Muslims Vs. Modernity

sparchus #93

seven VIRGINS

My friend, you certainly underestimate the generosity of the arabic Allah toward those who behead kafirs. You have to know the motivations of these people better. :)

he he he
all i can say as a `kafir` is i hope the `god of the muslims` puts some sense into them.So that we `non-believers` can live in a little peace minus the ambition of people who intend to get seven VIRGINS in heaven. god save aallaah!

#90 by solitude on June 22, 2004 5:53pm PT

[harish_hyd, why do you think its a stupid question?]

Well, it is stupid because there`s more than fair chance that a disillusioned Muslim would question Islamic beliefs, because that`s what led him to the disillusion in the first place. And if he isn`t a Muslim at all, there`s still a fair chance that he would question Islamic beliefs because we all know a true Muslim would never question the wisdom passed on by the Quran.

Correction:

``.....because that`s what led him to the disillusion in the first place.``

must read

......because that`s what led him to the disillusionment in the first place.

Sir Hamid,

We are still awaiting the fourth part :)

harish_hyd, why do you think its a stupid question?

#85 by arjun_m on June 22, 2004 10:58am PT
”why am I not surprised?”

What is there to surprise?

Prof Khursheed is a jamaat Islami old hand. Who else would say these things but a fundamentalist party that is the force behind some of the major problems in the educational system in Pakistan.
I think you should pay attention to Jehad is the basis of our ideology and it is the only way to defend our religious values, he added.

You did highlight it but this is the latest political line of the Islamist in Pakistan and elsewhere.
Now it is not a Jihad for Muslims rights in Kashmir, or Palestine but now jihad is to defend the religion.
It appears to me that Jihadi have conceded in Kashmir, Palestine, and Afghanistan etc.
The war against these fundos should now be more on ideological grounds than at physical level.

I think that is something that would hurt the jihadi more than anything else. They stand on very thin ideological grounds. The public support is waning.

The US, as the next step must emphasis to Pakistan to limit its religious programming on TV and other public media. I think Pakistan will soon have a new much more westernized PM, who would depend more on the US support than on the Army support for his power base.

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#85
``Jehad is the basis of our ideology and it is the only way to defend our religious values, he added.``
It is hard to understand. What began as covert deniable foreign policy is now touted as mainstream religion. And in a whole nation worth of Muslims there appears to be no decisive reply.

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#73 by omar_r_quraishi

[i think readers should know whether this article was written by a disillusioned muslim who left it or by someone who wasnt a muslim ever]

What a stupid question! Obviously, if he is a disillusioned Muslim, you can expect this from him. If he is not, you can still expect this from him. Man, the `Assistant Editor` seems to have taken leave of his senses.

dost-mittar,

``The Ontario govt. has agreed to allow muslims to settle their disputes according to sharia outside the Ontario judicial system. ``

.............. are you kidding !!!!.......... like the kind folks of medina, the canadians will regret the day they let in the meccan camel ! .............. trojan horse

#73 by omar_r_quraishi on June 21, 2004 6:44am PT

Regarding my name, Is it Arthur Shiraz or Athar Shiraz.

Mr. Quraishi since in most likelihood you have not stepped out of karachi I would like to inform you that the anglicized version of Athar is to ease communication with my American friends. I know of a lot of Xiao from China who use the name Steve because Xiao is harder to pronounce and a lot of Pervaiz`s who go with Peter or Pete and a lot of Jews who have Anglican names and Hebrew names (Yaqub call themselves Jacob).

Does that clear up your insinuations ? I am an open book. I lay no claim to being a Mullah. I do lay claim to kinship with the Muslims of the world because I was one before and I know how they feel and the Muslims know how I feel and they can relate to me quite well thank you (quite a lot of them).

What have you got next ? Will you next question my motivations as a Pakistani like your kind isolates and persecutes Ahmedi Pakistanis because of their religion? Will you next accuse me of being ethnically different (as in the case of Urdu Speaking people scorning the Punjabis as Paindoos and the rest of Pakistan looking down upon the Pathans as Niswar Choos?) What is next will you then question my credibility based on the color of my skin ?

You are a pathetic specimen sir and you are damaging our own people by such insinuations when you have no arguments to present. Its INDECENT and parochial and utterly evil that once again you try to squelch the voice of reform and once on basis of a name and once again you stigmatize the critic by branding them as the ``other``. That is just low and my fellow country men and women know that.

....A GOOD Muslim is a NON Muslim....:-)

digit#79:

I cancelled my subscription to the Post and Citizen two years ago because Izzy Asper (and his son) dismissed the publisher who refused to let them dictate editorials to him. I have recently started getting Citizen again and I do pay attention to the relevant sections of it.

There is nothing wrong with arbitration/meditation/conciliation in resolving personal disputes. They are both less costly for the parities, less stressful and do not accentuate hostility. But when they are to be decided according to sharia, you and I both know the kind of problems it can lead to. As regards the awards being in conformity with the Ontario law, this can only happen if they are not in conformity with the sharia laws, in which case they will simply be an arbitration panel and not a muslim panel. I am glad that people like you are involved in this issue - hopefully the govt. will realise the implications of this ill-considered idea and cancel the whole thing.

dos-mittar,

You read the Post/Citizen too much. :-)

Fear mongering aside, it is both well known, and a very common argument on the part of those who support these arbitration committees that the law of the land will reign supreme. This is not a `saving grace`, but understood to be a part of the design. Ismalis, Christians, aboriginals, and Jewish groups (not just `obscure` ones) have such comities.

The real issue isn`t Sharia, since any judgment of the arbitration panel must be in accordance with the law (there is only one law). The real issue is the competency of those who are running the arbitration panels, and those of us in the community are thinking along these lines despite the willful ignorance of those outside who would wish to obfuscate the nature of these arbitration comities. Either get rid of these across the board, or allow their use across the board. Personally, I would be very skeptical about the quality of the arbitration, so I wouldn`t go to one of these tribunals.

Your point about this potentially becoming an `image` problem...perhaps, but then there`s nothing that can make the Lowell Green types happy. In fact, given the hysteria these types have tried to stir up, it is better for the community to challenge it head on than to roll over and play dead.

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1086819009712&call_pageid=970599109774&col=Columnist969907621513

http://www.thestar.com/NASApp/cs/ContentServer?pagename=thestar/Layout/Article_Type1&c=Article&cid=1087078813623&call_pageid=970599109774&col=Columnist969907621513