Beena Sarwar October 3, 2004
#1 Posted by Urstruly on October 3, 2004 7:14:46 pm
I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that the attack on Imam Bargah was planned and executed by ISi and CIA. It is getting too perdictable - whenever these two rogue organizations kill someone in cold blood who has nothing to do with shia-sunni dispute, an attack on an imam Bargah happens - just to give an impression that the the political opponents they are eliminating were bad people.. Unless shias and sunnis don`t act and work together this alliance of satans will keep on unleeshing untold misery upon the people of Pakistan.
#2 Posted by arjun_m on October 3, 2004 8:00:44 pm
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#3 Posted by hassansiddiqi on October 3, 2004 8:35:41 pm
Good article Beena but you seem to propose that military action is not viable for Pakistan and only bringing about ``law and order, social justice, etc`` will help eliminate extremist elements.
I know that these extremists were in part nurtured by the CIA and the previous governments but the fact remains that the ``political mullahs`` dominated certain regions and provided a training ground for illiterate zealots. Hence a two pronged strategy for overcoming terrorism within Pakistan, in my opinion will be something like this...
1. We need to neutralize and disarm all those extremist forces which are staging such attacks. A military action against these forces will help us manage short term security concerns. I know that we have experienced more attacks after the war on terror but we need to understand that this is a phase that has to be countered to ensure short term security in the country.
2. For long term security I completely agree with you when you say that the rule of law, social justice and education will prevail. For this Musharraf and Pakistani administration needs to create policies that create interprovincial harmony, better understanding of other cultures and absolute adherence to law and order. Without it there is no hope for Pakistan.
#4 Posted by SoulKeeper on October 3, 2004 11:26:03 pm
Another despicable act of violence by the self proclaimed ‘thekedars’ of my faith. These people should be brought to justice and should be imprisoned for life (Yes, I am against capital punishment, so hang me).
And Urstruly:
Own up to the fact that Musalman, in this day and age, is primarily a savage society; the present times for the Islamic world are equivalent to the dark ages in Europe. Whose fault is it? Go figure.
What we need is to educate our masses and not blame the West for all our evils. A lesson in preservation of life as a premier value, at the school level should do the trick.
Whatever happened to the love for all human kind? It is hard to believe that this is the Ummat that was supposed to uphold the teachings of Rehmat-ul-lilAalimeen.
And Urstruly:
Own up to the fact that Musalman, in this day and age, is primarily a savage society; the present times for the Islamic world are equivalent to the dark ages in Europe. Whose fault is it? Go figure.
What we need is to educate our masses and not blame the West for all our evils. A lesson in preservation of life as a premier value, at the school level should do the trick.
Whatever happened to the love for all human kind? It is hard to believe that this is the Ummat that was supposed to uphold the teachings of Rehmat-ul-lilAalimeen.
#5 Posted by Urstruly on October 4, 2004 4:26:28 am
arjun
It is not a Muslim issue to begin with. Muslims can do worst attrocities to each other than what hindus did in Gujrat; trust me I have witnessed them doing it with my own eyes, but not everytime a bad thing happens in the world means that it must have been done by Muslims. The truth of the matter is Americans are fighting an imperialistic crusade to dominate the world. This is a unique phenomenon, which has no precedence in history where a sigle power stives to dominate the world economically and militarily. Muslims were the easiest prey in American assessment, so they started from them, but eventually the glut for power on their part and discontent of humanity triggered by the unjust distribution of wealth that have already resulted from it will trigger the global insurgency. Americans are working overtime around the globe to crush any such insurgency before it happens thru a brute military and political oppression. Keeping this background in mind, one must ask this question ``when tomorrow Iran will be militarily isolated, sanctioned, and ready to be invaded, would Pakistan provide ``logistical`` support to facilitate that invasion?`` if the answer to this question is ``yes`` then the next question is `` what must be done now, politically, in Pakistan so that when the time comes there is least political resistance inside Pakistan against such invasion``. Would a shia-sunni rift help? would the establishment of military installations in Baluchistan help? and so on and so forth.
#6 Posted by Urstruly on October 4, 2004 4:41:29 am
Soulkeeper
If you subtract the wars from the Muslim equation, that have been forced upon Muslims like that in Iraq, Afghanistan, Kashmir, Checheneya, Philipines, Darfur, Palestine, Wana, Baluchistan, Yemen, occupation of several Arab countries, Pakistan, and puppet despots whose strings are played from you know where, the Muslims are pretty decent and normal people like any other in the world. Yes rehmat-ullilalamin`s teachings will help us look inside but what to do with what is threatening from outside? We have to place the blame where it belongs - both inside and outside.
If you subtract the wars from the Muslim equation, that have been forced upon Muslims like that in Iraq, Afghanistan, Kashmir, Checheneya, Philipines, Darfur, Palestine, Wana, Baluchistan, Yemen, occupation of several Arab countries, Pakistan, and puppet despots whose strings are played from you know where, the Muslims are pretty decent and normal people like any other in the world. Yes rehmat-ullilalamin`s teachings will help us look inside but what to do with what is threatening from outside? We have to place the blame where it belongs - both inside and outside.
#7 Posted by stuka on October 4, 2004 6:21:53 am
````when tomorrow Iran will be militarily isolated, sanctioned, and ready to be invaded, would Pakistan provide ``logistical`` support to facilitate that invasion?`` if the answer to this question is ``yes`` then the next question is `` what must be done now, politically, in Pakistan so that when the time comes there is least political resistance inside Pakistan against such invasion``. Would a shia-sunni rift help? would the establishment of military installations in Baluchistan help? and so on and so forth. ``
That is the problem with Urstruly`s theorems. They are just a bit plausible. :)
That is the problem with Urstruly`s theorems. They are just a bit plausible. :)
#8 Posted by nikki7777 on October 4, 2004 7:36:45 am
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#9 Posted by arjun_m on October 4, 2004 7:36:45 am
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#10 Posted by mshergill on October 4, 2004 7:36:46 am
The snake that you breed by supplying it with milk daily may one day just bite your hand.
#11 Posted by Gandiv on October 4, 2004 11:10:35 am
Pathetic at the best!
Beena,
You wrote:
``It is hardly a coincidence that in this atmosphere, those who had been waiting in the wings in Gujarat were able to butcher, rape and loot Muslims with impunity, aided and encouraged by government functionaries. ``
The whole world knows that the Godhra Muslims attacked innocent womans and children in the train, some of whom were still sleeping and died while sleeping.
Why is it that you can`t see anything wrong done by Muslims, and always try to find an excuse in someone else` actions?
Stop jerking and get a life!
Beena,
You wrote:
``It is hardly a coincidence that in this atmosphere, those who had been waiting in the wings in Gujarat were able to butcher, rape and loot Muslims with impunity, aided and encouraged by government functionaries. ``
The whole world knows that the Godhra Muslims attacked innocent womans and children in the train, some of whom were still sleeping and died while sleeping.
Why is it that you can`t see anything wrong done by Muslims, and always try to find an excuse in someone else` actions?
Stop jerking and get a life!
#12 Posted by amit on October 4, 2004 11:55:20 am
Re:urstruly
Are you actually suggesting that the CIA and ISI are hiring suicide bombers in Pakistan? Why not blame RAW while you are at it? This is totally ludicrous. If the CIA wanted to create shia-sunni hatred, at worst they might organize a bomb blast, but hiring suicide bombers is a typical jihadi tactic. You are in serious denial that this is the work of sunni extremists, the Lashkar-e-Jhangvi types who have a venomous hatred against shias. These elements have become a toxic component of your society and it is high time you recognize the threat and start eliminating it.
Are you actually suggesting that the CIA and ISI are hiring suicide bombers in Pakistan? Why not blame RAW while you are at it? This is totally ludicrous. If the CIA wanted to create shia-sunni hatred, at worst they might organize a bomb blast, but hiring suicide bombers is a typical jihadi tactic. You are in serious denial that this is the work of sunni extremists, the Lashkar-e-Jhangvi types who have a venomous hatred against shias. These elements have become a toxic component of your society and it is high time you recognize the threat and start eliminating it.
#13 Posted by Urstruly on October 4, 2004 12:27:40 pm
Amit
where did you get the info that it was an act of a suicide bomber. I rest my case.
The so called toxic elements have been funded by CIA for atleast 25 years since Iranian revolution mostly thru Saudis. They work for those who fund them. Stop the funding, and they will stop too. But currently they are needed more than ever before to corner Iran. ISI has just begun to be a major player in this game - the new middle man if you will.
#14 Posted by jang on October 4, 2004 1:02:58 pm
#13 Urstruely
Are you saying that there was no bomb either?
So the plan is keep attacking shias hoping that iran starts getting interested, then use isi to cause trouble in iran. This is brilliant. Did not see this possibility. How big is isi, and how is it indoctrinated? Or is it simply like a mafia organization, works for money. Is it not a hierarchy? in which case, a policy has to be inplace, no?
Are you saying that there was no bomb either?
So the plan is keep attacking shias hoping that iran starts getting interested, then use isi to cause trouble in iran. This is brilliant. Did not see this possibility. How big is isi, and how is it indoctrinated? Or is it simply like a mafia organization, works for money. Is it not a hierarchy? in which case, a policy has to be inplace, no?
#15 Posted by ASO1 on October 4, 2004 1:02:58 pm
Usrtruly:
Let me nibble the bait and ask: ``Then why a bomb blast in an Imambargah and not in a mosque?``
Let me nibble the bait and ask: ``Then why a bomb blast in an Imambargah and not in a mosque?``
#16 Posted by arjun_m on October 4, 2004 1:02:58 pm
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