Tauheed Ahmed April 5, 2005
#34 Posted by Kamath on April 7, 2005 7:27:32 am
I bet the driver of the `car who honked is Mr. Fizz who believes ,``...I don`t think a child on the street ever gets `terrified` by a car...``
#33 Posted by tahmed32 on April 7, 2005 5:46:39 am
Fizza: Dont feel bad - you in fact hit upon the precise point I am trying to make in the poem. That is, just as ``thats the way it is`` for the girl, similarly the rest of us in society (i.e. the better-off people) have become inured to the daily miseries that poverty brings upon Pakistanis. And that is why I had added the third stanza (that some people had complained about in some of the posts below as being redundant) - to remind us that while ``thats the way it is``, thats NOT the way it should be.
#32 Posted by tahmed32 on April 7, 2005 5:42:00 am
urstruly: Thanks for your comments and glad you liked it. I chose the ``free verse`` route for this poem (perfectly acceptable method of course) because I felt it more appropriate in terms of tailoring the wording in each stanza to the situation. But no doubt, it could have been written in rhyming words.
#31 Posted by Fizza on April 7, 2005 3:34:18 am
Re: # 27
Oops! I know why you`d think that. I feel bad about making an impression of an insensitive zombie.
I`d like to recover by emphasizing (again) that if a girl is on the streets 24/7, she wouldn`t get `terrified` by a car. She could be immune to cars suddenly appearing on her way; not the poverty she`s surviving through.
The idea of the poem is compassionate, the wordings don`t reflect that strongly.
After all, poetry is about awakening what`s dormant within the reader.
Oops! I know why you`d think that. I feel bad about making an impression of an insensitive zombie.
I`d like to recover by emphasizing (again) that if a girl is on the streets 24/7, she wouldn`t get `terrified` by a car. She could be immune to cars suddenly appearing on her way; not the poverty she`s surviving through.
The idea of the poem is compassionate, the wordings don`t reflect that strongly.
After all, poetry is about awakening what`s dormant within the reader.
#30 Posted by Urstruly on April 6, 2005 1:12:09 pm
not bad; would have been much better if it rhymed. See what difference the first stanza makes.
#29 Posted by echoboom on April 6, 2005 10:50:38 am
rahul_capri:20
You have it. You got it.
there are also some other subtle points which no amount of `higher-education` can muster. Either in writing or in understanding poetry.
he was a natural.
I am delighted & impressed to know that you read insha--in that `other` script. Urdu is safe!
``hUm iss dil kay mehram tehray, yeh kisi Misr kaa zinDaaN thhaa
Lekin kUl kyaa baat thhe jaanay, kUl yeh qasr chraaGHaaN thhaa
aisaa vaisa noor thhaa iss meiN, noor bhhee noor-e kinaaN thhaa
chaanD sitaaray dUr kay vaali, Khwaja-e bRq jo durbaaN thhaa
....................................................................................................................................
Jaan miri, kUl kaun khaRRa thha, dUr pay tiray kshkoal b`dUst
yaa bsray kaa vaali thha vo, yaa Dilli kaa sultaan thhaa
Mulla jee taadeeb krO, kuchh upnay br`khurdaaroaN kee
kUl bhhee Quais miyaaN kay bUr meiN, Inshaa jee kaa DeevaaN thha.
w`salaam.
You have it. You got it.
there are also some other subtle points which no amount of `higher-education` can muster. Either in writing or in understanding poetry.
he was a natural.
I am delighted & impressed to know that you read insha--in that `other` script. Urdu is safe!
``hUm iss dil kay mehram tehray, yeh kisi Misr kaa zinDaaN thhaa
Lekin kUl kyaa baat thhe jaanay, kUl yeh qasr chraaGHaaN thhaa
aisaa vaisa noor thhaa iss meiN, noor bhhee noor-e kinaaN thhaa
chaanD sitaaray dUr kay vaali, Khwaja-e bRq jo durbaaN thhaa
....................................................................................................................................
Jaan miri, kUl kaun khaRRa thha, dUr pay tiray kshkoal b`dUst
yaa bsray kaa vaali thha vo, yaa Dilli kaa sultaan thhaa
Mulla jee taadeeb krO, kuchh upnay br`khurdaaroaN kee
kUl bhhee Quais miyaaN kay bUr meiN, Inshaa jee kaa DeevaaN thha.
w`salaam.
#28 Posted by tahmed32 on April 6, 2005 9:30:08 am
epiphany #25: you write ``But the most important and significant reason is that the government (with the exception of the leadership of the Quaid or the present guard) never cared for the people.``
I basically agree with you, although I dont think there is any particular reason to consider some pakistani leaders to be significantly more caring for the lives of the poor people than others. After all, Bhutto too raised the slogan of ``roti, kapra aur makaan`` and that was the only time I saw poor people in Pakistan get really excited about politics. And even he let them down badly by ruining Pakistan`s economy by nationalizing banks (which was more to give more power to himself as government leader, than for any particular concern for the poor) and by bad mouthing the entrepreneurs.
you write ``If you have a plan behind your poem, tell me and you will find me standing next to you to sharpen your plan and put it in action. ``
Unfortunately there is no magic bullet to ending poverty. I will say that I spent a career in a major international development agency spanning 25 years, and so have learnt a few things on what works and what does not.
First, what works:
1. Respect for the innate abilities of the poor: the Grameen Bank is a shining example of this, where one man entrusted the poor with loans - and the poor made a life for themselves and proved to be excellent credit risks. Thus starting the micro-credit revolution. So: if you are pakistan based, you can look into this further and participate in some manner to the microcredit operations in Pakistan.
2. Patience: a child takes a long time to be educated and matured into a productive adult. So, dont look for immediate returns or quick fixes. So: again you can participate in one of the many organizations that promote education for children (real, not madrassah, education, btw). My favorites are DIL (Developments in Literacy) and SOS (orphanages, where children receive not just an education, but also a ``house mother`` for every 5-6 children).
What does NOT work:
1. Government: They are hopeless. They are ``sahab logs`` with a miserable attitude. Stay away from any government run ``initiative``.
I basically agree with you, although I dont think there is any particular reason to consider some pakistani leaders to be significantly more caring for the lives of the poor people than others. After all, Bhutto too raised the slogan of ``roti, kapra aur makaan`` and that was the only time I saw poor people in Pakistan get really excited about politics. And even he let them down badly by ruining Pakistan`s economy by nationalizing banks (which was more to give more power to himself as government leader, than for any particular concern for the poor) and by bad mouthing the entrepreneurs.
you write ``If you have a plan behind your poem, tell me and you will find me standing next to you to sharpen your plan and put it in action. ``
Unfortunately there is no magic bullet to ending poverty. I will say that I spent a career in a major international development agency spanning 25 years, and so have learnt a few things on what works and what does not.
First, what works:
1. Respect for the innate abilities of the poor: the Grameen Bank is a shining example of this, where one man entrusted the poor with loans - and the poor made a life for themselves and proved to be excellent credit risks. Thus starting the micro-credit revolution. So: if you are pakistan based, you can look into this further and participate in some manner to the microcredit operations in Pakistan.
2. Patience: a child takes a long time to be educated and matured into a productive adult. So, dont look for immediate returns or quick fixes. So: again you can participate in one of the many organizations that promote education for children (real, not madrassah, education, btw). My favorites are DIL (Developments in Literacy) and SOS (orphanages, where children receive not just an education, but also a ``house mother`` for every 5-6 children).
What does NOT work:
1. Government: They are hopeless. They are ``sahab logs`` with a miserable attitude. Stay away from any government run ``initiative``.
#27 Posted by tahmed32 on April 6, 2005 9:15:17 am
Fizza: I am not sure why you say that. For some reason your remark reminds me of a nice young lady in the Pickwick Papers (19th century novel by Dickens) who says that she understands that the poor dont feel the cold when they sleep in the streets, and that they dont feel the pain when they get whipped.
#26 Posted by tahmed32 on April 6, 2005 9:12:45 am
kamath: thanks for reading, and appreciate your comments. It is true that such sad scenes are to be found not just in Pakistan, but in developing countries all over the world. If one looks at these children at reflects on the fact that ``There, but for the Grace of God, goes my own child``, the true horror (hope the word ``horror`` does not sound too dramatic, but that is what it is) of a young child laboring in the streets for her evening meal strikes home.
#25 Posted by epiphany on April 6, 2005 9:06:38 am
Tauheed Ahmed,
To beg for money is also, most largely, an institution in Pakistan created and propagated by many reasons chiefly civic helplessness and civil ignorance and arrogance.
Tell some stiff collar in Islamabad to curb this problem, and the most popular response you`ll get is, ``This is not included in my list of duties to be performed.``
So I have to ask, ``Now if the innocence of poor children be ravaged, who is responsible?``
There are many reasons, collosal number of theories for this: one being that the father of these little ones may be a drug addict who as a `living dead` relies on income by the family to sustain his habit; The mother of these children may then work at a home as an aid of sorts while the children may beg or steal or worse ... learn to rob at gunpoint.
But the most important and significant reason is that the government (with the exception of the leadership of the Quaid or the present guard) never cared for the people.
Eradicate poverty from Pakistan and the world. But start at Pakistan. For as the famous proverb goes: Charity begins at home.
If you have a plan behind your poem, tell me and you will find me standing next to you to sharpen your plan and put it in action.
Otherwise, if you wrote an emotional poem to the fancy of the hoi polloi, you will always find stangers who will venture forth in hoards and hoards to work together on perfecting the scansion to make it an immortal verse.
Peace!
To beg for money is also, most largely, an institution in Pakistan created and propagated by many reasons chiefly civic helplessness and civil ignorance and arrogance.
Tell some stiff collar in Islamabad to curb this problem, and the most popular response you`ll get is, ``This is not included in my list of duties to be performed.``
So I have to ask, ``Now if the innocence of poor children be ravaged, who is responsible?``
There are many reasons, collosal number of theories for this: one being that the father of these little ones may be a drug addict who as a `living dead` relies on income by the family to sustain his habit; The mother of these children may then work at a home as an aid of sorts while the children may beg or steal or worse ... learn to rob at gunpoint.
But the most important and significant reason is that the government (with the exception of the leadership of the Quaid or the present guard) never cared for the people.
Eradicate poverty from Pakistan and the world. But start at Pakistan. For as the famous proverb goes: Charity begins at home.
If you have a plan behind your poem, tell me and you will find me standing next to you to sharpen your plan and put it in action.
Otherwise, if you wrote an emotional poem to the fancy of the hoi polloi, you will always find stangers who will venture forth in hoards and hoards to work together on perfecting the scansion to make it an immortal verse.
Peace!
#24 Posted by Fizza on April 6, 2005 8:57:16 am
I don`t think a child on the street ever gets `terrified` by a car.
#23 Posted by Kamath on April 6, 2005 6:03:36 am
Sad little poem with such a compassion for the unfortunate.
It is no different elsewhere too. It is the same story like hers in Bombay, Delhi, Madras, Calcutta, Bangkok and Manila too.
It is no different elsewhere too. It is the same story like hers in Bombay, Delhi, Madras, Calcutta, Bangkok and Manila too.
#22 Posted by tahmed32 on April 6, 2005 4:37:09 am
Lyalpur2Del, Rahul_Capri, drlokraj, hamidm: Thanks for your appreciation.
hamidm/Lyalpur2Del: The third stanza could be taken out, I agree, without loss of meaning. As I mentioned to mr. t, I had originally taken it out, then stuck it back in out of concern that the point being made in the final stanza may not be too obvious. Obviously I underestimated the subtelty of people on chowk. :-)
Anyway, while fellows like me can only write about it, the real tragedy of seeing young lives doomed to going waste can be seen everyday in Pakistan in everyday scenes. With a tiny fraction of the amount that nations spend on armaments, this girl (and millions like her) could have turned out to be a competent professional or even a brilliant scientist and we would all have been better off as a result.
hamidm/Lyalpur2Del: The third stanza could be taken out, I agree, without loss of meaning. As I mentioned to mr. t, I had originally taken it out, then stuck it back in out of concern that the point being made in the final stanza may not be too obvious. Obviously I underestimated the subtelty of people on chowk. :-)
Anyway, while fellows like me can only write about it, the real tragedy of seeing young lives doomed to going waste can be seen everyday in Pakistan in everyday scenes. With a tiny fraction of the amount that nations spend on armaments, this girl (and millions like her) could have turned out to be a competent professional or even a brilliant scientist and we would all have been better off as a result.
#20 Posted by rahul_capri on April 5, 2005 8:19:10 pm
echoboom, #17, In my amateur opinion, the recurrence of the `t` syllable in both lines makes it more phonetically correct.I would like to hear ur comment on this.
#19 Posted by hamidm2 on April 5, 2005 8:14:19 pm
good job, tahmed ....... since i was introduced to billy collins by ms saminasha, i have rediscovered poetry ....... temporal does have a point about the third stanza - the poem does have more impact without it............
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