A Song for the Lord of the Hills

hamidm:

honestly, with ellipsis if you please. . .why do you find it absolutely necessary to ridicule all those who believe? is there absolutely no room for what you believe, and what i, for example believe? just curious, thank you.

and no, i have nothing to share about the Virgen Maria de Guadalupe shrine visit, given that i`ve never been. but i`d be interested in hearing about someone who did. : )

and i shall light a candle for you next time i`m in church!!!
n~

Many of the muslims in India - remember their Hindu past. A whole village
in Rajasthan returned to Hinduism recently.

Most of the singers, so called sufis even in Pakistan - remember their past.

In India, musicians like Ustad Allauddin Khan and Ali Akbar Khan all remember
their Hindu past - they would do a Shiva-pooja at home.
They are all ``muslims`` in name - nothing else.
Even Ustad Bismillah Khan is Hindu - except for the nominal muslimness outside.
A.R.Rehman is now back to using his Hindu name of Dileep.

ramgoweri # 9

(Sometimes the devotee requests for the prayer to be offered in the lord`s name, sometimes a near relative`s, often his or her children. In this )

Why should the Lord himself be needing special prayer from a priest. The Lord is himself is the giver of all things? I am a little confused.

Dost-Mitter

As you know, the Muslims have raised the status of the Prophet to much higher heights than due for a messenger. Not only Prophet but his friends and family members are treated like dieties. `Blasphemy` covers a wide area - and is punishable.

So ``Shirk`` is left far behind.

As they say, all religions begin with simple ideas - and then their clergy, with state power, keeps on making them more difficult & strict. Until, the followers simply get fed up and delink the clergy from State. It has already happened to Judaism & Christianity - now perhaps Islam is going through that painful stage. To get the Mulla & his edicts not capture the state power as it happened in Afghanistan to disastrous effects.

It seems to be true for only Abrahimic faiths - Bhuddism and Hinduism, much older, have survived in the same condition - greater tolerance and much less strictness & much less power & influence of clergy.

islam is in danger.........

.........they, the true believers, have been telling us all along that, ``islam khatray mein hai`` ....... first there was ali and his mum, the yazid, then there were the ahmedis, now it seems that the muslims of india are reverting back to hindooism in droves ............ where does this stop .......... anyway, i am glad to hear that most of these converts are musicians, writers, journalists and other people of loose character .......... the ummah doesn`t have any use for these artsy fartsy types anyway - most of them are homosexuals, reprobates and deviants to start with ....................

hamidm2:
While enjoying your humour, I am a bit reluctant, like Nooralain, to ridicule faith. Something has to be said about the power of faith, or what is better captured by the arabic word `aqeeda`. As the poet said:
Khak ko but aur but ko devta karta hai ishq
Inteha yeh hai ke bande ko khuda karta hai ishq.

...and dont worry, the future of ummah is safe in the hands of hunood. You see, a muslim can go offer prayer to a hindu shrine without having to convert; indeed, until some ramoos-come-lately decided otherwise, it was impossible to become a hindu, except the old-fashioned way, i.e. earn it by being a good guy in previous births. Ever since Muhammad bin Qassim, conversion in India has always been a one-way street and will remain so.
nhk:
``It seems to be true for only Abrahimic faiths - Bhuddism and Hinduism, much older, have survived in the same condition - greater tolerance and much less strictness & much less power & influence of clergy.``

As I said to hamidm, it ain`t so. These older religions did not survive those with stronger faith and sharper swords. Look at Afghanistan or Panjab or Indonesia for that matter.

...I dont think many hindus in the North are familiar with the concept of archanai.

Hamid,

I wonder why you did not choose to quote the next two sentences....

..My mom and now his mom are fully convinced that their prayers did the trick. The rest of us are not quite ``convinced``. However, we don`t see any reason to argue.

Maybe, I was not very clear...Our neighbors did not ``convert`` to hinduism nor did anyone think that ``Ram trumps allah`` as you indicate. Life went on as normal after that but the two ladies insist on paying a debt of gratitude at this temple. The ceremony is quite simple, they offer archana in my friend`s name that is all.

You have to understand it is not the god in general -- there are hundreds of temples of the same god all over Bangalore -- but it is that particular spot, the temple and the day on which the archana is offered. The archana is offered purely on a voluntray basis and does not require my neighbours to do anything else...

You also can rest assured that my friends recovery multipled the small temple`s legend by a thousand times. I am sure a lot of people who had similar situations came and prayed at this temple and their loved ones did not make it, but try and tell that to my mom..

I don`t know how to put this, but a lot of people do ``things`` -- rituals, ceremonies, prayers, archanas -- that seem religious but have nothing to do with religion per se. These ``things`` are done to get ``good luck`` and ward off ``bad luck``. It cuts across all religions. I have known muslim and hindus light a candle at one church in Bangalore before taking exams for luck. I have seen Muslims walking around with sai baba lockets. I am sure you will find several examples of Hindus visiting dargahs to get the luck if there are local legends. Ram or Allah are the last things on the peoples` minds when they perform these rituals and ceremonies. Mark my story as one example of the above described phenomenon.

CoolAL,

i had meant to respond to your post earlier, but was distracted by hamid mian. thank you for sharing more about your friend. i wonder how different it would be if he had taken different drugs (some drugs aren`t the cure, but the problem), but i know that it isn`t always possible to recover completely from encephalitis. he must be very proud to have such a brilliant daughter. : )

hamidm:

what more can i say? i usually find your satire quite amusing, but then there are times when i find you are, please pardon the expression, beating a dead horse. that is an awful expression to use. it should be struck from the books, and our minds. . .oh well. . .

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hamidm2 # 20:- boss, your triple decker cube root puns are being seriously. Maybe it is time for a hamidm3 to come along and provide an explnation of :-

1) Full frontal air-brushed fuzzy lens meaning for us serious types.
2) Hidden sarcastic teaser meaning for us ummah types.
3) Actual beaver split wide-open meaning for us irrelevant types.

Choose a type, or is there a fourth, too?

The future is simply not what it used to be, hamidm2. Everybody has not mastered Catch22 as yet, either.

Nazar Hayat Khan asked:
Why should the Lord himself be needing special prayer from a priest. The Lord is himself is the giver of all things? I am a little confused.

Nazar Khan -
The Bhagawan does not need prayer.
Here is a simple explanation:
In the South - when people go to a Temple , they ask for an Archanai to be done
- all that happens is that the purohit/archak (priest) then asks for the persons
birth star and gotra and name. The priest then utters 108 names of the Bhagwan
(it is called ashtottara-shatha naama or literally 8 more than hundred) and gives
some prasaad back. The birth star is easily known - any astrologer or astronomer :)
will tell you. Not many people know their gotra (or lineage) so they ``Kashyapa``
or ``Shiva`` etc....thats all ...

In the North, because of invasions - most of the old-temples have been destroyed
manuscripts and temple-families were also extinguished so the practices there have also
been weakened. You will find more continuity of tradition in the south.

BTW, all this puja stuff is for the laypeople - because we are in this world - and we ask
for the worldly things - for a Sanyasi ( or a renunciate ) no puja is really necessary.

This is a simple explanation - more later when I have time.
until then ....

hamidm2 #various
Cheesy though this may sound, IMO, this article is not about the weakness of the protagonists` faith, it is about the largeness of their hearts. They are secure enough in their faith to be open to other things. You don`t have to told this of course because you are just fooling around.

veeresh #25

i haven`t even read catch-22 as of yet. . .do you think that would help?! ; )

Yes, please read Catch22 right away if you wish to master hamidm2 posts.

That would help a lot.

Ofcourse, it is a Jewish conspiracy.

i don`t know that i want to necessarily master hamidm`s posts, but i will get to catch-22 as soon as i can get to reading for pleasure again. thank you!

: )

dost-mittar,

…. i don’t ridicule faith – it is organized religion that deserves our scorn ………… faith is a personal matter between man and his demons and doesn’t hurt anyone unless the man decides to go and sacrifice his son or torment jewish bankers plying their business on the street ……

……. i really don’t see any redeeming quality in organized religion other than the fact that it has supported many artists who wanted to paint obscene fat women playing with naked winged cherubs ……….

……. and please don’t ask me how to separate the business of religion from personal faith – the two have become so intertwined that it seems impossible ………..maybe the japanese can come up with a coin operated booth which you can set up at every street corner and for a quarter you can experience an intimate 3-d relationship with the god or goddess of your choice ……… kind of like a divine peep-show …………..

noorie:
...better still, see the movie Catch-22, with the jewish alan arkin in it.