Complicity in Silence

Those who propagated this war have blood on their hands. If they are the citizens of this great country, they have done a great dis-service to this country. With `friends` like these, US does not need any enemies.

Those who gleefully propagated this war, now have a responsibility to help US in this time of utter need. US needs all the help it can in Iraq. I ask people like tahmed32 to put their money where there mouth is and to sign-up as `private contractors` and head to Iraq to help US. It were you who lectured us that this was good for US and good for the world to attack Iraq. Now that you have been proven wrong, it is YOUR responsibility to take the lead in cleaning up.

Tahmed32 - The next post I see from you should be from Baghdad. Tell us - WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO IRAQ?

My prediction: you would either ignore this question, or your response would be in hyperboles, and ifs and buts and more `intellectual` droppings. My reading of history tells me that civilian war mongers in general lack balls.

Wajahat #27 you write ``What I would like to ask you is that you are obviously from a military family, can I ask you with the greatest respect to you and your father, what exactly did you do when these attrocities were being committed in Bangladesh. ``

That is a fair question. And the honest answer is: nothing publicly, although once it became clear that atrocities were committed in bangladesh, I remember my father calling for accountability in private conversations with fellow army officers. For myself, I have raised the issue in private gatherings of pakistanis and of course on chowk in the course of discussions. I should add that many atrocities were committed on Pakistanis too (a close family friend and a fine gentleman who was principal of the Chittagong Cadet College in 1971, for example was brutally murdered by a local mob, even though he was an educationist who had gone to then East Pakistan in order to try and help them by building up cadet colleges there). My father mourned the loss of his dear friend, but not once did I hear my father use such examples to ``explain the context`` that led to those atrocities (as malik was trying to do).

And that is all I am saying - we need as a first step to judge ourselves by certain moral standards, and not simply point fingers at others or set up a smoke screen of generalities and rhetoric.

If people want to find out what the Republicans (i.e. half of USA) is really thinking, they should stop listening to the politically correct apologies of Bush and Rumseld. And start listening to Rush Limbaugh. Rumsfeld and Bush had the report of atrocities on thier desk in January. They didn`t do anything about it. They refused Geneva Rights to prisoners in Guantonomo, and have created barriers for Human Rights organizations in carrying out prison investigations. Now that they have been caught, what the hell else are they going to say, except that they are sorry. Obviously, in reality, they are sorry that they were caught.

I have been in the military long enough to know that enlisted staff cannot, on their own, carry out such acts, in such a casual manner, unless they are specifically ordered to do so. Obviously, they were just implementing US policy, which is what those enlisted soldiers are themselves stating now.

Rush Limbaugh is the most powerful political media commentator on the circuit. He is not a marginal nutcase like Buchanan, whom no one listens to. Nor an apolitical shock jock like Howard Stern. He is at the heart of the political landscape of the neo-cons, Republicans and George Bush, having almost a hero-like status, amongst his followers.

He has been invited to the White House by elder George Bush. Republican leaders regularly are on his show, especially to do damage control, after scandals break out. This includes Dick Cheney after the Richard Clarke book came out. And I believe his name has also propped up as a potential Republican Congressional candidate. So, based on statistics alone, if you want to find out what a huge chunk of the US voters are thinking, just listen to what Rush is saying, Republicans listen to him.

However, his biggest attribute is his following. According to http://www.wolfesden.net/index.cgi/noframes/read/98233 his show is syndicated on 600 stations. And approximately 20 million viewers listen to it daily. He gets paid over 20 million dollars a year. He is out and out pro-Bush and pro-war.

About 105 million people voted in the last election. Out of which 50 million or so voted for Bush. That means 40% of the Repulican voters listen and follow Rush, daily. In fact, there is no other TV or radio show, which has 20 million listeners or viewers on a daily basis. Perhaps shows like Friends and Sienfeld are able to get this many viewers once a week.

He speaks for the Republicans. His biggest claim to fame being that he is not politically correct, and says the things his viewers want to hear, but are too afraid to say. He obviously choses his words carefully, ensuring his popularity amongst his listeners will increase.

Following is the long list of comments that Rush made, to his 20 million listeners, on his radio show, after this scandal broke lose:

````This is no different than what happens at the Skull and Bones initiation, and we`re going to ruin people`s lives over it, and we`re going to hamper our military effort, and then we are going to really hammer them because they had a good time. You know, these people are being fired at every day. I`m talking about people having a good time, these people, you ever heard of emotional release? You [ever] heard of need to blow some steam off?``

``All right, so we`re at war with these people. And they`re in a prison where they`re being softened up for interrogation. And we hear that the most humiliating thing you can do is make one Arab male disrobe in front of another. Sounds to me like it`s pretty thoughtful. Sounds to me in the context of war this is pretty good intimidation -- and especially if you put a woman in front of them and then spread those pictures around the Arab world. And we`re sitting here, `Oh my God, they`re gonna hate us! Oh no! What are they gonna think of us?` I think maybe the other perspective needs to be at least considered. Maybe they`re gonna think we are serious. Maybe they`re gonna think we mean it this time. Maybe they`re gonna think we`re not gonna kowtow to them. Maybe the people who ordered this are pretty smart. Maybe the people who executed this pulled off a brilliant maneuver.``

``Nobody got hurt. Nobody got physically injured. But boy there was a lot of humiliation of people who are trying to kill us -- in ways they hold dear. Sounds pretty effective to me if you look at us in the right context.``

(http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/05/06/opinion/meyer/main616021.shtml)

tahamd #5: ``All of US is up in arms against what happened in abu gharaib ``

I don`t agree with this. Despite the huge mess in Iraq, half the USA still considers this a just war. Including you. The blame of all the mess, including the prison scandal, falls not only on the soldiers who carried it out, but on individuals like yourself, who encouraged the USA to invade.

The only reason the public opinion in the USA in support of this war is now lower than it was a year ago, is because the USA is getting defeated, and American soldiers are dying. And the only reason the Abu Ghuraib scandal has broken lose, is because the pictures are out. The Red Cross and Amnesty Intl. have been crying out for months that such practices were going on. No one in American listened. Americans have generally supported the practices at Guantonomo and Abu Ghuraib. They are opposing it now, because they have been exposed. If they ever get exposed in Guantonomo, they will oppose that as well.....

``if we pakistanis had the same moral standard, we would not have allowed the rapes and murders of civilians in bangladesh by the army go unpunished.``

The reason Pakistanis allowed this, was because there were individuals like yourself present in Pakistan, at that time, as well. They kept selling the Bangladesh war, and kept justifying it, like you keep justifying the American actions. In the end, it is the soldiers in abu ghuraib, who will end up getting all the blame, however, all the Americans who egged the USA into this war, like all the people who egged Pakistan into a war, should take the blame also.

That includes you, as well. For every Iraqi humiliated in abu ghuraib and every Iraqi killed in other cities, individuals like yourself need to be blamed. The USA has absolutely no reason or justification to go to war in Iraq (far less justification than even Pakistan had to go to war in Bangladesh).

It would not have gone to war, if voters in the USA, like yourself, had not egged it on......

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#15 Hassan Siddiqui

``Syed Ali - First of all, sub human treatment on the Iraqi people is not the ``accepted occupational standard`` as you imply. The US public, the US politicians and the military are all against these atrocities.``

Yet the Secretary of Defence sitting in a senate hearing in full knowledge of all this, had only condemnation for the media to put this out as this hurts the cause of war. I mean I know for a fact that a large part of the US Public might be against this war, but they are the very people who brought this administration into power. If the military is conducting damage limiting excercise , its because they know the reaction to this will be very negative specially at home. I am not sure why people like yourself are so hellbent on defending this US Govt and its Military Enterprise, when it is proven that this entire war is based on lies and distortion, with two ultimate goals, America controlling the second Largest oil reserves in the world and the biggest threat to the Israelis being reduced to nothing.

Before this war started the likes of you and tahmed could not stop singing the praises of this war and its reasons. You were so proud when the armies went in and occupied the land with little of or no resistance. You have bought into that whole malarchy about democratisation so badly that you cannot possibly see the other side`s point of view. And now that everything has gone up in smoke when armed resistance is becoming stronger and the US planning a full cut and run option by the end of this year, you will not see the ensuing Civil war that will engulf Iraq for decades.

Dont ascribe your hideaos denials on us, we simply dont except your half hearted attempt to legitimise this war and its causes.

As far as Mohd Ali goes he is a hero and has always been a hero, but all of these anti war heroes at the time were either put in jail or killed. The war continued and it was not just the Anti War Movement in America that helped ended US Occupation in Vietnam, it was the bravery of each and every Vietnamese who fought against this war and gave America the most bitterest experiance of their Imperial adventure.

#5 Tahmed

``Two wrongs dont make a right. cnn says a US citizen has just been beheaded in iraq claiming this is revenge - which is exactly what your article clearly points to. It may be just hot air on your part, but the mindset is the same. All of US is up in arms against what happened in abu gharaib - if we pakistanis had the same moral standard, we would not have allowed the rapes and murders of civilians in bangladesh by the army go unpunished. So spare me your irresponsible and hypocritical grievances about abu gharaib.``

I have been waiting for a while for your categoric denials that usually start appearing around articles denouncing the US Imperialist wars. I wasnt around when the Pakistani Army were commiting their attrocities in Bangladesh and in my various articles I have thoroughly questioned the Clear out of that period of history from the Pakistan school textbooks, but I will not go into the details. What I would like to ask you is that you are obviously from a military family, can I ask you with the greatest respect to you and your father, what exactly did you do when these attrocities were being committed in Bangladesh.

Dont blame us for the moral, social, structural failures and havocs that you and your previous generations lavished upon Pakistan. Hypocritical, you are leaving us a Pakistan so ridden with problems that we cant even biggen to assimilate and you ask us about the Moral standards of Pakistan. Man dont even start on this.......

Guys! Wait- the Americans are packing their bags and leaving. This whole WMD farce shows that the idiots like Rumsfield need to be sent to mental asylum!! This episode would prove to be the second vietnam for the yankees.

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I believe that EVERY STRONG NATION HAS RIGHT TO PLUNDER AND LOOT THE WEAKER NATION. Cuz this is what the nations have done in past and this is what they will do in future what ever the journalists and intellectual do. Whosoever is given authority ... always misues it to his own extent.

Why is it that most Pakis go on an emotional diatribe when the aggressor is a non-Muslim while they remain silent when the aggressor is a Muslim?

If you look around, there are/were scores of Muslim countries that are/were ruled by tyrants. For example, Iraq under Saddam. The man killed thousands of his political opponents, gassed thousands of Kurds, waged a 9 year war with Iran that irreparably impoverished the region and caused great suffering to his own people. Didn`t see any Paki complain about Saddam`s misrule then.

Is a Muslim aggressor more sacred than a non-Muslim aggressor? Or is it because of the wide-spread feeling of ``he may be a b!astard, but he is our b!astard``?

american soldiers - the real wmds !

so where are those WMDs ?
the great american search left a country in ruins.
what was surprising was not the manner in which america raped iraq, it was the way this rape was tolerated by the rest of the world.
yes there was an outcry by people within and outside the u.s. of a, but there were no trade restrictions, no sanctions by the u.n., or any boycott of american products by the arab world.
why ?
has america `the big brother` grown into the `big daddy` ?
can no one challenge the might of the modern day colonial ruler ?
this is a country that has countless WMDs hidden in its stores and laboritries and yet it annhilates another country on the pretext of destroying theirs.
it talks of de-neuclearisation of the developing nations but never stands up to take the first step by destroying their stock-piles.
the treatment of the iraqi pows is fully insync with this attitude. they belive that they have the might to do anything, the power to hurt anybody anyhow anywhere without having to answer any questions or giving any justifications.
this blatant show of power and ruthlessness is the america of today.
america is currently in foreign territory and the prisnors that they are torturing are soldiers who fought to protect their motherland from a foreign power they desreve some respect.
if they have done anything wrong then let the people who they have wronged punish them but one can safely say that this will not happen, since america has not set up any legal redressal system.
the american soldiers are committing a crime for which they deserve to be punished severely... but by who ?
since this wrong is being committed against iraqis therefor is it not fair that the iraqi people be given the right to decide the fate of these soldiers ?
but one can safely say this wont happen either.

HP # 14 - You wrote ``No Islamic leader or country has so far come forward to apologize to the people of the US.``

This statement is too retarded and obscene to merit a response. However for the record, and for the benefit of board I will make a short statement.

Not only have muslim countries, leaders, people apologized and condemned sept 11 crime HUNDREDS or perhaps thousands of times, many of them have paid with their lives. If the right wing demagogues in current administration did not have a hidden agenda about Iraq, level of cooperation between US and Muslim countries against terrorism would have much exceeded. But as several US intellectuals have pointed out recently, fighting terrorism was NEVER on the agenda of these right wings - it was the war with Iraq that obsessed them.

Pinnacle of blindness:

White House spokesman Scott McClellan told reporters, ``this shows the true nature of the enemies of freedom..``_CNN

ENEMY OF FREEDOM? Then you must be talking about the unfettered freedom with which America decides the right and the wrong. Otherwise one would natrually label them as freedom fighters. They have lost their freedom to America, and paying with their lives to get it back, if you will. Driven from within against all odds, against the mighty super power, against the mad mighty super power, against the disgustingly conceited power.. and, of course, the freedom with which it executes its will.

These Worthless Iraqis dying in scores... No town shall morn their death, shall count them heros of their nation, shall have a football field named after them... I wonder what, if not from within, drives them to strike back. Of course towns could morn their heroes and name streets after those dying from American bullet, only if they were free people.

Just a perspective!

plats #13 since you obviously did not read #12 when you wrote your post, your prediction was smack dab on the mark.
I am in awe of your powers of prediction, Sir Nostrodamus. :-)

HP #14 you write ``Are the western values so strong that the President apologizes for gross acts and the Muslims values so weak that Muslims don’t even think about apologizing for what happened on 911? Condemnation is not an apology. ``

I agree with you. We must rise above ``tribal loyalties`` and know where to draw the line. We have yet to apologize to the bengalis for what the pakistan army did to them in 1971, and we have yet to bring a single individual to court. We have yet to apologize to the hindus and sikhs who were forced to flee what is now Pakistan in 1947, or to bring a single individual to trial for the quarter million innocent people among them who were brutally killed as they fled for their lives. Only then can we as a nation point pious fingers at anyone else. Indeed, if we were ever to do that, we would not have this need to point fingers. Fortunately, there is no shortage among Pakistanis of such people. It is just that we need to speak up to those who have an explanation for every bloody murder that is done in the name of revenge or some other bloody excuse.

tahmed32 - One of the PRIME requisites of critical thinking is to put every thing in its proper CONTEXT. Context is also the PRIME requisite of conflict resolution. You cannot look at things in absolute terms. If you ask ``whats`` and not ask ``whys``, you are bound to stay in the viscious circles without making any progress. Have you ever asked your child ``WHAT`` course he failed in, without paying attention to the more important question of ``WHY`` he failed?

Please do not lecture anyone regarding the ``legal basis`` of this murder. What ``legal basis`` there was for the murder of Iraqi people? What ``legal basis`` there was for dropping 1000 pound bombs on congested population centers? Are there any laws left in this world which are worth respecting? Why must the weak follow the laws, while the powerful make their own laws.

Indeed ``murder is a murder``. And so is the murder of 15,000 Iraqi civilians. This bloodbath will continue until we begin to ask WHY this is happening. Thankfully, many american intellectuals, academics, leaders are waking up to the fact that they were lied to. And God willing, the better angels will protect this country from getting further hijacked by people who crave wars and blood.