Survival of the Fittest

Romair: For once I agree with you when you say ``Take the good that comes from India (Madhuri and Ashwariya) and keep the bad out (Indian threats and attacks).``

To this I would only add that there is far, far more good in India than Ashwariya (democracy, Gandhian ideals even though they are in retreat nowadays, a rich history and culture that we share). As for the Indian threats (or more accurately, rantings of politicians like Advanis), Pakistan has the means to ensure they dont turn their dreams of overrunning and humiliating Pakistan (as I have no doubt Advani and plenty of other individuals in India would love to do) and that is enough. One day this cold war will end, and the ``bad`` that you see in India will also dissapear.

Also agree with you when you say that differences of opinion per se are a healthy thing.

d`souza #359 I agree with your opening sentence, and it proves that you are a very perceptive and insightful person. ;-)

On genes: I have heard of HUMAN genes, but did not realize that there was such a thing as Indian genes. But seriously, I think we should stop thinking in terms of Indian vs. non-Indian. Ghauri and party were invaders in the past few centuries only. Go further back in history, and EVERYBODY invaded India. Even the Dravidians (they came from Africa, just like Europeans, Chinese, and every other people on earth).
And if we look at the future, no one is going to be invading anyone else. That was a phase in human development that started with tribal warfare, contined with kingships, but starts to die out under democracies and with human development. India and Pakistan will realize this sooner or later.

hamidm #322 The India Pakistan confrontation (between the governments, or between people on chowk) is a rich man`s game.

The poor man in Chennai and the poor man in Lahore has more important things to worry about - like the next meal. To call a starving child or a widowed woman trying to keep body and soul together, or a schoolchild with dreams of making a life for himself or herself, or a young man doing odd jobs on the street, an enemy simply because he/she happens to be on the other side of the border requires, I think you will agree, an incredible stretch to the imagination. I quote again from my favorite philospher, Pogo: ``We have met the enemy, and he is us``.

Just forgot to mention the source of the story! It was an excerpt from the book, ``Leadership Wisdom from The Monk Who Sold His Ferrari`` by Robin Sharma. Since it was randomly but enthusiastically typed therefore the typos are justified.

Thanks.

Let us change track again and get the ``khujli ridden creature`` - Urstruly here.
Oye urstruly,
read what your ex-airchief Ashgar Khan says at http://www.dawn.com/weekly/dmag/dmag2.htm

``Yes. We must confess we made a lot of mistakes. The first mistake was made when Sardar Vallabhbhai Patel suggested that Pakistan take Kashmir and India get the state of Hyderabad, and Pakistani leaders turned it down. It is on record. Ultimately, we lost both. Then Sheikh Abdullah wanted to meet the Quaid-i-Azam before Partition, but it did not materialize. When Kashmir had still not acceded to India, we started an operation there. Let us forget about the past. Let us start afresh. Let us retrieve the situation. ``

#323 by Romair on May 1, 2003 4:33pm PT
``Take the good that comes from India (Madhuri and Ashwariya) and keep the bad out (Indian threats and attacks).``

kitne chalaak aur `opportunist` log...just like your arabic invading ancestors...
just like mushy uncle when he takes the best out of America and gets the best aids etc...even if...iske liye mushy ko apne hi paale huey `mullahs` ke khilaaf hi kyun na jana parey...

And ...ab kya hua...madhuri aur aish ko dekh kar kya karogey..indians are ugly and dark ...paki larkian gori gori kitni haseen...so what if they are silly..but will look good with handsome pakis...indian larkian `heeng-eaters` ... odiferous, malfeasant..ugly

tahmed..u r a good person..maybe have indian genes basically and are not a descendent of invading ghauris and ghaznis like urstruly is..

Sherdil,

A sweet story that I came across in a very interesting book that I would like to share. I am currently focusing on exploring some beautifully narrated myths in Leadership Wisdom from The Monk Who Sold His Ferrari by Robin Sharma. In light of what you wrote, I thought of sharing this with since you and some others may appreciate it.

So long long time ago...far far away...I am sorry that`s not how the story begins.

It starts from....``According to Indian mythology, all people on earth were once gods. However, they began to abuse their power, so the supreme god, Brahma, decided he would take this gift away from them and hide the godhead in a place where they would never find it.

One advisor suggested it be buried deep within the ground, but Brahma did not like that idea. ``Mankind will one day dig deep enough to find it,`` he said.

Another advisor suggested it be hidden in the deepest part of the ocean. ``No, said Brahma, ``one day mankind will dive deep enough to discover it.``

Yet another advisor suggested the godhead be placed on the highest peak of the highest mountain, but Brahma replied, ``No, mankind will eventually find a way to climb to the top and take it.``

After silently thinking about it, the supreme god finally found the ideal place for the greatest of all gifts.

``Here`s the answer`` Let`s hide it within man himself. He wil never think to look there.``

Dear Urstruly,

The following question was left abandoned and was ready to break into tears. Looking at the halat`ae`zaar, I carefully extracted the concern from one of my earlier posts and wanted to bring it to your kind attention.

``So, the British taught the South Asians on how to divide and rule. Who taught ``the select Pakistanis - mostly the ones in governance`` on how to get into everyone else`s mess and overlook one`s own?``

Any kind thoughts in ``normal font`` on the above query?

PS: I do not mean to put you on the spot, but since this is your interaction board, therefore I want to respect that. And, if you do not mind I may take the liberty of boring you to death by putting forth additional questions as time permits.

Polite Wishes.

arjun #313 And last year I guess the Indian army won a great victory. After ranting and raving and sending a million man army to the border, only to be confronted with reality. But dont let me stop you from hyperventilating your complexes on chowk...

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tahmed and the dixie chicks

``THEREFORE (per your assertion) chowk posters should reflect the same hostility in their posts.``

..............nobody is saying they should reflect hostility towards indians, but for god`s sake, you don`t have to aid and abet and coddle the enemy and then brag about helping starving sadhus in chennai ......... at least say `` i support the troops who are dying on siachin everyday`` instead of going on and on about contributing to charities on the other side of the border .........do you think martin sheen would do that ?........... even he would draw the line at sending a money order to saddam hussein........ as the guys on fox would say, `` you don`t have to be a weasel to be a nice guy``.........

............. looky here, even the dixie chicks had enough sense to see the idiocy of their position .........

hamidm #317:``on the other hand, the pathetic pakis are all over the map....it doesn`t matter, but it is silly to be all over the map ............. how the heck do you guys expect anyone to take you seriously - do something, or get off the pot ........... ``

You need to speak for yourself. Everyone else in Pakistan is just fine where they are.

It`s good to have all kinds of opinions. I certainly have no interest in marching to Delhi, or anywhere else. I am not quite sure which hole you pulled that one out of. I think the BJP and the one-opinion foreign policy vis-a-vis Pakistan that Indians believe in will do far more damage to India than any Pakistani could do. So why would me, or any Pakistani, be interested in marching anywhere. I don`t know if you have ever tried it, but marching is tough work, specially in the South Asian heat.

So I am fine where I am. But if a Pakistani wants to march to Delhi, by all means, he has a right to his opinion. And if a Pakistani wants Pakistan to join back into India, hey, good for him, as well. I don`t agree with either opinion, but its much better than having just one opinion.

Its a free world. And countries with opinions, ``all over the map,`` as you so eloquently described, tend to do much better in the long run, than countries that have one govt. sponsored opinion, that everyone must follow. That is what (used to make) made America great, and USSR not so great. If the Dixie Chics are the only ones disagreeing with Bush, then I am afraid USA is on its way down. Though I have heard, ``Stupid White Men`` (no, not your autobiography - I am talking about Michael`s book) is doing record sales, so maybe there is still hope for the USA.

You should thank God that Pakistan still has people with views all over the place. As long as they don`t try to take each other out (like the maulvis and the secularatics), there is still hope for Pakistan. If Indians support any view their govt. throws at them regarding Pakistan, then I am afraid they have lost the battle, before it has started.

Pakistanis have it correct in this regard. We used to watch Indian movies while sitting on alert duty against India, in underground shelters in the military. Our priorities were definitely correct. Take the good that comes from India (Madhuri and Ashwariya) and keep the bad out (Indian threats and attacks). This is why I still have faith in Pakistan, despite all your fears.

So let the tahmads and Urstrulys (and even Hamidms) of the world speak their mind. They may not make a lot of sense on most occassions, but that is not important.

hamidm2 #317 Your post needs to be read with a violin playing mournfully in the background, to set the mood.
However, it wasnt Kashmir about which I said anything. Rather, I had questioned your assertion that BECAUSE the Indian and Pakistani governments are in a state of cold war as a matter of policy at this time, THEREFORE (per your assertion) chowk posters should reflect the same hostility in their posts. This statement is too dumb for you to make, so I said I was sure you were kidding. Right?

Since you bring up Kashmir, I will repeat what I have always said: All of Kashmir is not worth one, single life. Indian or Pakistani. I shall play the violin now as you mull over this... (if you mull over anything, that is).

zeemax:
You could have chosen any number of industries and sectors to make your point and be right, but you chose the wrong one. The liberalisation process has worked unevenly for various industries in India but if it has had a desired effect on any one industry, it would have to be the automobile sector, both cars and auto-parts.
And you are particularly wrong re. Indica, an unhappy customer`s complaint notwithstanding. The car is not only 100% Indian manufactured but it is also 100% Indian designed and engineered. Tatas gambled their entire reputation on building this car and, after some initial bugs, it seems to be winning hearts and minds in India. The Indian auto market today is perhaps one of the toughest and most competitive, with a large proliferation in the number of cars being offered and new players entering all the time and some leaving the kitchen after not being able to stand the heat, like the Daewoo motors. I used Indica a few times during my recent long trip in Indian and found it very comfortable. It is interesting to note that suzuki/maruti rents in Delhi for Rs 450 per day while the charge for Indica is Rs. 500. I was advised against using it in the hills, though, as its diesel engine might be slow in starting in the cold mornings. Having said this, I saw any number of Indicas plying on the Himachal roads.
The Indian automobile is one of the few sectors in manufacturing which has emerged as globally competitive, with suzuki increasingly using its Indian plant (I believe it is now almost totally indigenised) for exporting to other countries. But I think the true success story belongs to those manufacturing car components, with companies like Sundaram Fastener being OEM suppliers to the Big Three in Detroit.

Oh, what the heck! This thread has mutated anyway..
On the subject of semis, i have been seeing a lot of patent applications from the TI facility in bangalore. Not computer chips obviously. TI specializes in mobile chips and such. Any one know the extent of their operations in india? How significant is their design team there?