Piece of What?

re: upman

{....u`ve been saying stuff abt her chasing cameras- care to substantiate? u shd probably stick to making witticisms abt stuff u know- like scout.....}

....as opposed to you, whose argument is simply that because she`s written a book, she should have the podium to mouth off?...fact is the woman has no credibility in india...what you and i say is irrelevant...you should stick to stuff you know about - like writing ``oh-that`s-so-sweet`` anecdotes about kerala...

rsax # 20 and others

..through all u`r posts i am yet to see u say

anything substantial against Roy....u`ve been

saying stuff abt her chasing cameras- care to

substantiate? u shd probably stick to making

witticisms abt stuff u know- like scout.....

..and what do you expect a writer/ activist to do

other than write abt things?...btw do u care if

she has done anything - u obviously know

she`s been doing a lot of work for NBA...whats

her fault if the cameras chase her?!...btw NBA

work is not easy...and she is dedicated....i

was at a malayalam literary function in Kerala

in 2000, where she suddenly, out of the blue

(and many thought inappropriately- in

presence of luminaries like adoor

gopalakrishnan, kamala das, mukundan,

pavan varma, etc) started talking abt NBA ,

asking for possible help.......are u aware how

much in $ terms the publicity she has

generated for NBA(and the international

support it has translated into) comes

to??.....do you know that she has contributed

the entire Booker prize money to the kerala

dalit sahitya akademi- `` i give this in memory

of Velutha`` (in case u read the book, which u

wouldnt hv)....

...a just publicity-crazy individual wouldnt hv

the stamina to last this long, and still be at

it.....she could hv easily played it safe, written

another book or written/acted in offbeat

movies....written abt the struggles of a writer

or an unconventional woman or such

stuff....but she isnt.....she is putting her money,

and limb, where her mouth is

...if ppl like u cd actually try to follow what she

is saying, rather than be so eager abt

parading u`r own attitude and smart-

aleckiness.....and be less infatuated with

symbolism like naidu`s laptop, india wd be a

much better place

The Pakistani ``elite`` had wild orgasms when Naom Chomsky came calling, and now with A. Roy they might faint or even die with ecstasy..... Both these leftie clowns have zero credibility in their own countries so whats the point in inviting them over?

Seems like ``aunties`` who came to listen to Roy might have confused her with some Indian film actress.

Also, where the hell has Sethi gotten the $$$ to launch an english newspaper from Karachi and Lahore simultaneously??? Jugnu Mohsin`s father left her a bookshop and a plaza on Mall Road Lahore, and Friday times sells exactly 69 copies, certain not enough to start publishing a new english newspaper.

to sadna, prem, nasah, sridhar, shankar,

zafar, dost-mittar and all indians here:

......please go to the Election Commission`s

website: http://www.eci.gov.in/ , to the

feedback section and convey your

appreciation and admiration of its courageous

stand not to let the genocidal BJP get away

with extracting votes from murdering and

burning babies....

.......there is a concerted attempt by

organizations like the overseas friends of BJP

(= enemies of India) and sympathisers to

demoralize one of the few actions we`ve seen

that reposes faith in a democratic india, and

that democracy will be used as a tool to

empower the weak, and not oppress them......

......the saddest fact of the events of gujarat is

that it has exposed those pretenders to

integrity- the shameless, debased

Magasaysay award winning ``intellectual`` Arun

Shourie who has not murmured a word on it

(who though has waxed eloquent about

probity and integrity when fighting that much

minor, almost, juvenile thug rajiv gandhi) and

our perennial turncoat socialist-fascist,

incredible pretender, liberator of Tibet and

Burma, and now sanctioner of yet more

murderous Gujarat Gaurav yatras, George

Fernandes.......its the employment of such

servile intellects and socialists that makes

this criminal bunch much more dangerous to

India....

read this about the legal standing of the BJP

on this issue:

``The BJP`s position had been further

undermined by legal experts attacking its

position that Art 174 of the Constitution

requires that the new assembly be constituted

by October as the last session of the previous

House was held in April. Senior lawyer Shanti

Bhushan, in a letter to the CEC, says that the

BJP, which is now using the Art 174

argument, had stated on oath before the apex

court in the UP elections case that the six-

month clause of Art 174 applies only to

successive sessions of the same House, not

to a new House. To quote Bhushan`s letter:

``The argument of Art 174 being used for

holding elections within six months of the last

assembly is so absurd that it has to be

rejected. What if the dissolution was made

two days before the expiry of six months from

the last session? Would the EC be told then

to hold elections within two days and

constitute a new House by then? What if there

was a war going on and it was not possible to

hold elections during that time? Would the

army be told to call off the war because six

months would elapse before the new House

could be constituted? Obviously the six

months in Art 174 refer to successive

sessions of the same House.``

http://www.outlookindia.com/

full.asp?fodname=20020826&fname=Cover+

Story+%28F%29&sid=3

Roy and Ram and Co., must after all bring their crackpot theories to Pakistan - for they cannot withstand an intellectual confrontation in India. Third rate intellectualism on the part of Jinnah made Pakistan a disaster from the word go. Third rate ``activism`` this time by Indian crackpots isn`t going to help either.

A Bangladeshi heading Amnesty International? A country where the events of autumn 2001 made Milosevic blush? Where an open season was declared on all things and persons Hindu? Where the party in power has publicly proclaimed that it will erase anything and everything Hindu from the face of the land? What a laugh!

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re: saminashah

{It seems that there are some interactors who don`t like her critiques of Indian policy viz the Narmada Dam? }

...no, as i said earlier, roy`s the type of person who will create a brouhaha if tomorrow the indian govt stops electricity theft...she`ll claim it is socially unfair for people to not be able to steal electricity...

...it is not about accepting constructive criticism or not...many people criticise but make constructive efforts at solutions at the same time...we also have journalists who do an excellent job exposing the a$$holes in the indian government...except they do it from behind the scenes...not by chasing tv cameras around town...

re: saraj

{The fact is, Roy shot out in the public world after writing a wicked little book}

..and the point is?...wonderful, a great book it was and may she write many more and win all the awards she deserves...

{...simply b/c a woman is forthcoming with her beliefs (political or not) doesn`t mean she`s attention deprived.}

...ummm, it has nothing to with her being a woman or not...

{I`m sure this Asma chick is great too but you can`t be that blind to ignore Roy`s efforts.}

...what efforts?...talking a lot and beating drums in public?...

Samina jaan...

[Again, she is a writer and NOT a politician in office; I appreciated the idea that she seemed to be delivering the meanings/realities of the communities she has worked with. This seems to be the role of a good writer`s literature, as Kafka wrote, is to be an axe with which to smash the frozen sea of the heart. In this time of rationalizations and disconnect, our best writers-Nadime Gordimer, Susan Sontag, Gabriel Garcia Marquez, Robert Pinsky-do exactly that. I`ll take their worlds over this world of bs any day.]

---Well said, behna!!!! *huge really affectionate hug * :)

And this is in response to you from another board...have just gotten your email address from a sweet soul, and will write soon!!!

ABOUT EGG SANDWICH,

The really useful info in the article is that they served sandwiches. It must be the most elitist place in pakistan, in india they would not serve anything, some tea and samosa in the north, some cofee and masala vadai in bangalore.

By collecting the baba black sheep croud munching on sandwiches, the organisers have made roy an entertainment for the rich. Well that reminds me of ylh who maintained that gandhi went to prison to enjoy the luxuries offered there.

#: 7

semipreciousme

...shandana, great write-up as usual...

``The other high point of the event were the egg sandwiches.``

...and the roast chicken:)...



Make up your fickle mind or is it feeble or unpredictable??

On YLH board you raved about her & sensing the flow of the wind against AR,you chime like an echoliliac addh kid ``..roast chicken``?????

Shandana,

Nice take this...do I espy a cynicism creeping in about the young ones of Pakistan...the apprehension only tightened when I remembered your age...:)

By the way...when are you going to add to the Pakistan`s vital statistics with a young one of your own...:)

I was kind of tickled to think two of India`s more dynamic editors should play the opening act to the Goddess of small things...she got 2 hours...suggests that the organisers too were perhaps making a Bollywood hit...aiming at the right audience and then tinging the event with that elusive cerebra...lity...:)

Harish

Shandana,

Intelligent, sharp review.

Chowkies

Again, she is a writer and NOT a politician in office; I appreciated the idea that she seemed to be delivering the meanings/realities of the communities she has worked with. This seems to be the role of a good writer`s literature, as Kafka wrote, is to be an axe with which to smash the frozen sea of the heart. In this time of rationalizations and disconnect, our best writers-Nadime Gordimer, Susan Sontag, Gabriel Garcia Marquez, Robert Pinsky-do exactly that. I`ll take their worlds over this world of bs any day.

It seems that there are some interactors who don`t like her critiques of Indian policy viz the Narmada Dam? I don`t know dudes, do you not like constructive criticism?

Dost Mittar,

(Hoping we can continue our argument on this board with Shandana`s permission)

I understand that you believe that gender parity must be the result of both genders working together. And that might be a good situation. Is it ideal? I don`t know.

In the meantime, I can`t say I`m against women`s grassroots movements that dialogue and facilliate supports and strategies. If we use the example of the very successful Sakhi movement in NYC, it was founder, organised, is run by women in various professions from South Asia. Not only does it provide immediate emotional, psych, and physical support for women, but the organization is involved in policy change for South Asian immigrant/South Asian American women in need of assistance. They tend to coalition with other progressive orgs; I`m not sure if any Islamic, Hindu, Christian, or Sikh religious org has affiliated themselves with Sakhi.

My grandfather was very moved by the life of his wife and was conscious of the limitations that had been placed on her since she was a very small girl. It was my grandmother`s experience that awakened his own conscience. It was the fear he felt for his daughters in that time of siege that made these brutal gender equations very clear to him. Externally, it may seem that he made the decisions in that family; to allow my uncles to run, to leave Agra, to spare my mother and aunt suffering...but it was my grandmother`s and his daughters` psychic pull that educated him. And he was a devout Muslim.

Prem

Do you say ``hats off to you, lady`` to imply I`m off the deep end? :)

Seriously, this week in the lives of my family is something I`ve been musing about for several years.

Interesting article, as usual.

All these ``peace`` yatras and jalsas are ok. But in the long run, they haven`t produced much, if anything. I suppose they are better than not having anything. I think people who don`t come in contact with Indians, on a regular basis, get quite excited by them. That is natural. Those of us who are surrounded by Indians ten hours a day, everyday, probably wouldn`t be too excited.

But a lot more needs to be done than just a prominent Pakistani going to India, saying two bad things about India and four bad things about Pakistan, and a prominent Indian coming to Pakistan and saying two bad things about Pakistan and four bad things about India. Both say a few bad things about the military, and a lot of bad things about religious parties. Of course they both address the, ``average`` Pakistani and Indian - assuming, ``average`` is someone who can get into Pearl Continental Hotel and read the Daily Times. This would be about 2% of Pakistan`s population. Interestingly it is people from this 2% who have been running Pakistan for ages, i.e. the fancy hotel visitors and English newpaper readers. Even those amongst the Army, those who have run Pakistan belong to this group. The maulvis, who do not belong to this group, have never had a chance run Pakistan (why does everyone keep jumping on their beards, all the time, for Pakistan`s problems then?).

Pakistanis (and Indians) need to stop blaming certain groups within their socieities for all the problems. We need to start blaming the group we belong to. There are people in Pakistan, who have now made a living through mere criticism. They criticise everything, and have become famous. I suppose this is all well and good, since someone needs to do this job. But I have more respect for someone who builds a cancer hospital, than someone who keeps lashing out at various govts. for not building one, but doesn`t take the initiative to build one himself/herself.

These speeches and peacefests have been going on for a while, now. They make everyone feel good. But, since they aren`t solving any problems, I think they need to be taken to the next level. What is needed is a joint Indo-Pak human rights commission at a large scale. Infact a joint South Asian Human Rights commission. The current head of Amnesty International is a Bangladeshi lady in her 40s, so it is possible for South Asians to hit it big in this field, also. This commission should consist of people who have a career record of telling it like it is. People like Arundhati Roy, Khushwant Singh, etc. Asma Jehangir (maybe, since I am unable to understand her agenda. She seems to just want to criticize every govt. for everything, without presenting any pratical solutions), Edhi etc.

This group should then stop worrying about political correctness, and stop trying to criticize both India and Pakistan equally on every issue. If India is wrong, its wrongs should be highlighted both in Pakistan and India, and in the rest of the world, without trying to equally blame Pakistan. And if Pakistan is wrong, its wrongs should be highlighted both in Pakistan and India, and in the rest of the world, without trying to equally blame India.

The organization should be above race, creed, religion, nationality etc. And it should try to appeal to the non luxury-hotel going/non English newspaper reading crowd. Since the PC/Daily Times crowd has done well enough in Pakistan and India, and isn`t as pushed about bringing change to the society, as the non PC going/Daily Times reading crowd.