Dost Mittar June 7, 2003
#54 Posted by dost_mittar on June 8, 2003 10:23:29 pm
kamalnsh#9
I think that Pakistan got its oases of modernity before India did. And in motorways and fast food outlets, it may still be ahead of India. But I encountered something new in India this year, and not just in the South: there is a new mood of confidence and a can-do attitude among the educated young people in India. The only other time when there was something even remotely similar was during the fifties when the Indian socialist idelogues thought that they had the solution to every problem not only of India but of the whole world.
nazar#10
A train journey through Pakistan is very much in my plans, and will be sooner than later, Insha-Allah (and more importantly, Insha faujee and Atalji!).
I think that Pakistan got its oases of modernity before India did. And in motorways and fast food outlets, it may still be ahead of India. But I encountered something new in India this year, and not just in the South: there is a new mood of confidence and a can-do attitude among the educated young people in India. The only other time when there was something even remotely similar was during the fifties when the Indian socialist idelogues thought that they had the solution to every problem not only of India but of the whole world.
nazar#10
A train journey through Pakistan is very much in my plans, and will be sooner than later, Insha-Allah (and more importantly, Insha faujee and Atalji!).
#53 Posted by bbabu on June 8, 2003 10:23:29 pm
ali87 #47
`` are you presuming that I am saying that US is country full of criminals on basis of this article? ``
The insinuation is that somehow people working for American relief organizations cannot ever commit crimes. Everybody knows people commit crimes. The real question is how well does the system do in catching these crooks. By catching and punishing crooks justice is served and future crime is deterred.
#52 Posted by dost_mittar on June 8, 2003 9:09:41 pm
Ansari#4
Thanks. You are right about the wretched lives of these poor people. But the colour, dance and music is indeed a woven into the fabric of Rajasthani life like in no other state that I visited. Every district has its own distinctive style of turbans and tunics. Rajasthanis excel in cloth paintings, chooris, saris, lehngas, etc. with colourful designs, amazing puppets...and the music, the street buskers with their ubiquitous sarangis who would play for you for nothing play their instrument more skilfully than many professional artists.
Naqshbandi#5
When an economy grows it is almost inevitable that disparities will first increase. While the gap may increase, the trickle down effect will ensure that the poor will benefit too. Thus, Korea may have greater disparities than India but the Korean poor are likely to do better than the Indian poor. As the great Chinese leader Deng once said, in China some people are going to get richer sooner than the others.
Nasah#7
I wouldn`t start celebrating too soon. The chances of Advani finding a place in Tihar are almost zilch, given the Indian legal system.
Thanks. You are right about the wretched lives of these poor people. But the colour, dance and music is indeed a woven into the fabric of Rajasthani life like in no other state that I visited. Every district has its own distinctive style of turbans and tunics. Rajasthanis excel in cloth paintings, chooris, saris, lehngas, etc. with colourful designs, amazing puppets...and the music, the street buskers with their ubiquitous sarangis who would play for you for nothing play their instrument more skilfully than many professional artists.
Naqshbandi#5
When an economy grows it is almost inevitable that disparities will first increase. While the gap may increase, the trickle down effect will ensure that the poor will benefit too. Thus, Korea may have greater disparities than India but the Korean poor are likely to do better than the Indian poor. As the great Chinese leader Deng once said, in China some people are going to get richer sooner than the others.
Nasah#7
I wouldn`t start celebrating too soon. The chances of Advani finding a place in Tihar are almost zilch, given the Indian legal system.
#51 Posted by dost_mittar on June 8, 2003 9:05:43 pm
SameerJB#1
Chowk is going to publish these articles, along with the Interacts, and has promised to split the royalty with me. :-)
It may be hard to believe that Ramakrishna Hegde was at one time known as belonging to the socialist wing of the Congress known as the ``young turks``. They were with Indira Gandhi when she split the party but soon left when they discovered that her socialism meant only slogans like garibi hatao. The other famous young turk was Chandrasekhar who went on to become prime minister, though for a very short while.
Chowk is going to publish these articles, along with the Interacts, and has promised to split the royalty with me. :-)
It may be hard to believe that Ramakrishna Hegde was at one time known as belonging to the socialist wing of the Congress known as the ``young turks``. They were with Indira Gandhi when she split the party but soon left when they discovered that her socialism meant only slogans like garibi hatao. The other famous young turk was Chandrasekhar who went on to become prime minister, though for a very short while.
#50 Posted by dost_mittar on June 8, 2003 9:05:43 pm
Pardesi:
If Indians succeed in using technology in the service of the common people, they will make a greater contribution to development than any do-gooding NGO.
Veeresh:
The Southern states, especially Tamil Nadu, seems to be quite pro-active in promoting employment of women and the disabled. One routinely comes across women supervisors and officers and blind office workers. And in Bangalore, one is likely to see as many women driving the scooter as riding it as a passenger.
If Indians succeed in using technology in the service of the common people, they will make a greater contribution to development than any do-gooding NGO.
Veeresh:
The Southern states, especially Tamil Nadu, seems to be quite pro-active in promoting employment of women and the disabled. One routinely comes across women supervisors and officers and blind office workers. And in Bangalore, one is likely to see as many women driving the scooter as riding it as a passenger.
#49 Posted by hrrehman on June 8, 2003 9:05:43 pm
I can`t figure it out if India is an emerging power or a dying empire
which has already seen it`s hayday in the mogul era.
which has already seen it`s hayday in the mogul era.
#48 Posted by pmishra2 on June 8, 2003 8:04:58 pm
Great article. While the north is behind, there is much admiration for the southern models and everyone from Amarinder Singh to Digvijay Singh to Budhadeb is trying to move in that direction.
In fairness, Jaisalmer vs. Bangalore is not a fair comparison. Comparing Pune or Noida to Bangalore would be more even handed. Also interior of South (especially parts of AP and Karnataka) can reveal some stunning backwardness. BTW, all our Infosys people are from Mohali near Chandigarh.
By the way I read a wonderful quote about our besharam Vishwa Hinsa Parishad cretins: engaged in destroying India`s future so that it can have an ideal past !!!
In fairness, Jaisalmer vs. Bangalore is not a fair comparison. Comparing Pune or Noida to Bangalore would be more even handed. Also interior of South (especially parts of AP and Karnataka) can reveal some stunning backwardness. BTW, all our Infosys people are from Mohali near Chandigarh.
By the way I read a wonderful quote about our besharam Vishwa Hinsa Parishad cretins: engaged in destroying India`s future so that it can have an ideal past !!!
#47 Posted by Ali87 on June 8, 2003 8:04:58 pm
#41 by bbabu on June 8, 2003 4:29pm PT
are you presuming that I am saying that US is country full of criminals on basis of this article?
are you presuming that I am saying that US is country full of criminals on basis of this article?
#46 Posted by hamidm2 on June 8, 2003 8:04:58 pm
ali87
.......... i have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say with your example of the bullock-powered dump truck ..........are you saying that this is what farmers in india and pakistan should be using instead of tractors and real dump trucks? ..........and what was the point in the post about the local shoes? ..... do you know how uncomfortable those cheap ``khusas`` are and how limited that market is compared to nikes and reeboks? .............all this talk about encouraging cottage industries and preserving rural traditions is bunkum sponsored by people who can`t see beyond their nose.............. you cannot build a modern economy by selling cheap pottery made by the village potter and his foolish apprentice on a foot-powered wheel!.......... it is a waste of time and energy and something silly idle women do in pottery class ............ the answer is to set up factories that export reeboks that sell for a hundred bucks apiece, and calphalon frying pans that sell for two hundred a piece so that the shoe-maker and the potter can make enough money to buy imported beer and locally made cars............
............ that is how china is doing it ........ the potters and the shoe makers are providing dishes and shoes to folks living in the hamptons .........and last year they made and bought over a million cars and this year they will sell over a million and a quarter ..........now that is real growth!...........and let`s not even begin to compare china to india - there is no comparison ............. shanghai is comparable to manhattan, not mumbai ........... and contrary to what sadna thinks, this phenomenal growth is all driven by exports, not by quaint village crafts sold to city folks who quibble over paying a hundred rupees for a plate of idlee ................. that is how spain did it after franco (its growth was almost entirely fuelled by multinationals), that is how ireland did it, and that is how china is doing it ............. and that is exactly what the indian it industry has done .............
.......... let us not get hung up on idealistic nonsense about preserving our cultural heritage and local industries - there is no demand for cheap khadar spun on a hand wheel or putrid goat milk ............
.......... i have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say with your example of the bullock-powered dump truck ..........are you saying that this is what farmers in india and pakistan should be using instead of tractors and real dump trucks? ..........and what was the point in the post about the local shoes? ..... do you know how uncomfortable those cheap ``khusas`` are and how limited that market is compared to nikes and reeboks? .............all this talk about encouraging cottage industries and preserving rural traditions is bunkum sponsored by people who can`t see beyond their nose.............. you cannot build a modern economy by selling cheap pottery made by the village potter and his foolish apprentice on a foot-powered wheel!.......... it is a waste of time and energy and something silly idle women do in pottery class ............ the answer is to set up factories that export reeboks that sell for a hundred bucks apiece, and calphalon frying pans that sell for two hundred a piece so that the shoe-maker and the potter can make enough money to buy imported beer and locally made cars............
............ that is how china is doing it ........ the potters and the shoe makers are providing dishes and shoes to folks living in the hamptons .........and last year they made and bought over a million cars and this year they will sell over a million and a quarter ..........now that is real growth!...........and let`s not even begin to compare china to india - there is no comparison ............. shanghai is comparable to manhattan, not mumbai ........... and contrary to what sadna thinks, this phenomenal growth is all driven by exports, not by quaint village crafts sold to city folks who quibble over paying a hundred rupees for a plate of idlee ................. that is how spain did it after franco (its growth was almost entirely fuelled by multinationals), that is how ireland did it, and that is how china is doing it ............. and that is exactly what the indian it industry has done .............
.......... let us not get hung up on idealistic nonsense about preserving our cultural heritage and local industries - there is no demand for cheap khadar spun on a hand wheel or putrid goat milk ............
#45 Posted by Studebaker on June 8, 2003 6:47:56 pm
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#44 Posted by Studebaker on June 8, 2003 6:03:18 pm
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#43 Posted by Studebaker on June 8, 2003 5:40:24 pm
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#42 Posted by Studebaker on June 8, 2003 5:40:24 pm
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#41 Posted by bbabu on June 8, 2003 4:29:12 pm
ali87 #40
Nobody said that America has no crime. The state makes a strong attempt to punish as many as them as possible within the rules of the system. I will conceed that they became too lenient in the 1960s and 1970s. America has a better justice system whether you are a victim or the culprit.
Nobody said that America has no crime. The state makes a strong attempt to punish as many as them as possible within the rules of the system. I will conceed that they became too lenient in the 1960s and 1970s. America has a better justice system whether you are a victim or the culprit.
#40 Posted by Ali87 on June 8, 2003 3:39:51 pm
a bit unreleated but check this out..
US film producer pleads guilty to beheading his own director
By David Usborne in New York
08 June 2003
Three weeks after a first screening of his film about an Afghan refugee navigating western culture in America, producer Nathan Powell finds himself in prison this weekend after pleading guilty to killing his director and stuffing his severed head in a freezer.
...
tahmed32 etc apologists for america..
some good reason may countries have to be suspicions of all american activites in thier countries including relif organisations..
here is what the prosecution said in the above case..
. Prosecutors later revealed that Mr Wassel had given the US authorities 80 hours of film showing roads and mountain passes in his native country to help American intelligence to plan their subsequent invasion of Afghanistan.
US film producer pleads guilty to beheading his own director
By David Usborne in New York
08 June 2003
Three weeks after a first screening of his film about an Afghan refugee navigating western culture in America, producer Nathan Powell finds himself in prison this weekend after pleading guilty to killing his director and stuffing his severed head in a freezer.
...
tahmed32 etc apologists for america..
some good reason may countries have to be suspicions of all american activites in thier countries including relif organisations..
here is what the prosecution said in the above case..
. Prosecutors later revealed that Mr Wassel had given the US authorities 80 hours of film showing roads and mountain passes in his native country to help American intelligence to plan their subsequent invasion of Afghanistan.
#39 Posted by Ali87 on June 8, 2003 3:39:50 pm
this was the link
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=413385
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