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Post no# 27:

Point taken! but it was understood way before. you shouldn`t have wasted time and effort in re writing a summary for me as i agree with what you are saying. Like i wrote in my post before:

``...Further, it has been pointed numerous times and I know that the respected author knows himself that the people who use religion as an excuse to commit injustices are the ones who do not know about the very Religion themselves. They, only use it to further their selfish motives.``

so we agree on the so-called Islamists part!!

Anyways, keep up the Good work!!

ps.
It would be a bad idea to use this as an obituary! :)

#22 stuka
~~Dude who the hell are u to pass judgement on someone`s faith. You people are as bad as Jihadis. They wanna stuff u with religion. U wanna stuff us with irreligion.~~

No, not irreligion. But Unreligion. There’s a difference.
And by asking “Who the hell am I to pass judgment on someone`s faith,” are you assuming I believe in Hell?

#26
No Summaiya, I am not attacking Islam. I am parodying “Islamists” and the whole idea of religion (any religion) being used as an excuse to distract oneself from his/her/society’s many social, political, cultural, domestic and psychological failings. “Laps” on the other hand deals with “liberals” using consumer brands and allusions to sexual liberation and romantic love to misinterpret what can actually be something as simple as cultural confusion and certain deeply repressed (and socially embarrassing) feelings and … I shouldn’t be going on and on like this, y’know. It’s like writing my own obituary!

Brilliantly written!

But when you write the following:
``They say God is the wisest. But why do this God appeal to the most exploitative and the most stupid, and the most sadistic, and the most idiotic, and the shitiest?
No, not always? Sweeping assumption? Bombastic? ``

I wonder exactly what you are applying. Aren’t you generalizing here? Assuming, for example that 50% of all chowkies are God Fearing (belonging to any religion that is) and maybe remotely religious people, then are you questioning their intellectual capacity or moral beliefs?

Further, it has been pointed numerous times and I know that the respected author knows himself that the people who use religion as an excuse to commit injustices are the ones who do not know about the very Religion themselves. They, only use it to further their selfish motives.

I do not know about other religions, but since you attacked Islam in your piece, I would only comment on that. Islam does not preach Injustices at all. I wonder if you have read the Quran or Islamic history in detail. Have you forgotten that when our Prophet (P.B.U.H) undertook Jihad in the final conquest of Mecca, He did not harm any of the residents of the city and infact pardoned most? How do you interpret this act?

People have exploited Islam and changed its interpretation. Given the fact that most of the people at least in our country are uneducated and hold an external locus, they can easily be influenced and brainwashed. These are the people who are unaware of the true injunctions of Islam.

The relations of Muslims (Submitters) with others are based primarily on peace, mutual respect and trust. The theme in the Quran is peace as long as there is no oppression or injustice that cannot be resolved by all the peaceful means available.


Maybe the following Quranic verses will give a better understanding of what I mean (in particular the capitalized verses):

[Quran 7:28] They commit a gross sin, then say,
``We found our parents doing this and GOD
has commanded us to do it.`` Say,
``GOD NEVER ADVOCATES SIN
Are you saying about GOD
what you do not know?``

[Quran 5:87] ... and do not AGGRESS; GOD DISLIKES the aggressors.

[Quran: 7:199] ......You shall resort to PARDON, advocate TOLERANCE, and DISREGARD the ignorant.

[Quran 6:151] ``...... You shall NOT KILL - GOD has made life sacred - except in the course of justice. These are His commandments to you that you may understand.``

(It really depends on a person how to interpret justice and the one who truly knows the major injunctions of Islam will never interpret it to mean mass injustice)

[Quran 5:32] ``......, we decreed for the Children of Israel that anyone who murders any person who had not committed murder or horrendous crimes, it shall be as if he murdered all the people. And anyone who spares a life, it shall be as if he spared the lives of all the people. ..............``

[Quran 4:90]``...... Therefore, if they leave you alone, refrain from fighting you, and offer you peace, then GOD gives you no excuse to fight them.``

Moreover It has been said by a respected Muslim scholar that:

****
Those who do not comprehend Islam and those who have an interest in distorting the truth about the religion of Islam have been trying to make the word terrorists and terrorism synonymous to the religion. A mistake that has been common in the media in the West.

Several groups who called themselves Jews, Christians or Muslims, have used terrorism to force their agenda, issues or beliefs. None of these groups represent the true religion of the Jews or the Christians as much as these terrorists represent Islam.

Attacks on the civilians and the least expecting people around the world by these groups is the kind of strife that cannot be justified by any religion or under any cause and is strongly condemned in all religions including Islam as clarified by the words of God in the Quran, the Final Testament.

Some of the terrorist groups which massacre innocent people consider themselves martyrs. Those who kill the innocent people in the name of their religion or the name of God, who think of themselves as martyrs should think twice. Their act is actually strongly condemned by God in the verses of the Quran. These people are disobeying God’s commandments and the TRUTH in the Quran. Instead they blindly follow the opinion of their corrupted leaders (and scholars). It is not a surprise that God has not granted them victory. Quite the contrary they have been the most humiliated, defeated and oppressed people on earth. Worse, they are oppressed by their own rulers.

The Quran is very clear that the believers must defend themselves but never to aggress. It is true that Islam (Submission) calls for the followers to be strong. This call however is to use the strength to secure peace, provide freedom for the society and the country but never to aggress unless aggressed upon.

Our Creator is one and the same. The God of the Muslims is the same God of the Jews and the Christians and all the other religions. God does not permit one group the killing of innocent people of the other religions.

The blame lies with the terrorists and not the religion they claim to adhere to. Not everyone who calls himself a Muslim is a Muslim as much as not every one who thinks of himself as a Jew or a Christian is one.

The religion of Islam should not be confused by what these so called Muslims have done. They actually, by the definition of the Quran, are not Muslims or at least as much Muslims as the Ku Klux Klan are good Christians. We should not let our emotions overcome our logic and understanding.

United we stand against all kinds of terrorism, as only through unity will we be able to eradicate them and bring them to justice. We will serve the terrorists cause by name calling and false accusations of everyone who happens to be a TRUE God fearing Muslim.

*****

nadeem #19

yes, i do understand your flight. i asked myself the same questions once upon a time. . . :) and then my question was answered. . .and a whole new set of questions came up. . .it never ends. :)

yes, here it comes, the `you`re just as bad as we are if not worse. .` scenario. i guess the number of lives lost on the basis of irreligion does exceed the murder of the six million in nazi germany, as well as those who were fighting `for god and country. .`

this is a work of fiction. . .this takes place in pakistan. last i heard, quite a few of the mullahs and the mullah-minded are being the exploitative ones. last i remember, quite a few of the ``marxists`` or any one who is labelled one because they don`t fit anywhere else in pakistan were either thrown into jail or their lives were made a living hell. marxism has never been much of a force to be reckoned with there. last i remember, religion has been used in pakistan to kill those not just in that country, but in kashmir and india. . .and various parts of the world.

so yeah, if you want to provide statistics about irreligion being the cause of more deaths in the world. . .you are no less passing a judgment than you believe a character in this fictional satirical piece is passing. the fact is that people are still being killed in the name of someone`s god in pakistan, in iraq, in palestine and israel. and we`ve entered a new century here. . .

And the thing is, Paracha, the author of post 22 is absolutely, without a trace of irony serious....

``But why do this God appeal to the most exploitative and the most stupid, and the most sadistic, and the most idiotic, and the shitiest? ``


Dude who the hell are u to pass judgement on someone`s faith. You people are as bad as Jihadis. They wanna stuff u with religion. U wanna stuff us with irreligion.

By the way, in this century more people have been put to death on the basis of Marx then on the basis of God, any god. Counting Cambodia, USSR, China...the list goes on.

Apparently....


Did anyone see Mohsin Hamid`s piece Letter From Lahore: Reinventing Pakistan in the July Smithsonian?

#13 by rozaiba on July 4, 2004 11:07pm PT
~~Good hard-hitting piece(s). Pringles now cost 85 rupees. ~~

Gold Leaf remains to be Rs.37 a pack, though. I think I’ll start smoking Pringles.

#11 by nasah on July 4, 2004 3:31pm PT
~~I support biblical law -- hang that sob sharon by the nearest lamp post -- for violating the biblical law... ~~

What do you expect from a sonofabitch near a lamppost? Lack of potty training, that’s all. Wonder if the Bible has anything on that!


#12 by nooralain on July 4, 2004 9:35pm PT
~~both good pieces nadeem.
why does god appeal to the most exploitative? iss maiN khuda ka kya qasoor hai? the exploiters will find a way to exploit anything and anyone. the question is why does god permit such exploitation? then again qasoor kis ka hai?~~

Which God are we talking about here, naveeda? The one taught to me in Scripture Classes at The Covent Of Jesus & Mary or the one taught to me in the Islamiat Classes at The Karachi Grammer School? The one taught to me by my grandparents (staunch Barelvis), or the taught to me by my mother (staunch Wahabi)? The one taught to me by my Koranic teacher (regular Frontier fanatic) or the one peddled by Zia-ul-Haq and (thus) Nawaz League in ‘80s and ‘90s? The one glorified in many of those old Jeetenera and Shatrugan Sinah movies I saw as a kid, or the one always rearing his Star Of David appearance in many Steven Spielberg movies? Please specify. Because Gods are many and I am One. Pitty my plight. Umm .. make that flight. ;)

~~interesting how the various complexes play out in laps. . .a la freud. and the thin line between love and lust. ~~

Indeed. I am a Freudian. But only so I can keep parodying him. He’s the easiest target, isn’t he? And thus, so am I. i.e A Freudian self-parody. And for LAPS, I think it’s more a case of Lust or Bust!

#14 by AhmadBilal on July 5, 2004 1:04am PT
~~Nadeem, is there a way to get hold of any Atish Raj recordings? Thanks. ~~

I wish there was (and easy way). Over the years I keep getting requests by many young men (and a few women) about those 1995 recordings I did as Atish Raj. But only two years later, in the peak years of my darkness (yes feedback bibi, those awful breakdowns you keep “hearing about”), those recordings started to scare me. So I just got rid of the masters. But ever since my “comeback,” I want the damn thing back. I have identified a few old friends who say they may still have a copy or two of that album (“Hard Tar & Black Bile”). Let’s see. The moment I manage to finally get my hands on a copy, I’ll mail you one, or maybe ask bandbaja.org to put up a few tracks for download.

#15 by Urstruly on July 5, 2004 5:58am PT
~~The only solution to Kashmir is a military solution, and it is working.~~

If so, then perhaps the military solution to Iraq and Afghanistan should be working as well?
But if you’re talking about Azad Kashmir, then I must agree. Anyway, both parts should neither belong to Pakistan nor India but to The Republic of Azerbaijan! Just for the F**k of it! This too can work, y`know.

#16 by FarooqA on July 5, 2004 6:23am PT
~~Can somebody translate the ``Leaves`` into Urdu and send it to the Jihadi outfits?~~

Wonderful, wonderful idea, Farooq. But only if you promise to take care of my parents afterwards. And don’t forget to feed the cat.

#17 by tintingem on July 5, 2004 6:23am PT
~~brilliant...
pringles and gold leaf?
the same attack on new brands?
thrash them...they deserve it....
(but pringles ain`t that bad...)~~

Neither was that damn jaw I was hallucinating.


#18 by Saminasha on July 5, 2004 7:46am PT
~~Well done, Paracha...bring it straight home ;) ~~


Will do Samin. But home is where the bomb is.

NFP, you go where no man has gone before. Any plans to return?

Actually, Tintingem has hit on something interesting...God and Pringles as self branding....ah the pleasure....

Well done, Paracha...bring it straight home ;)

Can somebody translate the ``Leaves`` into Urdu and send it to the Jihadi outfits?

brilliant...
pringles and gold leaf?
the same attack on new brands?
thrash them...they deserve it....
(but pringles ain`t that bad...)

The only solution to Kashmir is a military solution, and it is working.

Did anyone read ``Leaves`` while listening to ``What God Wants`` from the ``Amused to Death`` album of Roger Waters? Nadeem, is there a way to get hold of any Atish Raj recordings? Thanks.