajputs are descendants of Scythic (East Iranic) immigrants who entered India much after the Aryans. Although false genealogies were invented by the Aryan Brahmins in order to subvert the Rajput religion of Solarism (`Saura`) and convert them to the 6 astika schools of Brahmanism, a detailed analysis shows that the Rajputs are Scythics.

The Indo-Islamic (Mughalloid) Race - The Muslims of South Asia are overwhelmingly descendants of `Foreign Mussulman Immigrants`, ie. Arabic, Iranic and Turkic races. Even in Bangladesh, more than half of the Muslims are of `Aristocratic Foreign` (`ashraf`) descent [ Ris ]. They are hence not Aryan converts.

Mongoloids - Pure Mongoloids inhabit the Himalayas, and the extreme north-east. Genetic analyses have shown them to be more closely related to Chinese and Japanese peoples, a fact which is also borne out by their physiognomy and languages.

Indo-Mon-Khmer Race - The majority of East Indics (Assamics, Vangics, Odrics etc.), except the Aryan upper castes and the Kolarian lower castes, are of Indic Mon-Khmer (a branch of Mongoloids or East Asiatics) stock. Sir Risley has amply demonstrated this stratification in East India [ Ris ]. Thus, there is no such thing as a `Hindu Race`. Such concepts exist only in the minds and books of bigoted Brahmin anthropologists. 3.2 Race and Religion

In all ancient cultures, race and religion were intricately linked. Each race had its own religion. In Europe, the Germanic race practiced its Germanic religion, the Greeks had the Greek or Hellenic religion, and the Slavs followed the Slavic religion. It thus follows, that since there is no one Hindu race, there is also no one Hindu religion. Hence the Sudroid races of Dravidians, Dalits, Adivasis and Kols all follow Shaivism or Sudric Religion. The Aryans follow Vedism and Vaishnavism, collectively referred to as the 6 orthodox (`astika`) schools of Brahmanism. The Mongoloids generally follow Shaktism, while the Sino-Tibetan peoples follow Tantrism. 3.2.1 Vedic Origin of Vaishnavism Vishnu is one of the gods which were worshipped by the Vedic Aryans. He was not one of the more important ones, yet he oultived all his Vedic rivals to become the supreme god of the Aryan Religion. How was this possible ? Because of his feature of incarnation : Most other Vedic gods (Indra, Brahma, etc.) were declared as incarnations of Vishnu, as were many other minor non-Vedic Aryan tribal dieties (eg. the deified king Rama, and Krishna). Similarly, many local pre-Brahmanic gods were declared as incarnations of Vishnu, leading to the spread of the Vaishnava religion. Soon, the original Vedic religion split into two faiths : Vedism and Vaishnavism. Pockets of pure Aryan Vaidiks, who refused to follow the Puranas and other Vaishnava scriptures, remained. The division is analogous to that between Jews and Christians. Just as the Christians accept the Judaic Pentateuch, but have additional texts, so the Vaishnavas accept the Vedas but follow additional scriptures. Vaishnavism and Vedism are as much separate religions as Judaism and Christianity. However, they are still grouped under the term of `Brahmanism`. Two pre-Aryan gods could not be incorporated in this Vaishnava pantheon: these were Shiva (the Dravidian God) and Mahadev (the Tibetic God of Tantrism).

3.2.2 Tibetic Origin of Tantrism The original religion of the Sino-Tibetan peoples of India and Tibet was Bon religion, what may be called Proto-Tantrism, since many concepts of Tantrism can be found in Bon religion. The mad fantasy propagated by the modern-day Aryan Vaidikas and Vaishnavas holds that this Tantrism is a derivative of Vedic religion. Such fallacies have no foundation in any of the Vedic texts. Please keep in mind that the Vedic Aryans are those same monsters who invaded India, destroying the Harappan civlization, smashing thousands of Shaiva and Shakta temples. These barbarians raped, looted and destroyed the Indus Valley cities till no trace of them remained. Are such people even capable of imagining such an intellectual philosophy as Tantrsim, let alone be the originators of such a faith ? The answer is no. It cannot be. And I shall prove that below. The Tantric religion has been presecuted by the Brahmanist fanatics of the 6 orthodox schools for over two thousand years, and the Sinto-Tibetan peoples have been exterminated from many parts of India by the racist Vedic Aryans. That Tantrism is of Tibetan origin, being derived from the ancient Bon TIbetan religion, is evident from the following :

`Chinese Rites` - Tantrism is referred to as `The Chinese Rites` in the Indian Tantric texts themselves [ Alchmey, p.149 ], indicating their origin from `China` or Tibet, `Mahachina` being reserved for China Proper.

Fifth Veda - The legend of the Fifth Veda as narrated in the Tantric texts describe it falling from heaven into Tibet, and thus the people of that country are referred to as adepts at the ``Rites of the 5th Veda``. As per another legend, Brahma memorized all the 5 Vedas. He taught the 4 Vedas to the Brahmans, but kept the 5th Veda (ie. the Tantras) safe for a time when mankind was ready. Due to Brahma`s arrogance, Shiva cut off his head, and the 5th Veda then fell to Tibet, where its inhabitants took up the study with great zeal [ Alchemy, p.149 ]. Thus, as per the Tantras themselves, the original home of Tantrism is clearly stated to be Tibet.

Mahadeva`s Home - `Mahadeva`, the phallic god of Tantrism (to be distinguished from the black Dravido-Kolarian Shiva), is based on a Bon `Great God` of the mountains. His home is in the Himalayas, and he is white simply because he is Tibetic (North Mongoloid). Mt. Meru, `Mahadeva`s Home`, is obviously in the Himalayas, probably near Lake Mansarovar. Hence, the home of the supreme Tantric God is itself located in Tibet; another clear indication of its origins.

Vasishta`s Travel to Tibet - As per the Rudrayamala Tantra [ Rudrayamalatantra.XVII ], Vasishta travelled to the sea-shore (this would indicate Bengal) or, as per the Brahmayamala Tantra, [ Brahmayamalatantra I-III ], to the Kamakhya hills, Assam. He observed strict Yoga worship for the Devi Buddhesvari. He did for this for a long time without any results and so cursed the Devi. Then the Devi appeared and said, `` he had adopted an altoghter wrong path; her worship was unknown in the Vedas ; it was known only in the country of Mahacina; and that Vasishta would gain his object if he received instruction from Vishnu now residing there as Buddha. There he was surprised to find the Buddha drinking wine enjoying several women. His doubts were soon dispelled by Buddha, who initiated him.`` [ cf also Mahacinatantra ], [ Taratantram (Gaudagranthamala),Ch.141 ] [ Gupta ] [ cf also Alchemy, p.151 ]. This story once again indicates the source of Tantrism as being Tibet.

Lamaism - Tantrism is still practiced in Tibet, where it is the national religion, under the guise of Lamaism or Vajrayana `Buddhism`. All observers, however, are aware that this religion owes more to Bon than to Buddhism. Tantrism was more of an underground witchcraft movement in India. Orthodox Vaishnavism was not very happy with such beliefs, and in Bengal the Tibetan Buddhists (ie. Tantrics) were crushed by the Brahminist Sena dynasty. These persons welcomed the Islamic invasion, since it led to the destruction of Vaishnavite shrines. The Muslim Sufis further developed the mystic Tibetic Tantrism, mixing it with Arabian alchemy and ancient Egyptian cults (absorbed into Arab Sufism), as clearly depicted in the case of the Madari Sufists. There are thus two fountainheads of mysticism in Asia, one is Tibet, and the other Arabia (eg. the Syrian Harran, and the ancient Sabean shrine of the Ka`aba, a representative of Saturn, the Sabean Priapus, which as per Sufic doctrines was later absorbed into Islam).

`Parvati` - The name of Mahadeva`s wife is Parvati, meaning `of the mountain`, ie. she came from the Himalayas. She is depicted as fair in Tantric paintings In Dravidian Saiva tradition, by contrast, the black Kali is the consort of Shiva. This shows that the Sudric Shaiva and Tibetic Tantric religions are distinct, separate faiths.

Yab-Yum - Taoism in China has the concept of yin-yang, similar to the Tantric yab-yum concept and the Adi-buddha and Adi-prajna notions in later Buddhism [ Gupta, p.341 ].

Goddess Uma - Uma is another manifestation of Shakti, and is referred to as Haimavati or daughter of Himavat (the Himalaya range) [ Kena Upanishad.III.25 ] [ Chandra, p.123 ]. She is another Tantric goddess from the Tibetic Himalayas.

Taoist Siddhas - The Siddha cult (a medieval Mughal alchmist cult) was, as per its own tradition, introduced by one Taoist alchamist from China: This popular tradition holds that the Siddhas were

``a band of death-defying theriacal and therapeutic alchemists indebted in all respects to Bhoga, a pre-Christian Taoist immigrant from China , who, in his methods of cleaning up the body of impure matter through `reverberation` and `projection` to the pitch of pracitcally cancelling demise, merely sought to promulgate the lesser athanasic precepts of Lao-tse, since the vital objective of the Tao-Teh-King is the transfiguration of the immortalised ethereal body into a permanent garment of celestial virtue, in order to fit it to associate to eternity with the Tao``

-- [ Gupta, p. 193 ] and [ Siddha ]

ylh #various
I am not trying to `explain` anything `away`. There is enough in Gandhi`s actions, writings and political stances as well as in Ambedkar`s writings to understand both. Like measuring Gandhi`s legacy by his pet goat or Nehru`s stances by the ugliness of Edwina, sloganeering as opposed to a better understanding, well to each his own.

The UGLY Brahmin of hinduland.

What a diabolical creed!

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How India got divided into numerous linguistic areas

The picture of diversity of languages and scripts in India - past and present. How India, which, during Buddhist period, had only one main language and one or two main scripts, got divided into various groups with their intrinsic rivalries? This is the main problem, which nobody bothers to refer to. After the fall of Buddhism, Brahmanism not only divided the people into numerous castes with graded inequality and numerous tiny dynasties with rivalries due to sense of high and low, but also divided the whole country into small segments. It taught that each kingdom, though small, is a different country. The result was that the feeling of oneness was never present among the Hindus. There never arose a feeling on one India among them. In scriptures, we find definitions of `foreign` lands at many places. They denote the mischief caused. [Surendra Kumar Adnyat - ``hindu dharm ne bachaya ya pitavaya``, Sarita Mukta Reprint vol. 7, p. 24]

Brahspati says that if there is a big river or a big mountain in between, or if the language differs, then the countries on either side should be treated as foreign lands of each other. Some say after 60 yojanas, new country starts, some say 40 and some say 30 yojanas. (One yojana equals 8 miles). Brahaspati mentions another opinion using the word `videsh` in place of `deshantara`, that the videsh is that where one can not get messages within one day. [Surendra Kumar Adnyat - ``hindu dharm ne bachaya ya pitavaya``, Sarita Mukta Reprint vol. 7, p. 24]

Dharmasindhu defines `deshantara` or `videsh` on the basis of caste. For a brahmin distance of 20 yojanas from his residence, is `deshantara`, for ksatriya it is 24 yojanas, for a vaishya it is 30 yojanas and for a sudra it is 60 yojanas. If a big mountain or river comes in way or if there is difference of language, then it is a different country, as said by some people. It only means, in such an event, even though the distance is less than 20, 24, 30 or 60 yojanas, even then it is `deshantara` for brahmins, ksatriyas, vaishyas and sudras respectively. [Surendra Kumar Adnyat - ``hindu dharm ne bachaya ya pitavaya``, Sarita Mukta Reprint vol. 7, p. 24]

Thus as per scriptures, at the most 480 miles is the limit of your country, every thing beyond is a foreign land. Even today, we use the word `pardeshi` meaning a foreigner for a resident of a town, some distance away. When the sastras declare all areas except in immediate vicinity are alien lands, how can one expect the rajas and subjects consider other fellow Indians as their own in this vast land.

Kalivarjya was the method of control

That the kalivarj is the method of Brahmins to tackle with the Buddhist influence over the masses and impose their supremacy. They changed their laws without actually condemning them. All laws and rules, were amended including Civil, Criminal, Revenue and personal laws. It is not properly realized by the masses, that King was not the Law maker; he had no legislative powers, contrary to the popular belief. He was only the executive head and had a responsibility to implement the laws made by the Brahmins. At the most he could only legislate on revenue matters, that too, as per the rules already laid down. He had some judicial powers, but that too, he could not pass judgment against the law given by the Brahmins.

Who suffered in Kalivarjya

In Kalivarjya, main law was against sea voyage. That is how the sea worthy races of Pallava and Chola countries suffered. All the trade that was being conducted through the sea stopped. Who suffered? Not the Brahmins, surely. It will be clear, if we take a look at the products of export. Most of the products of export were based on the agriculture, horticulture, animal husbandry and forest economy. Even the textile industry which had reached a high acclaim in foreign lands, was based on cotton, silk and wool. All these occupations were in the hands of working classes, who were all doomed to be shudras. All these industries suffered. All these castes in the village economy suffered. All these occupational groups, which were prosperous during the Buddhist rule, were degraded into castes, due to rigid caste rules imposed.

The mobility of the professions was stopped. Telis, who extracted oil from oil seeds, Malis, who grew the vegetables, the Dhangars, who reared the goats and lambs, Sutars, who made and repaired the farmers` implements, Kumar, who suppled earthen pots to villagers and Mahars and Mangs who protected the villages from strangers, all were segregated. All these professions became hereditary and social intercourse among them stopped. Not only this caused multiplicity of castes, and regional variations in languages but also a different language for various castes. This ultimately lead to present situation of confusion, distrust and hostility among the people destroying social fabric of country, for which we have only to thank the fall of Buddhism and rise of Brahmanism.

PS Please read the Whole context... it is NOT in anger...!