What’s the Taj Mahal like from the inside? And Other Stories

re:#26 by Dalit
If u do not like what u are, u can choose any religion. Many Dalits are becoming Buddhists or Islam. As i already said, India gives religous freedom for individual conversions. The 800 million odd Hindus in India will not miss u if u convert.
But, seriously, what is the point in posting something that we already know.
Sridhar

urstruly, thanks, but i can`t be a brother, a sister maybe?? anyway, this is barachota talking to himself-this is worse than poor maligned fosa.
and no, i wouldn`t hug any unknown man, thanks, even we have our limits!but i have had college friends over who are dalits at my place, and i never gave it thought till now.

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A wonderful read. glad to know that some people are willing to look beyond the norm.
I think that the Indian and Pakistani chowkies who like to quarrel all the time should learn a bit from the respected author.

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Kaurasach

I think the easiest thing in the world is to through mud on others; doesn`t cost you a dime. If your heart is so soft for the plight of people, then show me by wiping off the tears from this Dalit`s eyes - hug him to your bossom and call him your brother? Can you do that? I don`t think so - a hindu has to be a god or mahatama to do that - you are neither.

Mr. D

My brother, I know you don`t like to be called by this word but you have to tell me how to address you. Until then I will call you my brother. So you ask whether Muslims are better in India? My bro all you have to do is to walk into a mosque and see it with your own eyes.

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While I agree that the dalit issue is one of extreme importance and has been ignored too often, I fail to see what relevance it has to the article above.

NB

We did fairly well. Of the three teams taking part, two of them made it to the quarter finals and one till the semi`s. The Best Speaker prize (based on cumulative marks in the 5 preliminary rounds) went to a student from our college. We were the only Indian University which managed to get visas....that too at the last moment.

Urstruly
Are Muslims any better in India?


We, the other people By K.G. KANNABIRAN- Hindu June 8, 2001

The 160 million Dalits are demanding that untouchability and other forms of discrimination based on descent practiced in India be equated with racial discrimination.

The SAGA of ``the other people has not ended. It is shifted to the international arena. They do not appear to be part of ``we the people``. Serious efforts to bring these ``the other people``, who are rotting as non-persons in a caste-ridden society, to the status of persons were on for some time prior to Independence. The people emerged from subjects to citizens after August 15, 1947. After the coming into force of the Constitution all of us attained a political status with well-defined rights. The most articulate representative of the other people wrote into the Constitution human values and gave it a human face. There was recognition in the Constitution that for the other people to truly become ``we the people`` specific safeguards and positive measures were necessary. Caste was not abolished by the Constitution. Provisions were made to treat all castes on a par with each other. But the other people, even after 50 years, have remained ``the other people``.

Constitutions and Gods have always been good. The problem has always been with the interpreters, lay and judicial. The Constitution makes untouchability an offence. And it persists. Bonded labour and child labour come from the ranks of the Dalits. Both the practices have been made penal and abolished by the Constitution and yet they persist. The entire administrative, judicial and political systems are still exercised by the ``upper`` castes despite large-scale movements against these hegemonic practices. A few are allowed to climb the social order as political leaders or as judges in the subordinate judiciary or as High Court judges. In education and Government employment, the Constitution has introduced reservation as a principle of ensuring equality for the Dalits. The present ruling party at the Centre attacked reservation as the prime cause for diminishing merit and efficiency in administration, and by stoking the anti reservation stir brought down the Government headed by Mr. V.P. Singh which stood for reservation and secularism. Thus the bogie of reservation blown out of all proportion with the reality at the ground level has created a feeling of hatred for the Dalits among the middle class intelligentsia. The rights the Dalits secured after prolonged litigation appear to offer them a quasi-freedom and a teasing illusion that they are reaching the stage of genuine acceptability into the social order as equal members. It is more difficult to fight this teasing illusion than to fight downright subjugation and the status as non-person.

In the rural areas, violence against the Scheduled Castes continues unabated. Recognizing this, Parliament enacted the Scheduled Castes and the Scheduled Tribes (Prevention of Atrocities) Act, 1989, a law creating special offences which were made triable by special court. Look at the practices which continue to exist and which parliament has identified as offences under the Act. Very few of us would have gone through the definition of ``atrocity`` in the Act; nor would many of us have heard about or witnessed the indignities to which Scheduled Castes and Scheduled Tribes are subjected continuously. Where social reformers have failed a Constitution may not succeed unless the words in the Constitution are transformed into deeds. Section 3 enumerates 22 categories of atrocities which are made punishable. Unless we read the enumeration of the atrocities set out, we may not be in a position to understand why Ambedkar wanted to get out of the Hindu system, why the Scheduled Castes want the conduct of upper castes to be made an international issue.

The law was intended to afford speedy justice, the component of speed was to act as a deterrent. The lebensraum provided by the law to evade, defeated the law without any necessary for open defiance. The assault on Dalits is legitimized by the acquittal of assailants in courts. The offences under the Act were made triable by a Special Court whose presiding officer shall be a sessions Judge. This id entrusted to the Special Court for purposes for speedy trial, an aspect of Article 21 of the Constitution. This was interpreted by the apex court to mean that like all other criminal offenses it should pass through the committal proceedings before a magistrate. This enactment now remains only in the statute book and will slowly fall into desuetude. All this is achieved without help of a loaded jury system as in the U.S. Thus we have laws, constitutional provisions showcased to tell international bodies through the obliging Attorney-Generals that the caste of the Dalits cannot be equated with race.

This story goes on to show that the minds of the people living in India and Pakistan are not biased or prejudiced . It is only the governments of the two countries and fundamentalist parties, who try their best to manipulate the minds of young people.

Welocome to Pakistan. Do Come again! :)

nb

It is incumbent upon me to introduce him to the truth - it wont hurt you either. Be our brother.

#17 Dalit

Dalits are only one group among many other groups struggling at the bottom of the indian economic pyramid. Overrepresented groups include muslims (strongly averse to modern education) and tribals (historically outside the modern economy). It would be good if your article were to acknowledge these realities.

As sridhar has pointed out, while brahmin baiting (based on 3000 year old texts) may bring some western NGO and christian money to dalit ``leaders`` as well as give pleasure at ``getting back`` at the oppressor, the reality is that 90% of violence against dalits today is from groups just above them in the economic hierarchy. It would be good if your article acknowledged these realities.

Finally, quoting western scholars like Dumont who have never travelled or lived in India probably sounds very impressive, but it misses the point. The point is economic empowerment of all indians, especially those in the bottom 25%. The point is to create 1000`s of small businesses run by dalits, to create an increasingly large middle-class based on education and professional aspiration.

Some of this has already taken place (thanks to the words largest affirmative action program run by the indian goverment

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instituted in 1947

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20 years before the great western nations recognized the need for such a program for their own minorities) and much more can take place in the India of today. But not if all energy is spent in attacking imaginary enemies and then begging for money and recognition from the UN, Christian Churches and impractical NGOs. All you will get is a handout-culture and a set of ``leaders`` whose main achievement are their large bank accounts and their ability to parade their victim status internationally.

what is wrong with you, urstruly, he is a muslim! this is barachota.

Mr. Dalit

I hope you must have heard the adage ``Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me``. Please expalin to me when you fully understand that it is the Hindu religion itself that sanctions the system of aparthied with a divine mandate, then why don`t you get out of this oppression when you have the choice. Why don`t you become Muslims and become our brothers. Islam is the only religion on this planet that mandates equality not only among human beings but nations as well. Your bemoaning will not change the core philosophy of a religion, neither it will change its adherents. Who are you when divinity itself has mandated it? So you have a choice - please study the religion of Islam with an open mind and open heart - it has never hurt anybody. You will still have the choice to go back to your old religion that has hurt you so much, but at least make an informed decision. What you are suffereing and what your ancestors have suffered since millenia, in what book it is written that your children should suffer the same. In the name of fairness and kindness to your children give Islam a chance. Remeber God helps only those who help themselves.