Reforming Pakistan’s Universities -- II

I agree with Dr. Hoodbhoy. The problem of universities is not lack of funding. It is lack of sincere people with vision. HEC is experimenting by trying to bring back Pakistani scientists and engineer working abroad by offering them handsome salaries. Feel sorry to say that it will not help at all. LUMS (The prestigious Lahore University of Management Sciences) groomed its faculty of Computer Science with same misconception. Come here and you will find well qualified professionals with PhD degrees from eminent world universities and developed research labs with generous external funding from various unfortunate so called government R&D organizations. But it is no different place than any other government sector university with locally qualified teachers rather it is worse in the sense that here for same output as of public universities they are wasting far more money. Yes it is glamorous; this is absolutely right due to good marketing strategy. The people here with foreign qualifications are even more disinterested in doing research than their counter parts in public sector universities with limited funding. Point is foreign qualification does not change the dishonesty and selfish attitude that is deeply rooted in our blood. Politics, diplomacies and leg pulling is also as common here as any where else. LUMS is conducting special tests to enroll as much HEC scholars as possible just to make more money without enhancing facilities. Even foreigners with good qualification cannot change us without a culture change and this cannot be done with in days. Perhaps what ever Dr. Atta is doing is with good intentions but I will suggest him that this is the time to do some research on actual outcomes of his moves. A research is also needed on attitude of our society. This will definitely help to make focused plans that can bring real change. Thanks! fnahmad@gmail.com

Great article.

1. India and China have made it very clear that they want their unis to rival the US`s ivies.

2. Pakistan has lost many of its citizens due to an economy and culture that wouldnt hire professional women about 30 years ago..i.e. of a prof couple, the husband would get the job, while the wife`s doctorate was useless.

3. Many of those same people became American citizens after Pakistan`s violent treatment of Bangladesh.

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#2 by Urstruly on January 4, 2005 1:26pm PT

`Let us accept the truth of the matter that the status quo in Pakistan cannot be changed without an armed struggle.`

Brother Urstruly,

Can you lay out possible avenues of where this armed struggle can come from? China, India, America probably are not good choices, But what about Afghanistan and Iran? Can we say that as much as this armed struggle comes from the grass roots of our society, it should also have help from abroad. From expatriates maybe? An MQM, Baluchistan rebels, Sindhi jiyala, Punjabi jawaan and Pakhtun warriors alliance? Perhaps a revolution within the army ala Zia? But all of this has to have America`s blessing.. or no?

In your response, also briefly mention why people like us who have access and time for the internet should even bother thinking about Pakistan and its poor people. Should it be God-ordained or just the right thing to do or a just giving back to a country where we were accidentally born.. Especially since we are so safe and sound, tucked far away from the maddening crowds. why should we bother shedding blood in an armed struggle..

And this is how intelligent, smart, no-showoffs, leaders who love their people not because they are western-slaves but because they serve their own people. O baighairtO, if nothing, then you just learn from your neighbors. Bhaand-KanjaRR kind of nangaa-shuhdaa-sharaabi behaviour will not fast-forward you into the company of your enlightened and modern neighbors like Iran and India.

The greatness of madressas: A report from India

Someone pointed out another `talent` among ``educated`` Pakis: Does any country, US UK India--ANY nation, forms polical groups & parties OUTSIDE their homelands? Do they have any identity OTHER than that of the country which issued them the passport. Do American , British, or Canadians [even of Paki-origin] form labour, liberal, republican or democrtic party OUTSIDE the country[Pakistan?]; to ``critique`` ``badmouth`` ``invite foreign-help to fix women, mulla, labour-union, or `education` problems `` back-home``?

How can total ignorants ( read: those from english-mediums fat cats in Pakistan) even think of reform. The very idea that they do not consider themselves disqualified & ignorant is the height & proofof their ignorance..and they think twice about shelling out legal & medical advice; when even lawyers & doctors [ yeah the Harvard types] have to consult imams on shariat matters.

Let me repeat: If you do not have ghairrat, dignity, honour as THE prime & foremost virtue then all the english-french-german stuff your spew out is not worth zilch;on the contrary you are a huge burden on the crumbling spines of our very LEARNED & highly educated but unmissionary-schooled AWAAM.

Ask any totaa-mainaa Paki about the progress he has made in his being a paRRhaa likhaa, he would tell you:
1. His job title & perks
2. The salary
3. How many people work ``under`` him
4. Been to `faarin`
5. Is illiterate ( & proudly so) in urdu
6. Knows so & so bigshot
7. Can be mistaken for a `faariner`
8. Elevates himself by deriding religion.
9. Loves `faarin` food. Kids speak english. Know songs by sung by Liverpool Dock rats (Beatles)

etc etc.

So where are all the pakistani academics teaching abroad ? I assume they exist in reasonable numbers. Why cant they do their bit ?

Indian educators could be persuaded but perhaps for short durations initially

Urstruly #2

Pakistan has no choice to go the private route in higher education. It has worked partially in Southern India. As you pointed out the state lacks the resources (or the will to allocate resources to education).

Education needs a good culture to flourish. I am not sure that Pakistan has the political stability for it. Peace with India may be necessary but not sufficient in itself.

So the Lafanga is back with his Harvardish sophistry.

(Has the news not reached him that Harvard & Cambridge have lost their lustre. They are easy sailing for those from madressas)

Until and unless this guy puts 7 years hard labour with the Edhi foundation and returns as as reformed homespun Desi ( meaning having forgotten american ``accent`` and ``slang``) , all his ``scholarship`` is a total drain ( not brain one) upon Pakistan`s resources.

Pakistan can progress a bit , once Hoodbhoy types at least stop interfering. That itself would be a great service to muslims, in particular. These are the ``Doctors`` of the impoverished world who have become experts in organ harvesting and trading and selling them to keep their Masters (the farangis) in robust health. These are the coffin-stealers who want to create societies of body-snatchers so that no fundamentalist & principled Islamic government gets a chance to get nourished & nurtured.

The Hoodbhoy types are incapable of learning anything until it is westinfested are the real jahils of Pakistan. Without madressa education, there Harvardism is like a plastic-plant.

Dr. Hoodbhoy

You speak the truth in ways that very few do in Pakistan. Yours is a clean, quality mirror. Please keep it up in spite of the great resistance you must encounter. The intelligent policy makers in Pakistan are listening to you. You give Pakistan hope. If Pakistan ever finds its place in the world, you will be one of the reasons. Thank God for people like you.

Dr. Doodbhoy,

It is comforting to know that people in your position are not only concerned but actually contributing to the slow and painful progress towards (hopefully) a better future.

A few thoughts/opinions.....

Success of western quality eduction comes out of a combination of state, community, and business support. Sound policies and continuous improvement in systems is a continued effort on the part of the administrations/university boards. Bottomline? You need sincere people at the helm of the affairs. If there is a will there is a way.

An example in very few words: We found out that an Indian professor was working on a project that had business potential. We approached the university board, they welcomed us. The professor, although by law/rules would be a major benefector of revenues, he was more concerned about his phd students and made sure that they were well taken care of. University Board made sure that the professor was happy and legally protected, and at the same time provided us an opportunity to use government fundings to acquire seed capital. Portions of revenues and royalties are to be used for the department`s development. It all happened because people did the right thing and acted objectively and self lessly. The benefactors were, the university, professor, students, and a business.

Last night we watched the Sugar Bowl (American college football finals) between Virginia Tech and Auburn. Another great example how community, business, education, sports, and most of all immense marketing for education is taking place in such a fantastic manner......these are `profitable` ventures in every sense of the word and support the most important thing, education.....

What I mean to say is that established systems are already out there, successfully implemented and getting better. Most important of all, the information is publicly available and accessible and can be used by anyone who is willing to look for it. We do not need to re invent the wheel, we may have to adapt it a little bit. All we need to do is to get our act together and do the one thing that is the most important thing...improve education and make it available for everyone....wishful thinking under the current circumstances......
but there is always hope...

NH

I found this article very useful, profound, informative and thought-provoking. I wish some of Dr. Hoodbhoy`s colleagues and other university teachers in Pakistan read the article and interact. Those who really feel for Pakistan should not be afraid of criticizing the weaknesse where they exist.

I had first hand experience of the kind of teachers that Dr. Hoodbhoy is talking about, at Lahore College of engineering and Technology in my time (1950`s). I have a few interesting and revealing stories about my teachers and their methods of teaching. But this is not the place for me to write about them. May be I`ll write an article about it. The reason I didn`t do it so far was that I hoped that the situation must have improved and my story would be out of tune. The intent is not to ridicule any person but to show the outdated system. Optimistically, I had believed like Faiz, ``Keh abb seht teray (Pakistan) rukh par bikhr gaiee ho gee`` and ``Keh teri maang sitaron sey bhar gaiee ho gee.``

It was easy for us to compare the standards of our local professors with a couple of expatriates who were still completing their contracts. Our German professor of Strength of Materials remarked frequently that in his country those who had not published any original research work were not allowed to teach. I was hoping that things would have changed for better with so many Ph.D`s who are teaching these days but apparently we`re caught in a whirl pool.

The readers should not take this article lightly; it`s a serious diagonosis and the symptoms are bad. Time is running out on us.

Thanks Dr. Hoodbhoy for an eye-opener.

Mohammad Gill

Higher education in Pakistan is in crisis. If you want to help please visit PEP Foundation website: www.pepfoundation.org and join us in our efforts to help Pakistanis help themselves.

labyrinth1,
Why don`t you give a positive spin on Pakistani Universities? You have all opportunities in world to point out descripancies in Dr Hoodbhoy`s report.

You should thank god that you have someone who can still think rationally and identify avenues for improvement.

Dr Hoodbhoy,
Unfortunately Indian educators will not be able to come till we have this atmosphere of mistrust. Muslim educators from India, of which there are many, would be best equipped culturally. But they will be seen with suspicion by Indian Intelligence Agencies. Non-muslim educators will be seen with suspicion by Pakistani Intelligence agencies..



Following is what I wrote in reply to Ahmed Sadozai`s thread..

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#252 by friend on December 18, 2004 10:18am PT
HP #251
Disbelief shown by you and other Pakistani interactors really accentuates the frustrations faced by Sadozai. If appears that he was the only one who knew gap between standard of education offered between Pakistan and elsewhere.
You atleast was gracious enough to admit it. Almost all other interactors from Pakistan, knowingly or unknowingly, found it hard to believe that education system can be any better in any south asian country.
This appears to be one area where normal relationship could have helped Pakistan with a jumpstart. At this time, non-muslim south asian educators wont go to Pakistan because it not seen as secure friendly to no-muslims. Muslim educators, (of which there are plenty in India) would not go to Pakistan because they will be seen by Indian intelligence agencies as sympathetic to Pakistan. I notice that IBA is trying to get ``foreign professors``. You may find many Indian educators who will go for the sake of adventure, thrill or just to earn money - provided Pakistan`s atmosphere is condusive to non-muslim foreigners.

The first note accuses Hoodbhoy of being a perpetual pessimist; the second calls for an armed struggle. Where is the constructive thought in that!!!!!!
Perheps its time that we should all turn into John Galt`s and leave the place alone to implode. Would that be satisfactory to you folks?

Regards.