Pakistan’s Software Industry

Mantolives #175

`` Dr. Qadeer Khan is a Kutay ka bacha... who ever helped proliferate our nuclear assets are pigs...

These idiots didn`t know that the first rule of ``Nuclear deterrence`` is that we don`t share with others...

Now... thanks to these bastards... not only do we have to worry about a nuclear armed neighbor to the east but also possibly one to the west... meanwhile ... this brotherly Islamic country is entering into alliances with our eastern neighbor every day...

SHAME ON people like QADEER KHAN .. and the haraamzadas who support him...``

I find it hard to believe Qadeer Khan was free lancing nuclear technology to Iran and North Korea.

I do not know about the sales to Libya. The whole saga sounds fishy.

re: rahul_capri

I was not seeking a proposal/suggestion from you. :) I was merely being rhetorical. :)

The mindset of the mullah is another debate. The power of the mullah, to influence, comes from the slogan that ``Islam is in danger``. Remember, Pakistani education places an emphasis on obedience and not questioning and the mullah uses this to his advantage. Any questions asked for justification, is branded as un-Islamic. The power of the mullah comes from the blant exploitation of an ignorant mind and it is allowed to exist due to the indifference of liberalism in Pakistan.

Years ago, in the early history of Pakistan, liberalism co-opted religion, because the politicans who came to Pakistan, in 1947, were transplanted politicans; their natural continuencies being Bombay, Delhi, Calcutta or Dhaka. The natural continuency of what is Pakistan was dominated by the feudals and it is no wonder that all of them resisted the idea of Pakistan, because it was threat to their power. Since the liberal politicans did not have any power base here, they used religion to gain political legitimacy and that gave the mullah a taste of political power. This also explains, why the mullahs went from hating the idea of Pakistan to becoming its champion defenders. The mullah in Pakistan is a political person and he is not religious, because historically, religion has been used to justify an illiberal form of government in Pakistan. To understand the mind of the mullah and the basis for his power, you have to understand the politics of religion in Pakistan and the politics is opportunistic in Pakistan.

re: Amit

Agreed!

re: hamidm2

Yes. You are right, because I was mature enough to be aware, when the balance started to shift in favor religious studies in Pakistan. I remember my days at Karachi Grammar School in the 1970s and Islamiyat was a just another course for padding up grades and it was never taken seriously and neither was it taught in a serious manner. I remember, the most common topic discussed in my Islamiyat class was cricket. Then, after the arrival of Zia, there was marked shift towards Pakistani studies in place of Pakistan and I remember to actually learning Islamiyat, because it was being taught with a more pronounced vigor.

I never experience the full impact of Zia`s educational folly, because my father decided to move outside of Pakistan since he had a major disagreement with Zia on the issue of the Afghan refugees.

Ciao

satyamvada #163


`` How about admitting that Islamisation in Pakistan started from
1948 itself. ``

I do not think Pakistan went for modern Islamic fundamentalism until 1970s. If there was any antipathy towards Indians before 1971 it was a product of pre- and post-partition rivalry.

Urstruly#192

Watch out, my friend. The mullah in you is getting the better of human. I can`t believe that this post was written by the same person who once wrote perhaps the most moving personal tribute to Dr. Salam on chowk.

Re: # 203 vert

Hey - don`t blame me. Your phrase ``Wrench in Gear`` sounded like that. Anyway - thanks for clarification - no hard feelings.

+++

//...Okay mohar, your masters will be in charge forever....//

Cut the cr@p - I don`t think anybody is my master. In fact I ``master`` over some ``western`` guys in my team. So you should dig a ten-feet hole and bury your inferiority complex. Your such statements is so freaking lame and out-of-date.

Anyway - your dream of Asian Century will remain a pie-in-the-sky because I don`t see it happening. India in particular is nowhere near building anything - the m0r0ns can`t even build a modern city. With f***ing commies and fools being rulers there - nothing will ever be built. If you take India out of your equation - there may be a slim chance, a very slim one at that.

Either way - don`t fear the west - they are not your masters. They are not out colonizing anybody [ except, those who want to be colonized e.g. pakis ]. So rest easy - don`t have nightmares about some imaginary masters.

Ferozek 168:
hey that was an excellent writeup!

Re: # 168
Thanks Feroz for a wonderful post. I wonder what are the insecurities that manifest themselves into brainwashing by mullahs that religion is in danger. It is really very difficult to single out one root cause among the three constituting the power triad.I realize that there can be no half baked solutions or quick fixes, and I was not trying to propose one. What amazes me is that voices like yours are very few.Some are apologists for the military, others believe that some pure version of Islam would solve all their problems and others are too immersed in their relatively privileged lives to care. I wonder if there are enough stakeholders for a secular democracy in Pakistan.

amit:
umm.. i didnt mean the perception of ``goodwill`` and ``respect`` which can easily be engineered by different States in their own interests.

That is something different from the talk of the self-interest of different states and how they ``project`` their power on other players in the world. In the case of Pakistan, my original query was about India`s projection On Pakistan which could be anything but of an Equal level player. That is what i meant. Others have pointed out this before that it has more to do with Pakistani ruling classes` delusional worldview vis a vis india that needs to be corrected for any real progress in indo-pak relations to be made based on pure self-interest of each state.

Re:ferozek#156

The area of Pakistan has always been at the cross-roads of civilizations. As you are well aware, every invader to India came via Pakistan. We tend to focus on that but we forget that there was a booming trade and commerce between India and Central Asia for centuries via the areas of Pakistan. The ancient Silk Road had sections passing into Pakistan. So the idea of exploiting Pakistan`s strategic location is not new but a renewal of something that was very natural in the past but got stopped due to the political issues in the past 100 years.

If Pakistan revamps its foreign policy to brand itself as a regional transit hub, sort of in the same way that India has branded itself as a IT hub, the chips will fall into place naturally. Indian businessmen have been pleading with Pakistani government for years to give them transit rights to Central Asia. The Indian hunger for natural gas and oil is well known as well, and it is only recently that Pakistan has agreed to the Indo-Iranian pipeline. Still it is a one-off project and not part of some overall strategy. I am sure, China would also like to tap into natural gas and oil from Iran. So it really depends on whether Islamabad realizes its self-interest and exploits its strategic location profitably, instead of just indulging in worthless geo-politics as a proxy of the US.

Re:Raw_Dust

The relationship between any two sovereign nations should be based on mutual respect and equality. Today the world hates the US for its arrogance and its lack of respect for other countries. Why should we make the same mistake and look down on anyone or try to dominate them? Our relations with Pakistan should be based on enlightened self-interest.

It is in our enlightened self-interest if we treat Pakistanis with respect and win their hearts and minds. That does not mean compromising our security or economic interests. It means building win-win relations with them. In fact we stand to gain immensely in terms of reducing our defence spending (peace dividend), getting cheap energy to fuel development, finding new markets in Central Asia etc. Also if we can have very close relations with Iran and Afghanistan, why not with Pakistan with whom we have ethnic ties? In the long run, I foresee that Indo-Pak relations will be like US-UK relations or US-Canada relations.

Re: # 205
tahmed32
granville technology group is the parent company owned by the pakistani brothers time computers, tiny.com are brand names they also have schools division, the advantage they have over dell is high street presece of 180 stores.

amit:
``Our mutual relations will always be as equals anyway.``

I question this assumption. Why the heck should india treat pakistan as a player equal to india`s econ./defense/political stature?

aslam: you are right on this board being hijacked for the usual subjects (and admittedly I am one of the culprits).

But coming back on track - I didnt know of Time computers - I followed the links you provided, but the news link was about 3-4 years old. So I googled, and seems like some company named the Granville Technology Group Limited bought it. Is this Group owned by the Pakistani brothers? And how is Time doing now? I looked at their prices and they seem a bit expensive compared to Dell (but that could be due to dollar devaluation). Personally I would be a bit skeptical, since this is a highly competitive market and even mighty IBM could not stand up to Dell.

Re:vertex#196

You are right on the money. India definitely does not like being used against any country, no matter what Henry Kissinger may dream about. The same is true with Iran and China who brush off any pressure from the US. Somehow Pakistan has been the exception in this regard, mainly because of its fixation about getting support against India. Now that we are normalizing ties, why should Pakistan feel the need to be at the mercy of the US? If we form strong alliances, Pakistan will never have the need to bow in front of anyone. Our mutual relations will always be as equals anyway. So it is entirely in Pakistan`s self-interest to form alliance with India.

mohar11,

``So pakiland is the last front of defense against ``american colonial engines`` ?? Even though America is controlling pakiland since the beginning?? ``

Duh read what I had to say fool. It`s exactly because Pakland is so prone to being a condomn-state that makes it dangerous for the likes of Iran, India and China. None of those three really want to be used against each other. Enter the Pakstani powers-that-be and they (perhaps literally) bend over backward to appease their white masters even if it ticks of their neighbours.

``And who told you future is Asian? Just because Indians can write code and chinese can make toys and pakis can make bombs out of stolen designs???``

Okay mohar, your masters will be in charge forever. Whatever... dumb ass oreo.

Re: # 194
Romair

I am not surprised you’ve not heard of them not many people outside UK have, they are 3 pakistani brothers tariq mohammed is medical doctor other 2 have no higher education, the story is they started assembling in their house and selling locally. When 20+ years ago government started computers in every school, they won major contracts for schools.

That’s when they hit big time, started buying smaller rivals, now they are biggest high street pc retailers selling over 2 million pcs a year, they are also expanding into Europe.