Losing Something In Translation

#13 by Tipu on March 5, 2003 9:22pm PT

the height of it is the Hyderabadi (deccan) ``Parsaon`` which can strech back a few years in time!!

or the comment `` ho jayaga dont worry`` the cavet if you pay enough money is usually omitted. So when some one says `` ho jayaga dont worry`` it could mean eternity.

pretty funny and sarcastic!

regards.

Zak is writing and Zakkk is askkkeding from his neighbourer for kricitism? I will gladding.

Where is Ahmed Madani when you need him the most?

In Pakistan, like many other countries, mistakes start from the top.

Can`t really blame the translation.


Ras

recently, i saw an article somewhat critical of shireen mazari/jang opinion maker where she had mentioned about some murder in houston where after the murder discovery, people gave out ``sweetmeats``
the author wondered what ``sweatmeats`` meant?

Hmm I wanted some criticism guys not a linguistics lecture;)

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Ref veeresh #6

[``pre-poned``.]

``Pressurised``. I suppose whenever you apply the powers of persuasion to an Indian, he is either taken up to a high altitude in a modern aircraft or locked up in a hyperbaric chamber.

Ref godot #7

[ Nakamura, in his most brilliant book “Ways of Thinking of Eastern Peoples”, writes:

“Lack of Common Sense Concepts of Time:…The thought process which regards existence behind the phenomenal world as a more important than the phenomenal world itself, naturally results in destroying the concept of time, especially the concept of differences in time necessary for expressing specific events in experience…Thus Indian people do not have too clear a consciousness of the discrimination of tense.]

Just because Urdu/Hindustani/Hindi doesn`t have a word for yesterday different from tomorrow doesn`t mean the rest of the Indian languages don`t.

Most other languages have distinctly different words for yesterday and tomorrow and also modify the verb to denote both tense as well as singular/plural **and** gender of the subject. Eg. `Vandaan` in Tamil means `came` but specifically `He came`. On the other hand, Hindi speakers have been known to translate their thoughts from Hindi into English as `Why don`t you go to my house yesterday?` (meaning, `why don`t you come to my house tomorrow?`).

Hindian isn`t the same as Indian, if you get my drift.

Don`t know about Japanese but the Chinese language/grammar has no tense. None whatsoever. Nakamura can`t say the Chinese don`t have a sense of history.

Re: Sameer, #5

The title of the Indian movie you mention ``kal, aaj, aur kal`` sums up the South Asian mind-set exceedingly well: ``Yesterday, Today, and Yesterday``.

[The Nawabzada confirmed that the All Party Conference would not invite at least 12 parties. ]

There is no god except god (allah).

I agree with you, godot and Saimashah. kal is not specified in `aaj kal` meaning these days. Thanks for `kal chaudhiveen ki raat thi` to clearify past and yesterday. I guess there is one old Hindi movie, titled `kal, aaj aur kal` in which first kal is yesterday and the last is tomorrow - hopefully. If you say, kal ka kya meaning nobody knows future but it could equally be used for irrelevancy of past.

[The South Asian mind-set is to sacrifice the future for the past. When planning the future, they look behind not ahead. ]

kaisa perda hae keh chilman se lagay baithay haiN
saaf chuptay bhi naheeN, samnay aate bhi naheen

South-Asians are sticking to the chilman, scare to face reality of the future and ready to hide in the past at the first opportunity.

``pre-poned``. ``air-dashed``. ``India/Pakistan scoffs/displays rage at Pakistan`s/India`s position``. ``caught conspirating``. ``VVIP``.

Re: Saima, #3

Saima, I didn’t think of it that way when I wrote it, but you bring up an excellent point. The study of a language and the way of thinking of its people is absolutely fascinating. Nakamura, in his most brilliant book “Ways of Thinking of Eastern Peoples”, writes:

“In studying the ways of thinking of a people, we find one of the first clues in their language. Language is basic to the cultural life of a people, so basic that when a special language system comes into being, we may say that a people has come into being.

“Lack of Common Sense Concepts of Time:…The thought process which regards existence behind the phenomenal world as a more important than the phenomenal world itself, naturally results in destroying the concept of time, especially the concept of differences in time necessary for expressing specific events in experience…Thus Indian people do not have too clear a consciousness of the discrimination of tense. There seems to be a similar linguistic phenomenon in Hindustani in which the same word—“kal”, adverb—has two meanings, namely yesterday and tomorrow. Similarly, the term “person” means the day after tomorrow and at the same time the day before yesterday, and the term “atarson” means three days after and before…That Indian people are not very sharply aware of the discrimination of tense denotes their unwillingness to comprehend the current of time from past to future in the form of quantitative time through which the length of time is capable of being measured.

“There is tendency among the Indians, divested in general of the concept of a perceptible objective order, not to differentiate too sharply between the actual and the ideal or between fact and imagination or fantasy…The very rich and fanciful imagination characteristic of the Indian way of thinking leads them to ignore the common-sense limits of physical possibilities of things in space and time…Such extreme imagination often sweeps away historical facts…Indians’ love of fantasy also checked the development of natural sciences in India. Even chemistry, which is said to have developed very earlt in India, inevitably changed to a kind of magic…Everything is reshaped into fantastic images, and any kind of dream is regarded as truth and reality…The imaginations of the Indians ignores the natural limitations of time and space. It is free, boundless and extravagant, and often goes to extremes. And as they do not fully realize, in many cases, the distinction between realities and dreams, they continue to pursue their dreams even within the sphere of reality.

“This pattern of thought is quite significant in that it provides men dwelling in darkness with light and hope for the future; but because there is no grasping of the distinction between the real and the ideal, it lacks the force of the rational recognition and control of the hard facts of reality.”

What are you talking, man! We write the English better than the English.
And what goes of your father anyways, hain?


Very funny!

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re:godot

so true-Which language has the same word for tomorrow and yesterday? isnt that odd? and why is Urdu always written in present continuous? Our concept of time is incredible--maybe that is why we carry fueds forever....tomorrow is always yesterday.

Good one, Zak.

CNN, FOX, MSNBC and all networks are reporting that Khalid Shaikh Mohammad has been taken out of Pakistan except information minister of Pakistan, Sheikh Rashid Ahmed. `He is still in Pakistan`, says he.

Another very intersting article about Pakistani generals appeared in Defense Journal and copied in the current issue of satribune. It is written by Hamid Hussain??.

It’s not only the current regime in Pakistan which is that way, it was true about the previous governments as well. It’s the South Asian mind-set: vengeance. The South Asian mind-set is to sacrifice the future for the past. When planning the future, they look behind not ahead.