A Case for Moderation

#120

you forget the most obvious stuka-bhai that disgusting black stuff that somes out of the ground.

the US companies have been left out of the Sudanese oil game. indian and chinese companies have grabbed the concessions. The Canadian company Talisman had to withdraw due to domestic HR pressure. This is the US companies road back in.

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Wht the hell should US march into Sudan? Have Bananas become a strategic requirement? That is if Sudan even produces bananas.

arjun_m,

``speaking of liberation, what`s the deal with darfur..should the marines march into darfur to liberate whoever the heck is oppressed there? ``

In principle, yeah, but considering those folks follow a liar and a self-serving lunatic, it`s best left to others. A good start would be to destroy the Sudanese air force, however the situation is complex...the terrorists (oh, excuse me, freedom fighters...) in the south will take advantage of the situation. Then we`ll just have a reverse scenario...

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#113 sigalph ``Iraq is free today and no amount of liberal-left hand-wringing can change the fact that Americans paved the way. Funny these folks never tire of second-guessing the success of freedom. ``


HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Well I agree with your analysis that its Deen-e-Mulla which muslims are

following.....


But I would Like to Know where in Quran..... it says to Kill ......


Infact I have heard.....


1-If you Kill one Human you kill whole humanity....


2- There is No compulsion in religion ( that is do not force your religion on others)

3- Do not say bad things about Other religions



Well It does not goes with your arguments....

You cannot live by the book, Quran or no Quran. The world is too complicated for that. Recognizing that fact is the first step toward moderation.

Mr. Gibran has advised the Muslim to shun Hadees and confine theselves to Quran. I may tell him that what is being practiced, especially in Pakistan, is not Islam but Deen-e- Mulla which is actually the continuation of `Doure Jahilia`. Apart from this so much in Quran too which requires re-interpretation to make it compatible in the environment of 21st centuy when the world has become a global village. For instance, Quran says `Ashadaul kuffar wa rohma beinahum` which means you shoud deal severely with those whome you consider kaafir but should be sympethatic to tose whom you cosider to be Muslims`. Who is a kafir and who is a muslim has been left to the subjective judgment of a person. Again Quran says ` Kill karirs where ever you find them`, and now they are in ample supply within Pakistan not to speak of the world at large. I have tried reinterpret a small Soora which I will try copy here as a sample:
Sorry I could not copy here the Urdu traslation of Soora Maoon (107) here. I will try now in Roman Urdu:
`` Tu ne dekha he us shakhs ko jo Deen (jo kih nizaam he makhlooq ki kheirkhaahi ka) ko jhoota qaraar deta he. Pas yih woh shakhs he jo dhake deta he beaasra (yateem) ko aur naheen targheeb dilata oopar khaana dene ghareeb ke. Pas barbaadi he aise musallion (nimaazion) ke lie jo apni salat ke maqsad se bekhabr hein. Woh dikhawaa karte hein logon ke saame apni deendaari ka magar munkar hein haqooqe insaani ke.``

re nasah 103

Another self serving post whose intellectual shallowness is aptly matched by its historical myopia. The same argument that was used by the so called America First crowd of Charles Lindbergh who proclaimed that poor Hitler was no threat to anyone.

Yes, Vietnam was lost but thanks to those sacrifices etched on the Wall, Communism was given a fight and contained within the Indochinese peninsula. Those sacrifices were the building blocks of rolling back Red totalitarianism in the eighties and, finally, Communism`s demise.

Iraq is free today and no amount of liberal-left hand-wringing can change the fact that Americans paved the way. Funny these folks never tire of second-guessing the success of freedom.

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ferozek,

.... with your permission, i would like to quote you :

``It is the fate of Pakistan that it will never see or experience democracy and it will languish in the agony of religion. It is a fate, which even the gods cannot prevent. The principle intention of a religion is to create distinctions and to force upon a view of exclusivity instead of inclusivity in its followers towards other people. Religion thrives on dogma, because like anyother temporal power, it disdains questions, which are seen as a threat to its existence. Religion is nothing more than an autocratic expression of political authority masked under a different rationale.``

........... your ilogs are the only thing worth reading on chowk nowdays .............

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Is it true that in Pakistan when one disagrees with you they call you a jahil? an illiterate?
Wow, ive never been accused of being illiterate before, yet in 4 days (since my article was posted) - two people (echoboom and urstruly) have accused me of being jahil about what 20 times and counting. its comforting...thanks guys.

URSTRULY.....(people look at post #6) : wow, this man can even quote verses of the Quran...to Allah we belong and to Him shall we return. Im not sure of the context....anyway, Mr. Urstruly, please do not put words in my mouth, and I certainly do not need to explain your statement, which misrepresents my views. Please, go do what you want to do cowboy....no one is stopping you. Go write your own article, instead of runnign around Chowk, looking for anyone who dare disagree with you. Freak.

Echoboom:
Again this man takes me out of context (see post 107) - I was writing that in response to people who argue why Muslims always think around Islam.
But you are right about one thing boom shakala, I am not in favor of a backward Islamic state, if you are - please give me your address, i know a few travel agents who can arrange a flight to Saudi Arabia tommorrow...ofcourse, internet is banned over there...so you will not be able to come on chowk.com. So sad.
My friends, I call on both urstruly and echoboom to stop this pointless character assasination. I just cannot agree with your points....maybe cause Im illiterate. SEE IM HOPELESSS. so you cant help me, so stop trying to convert me to your cowboy cause, go find some others to play cops and robbers.
I have recieved a lot of mail commenting on these extremist elements on chowk, i urge those who emailed me to expose thse bin laden wannabes for what they are... all talk.

Nasah:103

Thank you for posting that. Now who in the world would not admire a `` Vali posheeda, and kaafir khulaa``
Jee chahtaa hai choom looN, baRRh kr nazar ko meiN.

Shukria bohut bohut.

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jibbe:9

1. No matter how hard we try, religion will play a huge role in Pakistan and in the Muslim world, to break away from this character will take many many years. For those who argue for complete secularism - do note that change takes time, and by arguing for another extreme in our societies will only create a backlash. Therefore it has to be a gradual process coming from within our country through educated means.

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-``-break away from this character will take many many years..``

So is this your mindset? --Never again invoke Quran while, in that same foul breath, wishing for demise of religion. No it will not take many years to kick out closet atheists & secularists from Pakistan; especially if they seek refuge in a muslim closet.

...``.and by arguing for another extreme in our societies will only create a backlash..``

Oh! so these are your `tactics`?--No the gallows and coffins are already being prepared for such traitors. Vietnam, Iran, Cuba or any other place where the United-Satans have left their finger-prints bear a testimony to that. Iraq is a show that is still running in its 10th season. And Pakistan is next..Will give you more numbers about millions of asylum seekers.

jibbe: tell me if you can read this .

Most likely you are those unfortunate illiterates in Pakistan who went to Ba-Ba-Blacksheep schools. Your only claim to education is that your arse, mind, and hearts feel comfy in the the satanic westernish lifestyle.
How do you keep yourself in touch with that majority whose welfare you seek by posing as a muslim?

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..Now I want you in about 200-500 words to write your own article (or just post it here) - about how ECHOBOOM proposes we change the country. ...


No I do not have any desire to teach someone so characterless a person as yourself. Get lost.