Saroop Gul January 2, 2004
#17 Posted by adeelabbas on February 10, 2004 11:40:53 pm
Nice article... let me just add that graduate studies in Pakistan are also on the decline, top-schools like GIK, NUST and FAST are gradually on the decline. The dearth of PhD`s is also a severe problem. The PhDs who are already there cannot be classified as true experts. Many half-baked PhDs earn well above 6 figures because there are so few of them.
The total number of good computer scientists in Pakistan when combined will only make about one University faculty in the US. There is absolutely no research whatsoever in any Pakistani University. Subjects like for example Bio-Medical Engineering which are seen as future in US are not known by students in Pakistan.
The total number of good computer scientists in Pakistan when combined will only make about one University faculty in the US. There is absolutely no research whatsoever in any Pakistani University. Subjects like for example Bio-Medical Engineering which are seen as future in US are not known by students in Pakistan.
#16 Posted by mumbaikar on January 29, 2004 12:24:25 pm
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#15 Posted by M.B.Z.Isphahani on January 8, 2004 10:07:19 am
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#14 Posted by M.B.Z.Isphahani on January 8, 2004 4:29:20 am
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#13 Posted by dullabhatti on January 5, 2004 1:11:27 pm
Harimau: that is very interesting...I knew somewhat about Swaroop in sanskrit...now that you throw in the term Ram Swaroop..Ram who was a King...but I am sure the word Swaroop alone won`t mean King in Sanskrit although Sindhi like Punjabi has lot of words derived from Sanskrit.
#12 Posted by lala on January 5, 2004 7:48:19 am
Ms Sha, I got ur point.No exams can not measure students ability of critical thinking but yes they can disrupt the learning process the way a teacher wants his or her students to learn and develop their learning or what u call critical faculaties owing to a couple of factors.firstly teachers r rarely consulted in devising their course outlines in ideological states like ours. Consequently they enjoy less independence.Secondly, theyve to meet deadlines to complete their courses .They r evaluated solely on the ratio of their studentswho got good grades in exames.By the way do u think that students r placed in job markeet by their grades or through their critical approach.But being a teacher I still believe that a middle road can be devised by giving a teacher liberty to evaluate his students in his own way.To Ms gul s point I would say that teacher do go extra miles but students have lost patience I m afraid.What we ve to do is to made certain intutional arrangement the firt being to change and to overhaul our exam system which has become a great impediment in our learning process. I think that this debate should continue the credit of which goes to our young part time teacher Ms gul.
#11 Posted by harimau on January 5, 2004 7:48:18 am
Ref dullabhatti #10
[Saroop, Saroop in Punjabi/Hindi is used in two meanings...one is handsome in looks..sa-roop...sohna roop or good roop..used interchangebly for handsome and beautiful...Second is for similar...two roops(feature forms)...two forms/features being similar or saroop or I think sawaroop in sanskrit.]
That is a neat derivation for the name Saroop. I thought it might be a corruption of `Swaroop` from Sanskrit. A name like Ram Swaroop would then mean `the figure (or visage) of Ram himself`.
[Saroop, Saroop in Punjabi/Hindi is used in two meanings...one is handsome in looks..sa-roop...sohna roop or good roop..used interchangebly for handsome and beautiful...Second is for similar...two roops(feature forms)...two forms/features being similar or saroop or I think sawaroop in sanskrit.]
That is a neat derivation for the name Saroop. I thought it might be a corruption of `Swaroop` from Sanskrit. A name like Ram Swaroop would then mean `the figure (or visage) of Ram himself`.
#10 Posted by dullabhatti on January 4, 2004 9:42:52 pm
Saroop, Saroop in Punjabi/Hindi is used in two meanings...one is handsome in looks..sa-roop...sohna roop or good roop..used interchangebly for handsome and beautiful...Second is for similar...two roops(feature forms)...two forms/features being similar or saroop or I think sawaroop in sanskrit.
Thanks for clarification about Sindhi saroop...I had a collegemate named Saroop Singh Gill once thats why I asked about it.
Thanks for clarification about Sindhi saroop...I had a collegemate named Saroop Singh Gill once thats why I asked about it.
#9 Posted by DRUMZ on January 4, 2004 5:05:56 pm
Somethin to think about... We live in a world which uses an overwhelmingly left brained educational system, yet most of the people we idolize ``make it`` in society succeed through right brained activities (the arts, sports etc).
This is a ripple effect from the scientific rev. where if something couldnt be stated in numbers and observation, it was not true. Left brained science is inherently ILLOGICAL.
As for education, most educated people are indoctrinated idiots. Most of the people on this site have university degrees yet almost ALL particiapte in the same tired debates. Almost all just defend the religion or country they were born into. This requires zero thinking.
School measures largely ones ability to memorize. It stimulizes only the left brain. pictures, videos, exercises and the arts are rarely used, thus half of ones brain is not even cultivated.
This is a ripple effect from the scientific rev. where if something couldnt be stated in numbers and observation, it was not true. Left brained science is inherently ILLOGICAL.
As for education, most educated people are indoctrinated idiots. Most of the people on this site have university degrees yet almost ALL particiapte in the same tired debates. Almost all just defend the religion or country they were born into. This requires zero thinking.
School measures largely ones ability to memorize. It stimulizes only the left brain. pictures, videos, exercises and the arts are rarely used, thus half of ones brain is not even cultivated.
#8 Posted by Saminasha on January 4, 2004 11:08:55 am
#7
You`ve missed my point.
How does learning become meaningful to students?
Does rote memorization guarantee critical thinking abilities?
How can experimenting with different teaching methodologies develop these abilities?
You`ve missed my point.
How does learning become meaningful to students?
Does rote memorization guarantee critical thinking abilities?
How can experimenting with different teaching methodologies develop these abilities?
#7 Posted by sGul on January 4, 2004 9:18:07 am
Dear All!!!
Thank you for taking time out to read this piece and more so for interacting. I have tried to seek solutions for the concerns I had with the education culture when I was a student and now see among my students.
I have had teachers who went the extra mile to show us the other side of the picture and these are the teachers who have left a lasting impression. I am a die-hard optimist who believes that things can be made better even if on a basic level with our small efforts. I am trying, and hoping that others will try too.
lala: In response to your kind comments on the author page, lemme tell you that I also work as a Teaching Assistant part time :)
dullabhatti: I dont know what ``Saroop`` means in Sanskrit/ Punjabi/ Hindi. In Sindhi it means ``King``. I am named after my father`s grandmother.
Thanx again.
sGul
Thank you for taking time out to read this piece and more so for interacting. I have tried to seek solutions for the concerns I had with the education culture when I was a student and now see among my students.
I have had teachers who went the extra mile to show us the other side of the picture and these are the teachers who have left a lasting impression. I am a die-hard optimist who believes that things can be made better even if on a basic level with our small efforts. I am trying, and hoping that others will try too.
lala: In response to your kind comments on the author page, lemme tell you that I also work as a Teaching Assistant part time :)
dullabhatti: I dont know what ``Saroop`` means in Sanskrit/ Punjabi/ Hindi. In Sindhi it means ``King``. I am named after my father`s grandmother.
Thanx again.
sGul
#6 Posted by Awan on January 4, 2004 9:18:07 am
I agree both with the author and also with Lala. First of all most of the teachers at school level, at least, have limited knowledge of the subject and they dont want students to question and insult them before the class. At college level I agree that if you dont follow the exam-technique route you are never going to get the grades you need to get somewhere in life. As far as samina goes well one needs to have a sparkling grade sheet to get to the top colleges regardless of your knowledge and intellectual abilites. I havent heard of any Ivy League or Russell Group University claiming that a student can have poor grades yet they are going to provide a very individualized approach and judge every case on its merits sort of thing. A mishap maybe be fine but never would knowledge-over-marks approach be accepted.
#5 Posted by dullabhatti on January 3, 2004 12:38:35 pm
It is rare to see a Pakistani name like Saroop...I was wondering if it is the saroop of Sanskrit/Punjabi/Hindi wala or it means something in some other languages too? Above all I misread it twice, one article before by the author, as Saroop Gill.
#4 Posted by anew on January 3, 2004 9:49:06 am
If repeating facts without insight helped, parrots would rule the world.
They are ruling. How much insight you see in `the one who are ruling` the world? Who can doubt the `creativity and intelligence` of Bush and Blair? I think we should go `beyond the books` and look `outside the class room`. We need `insight` to see the `reality` and give up the prejudice and hatred.
And most of all we need to encourage Ethics and Morals. Clinton and Bush did not have bad teachers and schools. Both lack something. We need to explore the `systems` which are producing Ariel Sharons, Modis and Bushes. They had more `worse` educational institutions than `madrassah` - one time funded and supported by US to produce Jihadis for War Against Russia.
#3 Posted by Saminasha on January 3, 2004 4:57:29 am
Lala,
A great point; how do exams measure student ability to think about and explore ideas critically? To what extent are constant examinations attenuated gauges of intellectual performance and potential? To what extent do they disrupt the learning process and its goals?
A great point; how do exams measure student ability to think about and explore ideas critically? To what extent are constant examinations attenuated gauges of intellectual performance and potential? To what extent do they disrupt the learning process and its goals?
#2 Posted by lala on January 2, 2004 8:44:43 am
brilliant piece of writing but rarely exercied in our educational institutions especially in public sector institutions.I am teaching history in a college for the last ten years but I could not realie the goals mentioned in the said article due to couple of factors the main being our examination system.Anyway I agree one hundred percent what saroop has uttered in her article keep it up ms or mr saroop gul
#1 Posted by Saminasha on January 2, 2004 4:21:04 am
These are the kinds of discussions that take place in knowledge making disciplines like Comp Theory, where the emphasis is on inspiring students to develop critical thinking systems.
Interestingly enough, this relatively young field emerged in the last 30 years after the Women`s, Civil Rights, Anti War movements, and in the wake of mass Non English speaking immigration to North America. The average student was not necessarily an 18 year old middle class, white male who entered college straight after school-but female, of color, having worked for several years, a parent, a veteran, an immigrant. The idea that a college education is not a mechanism of class, but something that everyone has access to has changed the way North Americans think about education.
The ongoing issue is balancing rote info with critical and exploratory research; i.e. a student who has brilliant ideas but has not developed adequate grammar skills. On one hand, there is a certain amount of rote info that has to be familiar to the student so that she/he may function at a certain level of competancy. On the other hand, she/he must be encouraged to explore those ideas that are meaningful and relevant to her/him and her life.
Interestingly enough, this relatively young field emerged in the last 30 years after the Women`s, Civil Rights, Anti War movements, and in the wake of mass Non English speaking immigration to North America. The average student was not necessarily an 18 year old middle class, white male who entered college straight after school-but female, of color, having worked for several years, a parent, a veteran, an immigrant. The idea that a college education is not a mechanism of class, but something that everyone has access to has changed the way North Americans think about education.
The ongoing issue is balancing rote info with critical and exploratory research; i.e. a student who has brilliant ideas but has not developed adequate grammar skills. On one hand, there is a certain amount of rote info that has to be familiar to the student so that she/he may function at a certain level of competancy. On the other hand, she/he must be encouraged to explore those ideas that are meaningful and relevant to her/him and her life.
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