French Not the Only Offenders on Hijab

Forget armchair musings: This is what learned ones think and write. The ones who matter to intelligent Pakistanis. Not the english-trash columnists.

One point of view via sulekha

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/02/11/1076388433814.html
France`s great paradox to pursue secularism with religious zeal
February 12, 2004

Years of church-state conflict can help explain why the veil has been banned from schools, writes Sophie Masson.

It`s on. The lower house of the French Parliament has overwhelmingly voted to make into law the proposal to ban wearing ``ostensible religious symbols`` such as veils, yarmulkes and large crucifixes in public schools. The idea seems to be catching on elsewhere - Belgium and Germany have indicated they would consider a similar law.

To many Australians, however, it seems bizarre. What are the French on about? What has caused the country which trumpets itself as ``the home of the rights of man`` to indulge in such clumsy, unjust attempts at anti-religious repression?

Well, it`s the latest instalment in a 200-year-old French battle. To understand the situation, it`s useful to know that background, which shows a long-standing tension between religion and the republic.

It began in 1792, with the extremist Jacobins seizing power in France. Jacobinism is a paradox: a mix of revolutionary atheism and authoritarian republican statism. This resulted in a concerted attack on religion, leading to a hideous civil war which claimed hundreds of thousands of victims in the west of France.

The coming to power of Napoleon meant the repeal of much Jacobin anti-clericalism and for a time, there was peace between politicians and the church. However, in 1880 the militantly atheistic Jules Ferry (an ancestor of the present Education Minister, philosopher Luc Ferry) started the war with religion again, expelling all religious staff from public schools, and nuns from hospitals. France seemed set for turmoil again, but fortunately moderate elements intervened.

In 1902, under another militant atheist, Emile Combes, it flared up again. Not content with closing down more than 2500 religious schools, Combes`s government forbade all people from religious orders to teach. It went too far when one minister attempted a secret purge to rid the bureaucracy of anyone with religious convictions. It was too much for Parliament, and the government fell.

The separation of church and state law of 1905 was an attempt at balancing the different forces, going some way to reaffirming freedom of worship. But it caused strife by forbidding any religious instruction at all in public schools, nationalised much church property, and forbade the erection of new religious symbols in any public space (including graveyards).

And it was not until after World War I that diplomatic relations were resumed between the Vatican and France.

In 1941, the collaborationist Vichy government repealed the 1905 laws. When Charles de Gaulle came to power after the liberation, he restored some but not most of the 1905 laws, for instance, allowing the church to keep its property.

Today, France faces resurgent religion, and resurgent Jacobinism. The difference is that it`s not Christianity, but Islam, that`s the challenge to the unitary state and republican secularism these days. The state has been pussyfooting for a long time over Islamist militancy in the ``zones`` as they`re called in France (outer suburbs of big cities), rising anti-Semitism, and a rise in what is euphemised as ``incivility``, which includes violent misogyny among some Muslim boys. The new law is an attempt to show that they can still control the situation.

By banning symbols and depriving people of the right to religious expression, they are stirring up trouble but are not targeting the real problem - the failure of French society to integrate its Muslim youth, and the consequent rise in the influence of radicals.

It`s not necessarily about prejudice, incidentally, but rather a problem of mixed messages: French politicians and intellectuals denigrating their heritage, particularly that of non or pre-Jacobin France, yet at the same time they are most punitive if young people do not show respect for the ``saints`` of the Revolution, and for ``republican values``. Young people end up not respecting anything at all about their country. Who can be surprised?

Luc Ferry said recently that his ideal is a system of religious-style ethics: a secular system that goes deep but keeps religion well out, calling it ``sacred secularism``. He was not challenged on the contradiction. Perhaps that was because it perfectly illustrated the French paradox.

Sophie Masson is a French-Australian author.

ballukhan #212 this ``shamsul`` is only gujjubania trying to be clever. no big deal.

#210 by echoboom on February 6, 2004 6:51am PT
Souls lost in the mediaval history- they play their imaginary jehads in their fantasises. perverse mindset!!! behind all this is the satanic desire to slave the souls into submission.

#209 by shamsul on February 5, 2004 1:49pm PT

Miyan, Kafir tum ho ki woh yeh to upar wala hi bataiga!!!

``...We are a separate society and soon when the General is gone we will make sure that only Islamic values are followed...``

tahmed saheb, we have another jehadi in our ranks now!

This is to remind the ignorant-ones still leeching on to colonised mindset. The ones who were unfortunate not to get a madressa learning.

Distribute to muslims especially the near-muslims, afar-muslims, and anti-muslims.


Hand-delivered to President Chirac of France.


An Open letter from Hizb ut-Tahrir to President Chirac, President of the Republic of France

uploaded 08 Jan 2004



بِسْمِ اللهِ الرَّحْمنِ الرَّحِيمِِ
An Open letter from Hizb ut-Tahrir to President Chirac, President of the Republic of France

Monsieur le President,

We were hesitant to write this letter and there were two reasons for this hesitance:

Firstly; we do not represent a State. We are a political party whose ideology is Islam working for the resumption of the Islamic way of life by establishing the Islamic State, the Rightly guided Khilafah State in the Muslim lands. Since we do not represent a State we felt that you might find it inappropriate that a party writes to you rather than a state writing to a major power such as France.

Secondly; we do not write to any ruler who we believe will not accept the demands of our letter. We heard your speech on 17th December 2003 regarding the wearing of the Hijaab by Muslim women in France. We heard you say explicitly that France adopts secularism as a system and ideology and that you will not allow any religious symbolism in your institutions. We also heard you say explicitly that the Hijaab, i.e. the headscarf worn by Muslim women, is a religious symbol like wearing a cross and other such symbols, whereas in Islam the headscarf for a woman is considered a divine obligation like prayer and fasting. Thus, we understood from your speech that this matter has been decided by you and that you will not reconsider your recommendation to pass a law banning the Hijaab. Consequently, had we written to you there would have been little chance of you accepting our request.

In consideration of two points we decided to write to you:

Firstly: 480 years ago in the sixteenth century, we, the Muslims, undertook an act of goodwill towards France.

Secondly: Historically, France has a tradition of chivalry and reciprocating acts of goodwill.

It is our expectation in writing this letter, that the France of today will reciprocate the act of goodwill undertaken towards the France of yesterday. The French king Francis I was captured at the battle of Pavia in 1525. France felt humiliated by the capture of her king but her army was unable to rescue him from captivity. She made recourse to the Islamic Khilafah state, under the Ottomans, at that time, and she sent a messenger on behalf of the king of France on 6th December 1525 seeking help from the Islamic State. The messenger met the Ottoman Caliph Sulayman al-Qanooni who responded to his call. Sulayman gave the messenger a letter which read: “…we have received the letter delivered by your messenger, and in which you stated that your enemy has attacked your country and you are imprisoned and seek our help in respect to securing your release. We have answered your request so be at ease and do not worry…” This is how Sulayman responded. The Khilafah state used its international weight and military power to rescue the king of France and made an effective contribution towards his release.

The Caliph of the Muslims helped France without compensation, without occupying a part of France or colonising any region of France in return. Rather he did the action as an act of goodwill. Furthermore, the Treaty of Constantinople that was concluded in 1536 between the Caliph of the Muslims, Sultan Sulayman al-Qanooni and the king of France, Francis I, granted France concessions in the Islamic State which were granted to no other state.

Monsieur le President,

This is the act of goodwill that our State, the Islamic State, the Ottoman Khilafah State, undertook for the France of yesterday. Will the France of today reciprocate this act of goodwill to the Muslims and annul the decision to ban the wearing of the Hijaab by Muslim women in France?

We will wait and see - if France today reciprocates this act of goodwill then this will be a good gesture towards the Islamic Khilafah state when we re-establish it by Allah’s leave.

Kindly accept our greetings.

Hizb ut-Tahrir
9 Dhul Qa’dah 1424 AH

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#200 by tahmed32 on January 28, 2004 3:42pm PT
You forgot that the whole clan of Dagars sing the Dhrupads in praise of the Indian gods magnificiently- entire generations of muslim musicians have sung khayal compositions in praise of the God Krishna and his dalliance with Gopis of Braj. How can anyone forget RasKhan? his composition - Manusha hun to wohi.... has been sung thousands of times by the Dagars! You know that the muslims weave the chadars and chunaris, put gotas, make idols, provide misthans for numerous temples in India- none of us consider it to lesson our faith in Islam! The Dagar clan is a living example of the strength of Islam- Islam is not only about respect for other human beings- but also about humility in your attitude -something which the rascal Purists cannot understand in their attempts to sell their ``Pure-ware``.

#204 by Ralph:

``Which Pakistanis are you talking about? The ones who have funded Jihadis all over the world? Or the ones who support legal discrimination against people on the basis of religion?``

Please read my post again. I am talking about the other 99.99% Pakistanis who are broad minded.

``Without getting in between your Hindu-Muslim love affair, I can tell you that this is just nonsense. You should know that. ``

No its not nonsense. If it were, Indian Government would not be allowing PTV telecasts in India (see the post from fountainheader). The only time India has banned PTV airtime is when Pakistan was ``bombarding with propaganda`` about ``so called`` Indian attrocities in Indian held Kashmir.

``Your constant support to Romair is hardly unexpected. The two of you share the Pakistani way of thinking. ``

Read my post again with an open mind. I stated that I support romair`s posts on a particular viewpoint. For example, and this is just an example, I don`t support him at all on Imran Khan`s Tehreek-e-Insaf being the savior of Pakistanis, Mullas being better than the so called seculars of PPP and PML, etc.

Tahmed,

I guess we all have strong opinions and views on matters that are close to our heart.

How you put it or how you express yourself is certainly an individual`s style!

Take Care.

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Ahmadzai #199

``I keep saying that Pakistanis are very broad-minded people, something that has been lost on some brain-washed Indians under the heavy negative propaganda of their Government and media.``

Which Pakistanis are you talking about? The ones who have funded Jihadis all over the world? Or the ones who support legal discrimination against people on the basis of religion?

``Surprisingly, Pakistani Government and media have never been so harsh against ``Hindu` India and `Hindus`.

Without getting in between your Hindu-Muslim love affair, I can tell you that this is just nonsense. You should know that.

``Hence my constant support to romair`s messages when he writes that Pakistan should open its borders to Indians and let them see the truth.``

Your constant support to Romair is hardly unexpected. The two of you share the Pakistani way of thinking.

Ahmadzai 198

Thanks for the post. It is good to know about these gestures. We already have PTV being broadcast in India. I hope that the Pakistani private channels start broadcasting in India as well.

Tahmed #196,

Hmm, you have got a point there.

ahmedzai #198 It is indeed nice to see that we have this young man taking interest in, and participating in, hindu celebrations in sindh. Clearly this is the reassurance and welcome that we owe to hindus, christians and people of other minority religions in Pakistan. Interestingly, one of our own muslim festivals in Pakistan (called Sung, where pilgrims go from village to village, hold melas, collect offerings, and then go to a pir`s grave) dates all the way back to the ancient Harappan civilization which started around 4000 BC.

I have no doubt about the sincerity of your post - after all, no one is running for elections on chowk and we can freely speak our mind. This is in fact where the true character of people comes out - the genuinely decent and intelligent ones, and the specimen who probably go around wearing fake smiles in real life, and then come to chowk in the evening to spill their bile and take out their frustrations by cursing us pakis or white people and so on. For such people, I pray that they find peace from whatever is troubling them
:-)

Thanks for your kind words concerning my saying that Islam mandates respect for all religions. I am merely conveying what is there in the Quran but is too easily forgotten by some people. And you have already shown on chowk that you dont need any lessons in such matters from me or anyone else. But thanks anyway.