Ra Ravishankar August 6, 2002
#130 Posted by Shah on August 12, 2002 1:35:14 am
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#129 Posted by Studebaker on August 12, 2002 1:35:14 am
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#128 Posted by Ashok on August 12, 2002 1:35:14 am
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#125 Posted by harimau on August 11, 2002 8:19:52 pm
[Fear, hatred or resentment of the minorities is understandable if
i). they have been in power for a long time and have consistently discriminated against the majority, like the erstwhile apartheid regime in South Africa..]
Tell us poor ignorant sods who was in power in Delhi from around 900 AD to about 1800 AD. Was it somebody named Jayavarma or Chandragupta?
How about all those freebooters from Afghanistan or Uzbekistan who got a job as a faujdar or khiledar in the Mughal army because their names were Anwaruddin Khan or Khuda Bux? Would that be a merit-based selection in your eyes?
How about the fact that a tax called the jizya, at as high as one-third of the agricultural income, was laid only on non-Muslims? Would that count as equal treatment in your eyes?
Let us come farther south. Who do you think the Nizam of Hyderabad was, a Hindu? Did his dominion consist of a majority of Muslims?
How about Mysore? Do you think Tippu Sultan was a Hindu who is held in such esteem by Pakistanis that they have a warship named for him?
Can you tell me who the Nawab of Arcot was? Let me give you a clue: he was not Hindu, Jain, Christian, Parsi, Buddhist or Jewish. By the way, his descendant is fighting the Wakf Board of Tamil Nadu in courts and his stormtroopers pulled down the walls of a mosque in Trichy a couple of
months back; but that is okay. It would be okay with you if he pulled down some Hindu temple in Trichy too.
Can you name the last faujdar of Chinglepet? Did you even know that Chinglepet had a Muslim army stationed there? Do you know who Chanda Sahib was?
Did you know that every single village had a Muslim governor in Tamil Nadu whose annual income (in the 1700s) was Rs 200,000 to 300,000? Try converting that into today`s currency: your calculator will have an overflow error.
DO YOU HAVE ONE CLUE ABOUT THE HISTORY OF INDIA?
[ii). successive governments have allowed the minorities a free rein at the expense of the majority. Since `independence`, Hindus have enjoyed a clear superiority in decision-making.]
Let us take one example of the ``clear superiority`` of the Hindus in decision-making. Muslims are being paid a subsidy to undertake their Haj pilgrimage by the Government of India. Hindus, contrary to what a bunch of boot-licking a$$holes have posted on Chowk, are not paid one red cent to subsidize a trip to Ramanathapuram or Benares or Mt. Kailash. Recently, the Govt of India suggested that the Haj subsidy should be eliminated in steps. The suggestion was that it should be extended only to those over 50 in age, and only once in a lifetime. The Haj board immediately turned down the suggestions and Omar Abdullah (son and anointed successor of Farouk Abdullah) said that the Haj subsidy should not be politicized.
The Muslims of India want to fcuk four women as it their God-given right but do not want their hands cut off as specified in the Koran if they steal. Let me tell you one thing: the thugs of Tamil Nadu have gone one better than the Sharia. Just last week, one Muslim ``businessman`` who failed to return his loans was dragged out of his car in broad daylight in Chennai and had his throat slashed like a bakra. Let us extend the Sharia all the way, I say; not just to fcuk four women or to divorce by saying ``Talaq, talaq, talaq`` but by getting stoned to death for adultery and getting beheaded for blasphemy. Let us give them an Islamic way of life. I want to see one-armed petty thieves all over India.
[Advani`s yathra in an air-conditioned Toyota left a trail of blood in its wake, culminating in the destruction of the Babri Masjid in December 1992.]
It was so much better in the good old days, wan`t it, when Babur rode on a horse and got the Ram Temple pulled down in Ayodhya?
Would it have met with your approval if Advani had used a white horse instead of an airconditioned Toyota? After all, it is that additional dollop of comfort that seems to bother you. Oh no; Advani should have pulled down a HINDU temple to meet with your approval.
[The implementation of the Mandal Commission Recommendations (advocating reservations in education and jobs for the socially underprivileged classes), and the backlash orchestrated by the media and the Hindu upper castes further strengthened the HR.]
Let me give you ANOTHER clue. The constitution of India set aside 25% of jobs and educational opportunities for a defined period to erase past discrimination. The Mandal Commission recommended that the set-asides be increased to 50%. In your Tamil Nadu, already 87% of all opportunities are set aside for OBCs. So, how much farther do you want the country to fall behind because some Sudalaikkannu or Sangilikkaruppan wants a college degree? Do you think your beloved Doctor Artist Leader gets his treatment from one of those OBC doctors? You fcukers pay for his trip to New York just like you paid for that a$$hole MGR or The Great Intellectual Elder Brother`s treatment in the US.
[I am a native of Coimbatore, Tamil Nadu. Currently, I am in the US, pursuing a PhD in Electrical Engineering. I read and (intend to) write about the effects of communalism/casteism, globalization etc.]
How about telling us who is the accused in the Coimbatore bomb case? Is it a Hindu?
So, where are you doing your PhD, University of Southwestern Arkansas?
I bet you are one of those 87% OBCs from Tamil Nadu. Tell you what: if you convert to Islam, they are offering you a pukka house in your hometown AND a job in Saudi Arabia courtesy of all the money that is flowing into India for conversion. That is actually a better deal than what people got in earlier days when the alternative was the swift sword of death.
Keep writing articles like this but make sure you have a jar of Vaseline handy for when those guys come to sodomize you.
i). they have been in power for a long time and have consistently discriminated against the majority, like the erstwhile apartheid regime in South Africa..]
Tell us poor ignorant sods who was in power in Delhi from around 900 AD to about 1800 AD. Was it somebody named Jayavarma or Chandragupta?
How about all those freebooters from Afghanistan or Uzbekistan who got a job as a faujdar or khiledar in the Mughal army because their names were Anwaruddin Khan or Khuda Bux? Would that be a merit-based selection in your eyes?
How about the fact that a tax called the jizya, at as high as one-third of the agricultural income, was laid only on non-Muslims? Would that count as equal treatment in your eyes?
Let us come farther south. Who do you think the Nizam of Hyderabad was, a Hindu? Did his dominion consist of a majority of Muslims?
How about Mysore? Do you think Tippu Sultan was a Hindu who is held in such esteem by Pakistanis that they have a warship named for him?
Can you tell me who the Nawab of Arcot was? Let me give you a clue: he was not Hindu, Jain, Christian, Parsi, Buddhist or Jewish. By the way, his descendant is fighting the Wakf Board of Tamil Nadu in courts and his stormtroopers pulled down the walls of a mosque in Trichy a couple of
months back; but that is okay. It would be okay with you if he pulled down some Hindu temple in Trichy too.
Can you name the last faujdar of Chinglepet? Did you even know that Chinglepet had a Muslim army stationed there? Do you know who Chanda Sahib was?
Did you know that every single village had a Muslim governor in Tamil Nadu whose annual income (in the 1700s) was Rs 200,000 to 300,000? Try converting that into today`s currency: your calculator will have an overflow error.
DO YOU HAVE ONE CLUE ABOUT THE HISTORY OF INDIA?
[ii). successive governments have allowed the minorities a free rein at the expense of the majority. Since `independence`, Hindus have enjoyed a clear superiority in decision-making.]
Let us take one example of the ``clear superiority`` of the Hindus in decision-making. Muslims are being paid a subsidy to undertake their Haj pilgrimage by the Government of India. Hindus, contrary to what a bunch of boot-licking a$$holes have posted on Chowk, are not paid one red cent to subsidize a trip to Ramanathapuram or Benares or Mt. Kailash. Recently, the Govt of India suggested that the Haj subsidy should be eliminated in steps. The suggestion was that it should be extended only to those over 50 in age, and only once in a lifetime. The Haj board immediately turned down the suggestions and Omar Abdullah (son and anointed successor of Farouk Abdullah) said that the Haj subsidy should not be politicized.
The Muslims of India want to fcuk four women as it their God-given right but do not want their hands cut off as specified in the Koran if they steal. Let me tell you one thing: the thugs of Tamil Nadu have gone one better than the Sharia. Just last week, one Muslim ``businessman`` who failed to return his loans was dragged out of his car in broad daylight in Chennai and had his throat slashed like a bakra. Let us extend the Sharia all the way, I say; not just to fcuk four women or to divorce by saying ``Talaq, talaq, talaq`` but by getting stoned to death for adultery and getting beheaded for blasphemy. Let us give them an Islamic way of life. I want to see one-armed petty thieves all over India.
[Advani`s yathra in an air-conditioned Toyota left a trail of blood in its wake, culminating in the destruction of the Babri Masjid in December 1992.]
It was so much better in the good old days, wan`t it, when Babur rode on a horse and got the Ram Temple pulled down in Ayodhya?
Would it have met with your approval if Advani had used a white horse instead of an airconditioned Toyota? After all, it is that additional dollop of comfort that seems to bother you. Oh no; Advani should have pulled down a HINDU temple to meet with your approval.
[The implementation of the Mandal Commission Recommendations (advocating reservations in education and jobs for the socially underprivileged classes), and the backlash orchestrated by the media and the Hindu upper castes further strengthened the HR.]
Let me give you ANOTHER clue. The constitution of India set aside 25% of jobs and educational opportunities for a defined period to erase past discrimination. The Mandal Commission recommended that the set-asides be increased to 50%. In your Tamil Nadu, already 87% of all opportunities are set aside for OBCs. So, how much farther do you want the country to fall behind because some Sudalaikkannu or Sangilikkaruppan wants a college degree? Do you think your beloved Doctor Artist Leader gets his treatment from one of those OBC doctors? You fcukers pay for his trip to New York just like you paid for that a$$hole MGR or The Great Intellectual Elder Brother`s treatment in the US.
[I am a native of Coimbatore, Tamil Nadu. Currently, I am in the US, pursuing a PhD in Electrical Engineering. I read and (intend to) write about the effects of communalism/casteism, globalization etc.]
How about telling us who is the accused in the Coimbatore bomb case? Is it a Hindu?
So, where are you doing your PhD, University of Southwestern Arkansas?
I bet you are one of those 87% OBCs from Tamil Nadu. Tell you what: if you convert to Islam, they are offering you a pukka house in your hometown AND a job in Saudi Arabia courtesy of all the money that is flowing into India for conversion. That is actually a better deal than what people got in earlier days when the alternative was the swift sword of death.
Keep writing articles like this but make sure you have a jar of Vaseline handy for when those guys come to sodomize you.
#124 Posted by arjun_m on August 11, 2002 7:29:49 pm
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#123 Posted by tvarad on August 11, 2002 7:29:49 pm
RE: Reply #: 104 dost-mittar
``And my big complaint against Nehru is not that he was a socialist -... - but that he ignored the nuts and bolts of governance, such as developing an honest, efficient, motivated and dedicated administration.``
Methinks you blame Nehru too much. The rot in the political system started setting in during his daughter`s rein when she figured out that Nehru`s concept of a benevolent all giving government could be turned into a tool to strengthen her tenuous hold on power by selectively distributing government favors and largesse to those who kowtowed to her. Remember that she was the one who started nationalizing just about every industry in sight.
``And my big complaint against Nehru is not that he was a socialist -... - but that he ignored the nuts and bolts of governance, such as developing an honest, efficient, motivated and dedicated administration.``
Methinks you blame Nehru too much. The rot in the political system started setting in during his daughter`s rein when she figured out that Nehru`s concept of a benevolent all giving government could be turned into a tool to strengthen her tenuous hold on power by selectively distributing government favors and largesse to those who kowtowed to her. Remember that she was the one who started nationalizing just about every industry in sight.
#122 Posted by sigalph235 on August 11, 2002 7:29:49 pm
re rsaxena 120 and harpeet 121
Gentlemen, you`re attempting to teach modern geography to someone whose geographical context consists of two entities only- Darul Islam and Darul Harb. This fellow hasn`t been to a higher-studies madrassa where the subtle sub-divisions of Darul Harb are explained in detail. Perhaps we could all pool some dough and get him a ticket to the Islamic University of Gaza or the Medina University of Islamic Sciences?
Gentlemen, you`re attempting to teach modern geography to someone whose geographical context consists of two entities only- Darul Islam and Darul Harb. This fellow hasn`t been to a higher-studies madrassa where the subtle sub-divisions of Darul Harb are explained in detail. Perhaps we could all pool some dough and get him a ticket to the Islamic University of Gaza or the Medina University of Islamic Sciences?
#121 Posted by rsaxena on August 11, 2002 11:22:42 am
re: ali1
{We know exactly what you mean, beta..... you were busy ogling matadors in tight pants, right?}
...someone tell this homo mullah that matadors are in spain and south america, not italy...the dangers of inbreeding...tsk tsk...
{We know exactly what you mean, beta..... you were busy ogling matadors in tight pants, right?}
...someone tell this homo mullah that matadors are in spain and south america, not italy...the dangers of inbreeding...tsk tsk...
#120 Posted by Harpreet on August 11, 2002 11:22:42 am
ali1;
Sicily is in Italy, Matadors are from Spain.
-h-
Sicily is in Italy, Matadors are from Spain.
-h-
#119 Posted by harimau on August 11, 2002 11:22:42 am
Ref Sangilikkaruppan #: 102
[Good article overall. No mention of Meenakshipuram tho?]
How about you and the author forming a lynch mob against those who refused to give you water?
By the way, a$$hole, in a village in Tamil Nadu, where Dravidian parties have held the reins of power since 1967, a tea vendor was arrested for serving tea to Dalits in glass tumblers while serving to tea to his fellow castemen (Thevars) in stainless steel tumblers so that caste pollution may be avoided. If you don`t know it already, nobody has yet promoted the Thevars to the status of Brahmins.
You, the author and quite a few others need to go get your dicks cut off and join some other religion if you don`t like being Hindus.
By the way, you guys might also want to move to that paradise for minorities known as Pakistan.
[Good article overall. No mention of Meenakshipuram tho?]
How about you and the author forming a lynch mob against those who refused to give you water?
By the way, a$$hole, in a village in Tamil Nadu, where Dravidian parties have held the reins of power since 1967, a tea vendor was arrested for serving tea to Dalits in glass tumblers while serving to tea to his fellow castemen (Thevars) in stainless steel tumblers so that caste pollution may be avoided. If you don`t know it already, nobody has yet promoted the Thevars to the status of Brahmins.
You, the author and quite a few others need to go get your dicks cut off and join some other religion if you don`t like being Hindus.
By the way, you guys might also want to move to that paradise for minorities known as Pakistan.
#118 Posted by harimau on August 11, 2002 11:22:42 am
Ref Eunuch1 #: 116
[Hey Nagalingum (Chuhalingum?) you can start using your real name now. Your Naag (Rat?) Bhagwan will protect you.]
Naag (Rat?)/
No.
Naag (Snake).
You are welcome.
[Hey Nagalingum (Chuhalingum?) you can start using your real name now. Your Naag (Rat?) Bhagwan will protect you.]
Naag (Rat?)/
No.
Naag (Snake).
You are welcome.
#117 Posted by ali1 on August 11, 2002 3:37:22 am
Reply # 108 rsaxena
[``i went to this one cafe in palermo, sicily, and i must tell you, the coffee was the last thing i noticed...if you know what i mean....``]
We know exactly what you mean, beta..... you were busy ogling matadors in tight pants, right?
[``i went to this one cafe in palermo, sicily, and i must tell you, the coffee was the last thing i noticed...if you know what i mean....``]
We know exactly what you mean, beta..... you were busy ogling matadors in tight pants, right?
#116 Posted by ali1 on August 11, 2002 3:37:22 am
Reply # 105 arjun_m
[``What makes you think i would use my real name on the internet? :)``]
Hey Nagalingum (Chuhalingum?) you can start using your real name now. Your Naag (Rat?) Bhagwan will protect you.
[``What makes you think i would use my real name on the internet? :)``]
Hey Nagalingum (Chuhalingum?) you can start using your real name now. Your Naag (Rat?) Bhagwan will protect you.
#115 Posted by AlephNull on August 11, 2002 3:37:22 am
Fawad #44
Re. Saeed Naqvi`s article.- I agree in retrospect that it didn`t address the issue of your binary typology of Indian Muslims - `apologists`, including self-haters, and `fanatics`; although it did address the issue of cultural diversity, which is part of what I wanted.
On the other hand, the author of the article, Saeed Naqvi, is a well-known journalist who has frequently been critical of the current and previous governments (see his other columns if you don`t believe me), yet is certainly not a fundamentalist - thus an excellent example of somebody who defies your classification. Other well-known journalists and publicists who would break your proposed classification for the same reasons include M J Akbar, Seema Mustafa and Asghar Ali Engineer.
I can mention Dr. Yusuf Hamied, chairman of CIPLA - who was fairly outspoken on at least one occasion after the `93 riots in Bombay - as someone who similarly defeats your classification. And these folks are just the visible peaks on a huge population.
None of these folks have given up on the Indian system. Those who make that demand of Muslims in India as a test of `authenticity` are going to be overwhelmingly disappointed.
Re. Saeed Naqvi`s article.- I agree in retrospect that it didn`t address the issue of your binary typology of Indian Muslims - `apologists`, including self-haters, and `fanatics`; although it did address the issue of cultural diversity, which is part of what I wanted.
On the other hand, the author of the article, Saeed Naqvi, is a well-known journalist who has frequently been critical of the current and previous governments (see his other columns if you don`t believe me), yet is certainly not a fundamentalist - thus an excellent example of somebody who defies your classification. Other well-known journalists and publicists who would break your proposed classification for the same reasons include M J Akbar, Seema Mustafa and Asghar Ali Engineer.
I can mention Dr. Yusuf Hamied, chairman of CIPLA - who was fairly outspoken on at least one occasion after the `93 riots in Bombay - as someone who similarly defeats your classification. And these folks are just the visible peaks on a huge population.
None of these folks have given up on the Indian system. Those who make that demand of Muslims in India as a test of `authenticity` are going to be overwhelmingly disappointed.
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