India Votes - and How!

Ref Tmk #439

Well, here is another nugget for your next letter to Daily Times.

Prof. Subramaniam Chandrasekhar who won the Nobel Prize for his theoretical prediction of black holes was born in Lahore.

As Brother Jay is wont to point out, of all the people from the subcontinent who won the Nobel Prize, the one man who carried a green passport did not get the recognition he deserved from his country. So, why add Khorana to the list, particularly when he carried an Indian passport when he left to go abroad?

#436 by rsridhar on May 29, 2004 6:38pm PT

Why are you so predictable? :) I didn’t claim that Pakistan is a secular or democratic state, so save your energies on that. And you also need to learn about freedom of speech and political science. Isn’t it tragic that a Pakistani has to tell you that too? In your thoughtful replies, you conveniently chose not to deal with the point I was making, and used my country of origin as your only excuse. A state is not equal to leader of the house in the parliament, and legislature is just one pillar of the state. In all communal riots in India, elements of the state took sides based on their religious affiliations, as pointed out in the reports of Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International. This doesn’t happen in a secular state. Will it change overnight? Probably not! To me it seems that many of you dream of a secular India, but a comparable number of you are opposed to it too. That’s why overall character of the state remains in the grey zone, swinging between secularism and Hindu nationalism. Thanks.

Interesting letter to Daily Times:

Sir,

While browsing the Nobel e-Museum website, I noticed that the 1968 Nobel
Laureate for Medicine, Har Gobind Khorana, was born in a little village called
Raipur in what is now the Pakistani part of Punjab. Khorana was born into a
poor family, but his father was dedicated to educating all his children, which
resulted in their being the only literate family in the village of about a 100
people.

Khorana later studied at the D.A.V. High School in Multan before going to Punjab
University in Lahore where he attained an M.Sc. degree. He then went abroad to
continue his education, and was awarded the Nobel prize in 1968 for his work on
the describing the genetic code.

This is a story of a man who, despite his very humble beginnings, succeeded
through sheer hard work and determination, resulting in ultimate triumph. It is
very much a story that can still inspire young Pakistanis with humble
backgrounds (and priveleged ones for that matter). Yet, the Punjab University
does not even honor him on its website as a distinguished alumnus, nor is he
ever mentioned in Pakistani textbooks as a one-time local who went on to become
a brilliant scientist. It is still not too late to honour this son of our land,
the student who started his academic life studying under the open skies of
Raipur and went on to provide us with the basis of modern genetics.

Regards,

Taimur M. Khan
Philadelphia, PA,
U.S.A.

re:#433 by AhmadBilal and #436 by rsridhar

``Show me one minority leader, i mean just one minority leader, in your blighted country who has risen to a top civilian/military post in the last 50 years of your country`s existence. ``

I think the same can be said of bangladesh.

re:#433 by AhmadBilal
Now i have to learn about secularism from a Paki?
What is this world coming to!
Sridhar

re:#433 by AhmadBilal
I live in USA dude. So, what i think does not matter as far as India is concerned.
But, yes. The multitudes of Indians who recently voted are not in denial. They have strongly voted for secularism.
Show me one minority leader, i mean just one minority leader, in your blighted country who has risen to a top civilian/military post in the last 50 years of your country`s existence.
After u have done that, we can talk more about secularism.
You Pakis just hide behind defintions.
Which is why Mushy today claims Pak is a democracy!
Sridhar

re:#430 by gujjubania

You have not still answered my question: does your dad pay taxes for the income he earns? You were the one who boasted one time on chowk that your dad`s income, if revealed, would result in the IT officers raiding your dad`s house.
Be a good Indian and find out if your dad really pays taxes. Since only 10% of Indians pay taxes, this is one way of making India an economic powerhouse. Who told you that only Microsoft and IBM can bring in prosperity? If Indians honestly pay their taxes, follow rule of law, prosperity will come. Do you know how much black money is in the country?
http://www.freedomindia.com/01.html
``Dishonest industrialists, scandalous politicians and corrupt officers have deposited in their illegal personal accounts the huge sum of about US$ 1000 Billion which have been misappropriated by them creating scandals and by corruption. This amount is about 13 times larger than foreign debt. This amount is such a big amount that from it 45 crores of poor people can get Rs. 100000/- each.``

http://www.samachar.com/features/191101-fpj.html

``We simply do not know how much of this kind of cash is being skimmed off the top.Ten per cent? 20 per cent? We just don`t know.It is said that black money in India accounts for 20 per cent of GDP.If this is true, then black money generated every year must be around Rs 400,000 crore or $80 billion.``
So, it is not even necessary to have all those MNCs in India. Only if Indians pay up their taxes honestly, India would be a rich country without any foreign investments.
MNCs investing in India do it for a reason. They get to save money. It is that simple. They are not doing this for any altruistic reason. If tomorrow Pakistan can offer same kind of skills for less money, all these MNCs will move from Bangalore to Karachi.
Another thing.
Do a little research (since you have a computer at home and a lot of spare time) and find out how much Gold is hidden among the households in India. This is a whopping sum but it lies dormant in individual homes as security. Schemes to bring this into open would result in unbounded prosperity. So, you see, you do not need any foreign investments. There is plenty at home. Only there is no will, no honesty.
May be you can start by asking your dad the question that every honest kid in India should be asking: Dad, do you pay your taxes honestly?
Sridhar

Omar mian
//..this exchange just proves my point mohar...//

Of course ...... Actually, your point is already proven, beyond any doubt - you are the victorious soldier of Islam - you just quashed the opposition single-handedly - the evil Indians have all rolled over and are dead.

It`s time for celebration for you tiger, so open a champagne bottle ...... oh wait - you islamic types don`t touch alcohol....... so how do you folks celebrate??? ..... oh yeah - go get some huris, gillmans for yourself ...... even though that`s something you get after you are dead, but what the heck - you can cash out early.

You are the man!!!

One has to be reasonably ignorant to say that India is a secular state, unless you redefine ``secularism`` just like you redefined ``shining``. Having a Muslim president and a Sikh prime minister doesn`t make you secular, just like having a woman prime minister didn`t make Pakistan a champion of women`s rights. If you are still in denial, then take some time out to read Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International reports regarding role of your state agencies in various communal riots. Government machinery in a secular state doesn’t take sides based on religious affiliations. But I think you have more to be proud of than fake slogans of ``secularism`` and ``shining India``. As an outsider, I would appreciate the continuing democratic processes in India (minus IOK). Development work done by your emerging strong educated middle class is also a great thing for a third world developing country. Thanks.

slighted and overwhelmed - now thats an interesting combination -- aray shri mohar jee aap hindi mein baat kur lee jiaye na -- this exchange just proves my point mohar --

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re:#420 by harimau
In case u think i belong to the Nehru era, u are dead wrong. I actually do not care about any politician in India. I was only writing what i thought was an objective analysis of what Nehru really was. He was a mixture of good, bad and the ugly. Nobody is saying he is perfect. But give the devil its due.
You seem to harbor some kind of hatred against Nehru. Wonder why?
Sridhar

re:#420 by harimau
That article pretty much sums up what Nehru was. He did not have a good knowledge of military affairs and made some wrong decisions. But, this still does not take away the fact that he fostered other institutions and democracy flourished under him. One needs to only look at Pakistan to understand the difference.
If one thinks that only Nehru made mistakes, then one must be reminded of mistakes that the great military strategist and ex-premier of China Mao Tse Tung made.

http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/people/A0831663.html

``After withstanding five encirclement campaigns launched by Chiang Kai-shek, Mao led (1934–35) the Red Army on the long march (6,000 mi/9,656 km) from Jiangxi north to Yan`an in Shaanxi province, emerging as the most important Communist leader``
And in that Long march, almost 50000 people died. But strategically brilliant as it resulted in his being sworn in as the leader of Communist party in China by the Soviet politburo.

The same man made a bluder of unleashing the ``Great Leap forward`` in trying to catch up with Soviet Union.
http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/1999/china.50/inside.china/profiles/mao.tsetung/

``Mao`s faulty economics ended up creating a famine of massive proportions,`` writes historian Patricia Buckley Ebrey. She concludes from census reports that 30 million people probably died during the famine of 1959-62.``
Wow! 30 million died of famine in China in the early 60s. And, this man is considered a great leader in China even today!
I guess i have made my point.
Sridhar

#426 by omar_r_quraishi
//...you can tell from a mile away who the moron is usually...//

Of course you can, Mian - nobody here has any doubt.

So then why are whining ? Seems like you are feeling so slighted and overwhelmed. But you should get used to it, because you can`t escape the Indians. They have taken over this site. They will ride you like a pony if you are not careful.

So you may consider taking a hike, get some air. The stress is going to kill you.

shri nikki saat saat saat saat jee aur shri mohar ji aka losers from hell or should i say narg (hope i got it right) -- well yes your absolutely right -- its pretty one-sided, you can tell from a mile away who the moron is usually -- jai ram jee kee nikki saat saat saat saat jee

#422 Sridhar
You are right in saying it is never black and white.And thats what is my point.
India is such a diverse community that you cannot make generalizations. The article you cited, disproves a ``myth``, by giving one or two ``realities``. In most of the cases, you can`t generalize all over India, you can`t give the example of one state and say that this is reality.
Coming back to the Sonia point, had she not joined politics in 98 and had implicitly declared herself a candidate for PM? And had not BJP consolidated its postion in 99?
She did revive the Congress from a very bad position, I agree, but to say that that people voted for her being PM? Certainly not in 99 and extremely doubtful in 04.